National Awards, India

[MADDY]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Film_Awards

Categories:

Golden Lotus Award
Official Name: Swarna Kamal

* Best Film
* Best Direction
* Best Popular Film Providing Wholesome Entertainment
* Best Children's Film

Silver Lotus Award
Official Name: Rajat Kamal

* Best Actor
* Best Actress
* Best Supporting Actor
* Best Supporting Actress
* Best Child Artist
* Best Cinematography
* Best Screenplay
* Best Art Direction
* Best Make-up Artist [8]
* Best Costume Design
* Best Music Direction
* Best Lyrics
* Best Male Playback Singer
* Best Female Playback Singer
* Best Choreography
* Best Audiography
* Best Editing
* Best Special Effects
* Second Best Feature Film
* Special Jury Award / Special Mention (Feature Film)

Best Feature Film in each of the languages specified in schedule VIII of the constitution:

* Best Feature Film in Assamese
* Best Feature Film in Bengali
* Best Feature Film in Hindi
* Best Feature Film in Kannada
* Best Feature Film in Konkani
* Best Feature Film in Malayalam
* Best Feature Film in Manipuri
* Best Feature Film in Marathi
* Best Feature Film in Oriya
* Best Feature Film in Punjabi
* Best Feature Film in Tamil
* Best Feature Film in Telugu

Best Feature Film in each of the languages other than those specified in schedule VIII of the constitution:

* Best Feature Film in English
* Best Feature Film in Bhojpuri
* Best Feature Film in Monpa
* Best Feature Film in Tulu

Other Feature Film Awards:

* Best Film on Family Welfare
* Best Film on Other Social Issues
* Best Film on Environment Conservation/Preservation

Nargis Dutt Award - This award is given to the Best Feature film on National Integration

* Nargis Dutt Award for Best Feature Film on National Integration

Indira Gandhi Award for Best First Film - This award is given to the film judged Best First Film of a Director at the National Film Awards

* Indira Gandhi Award

Dadasaheb Phalke Lifetime Achievement Award - This award is for lifetime achievement and contribution to Indian Cinema. It is named after Dadasaheb Phalke, one of India's pioneering film makers.

* Dadasaheb Phalke Award

Non-Feature Film Awards - The Awards presented to Non-Feature Films are given in different categories including the following:

* Best Non-Feature Film
* Best First Non-Feature Film
* Best Anthropological/Ethnographic Film
* Best Biographical Film
* Best Arts/Cultural Film
* Best Scientific Film
* Best Promotional Film
* Best Agriculture Film
* Best Film on Social Issues
* Best Educational/Motivational/Instructional Film
* Best Environment/Conservation/Preservation Film
* Best Exploration/Adventure Film
* Best Investigative Film
* Best Animated Film
* Best Short Fiction Film
* Best Non-Feature Film on Family Welfare
* Best Non-Feature Film Direction
* Best Non-Feature Film Cinematography
* Best Non-Feature Film Audiography
* Best Non-Feature Film Editing
* Best Non-Feature Film Music Direction
* Special Jury Award / Special Mention (Non-Feature Film)

Best Book on Cinema - This award is given to the Best Book on Cinema:

* Best Book on Cinema

Best Film Critic - This award is given to the Best Film Critic on Cinema: Best Film Critic

[MADDY]

Amitabh has grabbed best actor award for Paa

[satissh_r]

Amit Trivedi wins best MD for DEV D :clap:

[MADDY]

Amit trivedi wins best MD award for DevD :bluejump: :bluejump: :bluejump: :bluejump: :bluejump: :bluejump: :bluejump: :bluejump:

currently my joy knows no bounds......same happiness i felt when AR won for Roja :bow:

[P_R]

Kaminey not in reckoning?
Friyanga did not get :-(
pOna thadavaiyE sonnEn repeat kudukka mAttAingannu
Rituparno kOs got the Best director and his heroine got the best actress

[AravindMano]

Kaminey got Editing (Along with Pazhassi Raja) for Sreekar.

Amit - well deserved! innum niRaiya vaanguvAr.

[Sarna]

Amitabh has grabbed best actor award for Paa

:clap: :clap:

[P_R]

Kutty Srank screenwriting beat Kaminey !

Hmm...padathai pAkkaNumE

[Plum]

pArunga pArunga. Definitely I am sure that wont be as shocking as Amit-ji over Mammookka.

[MADDY]

padathoda wiki page-la pona table ellam potturukkaanga - characters and their behavior-kku :lol: ......

[MADDY]

Kutty Srank screenwriting beat Kaminey !

Hmm...padathai pAkkaNumE

Delhi-6 wins award for best film with social message - idhellam AR fans-kke adukkala :rotfl: ........brangan vera praise pannaaru, naama dhaan edho miss pannitomo-nnu thonudhu :?

[Sanjeevi]

Superb Raaja won another NA and equals ARR :P

[AravindMano]

Kutty Srank had a limited release in Kerala. Was expecting in Chennai PVR in vain.

KeraLaththulayE limited release-aam as Kovai Sarala says EnnayE pudikkala in Sathi Leelavathi.

[ajaybaskar]

Superb Raaja won another NA and equals ARR :P

Musicla 4 awards mela vera yaarum vaangaliya?

[Sanjeevi]

Superb Raaja won another NA and equals ARR :P

Musicla 4 awards mela vera yaarum vaangaliya?

I think so

[ajaybaskar]

Gr8 then.. :-)

[MADDY]

singers vaangi irukkanga but MDs - these 2 are at the top......

and i dont see AR winning a award from here

tha, inime indian films panna dhaane

[ilayapuyalvinodh_kumar]

Tamil films category ku winners announce panniyaacha ???

[Sanjeevi]

பசங்க படத்துக்கு 4 தேசிய விருதுகள்!
புதுடெல்லி, செப்.15,2010
சினிமா ஆர்வலர்களின் பாராட்டுகளை வென்றதோடு, வர்த்தக ரீதியிலும் குறிப்பிடத்தக்க வெற்றியடைந்த'பசங்க' திரைப்படம், 4 தேசிய விருதுகளைப் பெற்றுள்ளது.

பாண்டிராஜ் இயக்கிய 'பசங்க' திரைப்படம், பிராந்திய மொழிகள் பிரிவில், சிறந்த தமிழ்ப் படத்துக்கான தேசிய விருதைத் தட்டிச் சென்றுள்ளது.

57-வது தேசிய விருதுகள் இன்று அறிவிக்கப்பட்டன.

அதில், 'பசங்க' திரைப்படம், சிறந்த தமிழ்ப் படத்துக்கான தேசிய விருதைப் பெறுவதாக அறிவிக்கப்பட்டது.

பாண்டிராஜுக்கு விருது...

சிறந்த உரையாடல் ஆசிரியருக்கான தேசிய விருதை, பசங்க படத்துக்காக அதன் இயக்குனர் பாண்டிராஜ் பெருகிறார்.

'இருவருக்கு' விருது!

பசங்க படத்தில் அன்புக்கரசு வெள்ளைச்சாமியாக நடிதத கிஷோர் மற்றும் ஜீவா நித்தியானந்தம் சொக்கலிங்கமாக நடித்த ஸ்ரீ ராம் ஆகிய இருவருக்கும் சிறந்த குழந்தை நட்சத்திரத்துக்கான தேசிய விருது கிடைத்துள்ளது.

[Sanjeevi]

தேசிய விருது அப்டேட் : சிறந்த பின்னணி இசையமைப்பாளர் இளையராஜா; சிறந்த நடிகர் அமிதாப் பச்சன்
புதுடெல்லி, செப்.15,2010

57வது தேசிய திரைப்பட விருதுகள் அறிவிக்கப்பட்டுள்ளன.

சிறந்த படம் : குட்டி ஸ்ராங்கு (மலையாளம்)

சிறந்த நடிகர் : அமிதாப் பச்சன் - படம் : பா (இந்தி)

சிறந்த நடிகை : அனன்யா சாட்டர்ஜி - படம் : அபோஹமான் (பெங்காலி)

சிறந்த பொழுது போக்கு திரைப்படம் : 3 இடியட்ஸ் (இந்தி)

சிறந்த சமூக திரைப்படம் : டெல்லி 6 (இந்தி)

சிறந்த இயக்குனர் : ரிதுபர்னோ கோஷ்

சிறந்த பின்னணி இசையமைப்பாளர் : இளையராஜா (பழசிராஜா - மலையாளம்)

சிறந்த இசைமையப்பாளர் : அமித் திரிவேடி (தேவ் டி - இந்தி)

சிறந்த பின்னணி பாடகர் : ரூபம் இஸ்லாம்

சிறந்த பின்னணி பாடகி : நிலஞ்சனா சங்கர்

[P_R]

pArunga pArunga. Definitely I am sure that wont be as shocking as Amit-ji over Mammookka.
Actually I don't quite get why people who have NOT watched the Mammooty films are outraged by Amitabh Bachchan's NA.

In Paa he was good only.

Bodistoda: ellA directionlErndhum ennai attack paNNunga

[Sanjeevi]

I too liked Amitabh in Paa. He did well IMO

[Sarna]

Because even the award for Bachcan is pro-Bachchan propoganda. How can they overlook Mammotty for not one, not two but 3 acclaimed performances, 1 of which I saw and is good enough to beat the crap out of Paa. And two others carry good reviews too. Plus Pazhassi Raja which is not much of a role but he still brought it the necessary gravity and dignity.

While subjectivity is involved, for the sheer range displayed there, they should have chosen Mammotty. I mean, the award is not called "Best performance in the year in aleading male role". It is called "best actor" so "Range+Excellence" should beat "Excellence in one role", which itself was debatable.

btw, ungalukkudhaan NA ellaam matter'E illayE :P why so much wrath against bachchan ?

[Nerd]

Wow Amit T and Raja :bow:

Amitji - :banghead:
Pasanga :banghead: (nalla velai nadodigal illai :shaking: )

[SoftSword]

Congrats to Illayaraja and the Pasanga team...
is it the School teacher character that has won the award?

[ilayapuyalvinodh_kumar]

Many people on Twitter are disappointed that Mamootty didn't get the Actor award ..... :clap: Mr.Bachan

[MADDY]

17 yrs back a young budding music director from kodambakkam pipped pannaipuram raja by a single vote to win NA..........today, another youngster from lanes of mumbai stuns the mozart of madras to take the title :bow:

raju in MMKR: idhellam adhuva varradhhu dhaan-laa 8-)

[SoftSword]

Many people on Twitter are disappointed that Mamootty should have got it ..... :clap: Mr.Bachan

Konda vechirukkavangalukkellaam betramox light kedayaddhu

[ilayapuyalvinodh_kumar]

Many people on Twitter are disappointed that Mamootty hadn't got it ..... :clap: Mr.Bachan

Konda vechirukkavangalukkellaam betramox light kedayaddhu

:confused2:

[Vivasaayi]

pasanga :hammer:

So, I think this is enough for whatever propogonda masinerium to place amitabh equal to the likes of Kamal?

[Vivasaayi]

17 yrs back a young budding music director from kodambakkam pipped pannaipuram raja by a single vote to win NA..........today, another youngster from lanes of mumbai stuns the mozart of madras to take the title :bow:

raju in MMKR: idhellam adhuva varradhhu dhaan-laa 8-)

rahmana idhukku munaadi neraya peru closeajeyichirupanga....idha mattum epdi varalaatru nigalvaa eduthukka mudiyin?

[Vivasaayi]

andha pasanga padathula ennayya irundhuchu... nejamave adhu nalla padamaa?..

naanthaan kooruketta thanama paathanaa?

[kid-glove]

By any 'norm' of superlative acting, Paa is a non-starter. It dates back to 2004, Mammootty's Kazcha was ignored for Saif's Hum Tum, I find this no different. And fact that AB equals the highest tally should be seen as blatant agenda..

[SoftSword]

Viv,

ungalukku andha padam mela ivlo veruppu vara edhachum points irukka?
becos, i liked this movie very much.. other side of story therinjukkalaamenu..

[Vivasaayi]

By any 'norm' of superlative acting, Paa is a non-starter. It dates back to 2004, Mammootty's Kazcha was ignored for Saif's Hum Tum, I find this no different. And fact that AB equals the highest tally should be seen as blatant agenda..

Mammootty, known for his passion towards National awards, not sure how he would have taken this.

It will be easier for NI media to place Amitabh in the top of "actors" list along with stars list now...

[Vivasaayi]

Viv,

ungalukku andha padam mela ivlo veruppu vara edhachum points irukka?
becos, i liked this movie very much.. other side of story therinjukkalaamenu..

It looked very fake and pretentious

[MADDY]

17 yrs back a young budding music director from kodambakkam pipped pannaipuram raja by a single vote to win NA..........today, another youngster from lanes of mumbai stuns the mozart of madras to take the title :bow:

raju in MMKR: idhellam adhuva varradhhu dhaan-laa 8-)

rahmana idhukku munaadi neraya peru closeajeyichirupanga....idha mattum epdi varalaatru nigalvaa eduthukka mudiyin?

Amit is a first timer

[Nerd]

And apparently he is in the league of *great composers* (not quite there but will be in a few years)

[Vivasaayi]

17 yrs back a young budding music director from kodambakkam pipped pannaipuram raja by a single vote to win NA..........today, another youngster from lanes of mumbai stuns the mozart of madras to take the title :bow:

raju in MMKR: idhellam adhuva varradhhu dhaan-laa 8-)

rahmana idhukku munaadi neraya peru closeajeyichirupanga....idha mattum epdi varalaatru nigalvaa eduthukka mudiyin?

