Sindhanai Selvar Dr.Kamal HaasaR - favourite movies,scenes 2

[venkkiram]

சகல..மகாதேவனை நீங்கள் விபத்துன்னு சொன்னாலும், இதுபோன்ற விபத்துக்களும் தேவைதான். அப்போதான் பிடிக்கும் ஒரு விஷயத்தின் மீதான எல்லா தூசிகளும் விலகவும் ஒரு வாய்ப்பாக அமையும். மகாதேவன் சொல்ற சில விஷயங்களில் நான் வேறுபட்டாலும், அடிப்படையான ஒரு ""மன்னிக்கத் தெரிஞ்சவன் மனுஷன். மன்னிப்பு கேட்கத் தெரிஞ்சவன் பெரிய மனுஷன்" வசனத்தையே உடைக்கும் மகாதேவனின் பாணி எனக்குப் பிடித்திருக்கிறது.

[aceqoxim]

Watched Mahanadhi last night and still crying my eyeballs out. I should totally stay away from Mahanadhi and Anbe Sivam discs. My eyes are getting sore from all the crying that's bound to happen.

[SoftSword]

Watched Mahanadhi last night and still crying my eyeballs out. I should totally stay away from Mahanadhi and Anbe Sivam discs. My eyes are getting sore from all the crying that's bound to happen.

maganadhi and anbesivam vaera levels aachae, as crying material i mean...

[aceqoxim]

maganadhi and anbesivam vaera levels aachae, as crying material i mean...


Mahanadhi is heavy throughout. Anbe Sivam is not as deep and runs in lighter vein up until the last minute where it packs the sucker punch.

Eventhough the dialogues aren't as brilliant as AS, my personal favourite remains as Mahanadhi. I can't watch a lot of scenes in Mahanadhi without taking calculated breaths in between. Athuvum antha Sonakachi scenes are just.. Ennoda Kamal fangirling intha padam partha piraguthan start aachu. What a man..his thinking was way ahead of his time. Kayila daughterai vachikittu aluthukonde kai eduthu kumbidivar help panra other sex workers-ai parthu. Goosebump material.

[SoftSword]

:thumbsup:

hope u did notice that frame having a koil gopuram behind and gods in front..

[joe]

Kayila daughterai vachikittu aluthukonde kai eduthu kumbidivar help panra other sex workers-ai parthu. Goosebump material.
:exactly:

[joe]

here you go


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AhZc1V7N0NQ

This guy is Genius

[aceqoxim]

:thumbsup:

hope u did notice that frame having a koil gopuram behind and gods in front..

The scene where they depart on the ferry? Then yes, I did.. Also, I'm with you on 3. After reading all the negative reviews in the hub, I wasn't sure what to expect, anaa I liked it. The movie is well made for a debutante despite its few serious flaws. Timing than pilaichu pochu. Mayakkam Enna shadow is still looming on 3, athanala ennavo parthavangalukku bore adichu irukkum. I found the movie, fresh, honest and interesting. Especially the first half. :thumbsup:

Thanks for the video Joe. It's a heart wrenching scene and I'm not ready to click play yet.

[SoftSword]

http://i47.tinypic.com/30bl25w.jpg

[SoftSword]

^kolkata kaali

[aceqoxim]

Yes, that's the scene. Just right before they depart on ferry. Mahanadhi ellam parkurathuku onnu masochista irukanum, illa manasu kalla irukanum. I think I'm a bit of masochist-nu. Despite breaking my heart every few minutes in it's running time I still watch Mahanadhi atleast once a year.Athukku mela parkira thairiyam illai.

[NOV]

It's a heart wrenching scene and I'm not ready to click play yet.same here :cry:

[app_engine]

Thanks for the video Joe. It's a heart wrenching scene and I'm not ready to click play yet.

