Topic suggested by Rengaswamy Selvaraju on Fri Apr 2 13:25:16 .
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

The Chola Empire simply disappeared at a certain point of time. Who was the last Chola King and how did he die? What happened to the descendants of the Cholas? By extension, who were the last Pandiya and Sera Kings? What happened to their descendants?

Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: Soniya (@ 195.101.0.167) on: Fri Jun 18 10:24:22
  
  JayBee,
  Why dont u gather all this information & write "sarithira kathai" then people like me would understand.I read "Ponniyin Selvan,Sivakamiyin sabatham..etc" by Amarar Kalki.I love to Know more abt the Cholas.
  
  Thank you.
  
  
• From: Shankar (@ 129.188.33.221) on: Fri Jun 25 12:02:20
  
  Soniya,
  
  Try getting "The Cholas" by K A Neelakanta sastry.
  
  
  
• From: Shankar (@ 129.188.33.221) on: Sun Jun 27 07:16:44
  
  Jaybee,
  Is it true that there was a second "ilachinai" for the pandyas (for the crown prince ,that is )which has a kOdAri and an elephant ?????
  
  
• From: JayBee (@ sp-69-142.tm.net.my) on: Sun Jun 27 19:30:55
  
  Yes.
  In fact, I have a Pandya coin which bears this emblem.
  It was the emblem of the vice-roy or the crown prince.
  There were several Pandyas ruling different parts of their country. The chief Pandya was at Madurai. His brothers and paternal uncles would be the rulers concerned. There were Pandyas ruling as vice-roys from Kilzhakkarai, ThiruNelvEli, Thiruvaadanai, and KoRkai. Later on, when the Pandyas captured the whole of Tamilnaadu, JayanGoNda Cholzha Puram, in Thiruchchi district became one of the capitals, with a Pandyan ruler.It was a few miles away from the capital of Cholzhas-Ganggai KoNda Cholzha Puram.
  JayBee
  
  
• From: JayBee (@ sp-69-210.tm.net.my) on: Mon Jun 28 01:18:08
  
  I forgot to mention a few more facts about the multiple Pandya rule.
  This fact has been noticed by several foreign travellers.
  Wassaf, the Arab, has written that Jatavarman Sundara Pandya(1251A.D.) ruled along with his brothers - "he had three brothers everyone of whom ruled over a province". Isaamii, the Persian poet writes in his famous ballad about a tragic event that took place in Pandya country in 1317 A.D.
  That ballad has been translated in English.
  
  "In those days the land of Ma'bar(Pandya country)
  Did'nt have a lonely king, I hear;
  There did five epople hold the sway;
  Their name was Panch Pandyas, they say."
  
  Marco Polo has this to say,"the country is ruled by five princes, who are own brothers"
  JayBee
  
  
• From: bb (@ dialup-209.245.193.13.houston1.level3.net) on: Mon Jun 28 01:34:35
  
  jaybee, were all the brothers usually born to the same queen? how was lineage defined?
  
  
• From: JayBee (@ sp-69-17.tm.net.my) on: Mon Jun 28 04:40:41
  
  In only certain instances, we know the accurate parentage. Otherwise, we know them only as brothers.
  This is something like the Prince of Wales,Duke of Kent,and Duke of York of the United Kingdoms.
  The Prince of Wales is the crown prince. The Duke of York and Kent are always the king's brother's or the Crown Prince's brothers.If the king died, the Prince of Wales becomes the king. The brother of the late king is allowed to continue holding the dukedom of York or Kent.But when he dies, the title does not go to his son.He becomes duke of something else somewhere else. His son would become an Earl. Kent or York reverts to the brother of the ruling king if there is one.
  The Pandyan scenario is like this.
  "A" is the main ruler at Madurai. His brothers, "B","C", and "D" are co-kings or co-regents.
  "A" dies and his son "E" comes to power."E"'s uncles "B","C","D" will still be kings. As and when they die or are deposed, their positions become held by the brothers of "E", - say "F","G","H".
  If the son of "B" were to succeed his father, then it would be tantamount to establishing a new collateral branch.
  This was not the case.
  It was always the sons, brothers, and uncles of the ruler - and never a nephew.
  JayBee
  
  
• From: Mani (@ spider-wg034.proxy.aol.com) on: Sat Jul 10 12:18:11
  
  I want to know if the Cheras and Pandyas worked together to fight the Cholans, because south kerala was part of the pandya dynasty.
  
  
• From: JayBee (@ sp-69-56.tm.net.my) on: Sat Jul 10 18:51:49
  
  Such alliances changed from time to time.
  In reign of the same king, he may switch alliances according to necessity.
  But generally, there were some loose alliances between certain dynasties and princely families.
  At many a time, the rule, "Enemy of enemy is friend" has operated. At other times, flocking together to destroy a common enemy took place.
  Cheras and Pandyas were allies at certain times but enemies at others.
  JayBee
  
  
• From: Idhayan (@ ss09.ny.us.ibm.com) on: Thu Oct 28 13:57:45
  
  Hi Jaybee,
  I enjoyed your explanations. Ever heard of the
  site
  www.itihaas.com.
  