Amit is a first timer

idhuthaan avar mudhal padamaa? ! :clap:

[AravindMano]

There have been greater non-deserving performances before. (Rikshakaaran, anyone?). I don't find anything wrong in awarding Amitabh Bachchan. He was after all, good in that film. (haven't watched Mamootty in those films). Even as a standalone attempt, I found his effort endearing and worthy.

[MADDY]

There have been greater non-deserving performances before. (Rikshakaaran, anyone?)

what were the other deserving performances that missed that year??

vivs, Aamir(2008) is his first release but he did DevD much before it and technically is his first movie......as Nerd said, he will be there in the league very soon.....pls listen to his works in Aamir, Aisha, Iktara song from wake up sid :D

[ilayapuyalvinodh_kumar]

17 yrs back a young budding music director from kodambakkam pipped pannaipuram raja by a single vote to win NA..........today, another youngster from lanes of mumbai stuns the mozart of madras to take the title :bow:

raju in MMKR: idhellam adhuva varradhhu dhaan-laa 8-)

rahmana idhukku munaadi neraya peru closeajeyichirupanga....idha mattum epdi varalaatru nigalvaa eduthukka mudiyin?

Amit is a first timer

idhuthaan avar mudhal padamaa? ! :clap:

At NA this is his first film. He did a film called Aamir before Dev.D

[AravindMano]

Maddy - Okay, I don't know. :) I was just hinting at one of such examples. Every time few of the awardees have been found undeserving, hints at power play, bias etc.,

My point is, when I watched Paa, I didn't think it's a national-award winning performance. On seeing the news, I don't feel it's undeserving either.

[ilayapuyalvinodh_kumar]

Best Male Playback Singer - Rupam Islam (Mahanagar) :clap:

I felt either of KK or Javed Ali should have got for their rendition in Tum Mile.

[MADDY]

Maddy - Okay, I don't know. :)

ok :) whenever there is a talk of misgivings in NA, MGR's name comes first - i thought he had spoiled some real good performance's chance......

[AravindMano]

Maddy - Okay, I don't know. :)

ok :) whenever there is a talk of misgivings in NA, MGR's name comes first - i thought he had spoiled some real good performance's chance......

Could be. I have heard a lot of people cribbing about it.

[SoftSword]

Viv,

ungalukku andha padam mela ivlo veruppu vara edhachum points irukka?
becos, i liked this movie very much.. other side of story therinjukkalaamenu..

It looked very fake and pretentious

interesting :)

[AravindMano]

Quite interesting that 'Harishchandrachi Factory' hasn't garnered even a single award. Oscar-ku laam anuppi vachchaanga.

[Plum]

Feeyaar i have watched paleri and with any scale, it is way over Paa. What is Paa anyway?
nAnga kUda thAn rubber makeup(adhuvum 10 role-la) pOttukittOm engaLukku kuduthIngaLA?
And you may remember I dissed the Paa performance when I saw it - not inventing a reason now to diss Amit-ji.

This is clearly a BPM initiative - committee chairman who? members who?

adutha varusham Abhishek Bachchan for Ravan :lol:

[kid-glove]

Oh yes, What could we say about normative merits of Bachchan's performance as Auro in Paa than that it would have us be concerned in not just physiology of such existence (miraculous as it seems), but also in AB's hieratic gestural method in recurrence of behavioral patterns, that gestates uninhibited emotional resonance. For a deformed, diseased kid, Auro manages to be affable and earn our sentiment predominantly because of AB's graceful presence, that even character development (a failing of writer/director Balki) isn't fully amiss. Auro is a complex entity that's created for simpler paternal, familial, and thoroughly humanistic values. The inner conflicts are never outwardly revealed. Nonperformance? I'd say 'subtle'. Well, this is the man who went overtly theatrical in Black and Last Lear, only because the characters merits such. He isn't self-indulgent, or narcissistic, after all it's the man whose humility knows no bounds, and his modesty never false. What we could truly say is that Bachchan strips this character bare. And effortlessly, I might add. He leaves it to the makeup man. Such uninhibited methods should rank up there with DDL of My Left foot and Moon So-ri in Oasis. Truly worldclass.

[Plum]

k_g :lol:

ungaLukku BPM-la membership card enna thalaivar padhaviyE tharuvAnga. summA ange vEra pErula post paNNi pArunga - evLO seriousA respond pandrAngannu pArkalAm :lol:

[AravindMano]

kid - :lol:

[Sanjeevi]

Who were in the final round of best Music and best BGM category?

[MADDY]

Who were in the final round of best Music and best BGM category?

its said, Amit pipped AR(Delhi-6) by few votes :P

[Sanjeevi]

Oh

I also remember yuvan missed a NA for his 7GRC by one vote - Source : Priyadharsan

[Vivasaayi]

vivs, Aamir(2008) is his first release but he did DevD much before it and technically is his first movie......as Nerd said, he will be there in the league very soon.....pls listen to his works in Aamir, Aisha, Iktara song from wake up sid :D

Thanks for introducing......Konkana sen sharma :)

[MADDY]

Oh

I also remember yuvan missed a NA for his 7GRC by one vote - Source : Priyadharsan

adha senjadhu SPB-nnu plum konja naal munnadi sonnaru

[Plum]

Oh

I also remember yuvan missed a NA for his 7GRC by one vote - Source : Priyadharsan

adha senjadhu SPB-nnu plum konja naal munnadi sonnaru
nAn marubadiyum sollalAmnu vandhEn :-)
BTW, SPB-nu direct-A nAn sollalai. nAn hint dhAn koduthEn - ellorum SPB-nu interpret paNNikittInga ;-)

[kid-glove]

k_g :lol:

ungaLukku BPM-la membership card enna thalaivar padhaviyE tharuvAnga. summA ange vEra pErula post paNNi pArunga - evLO seriousA respond pandrAngannu pArkalAm :lol:

Hey Plum, don't sound like one of those anti-North Tamil nationalist. Bachchan deserves more than just a NA. It should be sent to Oscars, it'll only be the second time a non-English-speaking role after Benigni to win Academy award for best male performer. Neer PaaurO...

[Vivasaayi]

http://ibnlive.in.com/news/bachchan-kamal-mammootty-who-will-break-the-record/131060-8-66.html?from=rhs

arambichutainga....!!!

ivar ksr kooda manmadhan ambu pannitu irukaru.... :x

[Bala (Karthik)]

ivar ksr kooda manmadhan ambu pannitu irukaru.... :x
:rotfl2:

[tamizharasan]

k_g :lol:

ungaLukku BPM-la membership card enna thalaivar padhaviyE tharuvAnga. summA ange vEra pErula post paNNi pArunga - evLO seriousA respond pandrAngannu pArkalAm :lol:

Hey Plum, don't sound like one of those anti-North Tamil nationalist. Bachchan deserves more than just a NA. It should be sent to Oscars, it'll only be the second time a non-English-speaking role after Benigni to win Academy award for best male performer. Neer PaaurO...

It will also reinstate the fact that Amitji is the most accomplished actor on other side of the atlantic ocean. He deserves every single award in the world and in the universe in general.

[Nerd]

http://ibnlive.in.com/news/bachchan-kamal-mammootty-who-will-break-the-record/131060-8-66.html?from=rhs

arambichutainga....!!!

ivar ksr kooda manmadhan ambu pannitu irukaru.... :x
Amitji on par with Kamal/Mammoo :cry:

Enthiran-kku thalaivarukku kudukkalai, kanyAkumAri-lerunthu kashmeeer varaikkum ellaa kadaiyilEyum tea kudippen.

[SoftSword]

http://ibnlive.in.com/news/bachchan-kamal-mammootty-who-will-break-the-record/131060-8-66.html?from=rhs

arambichutainga....!!!

ivar ksr kooda manmadhan ambu pannitu irukaru.... :x

i cant avoid remembering the sachin-lara-ponting* discussions :)
dont worry vivs, indha moonu perula kamal dhaan romba naal fieldla irukka poraru, so this is sappai matter as i believe he would come out of such passionate movies soon :)

[tamizharasan]

http://ibnlive.in.com/news/bachchan-kamal-mammootty-who-will-break-the-record/131060-8-66.html?from=rhs

arambichutainga....!!!

ivar ksr kooda manmadhan ambu pannitu irukaru.... :x
Amitji on par with Kamal/Mammoo :cry:

Enthiran-kku thalaivarukku kudukkalai, kanyAkumAri-lerunthu kashmeeer varaikkum ellaa kadaiyilEyum tea kudippen.

It is okay if Rajini does not win national award. But when I was in Delhi my friends used to make fun of Rajini by comparing with great Amitji. I used to think ellam nEram.

[kid-glove]

k_g :lol:

ungaLukku BPM-la membership card enna thalaivar padhaviyE tharuvAnga. summA ange vEra pErula post paNNi pArunga - evLO seriousA respond pandrAngannu pArkalAm :lol:

Hey Plum, don't sound like one of those anti-North Tamil nationalist. Bachchan deserves more than just a NA. It should be sent to Oscars, it'll only be the second time a non-English-speaking role after Benigni to win Academy award for best male performer. Neer PaaurO...

It will also reinstate the fact that Amitji is the most accomplished actor on other side of the atlantic ocean. He deserves every single award in the world and in the universe in general.

Not just awards, he's shahenshah of BO. Have you seen that 1988 gem? Ha, lovely memories.

[SoftSword]

http://ibnlive.in.com/news/bachchan-kamal-mammootty-who-will-break-the-record/131060-8-66.html?from=rhs

arambichutainga....!!!

ivar ksr kooda manmadhan ambu pannitu irukaru.... :x
Amitji on par with Kamal/Mammoo :cry:

Enthiran-kku thalaivarukku kudukkalai, kanyAkumAri-lerunthu kashmeeer varaikkum ellaa kadaiyilEyum tea kudippen.

It is okay if Rajini does not win national award. But when I was in Delhi my friends used to make fun of Rajini by comparing with great Amitji. I used to think ellam nEram.

oru velai avangellaam amitabha pattha kannu vazhiya Rajiniya pakkalayo ennavo

[tamizharasan]

ivar ksr kooda manmadhan ambu pannitu irukaru.... :x
:rotfl2:

Nadichcha mattum kodukkava poraanga. Ordinary Kamal's ordinary performance in Anbe Sivam lost out to Great Ajay Devgan's great performance in the legend of bhagat singh is one zmall samble.

[tamizharasan]

http://ibnlive.in.com/news/bachchan-kamal-mammootty-who-will-break-the-record/131060-8-66.html?from=rhs

arambichutainga....!!!

ivar ksr kooda manmadhan ambu pannitu irukaru.... :x
Amitji on par with Kamal/Mammoo :cry:

Enthiran-kku thalaivarukku kudukkalai, kanyAkumAri-lerunthu kashmeeer varaikkum ellaa kadaiyilEyum tea kudippen.

It is okay if Rajini does not win national award. But when I was in Delhi my friends used to make fun of Rajini by comparing with great Amitji. I used to think ellam nEram.

oru velai avangellaam amitabha pattha kannu vazhiya Rajiniya pakkalayo ennavo

For them Rajini only acted in Hindi movies and that too lighting the cigarette with gun on giraftaar scene.

[Vivasaayi]

When Kamal got special achievemt award from cnn-ibn, those guys talked only about hindi movies..

ekj tuje keliye, sadma, appu raja chachi 420...

Award kudukureenga...atleast adhukagavadhu konjam therinjutu varalamla?

[P_R]

k-g :bow:

I can't even begin to think that deeply when evaluating acting or any piece of art for that matter.

Here's how I go about judging acting:

1) Is the character credible ?
If it is poorly written, there endeth the evaluation. And I didn't have problems with the conceptualization of Auro.

I can never get poorly written but well enacted, filmed etc. For me the dream goes bust then and there.

2) Is the performance credible for the character
i.e. you don't see 'edges', you are never for once made to feel (during the performance) this is someone faking emotions.

Of course one is aware that this is indeed Bachchan and I won't deny that plays a part in evaluating the fact that he is playing a role so different from his real self. Trivially tue. But for that role his actions/antics were appropriate.


3) How did the performance stand up in certain 'demanding' scenes - subtle expressions, emotional high etc.

Here too I thought he scored rather well.

Now, it can be reasonably asked, what is there is no scope for 3 in the way a role was written - well then there is no way I am going to find such a performance impressive.

[P_R]

Feeyaar i have watched paleri and with any scale, it is way over Paa. Ok.
And you may remember I dissed the Paa performance when I saw it - not inventing a reason now to diss Amit-ji. Yeah I recall. In fact after all the dissing I went in expecting to see a bad film/performance and was kinda pleasantly surprised.



What is Paa anyway?:lol:
I imagined you saying: naan kEtkiREn..yaar indha paa?


nAnga kUda thAn rubber makeup(adhuvum 10 role-la) pOttukittOm engaLukku kuduthIngaLA? allOv..role demand paNNA makeup pOttudhaan aagaNum. thassAl teacher.


BPM ?

[ajithfederer]

:lol:


http://ibnlive.in.com/news/bachchan-kamal-mammootty-who-will-break-the-record/131060-8-66.html?from=rhs

arambichutainga....!!!

ivar ksr kooda manmadhan ambu pannitu irukaru.... :x
Amitji on par with Kamal/Mammoo :cry:

Enthiran-kku thalaivarukku kudukkalai, kanyAkumAri-lerunthu kashmeeer varaikkum ellaa kadaiyilEyum tea kudippen.

[tamizharasan]

k-g :bow:

I can't even begin to think that deeply when evaluating acting or any piece of art for that matter.