இன்னொரு தடவை குலுங்கிக்குலுங்கி அழுதாச்சு :cry2:

[app_engine]

Watched 'bAbul' (2006) that had the intro "from the bAghban team" (DVD from public library)...

First pAthi padu mOsam, still watched as a Hindi education exercise...second pAthi sumAr.

I thought Mumbai is far advanced but this movie portrays as if widow-remarriage had been frowned upon even in 2006 :confused: (Sarika plays a widow and utters just one dialog in the whole movie, for the climax)...other cast : deer KhAn, queen Mukherji, Aish kA mAmanAr, Sunny Deol ki chithi as his beevi, ardh-sathyA Om Puri & one male model as 3rd hero...

[P_R]

Fantastic scene

What absolutely brilliant writing first of all. Kamal is silent throughout.

Not only the horror of finding his daughter in the brothel, but also the unspeakable horror of being suspected of abducting her and being beaten up for it. And the only voice we hear trying to explain is the weak-loser voice of Poornam Viswanathan. The very conceptualization is astounding.

Poornam - the believer, the wisher of good, the only who resigns to fate and wants to live in a peaceful corner - falls at the feet of the pimp and prostitute. Is a thoroughly ineffective advocate in the situation. When the Tamilspeaking madam comes, he totally flops and blabbers and can't even string together a sentence. Overwhelmed by the situation and emotions (solliNdE irukkEn, adikkaREL neenga - he is angry but it is the anger of a mouse!)

And when the madam says that he need not pay for taking Kaveri home, all Panchapakesan can conjure up is 'thanks' :lol: Is he even aware of the enormity of what she is saying!
Extraordinary writing/direction by Kamal.

And he is completely silent. Look at the way he looks up at the madam when she asks the girl to pay. What a complex emotion of overwhelming gratitude, shocked by the unexpected kindness he is showing.

There is one girl who (presumably) says: you give for me today, I will pay you tomorrow.
Why did Kamal insert that shot. More than cash in hand, what does that one line mean. The girl is saying I want to contribute to Kaveri's release today even if it means I have to pay for it by sleeping with someone tomorrow. Ghastly!!


The madam's daugher calling him 'appa' - the impact of that is tremendous.
You can see Panchapakesan in the next scene is relieved to have come out of the personal misery. He wants to retreat to his safe corner unmauled. He will probably want to forget anything happened at all. While Krishnaswamy says: 'ayyO...anga kAvEri maadhiri niRaiya puLLainga irukku Yamuna'.

And the line that shakes me up in this scene...
siri dee, un dheivam vandhirukku dee unnai koottittu pOga

It is Kamal's blackhumour to show faith in the depth of such misery. But it is such a brilliant depiction of the human condition. People will cling on to faith, particularly when that is the only thing they have to cling on to.

Kamal - you beauty!

[P_R]

http://i47.tinypic.com/30bl25w.jpg
:exactly:
Posted this exact same frame in twitter a few months back. What excellence.

Anbe sivam ellAm unsubtle elaborations of something he has done so much more brilliantly earlier here.
Dasa ellAm :-|

That is what I mean when I say, yes only Kamal can do these films, but should he be doing them when he can do so much so much more with his time and energy.

[Arvind Srinivasan]

Heart wrenching scene and at the same time mind boggling at the writing involved in this. Super stuff. Kamal you beauty!!!

[aceqoxim]

Not only the horror of finding his daughter in the brothel, but also the unspeakable horror of being suspected of abducting her and being beaten up for it.

The initial reaction from him tugs at my heart strings everytime. The way his daughter shies away from him because of the way she is dressed and how he embraces her without giving a damn about it... Enga amma solra dialogue than gyabagam varuthu. Enna aana enna? pethavangalukku pullainga eppavume thangaloda kulanthaigathan.



And he is completely silent. Look at the way he looks up at the madam when she asks the girl to pay. What a complex emotion of overwhelming gratitude, shocked by the unexpected kindness he is showing.