  Why dont you publish an article on early/later
  "Three kingdoms of the south"?
  
  You have a good writing style.
  
  
• From: JayBee (@ sp-69-97.tm.net.my) on: Thu Oct 28 19:21:00
  
  Thanks for the commendation. By and large, all my articles which have been written in the internet will have to collected and compiled into categories. While doing so, we can fill in the gaps.
  But for one man to do that task has some insurmountable problems. That has to be done by a task-force or panel.
  But South Indian history is vast.
  And if you want to make a holistic approach to it, then South East Asian, Chinese, Roman, and Arab connections also come into play.
  The presently available books are not up-to-date and they are not expansive nor extensive.
  Many small scale discoveries have been made constamtly. These things have not been brought to light. A few of them have appeared in some of the seminars. But nobody compiles them.
  The task is immense.
  The same thing appies to our Tamil arts and crafts. Then there is the remote branch called Tamilian Mysticism. The list goes on and on.
  The Tamils do have the means to embark and finish this mammoth task.
  But will they?
  
  
• From: Idhayan (@ ss05.ny.us.ibm.com) on: Mon Nov 1 15:02:58
  
  Jaybee,
  How about you giving a start in that direction.
  But actually this itihaas site is for Indian history and interestingly not much is written about the history of south india. Since you have the knowledge why dont you contribute regularly to that site. Just a request.
  
  
• From: JayBee (@ sp-69-75.tm.net.my) on: Mon Nov 1 18:20:11
  
  Thanks for the suggestion and the regards that you show.
  I'll try to accommodate that also.
  
  
• From: AT (@ proxy1.njit.edu) on: Wed Jan 19 18:47:08
  
  By Historian Bipan chandra..(from rediff.com)
  
  "Rajaraja Chola I (985 -1018) was the founder of the strongest state structure in early medieval India. He conquered the whole of the peninsula, south of the Kaveri region and extended his kingdom to Elam (modern Sri Lanka) and parts of today's Mysore and Andhra. His greatest achievement was the administrative machinery he set up for this region.In effect, the literary imagination of the Sangham poets, which spoke of a Tamil macro-region, was made an administrative reality by Rajaraja. The notion of this region as sharing a common political structure was to continue throughout the successive periods till the colonial period. He built the towering Tanjavur Brihadisvara temple which he named after himself as Rajarajeshwaram."
  
  -What was so special about the administrative and political setup? (was it varnasrama)
  Was is it a boon or bane for the people of the region and their culture?
  How different was it from other kingdoms in the region?
  
  
• From: Little Casper (@ lsanca1-ar1-4-62-123-087.lsanca1.dsl-verizon.net) on: Wed Aug 13 15:23:38
  
  Searching for a Firme hina.
  That knows how to take care of a man
  
  
• From: tamilnesan (@ 210-210-64-224.lan.sify.net) on: Mon Aug 25 01:08:10 EDT 2003
  
  hi freind's,
  what jaybee has said is correct in one point.that pandia's ruled many parts as an qusai or independent ruler without any respect to their supreme command.
  after the fall of chola empire veere pandia and his brother varagunapandia ruled madurai and thrichy respctly in the 13 century the continusly qureled between them that whom to acquire the central command.
  in this time the mighty telugu rulers of vijaynagar enterd their and one by one they eliminated both pandya govt,s here the allaudin gillg's invasion is also a cause for the down fall of pandia's
  
  
• From: nanpan (@ ac96fb47.ipt.aol.com) on: Tue Aug 26 13:50:35 EDT 2003
  
  >> were all the brothers usually born to the same queen? how was lineage defined?
  
  Not necessarily born to same queen. Usually the eldest son succeeds the king in Madurai. Sometimes a younger son was declared
  
  the heir by the king before his death. This caused family quarrels and civil war. Example: War between half brothers Jatavarman
  
  Sundara Pandyan (older son) and Jatavarman Veera Pandyan (different mothers)
  
  http://www.geocities.com/tamiltribune/02/0202.html
  
  Another civil war was between Parakkirama Pandyan and Kulasekhara Pandyan who bothclaimed the throne. I don't know if they
  
  were brothers.
  http://www.geocities.com/tamiltribune/01/1201.html (Section 3)
  
  
• From: nanpan (@ ac96fb47.ipt.aol.com) on: Tue Aug 26 13:52:35 EDT 2003
  
  >> But actually this itihaas site is for Indian history and interestingly not much is written about the history of south india.
  
  "Indian History" books consider south and northeast not really part of Indian history. This is true even in history books used in central schools.
  
  I suggest that Mr. Jaybee put his history of South India in a separate site. Tamil.net may be willing to give him web space.
  
  
• From: R.Sri Hari (@ modem15.bayrac2.eureka.lk) on: Tue Jul 6 13:26:26
  
  Dear Readers,
  
  Please vist the Website with the URL adddress
  http://kundavi.proboards33.com
  to know of some informations on the Medieval Chola Empire and its relations with the Maldive Islands
  
  

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