Here's how I go about judging acting:

1) Is the character credible ?
If it is poorly written, there endeth the evaluation. And I didn't have problems with the conceptualization of Auro.

I can never get poorly written but well enacted, filmed etc. For me the dream goes bust then and there.

2) Is the performance credible for the character
i.e. you don't see 'edges', you are never for once made to feel (during the performance) this is someone faking emotions.

Of course one is aware that this is indeed Bachchan and I won't deny that plays a part in evaluating the fact that he is playing a role so different from his real self. Trivially tue. But for that role his actions/antics were appropriate.


3) How did the performance stand up in certain 'demanding' scenes - subtle expressions, emotional high etc.

Here too I thought he scored rather well.

Now, it can be reasonably asked, what is there is no scope for 3 in the way a role was written - well then there is no way I am going to find such a performance impressive.

If that is the case of what is your opinion of Amitji perparmans in kabhi kushi kabhie gham. Because karan soher brought the best of amitji I say. He is capable of doing justice for only that kind of melodramatic roles. Highly deserving performance of oscar and more.

[tamizharasan]

When Kamal got special achievemt award from cnn-ibn, those guys talked only about hindi movies..

ekj tuje keliye, sadma, appu raja chachi 420...

Award kudukureenga...atleast adhukagavadhu konjam therinjutu varalamla?

It was not their fault if Kamal had done tamil movies. Because when you say Indian cinema it is implied that it is hindi cinema and only they make gloss movies.

[P_R]

Thamizharasan, good acting in an ordinary, undemanding role is not great.

Writing is pretty much everything - idhu oru pazhaya panjAyathu.

[tamizharasan]

Thamizharasan, good acting in an ordinary, undemanding role is not great.

Writing is pretty much everything - idhu oru pazhaya panjAyathu.

P_R I was just sarcastic. Even though I rate Amitji as an average actor. The north indian media and mass blown his talent out of proportions. IMO Aamir, SRK and even Salman Khan are better actors when it comes to acting when compared with Amitji. Apart from good voice and early angry man look, Amitji does not have great assets to be called as even good actor.

[P_R]

IMO Aamir, SRK and even Salman Khan are better actors when it comes to acting when compared with Amitji. ennadhu !!??!!

Apart from good voice and early angry man look, Amitji does not have great assets to be called as even good actor. Rightu vidunga.

For the onlooking podhujanam, K_g has high regard for Bachchan, we're only discussing the merits of this performance, which will shed some light (for me that is) on generalizable ways people can evaluate any performance.

[kid-glove]

k-g :bow:

I can't even begin to think that deeply when evaluating acting or any piece of art for that matter.

Here's how I go about judging acting:

1) Is the character credible ?
If it is poorly written, there endeth the evaluation. And I didn't have problems with the conceptualization of Auro.

I can never get poorly written but well enacted, filmed etc. For me the dream goes bust then and there.

2) Is the performance credible for the character
i.e. you don't see 'edges', you are never for once made to feel (during the performance) this is someone faking emotions.

Of course one is aware that this is indeed Bachchan and I won't deny that plays a part in evaluating the fact that he is playing a role so different from his real self. Trivially tue. But for that role his actions/antics were appropriate.


3) How did the performance stand up in certain 'demanding' scenes - subtle expressions, emotional high etc.

Here too I thought he scored rather well.

Now, it can be reasonably asked, what is there is no scope for 3 in the way a role was written - well then there is no way I am going to find such a performance impressive.

Precisely, so what I say is wiser than the three fundamental points. I look deeper to appraise any role to be award worthy. Writing is foremost criteria. Balki names the kid after Goddess Aurora for reasons unbeknown to lesser souls. DEEP! I suggest Paa to be sent to Cannes. World audience will know that SirJi is not just about Angry young Vijays..

[tamizharasan]

For the onlooking podhujanam, K_g has high regard for Bachchan, we're only discussing the merits of this performance, which will shed some light (for me that is) on generalizable ways people can evaluate any performance.

Really.
K_g
Can you please clarify this?

[Bala (Karthik)]

IMO Aamir, SRK and even Salman Khan are better actors when it comes to acting when compared with Amitji.
TA,
Oru flow la solliruppeenga, nejamave mean pannala nu nambaren :razz: !

I saw only a few scenes in Fa and don't want to get into this NA debate but Amidhaa Bachan is a good actor IMHO, and terribly underrated in the hub

[Nerd]

.
is it the School teacher character that has won the award?
avarukku kuduthirunthaa santhosa pattiruppEn.

And best dialogues??!! Indha 'sakkarai pongal' epdi translate panniruppaainga :lol2:

[tamizharasan]

IMO Aamir, SRK and even Salman Khan are better actors when it comes to acting when compared with Amitji.
TA,
Oru flow la solliruppeenga, nejamave mean pannala nu nambaren :razz: !
I really do not know what to say. I saw some genuine tries from these actors for example
Aamir really acted well in earth(1947) and TZP.
I liked SRK's acting Darr(though it became montonous later), Hey Ram and recently MNIK(eventhough had some western influence)
Salman Khan did good job in Sethu's remake in Hindi.
IMO they are more capable than what we have seen in them.

Amitji did good job in Black everything else is way overrated.

I honestly believe my argument does not sound as silly as the north indian media claim as Amitji as the most accomplished actor on the other side of the atlantic.

[app_engine]

andha pasanga padathula ennayya irundhuchu... nejamave adhu nalla padamaa?..

naanthaan kooruketta thanama paathanaa?

+1...கொஞ்ச நேரத்துலயே நிறுத்திட்டேன், மறுபடி முயற்சியே பண்ணலை.

[MADDY]

andha pasanga padathula ennayya irundhuchu... nejamave adhu nalla padamaa?..

naanthaan kooruketta thanama paathanaa?

+1...கொஞ்ச நேரத்துலயே நிறுத்திட்டேன், மறுபடி முயற்சியே பண்ணலை.

+2...very fake film and was silly in many places

[tamizharasan]

andha pasanga padathula ennayya irundhuchu... nejamave adhu nalla padamaa?..

naanthaan kooruketta thanama paathanaa?

+1...கொஞ்ச நேரத்துலயே நிறுத்திட்டேன், மறுபடி முயற்சியே பண்ணலை.

+2...very fake film and was silly in many places

I was really shocked when somebody rated pasanga as a better movie over TZP. idhu andha aandavanukkE adukkAthu.

[AravindMano]

What is Paa anyway?:lol:
I imagined you saying: naan kEtkiREn..yaar indha paa?


:rotfl2:

[Plum]

Enga I also high regard for amitjinga. But avar ni media claim aLavukku thillAlangadi illainga. Athai chonnA underrate pandrOmgareenga?

AgneepathjlAm oru performanceA? Black? Ham fest. And really what is his range. Rajini is a ordinary actornu solrAigaLE bachchan fans adhai vidavaa? Mullum malarum laam amitji? :rotfl2: rangela irukkum.

I say amitji isn't a match to Rajini.
Is there a performance where amitji is not in control - as in the character is not in control if you see what I mean. Limitewd actornga. Extremely good in some parts of his limited range. Apdi paarthaa prabhu devavum thespian

[app_engine]

This is clearly a BPM initiative - committee chairman who? members who?


Ramesh Sippy, I think.

[app_engine]

http://ibnlive.in.com/blogs/lopamudraghatak/1885/62008/why-no-one-but-bachchan-could-have-done-paa.html

[P_R]

Flau I like Black also. :lol2:

Most certainly agree that Rajini > Amitabh.
IIRC last time indha argument vandhappO the only strong naysayer was equanimar. (yEdhO ennala mudinjadhu). Of course I may have seen less than 20 Amitabh films.

[P_R]

I voted for 'yes' as they have given it to iLayaraja. Many seem to disagree :P

[kid-glove]

This is clearly a BPM initiative - committee chairman who? members who?


Ramesh Sippy, I think.
That explains it! ;)

[kid-glove]

Amitabh is a damn good actor on his day, perhaps a bit too limited proportionated to the hype elsewhere, that he could do with the underrating here. :P

[app_engine]

[tscii:4742f8ec67]Some interesting comments (http://blog.livemint.com/livelounge/first-cut/film/2010/09/bachchan-a-director%E2%80%99s-actor/)



Bachchan’s role as the overgrown, dying boy was convincing in parts. He gave it all and deserves all the kudos for it, having attempted it in his 60s. More deserving than the 2005 award, for his exaggerated, overwrought and unconvincing histrionics in Sanjay Leela Bhansali’s Black.
...
a film that was sloppily written, with many unnecessary digressions, Bachchan held it together.
...
good time to remember what we have in Bachchan as Hindi cinema’s most experienced actor and star. He is rarely ever “directed”. His baritone, his screen presence and almost always, his inclination towards larger-than-life histrionics get him all the accolades. We are used to the way Bachchan acts and when we get that, we applaud. No director wants to let the man trapped in his own iconic and godly persona out. In that sense, Paa was a refreshing change, but that was largely because of the role’s radical physicality.
...
Paa was a family entertainer. It reaffirmed the positivity canon that many mainstream Hollywood films and Bollywwod films exploit while depicting disease and death. There were no ugly moments in Paa. Auro’s disability was his strength. Bachchan played it to perfection. And he was awarded.

[/tscii:4742f8ec67]

[ajithfederer]

:rotfl:




What is Paa anyway?:lol:
I imagined you saying: naan kEtkiREn..yaar indha paa?


:rotfl2:

[app_engine]

Sippy the chair person (http://movies.ndtv.com/movie_story.aspx?Section=Movies&ID=ENTEN20100153330&subcatg=MOVIESINDIA&keyword=bollywood&nid=52287&pfrom=Movies)



Effusive in his praise for Bachchan, Sippy said, "To portray Auro's role was not easy" and compared to the rest of the performances, there was hardly any discussion on it."

[AravindMano]

Official list with jury names (http://pib.nic.in/newsite/erelease.aspx?relid=65776)

Apart from Sippy, Lenin is a known name. M S Sathyu, I vaguely remember, is a reknowned Kannada director.

[Vivasaayi]

I voted for 'yes' as they have given it to iLayaraja. Many seem to disagree :P

voted yes...canvass na ipdithan pannanum!

[Plum]

Sippy irukkudhu oozhal irukkudhu
Thirandhu paarka neramilladi raajathi

[Plum]

Balu mahendra - learn from bollywood and the sippys. If you had induled in nepotism like SIPPY, iR will have a 5th award now. (And you would have actually given to a deserving candidate unlike sippy).*

* that was in favour of another tamilan adhu vera vishayam

VEndum pudhiya aathichoodi for tamizhans:
Nepotism pazhagu!

[Plum]

Voted No. Apdi pArthA Rajakku by now 10 awards vandhirukkaNum

[tamizharasan]

Flau I like Black also. :lol2:

Most certainly agree that Rajini > Amitabh.
IIRC last time indha argument vandhappO the only strong naysayer was equanimar. (yEdhO ennala mudinjadhu). Of course I may have seen less than 20 Amitabh films.

If any north Indian buys this then I will stop criticising Mr. Bachchan.

[app_engine]

Voted No. Apdi pArthA Rajakku by now 10 awards vandhirukkaNum
+1

[kid-glove]

NT 0
I voted NO

[ajithfederer]

May be should have been as an option.

[tamizharasan]

Voted No. Apdi pArthA Rajakku by now 10 awards vandhirukkaNum

If that is the case even Ajay Devgan should have got atleast 3 acting honors. Do not worry though Ajay devgan will win for his performance in once upon a time in mumbai this year and will equal Kamal, Mammoo and Amitji.

[Murali Srinivas]

[tscii:ed8e4d7a65]I’m happy my films won eight national awards: Mammootty

Thiruvananthapuram, Sep 15 – Mammootty missed out on the best actor award but the Malayalam superstar says he his happy that two films he acted in – ‘Kutty Srank’ and ‘Kerala Varma Pazhassi Raja’ – had bagged eight national awards between them. ‘Kutty Srank’ director Shaji N. Karun too said he was overjoyed.
‘Honestly, I feel proud that the films I acted in have won eight awards. I feel really happy. You see my job is to act and I will keep on acting and try my best,’ Mammootty told IANS over the phone from Shimoga in Karnataka, where he is shooting the film ‘Shikari’.

‘Kutty Srank’, which is produced and distributed by Big Pictures, won five awards including the best feature; special jury; best costume designer award for Jayakumar as well as best cinematography and best screenplay (original) awards for Anjuli Shukla and P.F. Mathews-Harikrishna respectively.

Southern music maestro Illaiyaraja bagged the award for best background score for ‘Kerala Verma Pazhassi Raja ‘, which also won the best Malayalam film award. Resul Pookutty got the best sound designer for the same film.

‘Kutty Srank’ saw Shaji N. Karun and Mammootty join hands for the first time. And the filmmaker is overjoyed with the string of awards.

‘I am very happy as a Malayali to have got this award. I have done four films and three of my films have won the National Award and I am happy,’ he said.

The film is about the story of a character (Mammootty) told from three different perspectives — by three women he was involved with at different stages of his life.

Oscar Award winner Resul Pookutty said he is elated with the national recognition.

‘The work I did for the film ‘Pazhasi Raja’ was different because the sound played a crucial role in the film,’ said Pookutty.



"Acting is not about winning or losing," says Mammootty.

"I have done my job," he said. "I have just reached here and during the next two to three weeks I am going to complete my Malayalam-Kannada film Shikari," Mammooty told IANS over telephone from Shimoga in Karnataka.