He even falls at her feet at one point. This kind of broad minded thinking is exactly why I think he is generations ahead of all his contemporaries.. While our mass heroes are still degrading women influenced by the social construct, Kamal stands out. He doesn't seemed conditioned by the society or its norms about how women should be treated, especially a sex worker at that. He neither looks at her as a woman nor a sex worker there, he looks at her like the goddess herself. (The scene after-in front of the temple speaks volumes) Partly a reason why I practically worship him. What kind of man he must be and what kind of heart he must possess to harbour such thoughts and perspectives?


While Krishnaswamy says: 'ayyO...anga kAvEri maadhiri niRaiya puLLainga irukku Yamuna'.

And the lamenting after that about why only good people suffer. Mahanadhi is a masterpiece.

[P_R]

Just listening carefully to the dialogues (overlapping dialogues Altman, Woody 'mbAingaLE)

The pimp calling for the madam as these guys are speaking some madarasi language :lol: She asks 'Tamil?' and he affirms. Just the pronunciation difference in that is :lol:
Meanwhile Poornam is saying: ennadhidhu..solliNdE irukkEn ippadi adichchiNdE irukkELE...pommanaattingaLA irundhuNdu :rotfl:

They are taking it out on Kamal precisely because they think he is the worst of the offenders. A man who is abducting Kaveri to make her his own. It is the rage they have felt against all-men. Panchapakesan can't even realize this. He is still standing in the platform of 'how women should behave'!! Where? In which location? The spot where the oppression of patriarchy is the strongest!

oru manushanaala eppadinga ivvaLavu deep-A ezhudha mudiyin? :bow:

[P_R]

And now in addition to Krishna,Kaveri,bharaNi, Narmada,Saraswati,Yamuna,Panchabi.. I just realized the madam's (Ganga!) daughter's name is Jalaja
:bow:

[P_R]

And every character represents a response to moral questions for an individual in society

Muthusamy: uniform pOtta udhavi seyya mudiyAdhu (Why not? He is also a pawn in the system. He considers himself powerless. He is limited by his situation - presumably merely the fact of having a family imposes wrought iron limits on what he can and cannot do? How different is he from Panchapakesan?)

naaLaikku kaalaila naan duty-ku pOgumbOdhu nee en veet..en paadhukaappula irukka koodaadhu

It is not just a polite alternative.
prachanaiyE idhu dhaan. If veedu is catch-all for man functioning honestly, being what he is, then that is exactly what is suppressed when he is functioning in society, performing his duties.

Societal anger amounts to little, unless one is willing to suffer personal losses for it, overcoming the instinct of self-preservation - as Krishnaswamy's act of severing his arm symbolizes.

[V_S]

P_R :notworthy: :clap: I can literally visualize all the scenes you and Stardust brought with utmost details and insights. Watched many times during its release, will have watch it again. The follow-up song (bengali and the thamizh versions) to this entire situation is just breath-taking and I can't hide my tears when his daughter lies on his shoulder and Kamal looking away controlling his emotions and tears. :notworthy:
http://videos.sify.com/Engeyo-thikku-thisa-song-from-Mahanadhi-ISTREAM-watch-jgtuajhbcde.html

எங்கேயோ திக்கு தெசை காணாத தூரம் தான்
எம்மாடி வந்ததென்ன என் வாழ்கை ஓடம் தான்
காவேரி தீரம் விட்டு கால்கள் வந்ததடி

காணாத சோகம் எல்லாம் கண்கள் கண்டதடி
கை மாறி நான் வளர்த்த பச்சைக்கிளி போனது

கண்ணார நானும் காண இத்தனை நாள் ஆனது
இரு கண்ணே செந்தமிழ் தேனே
தந்தையின் பாசம் வென்றதடி
பசும் பொன்னே செவ்வந்தி பூவே
இத்துடன் சோகம் சென்றதடி

நாம் கங்கா நதியை காணும் பொழுது உண்மை விளங்குது
அட இங்கே குளிக்கும் மனிதன் அழுக்கில் கங்கை கலங்குது

சில பொல்லா மனங்கள்
பாவக்கறையை நீரில் கழுவுது
இந்த முட்டாள்தனத்தை எங்கே சொல்லி நானும் அழுவது

[SoftSword]

i think panjapakesan realizes why they are angry and beating kamal.. thats why from the beginning he says 'avar vandhu... indha ponnoda appaa avar'...
adikkireengalae... pommanaattiyaa irundhuttu - adhu vera department...

indha scene discussions already idhae PR panjaayatthula senjirukkomnaalum, pudhusu pudhusaa perspectives vandhuttae irukku...
kaatchiyum onnudhaan... kannum onnudhaan... but the mentality in which we sees such scenes evoke different perspectives every time... (adhu engalukku theriyaadhaa..)

nallaa peruvechirukkangayya PR'nu...

[Arvind Srinivasan]

Thanks to stardust and PR I am gonna revisit mahandhi....I still remember the day I watched the movie completely in 2002. Till then I was strongly advised by my grandmother and mother to not watch the movie lest you wanted to fall into depression. But only then did I realise that I had missed a masterpiece all this while....

[Mahen]

MAhanadhi is one of my all time favorites..the only spoiler was the romance of kamal-suganya..wrong time-le varum :sigh2: IIRC, there was one touching scene and immediately after that Kamal will be ready to romance suganya..jail-le kuda sila irukum..when the kids and suganya visited him, he showed more interest towards suganya than his kids..

15 years back pakkum bothum pidikile..i might change my opinion if i revisit it again :)

[Cinefan]

Anbe sivam ellAm unsubtle elaborations of something he has done so much more brilliantly earlier here.
Dasa ellAm :-|

That is what I mean when I say, yes only Kamal can do these films, but should he be doing them when he can do so much so much more with his time and energy.

Neengalum sollinde irrukkel.Avar kekkara maadhiri theriyale.Depression-le irukkaro?

That's why probably doing Dasa,VR(which is unlikely to be anywhere close to Mahanadhi or Guna)to pull himself out of it.

Vidungo P_R,avar thirumbi oru round varuvaaru.Wait pls.

[Cinefan]

Oh My friend(telegu)-Deivakuzhandhai/Pappa nadichu naan paartha mudhal padam.She is beautiful,graceful,expressive,dubbed so cannot comment on her voice/modulation.

Mathapadi ok film.Nothing very impressive nor anything bad.Enna,unlike most films where a boy and girl are best friends,get into relationships with others and then realize they actually love each other,this one maintains that they remain friends till the end.

Siddharth also does well but Thanikella Bharani was impressive as always.

Reading all the posts about Sruthi,feel she is being put under a microscope just because she happens to be Kamal's daughter.Whatever I saw,I liked,

[P_R]

i think panjapakesan realizes why they are angry and beating kamal.. thats why from the beginning he says 'avar vandhu... indha ponnoda appaa avar'...
adikkireengalae... Of course.
pommanaattiyaa irundhuttu - adhu vera department... :lol: idhai thaan sonnEn.

[P_R]

Vidungo P_R,avar thirumbi oru round varuvaaru.Wait pls.
Periya thEvar: ungaLai thaanE nambaNum....vERa yaar irukkaanga namburadhukku?

[P_R]

MAhanadhi is one of my all time favorites..the only spoiler was the romance of kamal-suganya..wrong time-le varum :sigh2: IIRC, there was one touching scene and immediately after that Kamal will be ready to romance suganya..jail-le kuda sila irukum..when the kids and suganya visited him, he showed more interest towards suganya than his kids..

15 years back pakkum bothum pidikile..i might change my opinion if i revisit it again :)

Unselected.
Nothing shows the human-ness of Krishnaswamy as his love. During my younger days,NOV kitta saNdai pOttirukkEn.