Regards[/tscii:ed8e4d7a65]

[tamizharasan]

I voted No for the poll, because Amitji is not the clear leader in the acting race yet. Ajay Devgan has won only two awards yet and Huge acting talents such as Saif and Anil kapoor has only one on their kitty. Let these things change first and it will automatically get its credibility.

[Bala (Karthik)]

Anil Oscar medaye erittaaru, NA ellam enna...
(Namma aalu Oscar vaanguna athana sandhoshathula adhu dhaan ore varutham)

[tamizharasan]

Anil Oscar medaye erittaaru, NA ellam enna...
(Namma aalu Oscar vaanguna athana sandhoshathula adhu dhaan ore varutham)

Honestly we should be worried about all these stuff. Because all these functions have hidden agenda. Academy is worried about the money they make in broadcasting that show. Even though oscar is million times better than our national award, still it is not 100% authentic. For example Kevin costner and sylvester stallone were nominated for oscars in acting category, though critics consider both of them are one of the worst actors ever produced by nature.

[Wibha]

Kutty Srank screenwriting beat Kaminey !

Hmm...padathai pAkkaNumE

Delhi-6 wins award for best film with social message


:rotfl: :rotfl:



Amitji on par with Kamal/Mammoo :cry:

Enthiran-kku thalaivarukku kudukkalai, kanyAkumAri-lerunthu kashmeeer varaikkum ellaa kadaiyilEyum tea kudippen.

:rotfl: :rotfl:

[MADDY]

May be should have been as an option.

i put "inconsistent" which would have swept the polls but somehow it didnt turn up :oops:

[Plum]

Ok, that seems to be a problem. I put up a poll where the last option(agassi) didn't show up. Hub softwarela bug-gu

[MADDY]

Most certainly agree that Rajini > Amitabh.
IIRC last time indha argument vandhappO the only strong naysayer was equanimar. (yEdhO ennala mudinjadhu). Of course I may have seen less than 20 Amitabh films.

me too - i feel Amitabh is certainly > rajini sir......Don, Zanjeer, Abhiman, silsila and so many films where he completely remodelled the way hindi heroes perform those typecast role.......he had the ability to accelerate and put brakes as and when required......he also had a towering charisma and screen presence without any dependance on style.....post 2000, there is no scope for arguement - he has been marvellous.......chenni kum was a huge array of emotions which he mantled with very less effort.....

ofcourse, he cant do highly localised roles like mullum malarum but that one aspect is not strong enough for me........

[Plum]

muLLum malarum is not about localised role, Maddy. Watch it again. Watch how Rajini handles each emotion, scene - that goes beyond gesture, style charisma and screen presence. That was kALi, not Rajini. You never feel that way with Amit-ji ever. He is always Amit-ji. People diss Sharukh, Vijay et al that they always play themselves(or a specific aspect of their self) in all movies.

To me, Amit-ji is similar. Whether it is Black, Zanjeer or Bhootnath, the type of performance is the same.
His 70's good movies which you outlined(commercial and middle of the road) always had the same uptight, intense persona. The gestures, screen presence etc were similar. He had his 80's persona which was different but drew from the same well. Then back to 2000's, again he reverted to an intense, this time old, man roles.

Rajini can jujubee those roles now but I guess he wont becausee he really doesnt need to act now. Above anything else, I dont see him feeling any need now to prove himself as an actor. I guess he is satisfied with what he is now.

In short, 70's Rajini>> 70's Amit-ji. The masala versions catered to different markets and were humongously succesful, so you could say 80's Rajini=80's Amit-ji
But 90's masala Rajini was far more succesful so overall
masala Rajini > masala amit-ji (because mass success is the only criteria here)

2000's bachchan - Rajini hasnt played this game yet. So, Nadal 16 grand slams vAngara varaikkum he is not the GOAT-nu nAn(en thrupthikkAga) solikkarA madhiri, Rajini is not capable of matching Bachchan in this-nu sollikkalAm :-)

[equanimus]

Most certainly agree that Rajini > Amitabh.
IIRC last time indha argument vandhappO the only strong naysayer was equanimar.Absaleetly. No-contest 'ம்பாயிங்களே.

[Plum]

Are you agreeing with P_R absoleetly or emphasising the naysayer aspect.

Amit-ji>> Rajniniku konjam velVariyA sollungaLEn...

[equanimus]

I'm completely disagreeing, of course. வெலாவரியா அப்புறம் பேசுவோம். But ஒரு doubt. I don't see how 70s Rajini could be greater than 70s Bachchan. 70s was practically Bachchan's golden period. What are the films of Rajini that you have in mind?

[Plum]

What are the golden films of Bachchan in 70's?
Wait, I know it myself.
Anand(excellent supporting act), Abhimaan(not so great performance; movie was very good, role itself had little scope), Chupke Chupke(comic persona - no way this can be greater than Rajini's wide range in comic persona), Zanjeer(Intense - template for angry young man; again not beyond Rajini), Silsila/Deewar(replay Zanjeer comments), Don(general masala stuff - though Billa doesnt stand up, Rajini has many subsequent kickass stuff to match up), Amar Akbar and other Desai Gonsalves persona(I am deeply unappreciative of these and Amitji's comic turns - Rajini has done middle class visu humour, his own brand in TEO and Guru Sishyan, and some outstanding touches like the one in UzhaippaLi I keep quoting - Bachchan is more of Anthony Gonsalves in humour/comedy and nothing else).

Romance - documented weak point of Amit-ji. JohnnylAm....(En, En, En...in response to naan apdi thAn pEsuvEn...:bow: )
(Think Amitji-VinodMehra-Rakhee movies for comparitive attempt by Amitji on romance)

Rajini as a villain - no chance for Amit-ji. (yeah, yeah, RGV ki Aag and all we have seen. And what was before that - Rakesh Mehra's first movie, Aks, was it? Busssss..was more like it)

When I say villain, I dont mean it in the nambiar sense. A relentlessly everyday evil, wicked man. Like in avargaL, mUndru mudichu.

Have you seen all of Rajini's 70's movies?

padikkAdhavan vs KhuddAr - watch Rajini when Nagesh dies, the respectful body language towards NT in the final scenes, reaction the thambi's betrayal. Amit-ji not in the same planet. And even the scenes with Ambika, the comedy, Amitji hams in the pregnant-with-liquor-bottles scenes.

And finally muLLum malarum - boss, that one is enough. Nothing that AB did matches up ever.

Angry/Intense/both Young man in various forms - sums up Bachchan of 70's
B Grade masala actor - Bachchan of 80's - albeit a very good one.
Stern patriarch in various forms - this sums up Bachchan of the 90's and 2000's. Isnt that too limited?

[Plum]

Yeah, I didnt list Rajini's 70's movies. It was a general response.

Some performances of Rajni in 70's Bachchan cannot manage in another 7 jenmams:

1. thappu thALangaL
2. avargaL/mUndru mudichu
3. 16 V
4. Above all, muLLum malarum.

And that's not exhaustive. Just look at the versatility, the variety, and not just width but depth in each of these. Compare that with the single note (intense young man) of Amitji in 70's.
I mean, it is a no contest in Rajini's favour.

[MADDY]

enna equanimar padichittu poittaaru - vaanga sir respond pannunga :P

branding Amitabh as a "single note" actor itself is not acceptable to me.......cheeni kum comes to my mind immediately since he just did everything in the movie - the scene where tabu returns his pulao - i thought he had multiple gestures lined up one after another conveying a sumaar-written scene......IMHO, rajini can never do that.....

secondly, Amitabh's Don and rajini's Billa - Amitabh simply outplays rajini.......the control and poise that amitabh had for a don role was unmatched - rajini was really not a international don, he looked like a mere local rowdy......

interestingly, to me, rajini lost the plot(acting) in 80's and completely lost after thalabadhy.......

[Cinefan]

NA awards are agenda driven,lost their value the day Anil kapoor won it for Pukar,Saif for Hum tum and Priyanka/Kangna for Fashion.

As for Amitabh,he was good in Paa,have not seen Mammotty's films last year and so cannot compare.Was Amit's National award worthy-not so sure.

But one thing,am sure Kamal and Ilayaraja have given more award worthy stuff and from the little I have seen of Lal and Mammotty,they sure deserve more than what they have won.

[Plum]

It speaks of bollywood brainwashing that you expect an International Don to be suave and stylish only. A guy looking like a local rowdy can and probably is a typical profile for an international Don. Afterall, Dawood Ibrahim is not a looker, is he?
Lining up gestures - it is not about that either. He was still a patriarchal old man fully in control of his circumstances. His comfort zone is very much there.

If you deny his single note in 70's - his golden period - tell me where am I wrong about that.

A straight comparison of Don to Billa to make a definitive judgement is what I find insincere analysis.

It seems to me it finally boils down to surface attributes - who is polished, who is more poised etc. Fair enough since those are the only terms in which one can prop up Amitki over Rajini.
Over to kid_glove!

[MADDY]

If you deny his single note in 70's - his golden period - tell me where am I wrong about that.

theres lot of difference in sholay and a zanjeer..........he did a range of roles in 70s and he never came across as single note - he could do variations well enough......


A straight comparison of Don to Billa to make a definitive judgement is what I find insincere analysis.

well, thats just one of the many amitabh remakes that rajini did........infact for every rajini movie of 80's - there was a amitabh performance as a template to be bettered upon......that itself is a testimony to amitabh........


It seems to me it finally boils down to attributes - who is polished, who is more poised etc. Fair enough since those are the only terms in which one can prop up Amitki over Rajini.Over to kid_glove!

not really, even depth wise, amitabh was great..

[Plum]

What are those variations? Even equa is holding back from elaborating that. I suspect he'll come up with is variation really a criteria, which is fair enough.

[AravindMano]

cheeni kum comes to my mind immediately since he just did everything in the movie

:exactly:

[Plum]

Everything-nA? diving, running, jumbing ellAmA?

[MADDY]

wat variationsa - namak haram, abhiman, parwaana in 70s - i dont think he was just a "intense" actor, he was more than that........anyways, i would wait for equa's views -

[MADDY]

Everything-nA? diving, running, jumbing ellAmA?

actually, yeah :lol:

[MADDY]

infact i do not find any difference between billa rajini's body language and gayathri rajini body language - rendum onnu dhaane.....

[Sarna]

Rajini vs Amitab'aa ?

Kamal > Rajini'nu sonnaalE, naan oththukka maattEn.... idhula Amitab > Rajini :banghead:

[Plum]

Namak Haram - intense young man again. The key note is in the confrotnation with close friend over ideology. Another variation of angry young man.
Parwana - intense lover; another incarnation of the angry young man.
Abhimaan - not very intense but an ordinarry role not requiring much

Either Amitji is this intense, brooding persona(and in seemingly varied array of films as wide in Range as Anand, Parwana, Zanjeer, Silsila - but all shades of the same persona) or this goofy, comic superhero(AAA, Naseeb, whole plethora of 70's-80's Desai masala).

Infact, the two directors he came to be identified by - Prakash Mehra and Manmohan Desai - represent these two persona. Mehra, the former and Desai the latter

What I am saying is that in retrospect, his acclaimed 70's performances, when seen through the prism of the two major personae marking his signature, seem to fall in one or the other definitively. I dont think you can say that of Rajini.
Billa and Gayathri, you said. What about avargaL/mUndru mudichu - ofcourse, you see some common gestures, shades and expressions between these two but in comparison to billa and mumu?

What about Thyagu and thappu thALangaL? Are they remotely in the same mould as any other Rajini performance.

Johnny and Vidyasagar - arent they unique performances? Does Vidyasagar's comedic effect have anything in common with AAK Chandran or Guru in Guru Sishyan?
Whereas Amitji's comedy invariably will have shades of Anthony Gonsalves.

And Johnny - romance. Amitji loses deposit, zimbly.

[Sarna]

time to lock this thread :rant:

[Waterloo]

Infact Rajini used to copy Amitabh. So it says all :lol:

Rajini today is more of a masala actor. What he did during his formative years were all thanks to Kamal's generosity.

But for some few movies like Mullum, Jonny , rest are pucca masala movies. In comparison, majority of Amitabh's old movies are still watchable.

Besides, Amitabh today is playing better roles than our Shivaji Sir did during these years.

Rajini Amit comparison is ridiculous.

[Waterloo]

Add

There were a series of comedy movies which RK downloaded fm Bollywood to Kollywood. Just observe how he had acted in those . All straight copies of Amitabh.

[Waterloo]

Movies like Silsila, Abiman, Sholay ! No comparison pls.

I dare Rajini to do a Baghban . First let him come out of the masala mindset. He tried Valli. We all know the outcome. Chandramukhi was ok but again he had to lift from Malayalam >> Kannada >>

[MADDY]

WL, though rajini remade amitabh movies, he had his own stamp......

btw, kutty srank paathe aaganum - how it is better than DevD :evil: .........watched some scenes of DevD - hulchul si towards climax - hair-rising energy of expression 8-)

[kid-glove]

Plum, I tilt slightly towards Amitabh, but the gap isn't wide or conclusive as it is made out to be, in fact, it's so small that finding Rajini superior on quite a few counts is reasonable..

[kid-glove]

Rajini had his own stamp, even if he remade those Bachchan films. Irony is that the remakes were poor in terms of execution, almost always. Except for Rajini's persona, which markedly differs from Amitabh. If at all it owes to anybody, it's NT!

[kid-glove]

Kutty Srank is a must-watch. I'm just basing it on Shaji N Karun's masterwork, Vanaprastham. And based on Lal's work there, I'm much looking forward to Mammooka's performance here. Paa :lol2:

[Plum]

k_g, nIngaLum edhirkatchiyA? idhu theriyAma nAn reNdu mUNu dhadava ticket vAngittEnE!

seri, nAn grouch-ku PM paNNikkarEn.

sarNA, do you want me to answer now why I, seemingly, indulge in anti-Bachchan propoganda always?

[Plum]

Rajini had his own stamp, even if he remade those Bachchan films. Irony is that the remakes were poor in terms of execution, almost always. Except for Rajini's persona, which markedly differs from Amitabh. If at all it owes to anybody, it's NT!

Exactly- "Rajini copied Amitabh", "Rajini does only masala" are all lame arguments with no factual basis. Infact, my respect for rajini is probably rooted in his being ekalavyan to NT's Drona.

Comparing the Amitji remakes is really pointless considering the directors involved and the economics and the respective target markets.

And anyone who says Rajini copied Amitabh's acting in those movies....no comments!

[Plum]

I dare Rajini to do a Baghban .

:rotfl3:

[Plum]

There were a series of comedy movies which RK downloaded fm Bollywood to Kollywood

engE konjam movies pEru sollunga pArpOm? Series of Comedy movies-A? Rightu.

(or are you implying that Mard, Trishul, Laawaris were all comedy movies - well, if you think so, then poor amitji, he intended them as regular masala :rotfl2: )

[Plum]

Besides, Amitabh today is playing better roles than our Shivaji Sir did during these years.

I really wonder...the fact that Amitji is not doing downright ridiculous roles like NT somehow got into during his 60's is one thing.
But are these of absolute merit is another question altogether.

RGV ki Aag is much different from what NT got during his twilight years but is that necessarily a great performance?

Baghban itself is a variation of Vaazhkai. So there.

Bhootnath etc - no comments. indha kuppaikku NT paNNina kuppai oNNum kuraichal illai.

You really have an handful of movies that stand out like Black, Farhan's second movie(what was its name?), and a few others. In all such, Bachchan was this scenery chewing, high baritone, dialogue spewing personality so I say Bachchan has his own rut.

By the same token, NT had a handful of movies that stood out in his 60's.
It is just a matter of perspective.

[kid-glove]

Truth is that Rajini could afford to do those Bachchan remakes and create his own stamp. Even if the plot alone were remade, the way Rajini rendered the role holds its own forte. While Bachchan had remade films of NT, Kamal and hold your breath, Sarath Kumar, and hasn't upstage any of 'em. In fact, he didn't impress me at all. I say this because I read people claiming him to be one of the greatest star-actors in planet earth. Star, undoubtedly! But as an actor? he has rough edges IMO..

[MADDY]

I say this because I read people claiming him to be one of the greatest star-actors in planet earth. Star, undoubtedly! But as an actor? he has rough edges IMO..

lets settle some things - is "hype" the big problem here? if we keep away the hype - do u agree Amitabh is a great actor??

[kid-glove]

Great? I reserve that for specimen like NT, Kamal, Lal, Mammootty.

I find Big B to be very very good, but one or two notches below absolute greatness. Just my opinion. Tho He's the best lead actor in Hindi cinema for a while now. Aamir, SRK, Kruthigai, ah :lol2:

[Sarna]

I have seen few movies ranging from his early days to recent ones like aag, nishabdh, paa of Amitabh and IMHO Amitabh is very good actor. But that doesnt mean that Amitabh(both as actor and star) is better than Kamal or Rajini. And saying like Amitabh > Rajini/Kamal, is a great insult to Rajini and Kamal.

Even Amitabh is lesser as an actor and better as a star than the next two sets prabhu and karthik :)

Wait.... as a star, Amitab is lesser than Vijaykanth :)

[Sarna]

But amitabh is the best actor and star among bollywood heroes :) thats it :)

[MADDY]

Great? I reserve that for specimen like NT, Kamal, Lal, Mammootty.

I find Big B to be very very good, but one or two notches below absolute greatness. Just my opinion. Tho He's the best lead actor in Hindi cinema for a while now. Aamir, SRK, Kruthigai, ah :lol2:

good to see no rajini as well there :D

even i have similar opinion on amitabh - he is surely a very very good actor :D.......

[Plum]

Great? I reserve that for specimen like NT, Kamal, Lal, Mammootty.

I find Big B to be very very good, but one or two notches below absolute greatness. Just my opinion. Tho He's the best lead actor in Hindi cinema for a while now. Aamir, SRK, Kruthigai, ah :lol2:

Amen.

Really, we cant bandy about the word great just like that, can we? The above 4 mentioned by kid had some absolutely great roles, great performances in great movies.

Amit-ji's whole masala career can be written off in the acting stakes. That leaves his 70's and thesp stuff post 2000's.
70's stuff is not really comparable to the great performances of the Kamal-M-M triumvirate by any scale. Post 2000's character artist stuff is being discussed only because it is amitji the star doing it. Otherwise, they should be compared to various character actors like Puri, Shah, SV Rangarao stuff in tamil 60's, maybe nAttamai Vijayakumar stuff in some of those roles, Nambiyar roles in his character artiste mould etc. (Amitji as a failed security officer trying to fight his ghosts to protect a new charge - :yawn: nambiyar used to do such stuff in 80's).

What's happening is that the combination of his stardom and the bookending of it with these above-average roles and performances is giving the illusion of a great actor.

Kamal-M-M actually straddled stardom and acting chops simultaneously throughout their career. Now, that is greatness.

I deliberately left out NT because it is a sin to take his name in this context.

As for Rajini, ofcourse, Rajini the actor was lost in his superstardom. Nevertheless, even in his masala movies, Rajini brings the inner NT in him, and actually gives performances that are more than just Gonsalves-cum-VijayMalhotra.

Well, maybe a Rajni stint like Amitji post Lal Badshah venturing into character roles might settle this but fortunately or unfortunately, Rajni doesnt have a need to do it.

Remember that Amitabh was such a "great" star that he was forced to turn to character roles by the time he reached 60's - just to survive. Whereas Rajni kisses his daughter-in-law at the same age so even stardome wise, nIngaLE kootti kazhichu pArthukkunga.

[Sarna]

Remember that Amitabh was such a "great" star that he was forced to turn to character roles by the time he reached 60's - just to survive. Whereas Rajni kisses his daughter-in-law at the same age so even stardome wise, nIngaLE kootti kazhichu pArthukkunga.

Why going upto Rajini.... Vijaykanth is still a Star :)

[equanimus]

Some performances of Rajni in 70's Bachchan cannot manage in another 7 jenmams:

1. thappu thALangaL
2. avargaL/mUndru mudichu
3. 16 V
4. Above all, muLLum malarum.

And that's not exhaustive.Plum,
Incomplete as this may be, one already gets a sense of scraping the bottom. And I'm not much of a fan of his performances in KB's films. I think he's much better in avaL appadiththAn (where he brings a totally different dimension to the exact same role). For Bachchan on the other hand, there are a variety of roles in 70s. His angry young man is of course the most influential, followed by his Manmohan Desai roles. But he's excellent in other kinds of roles too. Even within the Hrishikesh Mukherjee-Basu Chatterjee universe, he's very different in films like Anand, Mili etc. than in Manzil, Jurmana, etc., which is in turn very different from Alaap and so on. And like PR, even I haven't seen very many of his films, but have seen enough to say that he's a fantastic actor and, as an actor, leagues ahead of Rajini.

And I have a major problem with people trying to put forth the 70s Rajini as the answer whenever it comes to a question about acting. One, we're basically talking about a handful of films (primarily the ones with Mahendran and KB and then perhaps a couple more), and more importantly, the real Rajini happened after these films. I've written about this (http://mayyam.com/hub/viewtopic.php?p=1981636#1981636) earlier too.

[equanimus]

IMHO Amitabh is very good actor. But that doesnt mean that Amitabh(both as actor and star) is better than Kamal or Rajini. And saying like Amitabh > Rajini/Kamal, is a great insult to Rajini and Kamal.

Even Amitabh is lesser as an actor and better as a star than the next two sets prabhu and karthik :)

Wait.... as a star, Amitab is lesser than Vijaykanth :)ஆகா! அதாவது கிட்டத்தட்ட நட்சத்திரவரிசையில வர்ற எல்லா தமிழ் நடிகர்களுமே வேற league 'ன்றீங்க. ஏதோ ஒரு விதத்துல அமிதாப் அவங்களுக்குக் கீழ தான் இருக்கார். ஆனா இந்தி சினிமாவப் பொறுத்தவரை அவர் தான் best actor, star எல்லாமே.

[Sarna]

srihari, ennOda opinion oru pakkam irukkattum :)
Let me ask few questions.... Can Amitab do a Ramana or Chinna gounder or Captain prabahkaran ? or even a Vaidehi ?

[equanimus]

இப்படி எல்லாம் பிரிச்சுப் பார்த்து (என்னால) speculate செய்ய முடியும்னு எனக்குத் தோணல. இருந்தாலும், ஒரு பேச்சுக்குச் சொல்றேன். நீங்க சொல்ற இந்த roles 'ஐ எல்லாம் சாதாரணமா இதை விட பல மடங்கு பிரமாதமாவே செஞ்சிடுவார். அதுக்கான star wattage அவருக்கு இல்லைன்னு சொல்ல வரீங்களா?!

[Plum]

where he brings a totally different dimension to the exact same role
Doesnt that tell you something? ;-)

Infact, you have said in one phrase what I have been trying to convey with essays.

[equanimus]

That tells me a lot about how Rudraiah envisioned his film, as a response of sorts to KB that, "this is how you should have been making your films."

[Plum]

Some performances of Rajni in 70's Bachchan cannot manage in another 7 jenmams:

1. thappu thALangaL
2. avargaL/mUndru mudichu
3. 16 V
4. Above all, muLLum malarum.

And that's not exhaustive.Plum,
Incomplete as this may be, one already gets a sense of scraping the bottom. And I'm not much of a fan of his performances in KB's films. I think he's much better in avaL appadiththAn (where he brings a totally different dimension to the exact same role). For Bachchan on the other hand, there are a variety of roles in 70s. His angry young man is of course the most influential, followed by his Manmohan Desai roles. But he's excellent in other kinds of roles too. Even within the Hrishikesh Mukherjee-Basu Chatterjee universe, he's very different in films like Anand, Mili etc. than in Manzil, Jurmana, etc., which is in turn very different from Alaap and so on. And like PR, even I haven't seen very many of his films, but have seen enough to say that he's a fantastic actor and, as an actor, leagues ahead of Rajini.

And I have a major problem with people trying to put forth the 70s Rajini as the answer whenever it comes to a question about acting. One, we're basically talking about a handful of films (primarily the ones with Mahendran and KB and then perhaps a couple more), and more importantly, the real Rajini happened after these films. I've written about this (http://mayyam.com/hub/viewtopic.php?p=1981636#1981636) earlier too.

You know that it is not exhaustive. You not liking his KB performances is only a subjective fact. It is a valid form of acting and a top notch performance given the parameters. nALaiku grouch varattum - innum neraiyavE vELiya varum.

Indeed, the fact that Amit-ji is limited to what he can do in specific ways only is precisely my point.

I know you have written before and the fact that many people prop up Rajini's 70's record is precisely the one that puts you off, just like the hype for Amitji puts me off and forces me to be militantly against his deification.

I really dont buy the Anand/Mili is different frfom Zanjeer/Deewar is different from Alaap/Manzil.

Anand/Mili is exactly the same way he plays Zanjeer/Deewar. The characters are different so it is not obviously a xerox. I dont remember much of Alaap/Manzil - but perhaps, you are just adding a third template to AYM and AG. I think Silsila showed his limitations clearly - do you consider it a great performance? And ofcourse, Alaap/Manzil arent his great performances or the most remembered ones - doesnt that tell you something?

And as I told before and you yourself added to, Rajini has many dimensions, too. Infact, within the comedy part of it, he has more templates than Amitji does, who has exactly one template - Anthony G
You yourself pointed out how he plays the *exact* same character differently in AAA and KB films.

So, whether it is playing a range of characters or the same character in different ways, Rajini is ahead.

[equanimus]

Infact, you have said in one phrase what I have been trying to convey with essays.You're trying to miss the point now. My point is I personally don't find him as good as most other people in his KB films. Even with Mahendran, it's just two films: muLLum malarum (in which he's no doubt sparkling) and Johnny.

[Plum]

That tells me a lot about how Rudraiah envisioned his film, as a response of sorts to KB that, "this is how you should have been making your films."

I quite dont agree to it. KB had his vision, and to expect him to have made his films as Rudriah did later is unfair, patently. If you are attributing Thyagu to Rudriah , then I think you are being grossly unfair. So, should I attribute Black to Bhansali and Khakee to Santoshi?

[Sarna]

அதுக்கான star wattage அவருக்கு இல்லைன்னு சொல்ல வரீங்களா?!

naan ennikkO oru naal ungakitta, neenga thamizh'la ezhudhunga, appadhaan enakkum puriyum'nu sonnadha innum gnaabagam vachchikittu thamizh ezhudhuradhukku en nandrigal pala :bow: :bow:

ramana'vayE eduththunga...adhu paakkuradhukku normal vigilant shanker movie with less cinematic masala maadhiri theriyum.... but vijaykanth'Oda acting'Oda intensity level pala edangal'la kamal range'ku irukkum :bow: :bow:

pEchchukku illaama serious'aave sollunga... can Amitab do better than vijaykanth in Ramana ?
IMHO, amitab cant :)

[app_engine]

can Amitab do better than vijaykanth in Ramana ?
IMHO, amitab cant :)

ஹே, நம்ம ஆனஸ்ட்டு "கூடு விட்டுக்கூடு" பாஞ்சிட்டாரா?

[Plum]

Infact, you have said in one phrase what I have been trying to convey with essays.You're trying to miss the point now. My point is I personally don't find him as good as most other people in his KB films. Even with Mahendran, it's just two films: muLLum malarum (in which he's no doubt sparkling) and Johnny.

Well, that's a fairly unique perspective considering he stole the show in most of his KB films.

I think the way we are talking about quantity, Mahendran himself will be reduced in stature compared to say, Manirathnam or KB, which I staunchly feel uncomfortable about.

I can reduce Amitji's good acting to 1 or 2 films, too.

It is not a fair way to assess

[app_engine]

Once we have RK's "prosthetic make up thingy" released, there should be another "dimension" to compare AB v/s RK v/s KH :-)

[equanimus]

[tscii:64fdfe07b8]
I quite dont agree to it. KB had his vision, and to expect him to have made his films as Rudriah did later is unfair, patently. If you are attributing Thyagu to Rudriah , then I think you are being grossly unfair.I don't see it as a matter of who ‘created’ it at all. Just because someone else envisioned it, it doesn't take away the credit from the actor. Salim-Javed wrote the angry young man roles and Amitabh played them. Their respective roles can't be separated and seen. With avaL appadiththAn though, the difference is obviously that it was a one-off avant-garde film. It came and it went. It's not just Rajini, even Kamal's performance here is quite removed from his regular films.

So, should I attribute Black to Bhansali and Khakee to Santoshi?To a good extent, yes. Santoshi though borrows quite a bit from Bachchan's yesteryear persona.[/tscii:64fdfe07b8]

[kid-glove]

Plum,
I'm equally skeptical about new-found discovery of Amitabh as a capable actor (as you, I think he had no choice but to relegate himself to find work, he lost the market of 70's/80's), as he always had a good streak of character roles in him, BUT it'd be just as "scrapping the barrel" (to borrow Equa's phrase on Rajini): Anand, Saudagar, Main azad hoon, Mili, etc were few and far between. He made loads of crap in between. And there was a significant gap before he became a full-time character actor for aforementioned reason - the decline of star status. But even in these character roles, I'd not put it like they were completely uninhibited from Amitabh's persona. In fact, he's handicapped a bit in this regard. Much much more than K-M-M ! One notable exception being Paa, and it's non-starter to discuss acting capabilities. If they wanted to go something like John Hurt in Elephant Man, I'd say they failed a lot. And as an example, Hurt's performance doesn't match Deniro's in Raging Bull - which is how I'd contrast Paa vs Paleri/Pazhassi or Bhramaram. The Elephant man was much more effective and worth noting than Auro. Apart from Raaja's score, nothing worked for me. I'd pick better examples to display some of the highs of Big B's acting, Bachchan's initimate scene with Rani in Black, dinner table scene in Nishabd when "this Humbert" breaks down to laughter (As he hides his weakness) , Long shot of deeply shaken Bachchan making up the stairs and delivering that speech in Rann. There's nothing in Paa that comes off as poignant and nuanced as these films. He was more of a passive robot in Paa! Yet, I have to add that neither of these films came off as 'award winning performance' to me. You find 'em falling short in comparison to deserving winners of the year, or, inconsistent. Take for instance, Schizoid scenes and hamming portions of Black cancels some of the good acting he does in the film. Last Lear is tour-de-force of excessive acting - we get the point that he's veteran of theater and the bard, but he failed to bring out nuance anywhere (in stead, annoys playing an already annoying character, where's the craft here? Shouldn't a great actor show there's a vulnerable man in every past-his-best curmudgeon? Think Gloria Swanson in Sunset boulevard made infinitely worse by bachchan. Lot of analogies to Bachchan's career should have been capitalized upon, and even when the writer/director sets such moments, Bachchan fails to pick on this and earn our feelings ) - he made Arjun Rampal look as deviously restraint, and nuanced as Mohanlal! :lol2: What pisses one off, is this relentless motion in place to make him seem the numero uno of 'Indian' cinema. Both in stardom and acting. I find it amusing that NA find odd ways to boost his profile. Take Agneepath, Main Azad hoon was far better than that. I think they came out around the same time, I could be wrong. But were they "better" than Thazhvaram/Kireedom, or better than Apoorva/MMKR or better than Oru Vadakkan Veeragatha/Mathilukal. I guess not.

[app_engine]

One point in favor of RK - his performances in negative shades (MM/MM/16V/AA - even "the boss" portions / CM climax) are "great" - they're NT / M&M levels IMO.

[Plum]

I think OVV lost out to Agneepath! That's how grossly unfair it is.
And what I find a little perplexing is that equa, while being put off by proppers-up of Rajni's 70's acting to add sheen to Rajini, is not at all put off by a much bigger conspiracy to make Amitji look more of a star and actor than he is.

And as you pointed out, if we are talking of scraping the bottom, Amitji's side will really have to do much more of scraping.

The fact is that people are going more by the dazzling "Amitabh has turned from star into actor post 2000's" narrative, which, even if you anlayse slightly doesnt hold up at all!

[equanimus]

Well, that's a fairly unique perspective considering he stole the show in most of his KB films.Just to clarify though, I said I don't find it as good as a lot of people here. I do think he's effective in those roles, but quite one-dimensional. He plays these negative roles in a rather showoffy manner, which I'm not that big a fan of. In avaL appadiththAn OTOH, he plays it in a commonplace sense that gives it a serious edge. That's about it.

I think the way we are talking about quantity, Mahendran himself will be reduced in stature compared to say, Manirathnam or KB, which I staunchly feel uncomfortable about.

I can reduce Amitji's good acting to 1 or 2 films, too.

It is not a fair way to assessI see what you mean here, but I don't mean to insist on a quantitative look in a strict sense. I'm just interested in what the performances meant to the larger narrative of the actor's career, choices of roles etc. This naturally reflects in the quantity to a certain extent.

So, to respond to the directors analogy, Mahendran's stature is big because he did make quite a few films that are of a certain standard. Making 10 films is big enough for a director, no?

[equanimus]

I think OVV lost out to Agneepath! That's how grossly unfair it is.Not to defend the National Awards (for which I don't care at all, except as "general knowledge"), but Mammootty won for OVV, didn't he? Incidentally, he has the rather strange record of winning the award for 2 performances (i.e. in two different films the same year), not once but twice!

[Plum]

I'm just interested in what the performances meant to the larger narrative of the actor's career, choices of roles etc
Applying this to Amitji, did Amitji really choose or have a choice of roles? I think he just was left with no other option in each stage of his career.

His 2000's version was a necessity converted into a virtue.

[equanimus]

And what I find a little perplexing is that equa, while being put off by proppers-up of Rajni's 70's acting to add sheen to Rajini, is not at all put off by a much bigger conspiracy to make Amitji look more of a star and actor than he is. The important difference is 70s was Bachchan's golden period, as 80s and 90s was for Rajini. Also note that, whether talking about Bachchan the actor or Bachchan the star, we talk about films from more or less the same era. This is crucial to the point I was making about 70s Rajini.

[equanimus]

I'm just interested in what the performances meant to the larger narrative of the actor's career, choices of roles etc
Applying this to Amitji, did Amitji really choose or have a choice of roles? I think he just was left with no other option in each stage of his career.

His 2000's version was a necessity converted into a virtue.Oh the last thing I care about is the actor's original intentions! Surely I can do with a different word than 'choice' here. The point is about how things actually panned out, the overall trajectory of the roles the actor gets to play.

[Plum]

equa, with due respect, the star bachchan was in the 80's when he shouldered largely ordinary movies.

In 70's, it was in two parts. Anand, Abhimaan etc pre-date the star of Zanjeer/Deewar etc.
A few attempts at alternate like Milap, Manzil etc actually flopped. So did Silsila. And these arent really great performances either. One could compare to 6-to-60, EKK etc which were Rajni's comparable alternate attempts during his stardom. Yes, I dont dig them either.

Really speaking, Amitji is the older man therefore he pre-dated Rajini in whatever the latter did.

Consider this

Amitji comes into movies - does bits-and-pieces roles, which are neither memorable for his performance, nor in great movies, save an odd Parwana.

Rajini comes into movies - does bits and pieces stuff, for what, 1 or 2 movies, and graduates into heavy weight roles quickly

Amitji gets Anand, Abhimaan, Mili and does really well mostly - Anand towers above the rest in this group while Abhim, Mili are okay performances.
Rajini doesnt have significant comparable work in these terms but he continues to be a star villain, and does add up to a significant body of work during this period - you may disagree with his KB movies performances as great but they are definitely much better than what Amitji got in a comparable period of his career.

Amitji gets Zanjeer and moves on to become a star

Rajini becomes a hero and moves on to become a star

Amitji does a few flop attempts at acting chops parallel to his herogiri. Ditto for Rajini

Without sweating about 70's, 80's, you can see that it is just a matter of chronology.

Amitji's golden period - early-to-late 70's- about 10 years when he straddled Anand, Abhimaan, Mili and Zanjeer, Tirshul, Kabhie Kabhie(an ordinary performance btw), Deewar, AAA, Paravarish etc.

Rajini's golden period - mid-70's-to-Till Date - starting with excellent perrformances in KB and Mahendran films, not to mention Sridhar, Rudriah and other ordinary films wher he acquitted himself quite well. The actor really disappeared largely after mid-80's but even during his masala period, unlike Bachchan, he displayed acting chops both in his masala films(where he went beyond dialogue delivery and standard templates, which is what Bachchan did in his masala movies) and made quite a few other films. Bachchanm OTOH, ceased to be part of meaningful movies or masala roles requiring him to really act even a little bit from late 70's until his reinvention.

[Plum]

I think OVV lost out to Agneepath! That's how grossly unfair it is.Not to defend the National Awards (for which I don't care at all, except as "general knowledge"), but Mammootty won for OVV, didn't he? Incidentally, he has the rather strange record of winning the award for 2 performances (i.e. in two different films the same year), not once but twice!I didnt know that - I thought he won just for MadhilugaL. Hmm...still, Agneepath isnt quite a performacne to be talked about.

[Plum]

I'm just interested in what the performances meant to the larger narrative of the actor's career, choices of roles etc
Applying this to Amitji, did Amitji really choose or have a choice of roles? I think he just was left with no other option in each stage of his career.

His 2000's version was a necessity converted into a virtue.Oh the last thing I care about is the actor's original intentions! Surely I can do with a different word than 'choice' here. The point is about how things actually panned out, the overall trajectory of the roles the actor gets to play.
Sticking to Amitji, can you actually put together what this means in the context of Amitji?

[kid-glove]

I think OVV lost out to Agneepath! That's how grossly unfair it is.Not to defend the National Awards (for which I don't care at all, except as "general knowledge"), but Mammootty won for OVV, didn't he? Incidentally, he has the rather strange record of winning the award for 2 performances (i.e. in two different films the same year), not once but twice!I didnt know that - I thought he won just for MadhilugaL. Hmm...still, Agneepath isnt quite a performacne to be talked about.
Just checked, Mamm won for both OVV/Mathilukal. Btw, Agneepath is a performance to be talked about. In negative terms. How to not play a 'character'! :P

[Plum]

And what I find a little perplexing is that equa, while being put off by proppers-up of Rajni's 70's acting to add sheen to Rajini, is not at all put off by a much bigger conspiracy to make Amitji look more of a star and actor than he is. The important difference is 70s was Bachchan's golden period, as 80s and 90s was for Rajini. Also note that, whether talking about Bachchan the actor or Bachchan the star, we talk about films from more or less the same era. This is crucial to the point I was making about 70s Rajini.

I actually dont understand the significance of this.
1. We are saying Bachchan's significant body of work is restricted to a decade.
2. He straddle stardom and acting greatness simultaneously? This is untrue, equa!!!!! He didnt- all his attempts at acting chops during his stardom period flopped and/or were ordinary acting attempts. Anand etc pre-date his stardom.

[Plum]

To be fair, what was the competition to Agneepath. Which year was this?

But heck, I know it is the late 80's, the golden period of MFI, so one or the other M is sure to have had a great performance in whichever year agneepath was!

[Puliyan_Biryani]

Just checked, Mamm won for both OVV/Mathilukal. Btw, Agneepath is a performance to be talked about. In negative terms. How to not play a 'character'! :P
Wasn't this inspired (rather heavily) from Pacino's Scarface?

[kid-glove]

Yes, I fully disagree on Amitabh 'straddling both simultaneously'. That's an illusion hardcore Bachchan fans (incl. 'critics' like Khalid and paeans in magazines like Jitesh Pillai) have successfully propagated over the decades...

[Sarna]

can Amitab do better than vijaykanth in Ramana ?
IMHO, amitab cant :)

ஹே, நம்ம ஆனஸ்ட்டு "கூடு விட்டுக்கூடு" பாஞ்சிட்டாரா?

have u seen the remake of Suryavamsan in which Amitab replaced Sarathkumar ?

[kid-glove]

Just checked, Mamm won for both OVV/Mathilukal. Btw, Agneepath is a performance to be talked about. In negative terms. How to not play a 'character'! :P
Wasn't this inspired (rather heavily) from Pacino's Scarface?
Yep. Scarface was excessive too, but it's at least addictive. Agneepath on the other hand :oops:

[Plum]

Oh I need groucho in this debate. That man can make far more points about 70's Rajini than I can. Not as a debate to be won but we'd learn a lot more about Rajini and his 70's work.

And equa, I really feel that you have fallen for the propoganda of Amitji being a star nad actor simultaneously. Having lived through it, i can assure you that is a patent lie propogated by the BPM through the years.

We can disagree on the acting capabilities of Rajini and Amitji, but these are facts that are being distorted and I find you echoing these distortions!

[MADDY]

//i think i know u Mr.P_B :P //

[Puliyan_Biryani]

Just checked, Mamm won for both OVV/Mathilukal. Btw, Agneepath is a performance to be talked about. In negative terms. How to not play a 'character'! :P
Wasn't this inspired (rather heavily) from Pacino's Scarface?
Yep. Scarface was excessive too, but it's at least addictive. Agneepath on the other hand :oops:
Scarface is one of my favorites (especially the later half when Pacino is almost completely paranoid). But I couldn't stand Amitabh or Mithun in Agneepath.

I haven't seen enough films of Amitabh, so will stay out of this discussion. Sorry for the digression.

[Plum]

//i think i know u Mr.P_B :P //

:roll:

yaaru saar indha figure-u?

[equanimus]

Hmm, but I think he's fantastic in Deewaar, Amar Akbar Anthony, Trishul etc. Anyway, it's not like I know his films inside out, guys, so don't have much else to say. I acknowledge the possibility of appreciating him better because I;m less familiar with his films (in comparison to Rajini). :)

[Plum]

but I think he's fantastic in Deewaar, Amar Akbar Anthony, Trishul

Dont like much of his Anthony Gonsalves. Deewar/Trishul - yes, charismatic, polished, brilliant - although I feel the dock worker of Deewar couldnt have been so polished and suave!

Actually, Gonsalves and his famous drunken, mirror monologue - mudilla range! idhukku nAN Vivek in front of mirror in padikkAdhavanE pathu muRai pArpEn!

[Puliyan_Biryani]

//i think i know u Mr.P_B :P //
//:shock: Please do tell me. I would also like to know me :D. But seriously, do you know me? //

[Plum]

Anyway, it's not like I know his films inside out, guys, so don't have much else to say. I acknowledge the possibility of appreciating him better because I;m less familiar with his films (in comparison to Rajini).
Maybe.

Actually, that is why I wanted you to list out why Amitji is great. It probably will help you re-assess in the light of availabe evidence.

[Plum]

Maddy, flease feeyem(PM) the identitfy of Fuli :-)

[kid-glove]

To be fair, what was the competition to Agneepath. Which year was this?

But heck, I know it is the late 80's, the golden period of MFI, so one or the other M is sure to have had a great performance in whichever year agneepath was!

Not just M, there was a major conspiracy Thilakan's performance in Perumthachan was overlooked !

Here's Thilakan's own take on this:


You almost won the National Award in 1990 for Perumthachan before Amitabh Bachchan walked away with it at the last minute for Agneepath.

Of course, Perumthachan was very special. Yes, I was tipped to win the award. It is a long story how I lost out at the last minute. It was almost decided the award would come my way.

Even Ashok Kumar, the jury chairman, was keen on giving me the award.

Others in the know told me that a top Congress politician, who was planning a comeback of sorts in power, wanted the award to be given to Bachchan to woo him to the Congress. He wanted Bachchan to woo the voters, and so wanted to keep Bachchan happy by conferring a National Award on him. Apparently, the top leader called up the jury and asked who the leading contender for the award was. When they said it was an actor from the South, he promptly told the jury head to award 'that fellow from the South next year.' The award went to Bachchan.

Quizzed by a Gulf daily why I was not given the award, Ashok Kumar said that 'it was a secret which can't be revealed.' I still have that newspaper with me. They also sought my reaction to the news. And that night, I lost my sleep, and confidence in awards.

[MADDY]

//i think i know u Mr.P_B :P //
//:shock: Please do tell me. I would also like to know me :D. But seriously, do you know me? //

:oops: summa oru bittu dhaanga potten - ur posts reminded me of old hubber selvakumar :P

[Sarna]

//i think i know u Mr.P_B :P //
//:shock: Please do tell me. I would also like to know me :D. But seriously, do you know me? //

:oops: summa oru bittu dhaanga potten - ur posts reminded me of old hubber selvakumar :P

puliyan_biriyani cant be selvakumar :)

[SoftSword]

cant be selva, i m 100% sure, selva cant hide and never can post out of his skin. :)

[Puliyan_Biryani]

//i think i know u Mr.P_B :P //
//:shock: Please do tell me. I would also like to know me :D. But seriously, do you know me? //

:oops: summa oru bittu dhaanga potten - ur posts reminded me of old hubber selvakumar :P
//velanguchu. ungaloda 5 MNC 12 Manager (engeyo padichen) paathadhunaala, neengadhaan en Engg. manager-onu oru nimisham bayandhutten. appaadaa ippodhaan moochu vandhuchu :D//

[Sarna]

puli :rotfl: u have lot of sense of humour man :thumbsup:

[Puliyan_Biryani]

cant be selva, i m 100% sure, selva cant hide and never can post out of his skin. :)
//Oh game restarted-a :D. Start meesic :happydance:

Please continue the predictions in "Guest of the week" thread. There is some serious discussion going on in this thread, lets leave it alone :D//

[SoftSword]

oh those threads are still active?
use to hav real fun in those threads before as a gang.

[Sarna]

There is some serious discussion going on in this thread, lets leave it alone

Amitab > Rajini appadinu panra discussion serious discussion'aa :o irundhaalum neenga romba kurumbu sir :lol2:

[MADDY]

//velanguchu. ungaloda 5 MNC 12 Manager (engeyo padichen) paathadhunaala, neengadhaan en Engg. manager-onu oru nimisham bayandhutten. appaadaa ippodhaan moochu vandhuchu :D//

:P ivalavu company maaruna manager enga aaguradhu........ennaikkume thondan dhaan :P

[Plum]

Idhu romba over. Apdi clearA there is daylight between rajni and amitjinu solla mudiyaadhu.
DiscussionE jokenu solradhu over.

What I was fighting was the notion that amitji >>Rajni, which is a result of propoganda, and conscious propoganda at that, by BpM through years

As you can see, people who only know Bachchan sketichily from his few good movies easily fall for it.

[Puliyan_Biryani]

There is some serious discussion going on in this thread, lets leave it alone

Amitab > Rajini appadinu panra discussion serious discussion'aa :o irundhaalum neenga romba kurumbu sir :lol2:
//ungalukku edhudhaan sir serious discussion. naalaikku ulagam azhiya pogudhunnu discussion nadandhakooda neenga :yes: :notthatway: :exactly:-nu edhavadhu periya periya banner-aa kaamichu comedy pannittu iruppeenga :D. modhalla indha banner ozhippu kazhagam-nu onnu aarambikkanum.

Plum, equanimus, kid-laam 70s, 80s-la nadandhadhai pathi pesittu irukkaanga, kettu therijukuvom.//

[Plum]

Kid, that shows the pathetic attitude of bachchan loyalists and how much conspiracy, propoganda and cheap tactics have been used to prop up Bachchan along other great actors of india, right upto cooking up an award for paa. Really shameful - if I were a bchchan fan, ild be ashamed

[tamizharasan]

To be fair, what was the competition to Agneepath. Which year was this?

But heck, I know it is the late 80's, the golden period of MFI, so one or the other M is sure to have had a great performance in whichever year agneepath was!

Not just M, there was a major conspiracy Thilakan's performance in Perumthachan was overlooked !

Here's Thilakan's own take on this:


You almost won the National Award in 1990 for Perumthachan before Amitabh Bachchan walked away with it at the last minute for Agneepath.

Of course, Perumthachan was very special. Yes, I was tipped to win the award. It is a long story how I lost out at the last minute. It was almost decided the award would come my way.

Even Ashok Kumar, the jury chairman, was keen on giving me the award.

Others in the know told me that a top Congress politician, who was planning a comeback of sorts in power, wanted the award to be given to Bachchan to woo him to the Congress. He wanted Bachchan to woo the voters, and so wanted to keep Bachchan happy by conferring a National Award on him. Apparently, the top leader called up the jury and asked who the leading contender for the award was. When they said it was an actor from the South, he promptly told the jury head to award 'that fellow from the South next year.' The award went to Bachchan.

Quizzed by a Gulf daily why I was not given the award, Ashok Kumar said that 'it was a secret which can't be revealed.' I still have that newspaper with me. They also sought my reaction to the news. And that night, I lost my sleep, and confidence in awards.


This happened many times before. I heard that even Sivakumar missed award that way for marupakkam. National award is big conspiracy and not worth discussing here for such a long time.

[raghavendran]

its really pathetic to c the standards go this much down..amitabh best actor of the country for paa in 2009...lollu sabha comedy..
this is bias to the core, :x

[app_engine]

And that night, I lost my sleep, and confidence in awards.


P_R, please note the pointtu :-)

[MADDY]

What I was fighting was the notion that amitji >>Rajni, which is a result of propoganda, and conscious propoganda at that, by BpM through years

well, to me, its not a notion but my opinion......watever i saw of Amitabh and rajini - i really feel Amitabh is the superior one.......infact i grew much closer to rajini-fanatism in TN than Bachan parivar morcha gang of north :lol:

[kid-glove]

Kid, that shows the pathetic attitude of bachchan loyalists and how much conspiracy, propoganda and cheap tactics have been used to prop up Bachchan along other great actors of india, right upto cooking up an award for paa. Really shameful - if I were a bchchan fan, ild be ashamed
:exactly:

[MADDY]

its really pathetic to c the standards go this much down..amitabh best actor of the country for paa in 2009...lollu sabha comedy..
this is bias to the core, :x

:rotfl: namma dhaane serndhu paathom indha padam

honestly in this movie, abhishek bachan beats the daylight out of amitabh - amitabh was horribly ridiculous in paa

[raghavendran]

its really pathetic to c the standards go this much down..amitabh best actor of the country for paa in 2009...lollu sabha comedy..
this is bias to the core, :x

:rotfl: namma dhaane serndhu paathom indha padam

honestly in this movie, abhishek bachan beats the daylight out of amitabh - amitabh was horribly ridiculous in paayea :x ..periye nadigaram :banghead:

[MADDY]

Idhu romba over. Apdi clearA there is daylight between rajni and amitjinu solla mudiyaadhu.
DiscussionE jokenu solradhu over.

reminds me of "sabai" scene:

Rajini fans, KG, sarna, AE: avan kitta ennada pesittu irukka, bottle-a eduthhu mandai-la podura
Plum: iru iru, yaarra avan, eppadi paathalum namma payyan da avan.....eppavum nidhanama pesanum
:P

[raghavendran]

Idhu romba over. Apdi clearA there is daylight between rajni and amitjinu solla mudiyaadhu.
DiscussionE jokenu solradhu over.

reminds me of "sabai" scene:

Rajini fans, KG, sarna, AE: avan kitta ennada pesittu irukka, bottle-a eduthhu mandai-la podura
Plum: iru iru, yaarra avan, eppadi paathalum namma payyan da avan.....eppavum nidhanama pesanum
:P :lol:

[raghavendran]

any1 knows the nominees for best acotr?..wonder how amitabh won it..but VA best regional film NA vangumbodhu,amitabh vangardhille onnum surprise ille..surely NAs lost its shine

[Nerd]

Infact Rajini used to copy Amitabh. So it says all :lol: .
Nakee, show me one instance where Rajini had copied Amitji's expressions (if there is more than one)?

A few important 70s films of Rajini are missing (BOK for example). Even if we completely leave out the 70s of Rajini, Amitji's 70s films << Rajini's 80s films like Padikkathavan, Velaikkaran, thambikku entha ooru, nallavanukku nallavan etc. The range of emotions and more importantly the ease at which he displayed those are unmatchable by Amitji.

[Nerd]

naan yErkanavE tungsten-la irukkEn, that a largely non-actor like Amitji has been conferred with three NAs, for three very very ordinary ferformances venaam vittrunga :hammer:

[Nerd]

And Plum-ji :bow:

[app_engine]

BTW, Maddy, I'm not anti-AB group :-)

மும்பைல ராசாவுக்கு இருக்கற ஒன்னோ ரெண்டோ ஃப்ரண்ட்ஸுல ஒருத்தர்.

அவருக்கில்லாத அவார்டா, இன்னும் ஒன்னு ரெண்டு வேண்ணாலும் கொடுங்கப்பா :-)

[Plum]

Maddy, nAn sonnadhu Amitji>>Rajni is a wrong notionu. Marubadiyum kEkkarEn - do you really believe Bachchan is that far ahead as an actor, even as an opinion?
Mathabadi, orE oru> pOttu endha sideai support paNNinAlum opinion levella vutturalam. But rendu > pOttu clearly aheadh-nu solra aLavukku illaiyE...

[tamizharasan]

What I was fighting was the notion that amitji >>Rajni, which is a result of propoganda, and conscious propoganda at that, by BpM through years

well, to me, its not a notion but my opinion......watever i saw of Amitabh and rajini - i really feel Amitabh is the superior one.......infact i grew much closer to rajini-fanatism in TN than Bachan parivar morcha gang of north :lol:

This one does not prove anything and does not make your argument stronger.

[Nerd]

Honestly, the only film in which Amitji impressed me a lot was Deewar. He was OK- GOOD in Anand/Don too.

I have in fact seen most Amitji films which were remade by Rajini. Here is my opinion (strictly the performances)

Deewar >> Thee
Don > Billa
Khoon Pasina < Siva
Namak Halal << Velaikkaran
Khuddar << Padikkathavan
Laawaris << Panakkaran
Trisool < Mr. Bharath
Kasme Vaade << Dharmathin Thalaivan

(There are a couple more I think).

[m_23_bayarea]

Honestly, the only film in which Amitji impressed me a lot was Deewar. He was OK- GOOD in Anand/Don too.

I have in fact seen most Amitji films which were remade by Rajini. Here is my opinion (strictly the performances)

Deewar >> Thee
Don > Billa
Khoon Pasina < Siva
Namak Halal << Velaikkaran
Khuddar << Padikkathavan
Laawaris << Panakkaran
Trisool < Mr. Bharath
Kasme Vaade << Dharmathin Thalaivan

(There are a couple more I think).

I know Deewar is considered a classic in Hindi, while Thee isn't spoken all that much in Tamil, so I watched Deewar, and honestly felt that Rajini's performance in Thee was far more superior than AB's in Deewar. Even the way the 2 movies were made - Thee had a much bigger and richer look than Deewar as a whole! 8-)

[Nerd]

I know and I was expecting you here bay :lol:

[m_23_bayarea]

I know and I was expecting you here bay :lol:

Man, I hate this AB/Rajini comparison that pulled me to this thread, and I hope they'll get back to National Awards! :oops:

[app_engine]

they'll get back to National Awards!

அதாவது உப்புச்சப்பில்லாத ஒன்னப்பத்திப்பேசனுமுங்கறீங்க :-)

[tamizharasan]

Honestly, the only film in which Amitji impressed me a lot was Deewar. He was OK- GOOD in Anand/Don too.

I have in fact seen most Amitji films which were remade by Rajini. Here is my opinion (strictly the performances)

Deewar >> Thee
Don > Billa
Khoon Pasina < Siva
Namak Halal << Velaikkaran
Khuddar << Padikkathavan
Laawaris << Panakkaran
Trisool < Mr. Bharath
Kasme Vaade << Dharmathin Thalaivan

(There are a couple more I think).

I know Deewar is considered a classic in Hindi, while Thee isn't spoken all that much in Tamil, so I watched Deewar, and honestly felt that Rajini's performance in Thee was far more superior than AB's in Deewar. Even the way the 2 movies were made - Thee had a much bigger and richer look than Deewar as a whole! 8-)

Bay creates lot of interest in me to revisit thee. It has been a while I saw that movie though.

[m_23_bayarea]

they'll get back to National Awards!

அதாவது உப்புச்சப்பில்லாத ஒன்னப்பத்திப்பேசனுமுங்கறீங்க :-)

Why don't you start a IR/ARR comparison, so we'll have Maddy come in and entertain you for a few pages? Maddy, no offence! :P

[ajithfederer]

Inconsistent is a very good Option. Yen poll-la varala???


May be should have been as an option.

i put "inconsistent" which would have swept the polls but somehow it didnt turn up :oops:

[Murali Srinivas]

To be fair, what was the competition to Agneepath. Which year was this?

But heck, I know it is the late 80's, the golden period of MFI, so one or the other M is sure to have had a great performance in whichever year agneepath was!

Not just M, there was a major conspiracy Thilakan's performance in Perumthachan was overlooked !

Here's Thilakan's own take on this:


You almost won the National Award in 1990 for Perumthachan before Amitabh Bachchan walked away with it at the last minute for Agneepath.

Of course, Perumthachan was very special. Yes, I was tipped to win the award. It is a long story how I lost out at the last minute. It was almost decided the award would come my way.

Even Ashok Kumar, the jury chairman, was keen on giving me the award.

Others in the know told me that a top Congress politician, who was planning a comeback of sorts in power, wanted the award to be given to Bachchan to woo him to the Congress. He wanted Bachchan to woo the voters, and so wanted to keep Bachchan happy by conferring a National Award on him. Apparently, the top leader called up the jury and asked who the leading contender for the award was. When they said it was an actor from the South, he promptly told the jury head to award 'that fellow from the South next year.' The award went to Bachchan.

Quizzed by a Gulf daily why I was not given the award, Ashok Kumar said that 'it was a secret which can't be revealed.' I still have that newspaper with me. They also sought my reaction to the news. And that night, I lost my sleep, and confidence in awards.

Plum/Thilak,

It was Rajiv who was instumental in getting his dear friend the coveted piece. It was sort of a compensation for AB, who had to resign his Allahabad MP seat in the face of Bofors scandal in 1987[Remember Ajithab's name getting mentioned in Quttrochi's diaries]. It was also a sort of paying back by Rajiv against VPSingh, who spearheaded the movement against Bofors and who was instrumental in Amithab resigning. So when the VP Singh govt came down [Nov 1990] and instead a Govt headed by Chandrasekar was propped by the Congress, the jury had to give in, when it is the wish of the Congress leader.

This brings again another one to memory. Year 1986. Films of 1985 are competing. As a sort of compensating for the negligence that was shown all those years, the members decide to give the Best actor award to the Greatest actor of India and you know for what film. In comes the jury chairman [chairwoman], the honourable Mrs. Jaya Bachhan and puts her foot down. An emphatic "No" from her and on her insistance Shashi Kapoor gets it for New Delhi Express. Reason for her outburst? Madam Gandhi had given the Rajya Sabha seat to NT in 1982 inspite of Rajiv lobbying for her hubby.

In the present context, Amithab winning this time had earned the wrath of the entire Kerala, it looks. Ironically every time AB had won it at the cost of Malayalam and that has made them go mad.

1990 - Agneepath Amithab pips Thilakan of Perunthachan [If my memory serves me right, Bharathan- Lohithadas- Mammootty's classic Amaram had also contested, on the basis of that film getting censored in Dec 1990, though it was released in Feb 1991].

2005 - Black Amithab scores over Thanmathra Lal.

2009 - Paa over Paleri/Pazhassi/Kutty Srank.

Regards

[app_engine]

I haven't watched palEri / kutty srank movies but IMHO PR is not award material, i.e. by M & M standards. May be I'm used to superior performances from them.

(BTW, no need to compare that movie with pA, just seeing it in isolation).

[tamizharasan]

One more thing I remember from Kumudam. Jaya Bachchan, Goddess of acting, thought Kamal's performance in Nayagan as very unnatural and asked the committee not to consider him for the award. Inspite of all her good work, committee did give award to that performance.

[varunlss12]

PASANGA 3 national awards :clap:

[directhit]

Amitabh NA over Mammootty :banghead: :banghead:
bilady award committee!!

[directhit]

1990 - Agneepath Amithab pips Thilakan of Perunthachan [If my memory serves me right, Bharathan- Lohithadas- Mammootty's classic Amaram had also contested, on the basis of that film getting censored in Dec 1990, though it was released in Feb 1991]. :shock: :rotfl2: funniest...


2005 - Black Amithab scores over Thanmathra Lal. :x


2009 - Paa over Paleri/Pazhassi/Kutty Srank. :lol:

[MADDY]

Maddy, nAn sonnadhu Amitji>>Rajni is a wrong notionu. Marubadiyum kEkkarEn - do you really believe Bachchan is that far ahead as an actor, even as an opinion?
Mathabadi, orE oru> pOttu endha sideai support paNNinAlum opinion levella vutturalam. But rendu > pOttu clearly aheadh-nu solra aLavukku illaiyE...

ofcourse, as u said, some of the movies and performances, comedy, style - rajini really towers over amitabh......amitabh wins to me largely due to his post 2000's work and early 70's work......actor rajini's derailment since thalabadhy is also part of the reason......i loved sivaji performance though, the scene where he hands over the key to lawyer and walks off - terrific but amitabh really is getting a lot of plum roles......

neenga solradhum correct dhaan - rajini hasnt got those "post-2000" roles and also neednt prove anymore........

[MADDY]

BTW, Maddy, I'm not anti-AB group :-)

மும்பைல ராசாவுக்கு இருக்கற ஒன்னோ ரெண்டோ ஃப்ரண்ட்ஸுல ஒருத்தர்.

:exactly: genius talentsa madhikka therinja oru hero.....

[Sarna]

Had anyone seen the hindi remake of Suryavamsam, in which Amitab did Sarathkumar role ?
Sarathkumar acting'a vida better'aa act panna mudiyaadha amitabh'a Rajini/kamal'a vida better actor'nu solradhu :|

[Vivasaayi]

Had anyone seen the hindi remake of Suryavamsam, in which Amitab did Sarathkumar role ?
Sarathkumar acting'a vida better'aa act panna mudiyaadha amitabh'a Rajini/kamal'a vida better actor'nu solradhu :|

inga yarum apdi sollave illaye ..neenga yEn appu irundhu polambitu irukeenga :lol:

[Sarna]

Vivs, IMHO Rajini is better actor than Kamal. If someone says, Amitab is better actor than Rajini, then for me it sounds like Amitab > Kamal. adhaan.....

[kid-glove]

To be fair, what was the competition to Agneepath. Which year was this?

But heck, I know it is the late 80's, the golden period of MFI, so one or the other M is sure to have had a great performance in whichever year agneepath was!

Not just M, there was a major conspiracy Thilakan's performance in Perumthachan was overlooked !

Here's Thilakan's own take on this:


You almost won the National Award in 1990 for Perumthachan before Amitabh Bachchan walked away with it at the last minute for Agneepath.

Of course, Perumthachan was very special. Yes, I was tipped to win the award. It is a long story how I lost out at the last minute. It was almost decided the award would come my way.

Even Ashok Kumar, the jury chairman, was keen on giving me the award.

Others in the know told me that a top Congress politician, who was planning a comeback of sorts in power, wanted the award to be given to Bachchan to woo him to the Congress. He wanted Bachchan to woo the voters, and so wanted to keep Bachchan happy by conferring a National Award on him. Apparently, the top leader called up the jury and asked who the leading contender for the award was. When they said it was an actor from the South, he promptly told the jury head to award 'that fellow from the South next year.' The award went to Bachchan.

Quizzed by a Gulf daily why I was not given the award, Ashok Kumar said that 'it was a secret which can't be revealed.' I still have that newspaper with me. They also sought my reaction to the news. And that night, I lost my sleep, and confidence in awards.

Plum/Thilak,

It was Rajiv who was instumental in getting his dear friend the coveted piece. It was sort of a compensation for AB, who had to resign his Allahabad MP seat in the face of Bofors scandal in 1987[Remember Ajithab's name getting mentioned in Quttrochi's diaries]. It was also a sort of paying back by Rajiv against VPSingh, who spearheaded the movement against Bofors and who was instrumental in Amithab resigning. So when the VP Singh govt came down [Nov 1990] and instead a Govt headed by Chandrasekar was propped by the Congress, the jury had to give in, when it is the wish of the Congress leader.

This brings again another one to memory. Year 1986. Films of 1985 are competing. As a sort of compensating for the negligence that was shown all those years, the members decide to give the Best actor award to the Greatest actor of India and you know for what film. In comes the jury chairman [chairwoman], the honourable Mrs. Jaya Bachhan and puts her foot down. An emphatic "No" from her and on her insistance Shashi Kapoor gets it for New Delhi Express. Reason for her outburst? Madam Gandhi had given the Rajya Sabha seat to NT in 1982 inspite of Rajiv lobbying for her hubby.

In the present context, Amithab winning this time had earned the wrath of the entire Kerala, it looks. Ironically every time AB had won it at the cost of Malayalam and that has made them go mad.

1990 - Agneepath Amithab pips Thilakan of Perunthachan [If my memory serves me right, Bharathan- Lohithadas- Mammootty's classic Amaram had also contested, on the basis of that film getting censored in Dec 1990, though it was released in Feb 1991].

2005 - Black Amithab scores over Thanmathra Lal.

2009 - Paa over Paleri/Pazhassi/Kutty Srank.

Regards
Thank you, Murali sir, for the valuable information, as always!

I hope you wouldn't mind me using this info elsewhere. :D

Blood boils to know of dark crafts of Jaya 'first lady' bachchan. Makes one to lose all respect (little as it is) And it's a pity that one of the greatest actors in the world hadn't been awarded by his own country.

[kid-glove]

Looking at the hegemony that Bachchan had enjoyed in NA (through his influential friends), one has to applaud both M's and Kamal to be right up there in head of the pack! They're that Good!

[Cinefan]

Vivs, IMHO Rajini is better actor than Kamal

Appadiya,Amitabh >> Rajni vidunga,inge innoru thiri burning,start meesic.

[kid-glove]

Adhu Oru Karuthu.

[app_engine]

MSN report on Raja award (http://entertainment.in.msn.com/southcinema/article.aspx?cp-documentid=4393109)

When I read this, for some reason the Shivaji scene where Hanifa gets "operated" came to mind :-)

பழசி ராஜா தயாரிப்பாளர், தேசியவிருதுக்கமிட்டியிடம் (ஹனீஃபா குரலில்) : "சார், ஹங்கேரியெல்லாம் போயி சிம்ஃபனி ஆர்கெஸ்ட்ரால்லாம் போட்டிருக்கோம் சார் - கொஞ்சம் பாத்துப்போட்டுக்குடுங்க சார்" :rotfl:

[Ramakrishna]

http://entertainment.in.msn.com/southcinema/article.aspx?cp-documentid=4393109

Ellaam serithaan except that irrelevant & unnecessary bolded part.

"Mere keyboard playing is not composing music. When I did this background score ('Kerala Varma Pazhassi Raja'), I envisioned each shot, the story and how it was going to be executed on screen and felt the music and situation. That is composing... when you create something, the feelings of the director should get translated into the music. This has happened in this ('Kerala Varma Pazhassi Raja')."

[ajaybaskar]

Come on Ram..

IR's words shudnt be taken seriously.. Enjoy his music alone.. His music alone has made him to reach this level and not his words.

He always speaks his mind out and not like others who speak according to the stage..