Also remember

Krishnaswamy: andha manju poNNu avvaLO nallava illai mA
Saraswathi ammaL: sari, adhukku enna ippo....oh!

And even in that love, the extraordinariness of the situation is something that- Panchapakesan - a man who has also seen his world shake, is not willing to engage with. He is insistent on clinging on to the social mores
yamunA, en mookku-kaNNaadiyai paarthiyAmmA :lol: :clap:

Kamal's got all bases covered 'nga. Not a frame is there without thought. Touch paNNikka mudiyAdhu.
Talk me.

[Plum]

Feeyaar - you beetti. Just like Kamal is wasting time doing lesser efforts is sad, You shouldn't waste your time "talking me" on Baggy Pants, Chief Minister etc

[jaiganes]

P_R :notworthy: :clap: I can literally visualize all the scenes you and Stardust brought with utmost details and insights. Watched many times during its release, will have watch it again. The follow-up song (bengali and the thamizh versions) to this entire situation is just breath-taking and I can't hide my tears when his daughter lies on his shoulder and Kamal looking away controlling his emotions and tears. :notworthy:
http://videos.sify.com/Engeyo-thikku-thisa-song-from-Mahanadhi-ISTREAM-watch-jgtuajhbcde.html

எங்கேயோ திக்கு தெசை காணாத தூரம் தான்
எம்மாடி வந்ததென்ன என் வாழ்கை ஓடம் தான்
காவேரி தீரம் விட்டு கால்கள் வந்ததடி

காணாத சோகம் எல்லாம் கண்கள் கண்டதடி
கை மாறி நான் வளர்த்த பச்சைக்கிளி போனது

கண்ணார நானும் காண இத்தனை நாள் ஆனது
இரு கண்ணே செந்தமிழ் தேனே
தந்தையின் பாசம் வென்றதடி
பசும் பொன்னே செவ்வந்தி பூவே
இத்துடன் சோகம் சென்றதடி

நாம் கங்கா நதியை காணும் பொழுது உண்மை விளங்குது
அட இங்கே குளிக்கும் மனிதன் அழுக்கில் கங்கை கலங்குது

சில பொல்லா மனங்கள்
பாவக்கறையை நீரில் கழுவுது
இந்த முட்டாள்தனத்தை எங்கே சொல்லி நானும் அழுவது

yaaruppaa ezudhinadhu wall-eyaa? illai haasarevaa?
chanceless lines. the beginning bengali song - adhoda meaning innaadhu? - haauntingnnu solvaangale - adhe adhe.
P_R - u have made my monday...

[P_R]

:ty: folks. ellA pugazhum hAsarukkE.


yaaruppaa ezudhinadhu Vaali. But surely there is a significant input from Hassar given how this pretty much conveys the central idea of the movie. I think long back in these threads we discussed the genesis of Mahanadhi. The interview in maiyam magazine upon returning from Delhi after collecting the Padmashri. He speaks about Cooum being a symbol of our collective complicity of our society: அதில் என் நரகலும் கலந்திருக்கிறது

And Vaali's (+ Kamal, I allege) lyrics are very foretelling, even in the first song which celebrates the purity and innocence of Kaveri



சொர்க்கம் என்பது மன்னில் உள்ளது வானில் இல்லையடி
இன்பம் என்பது கண்ணில் உள்ளது கனவில் இல்லையடி



the beginning bengali song - adhoda meaning innaadhu?
After several years of research....I give up.
Hey Ram Jibonanda Das poeththukkellAm lyrics/meaning kidaikkudhu, idhukku kidaikkalai.
iththanaikkum it is a Rabindrasangeeth (i.e. Robindroshongeeth)


ebAr tOr mOrA gangE
ban eseche jai ma bOlE basha tOri

Plum-ku Bengali theriyin. Translate please.

I see it is sung (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qvFGkNZ1Lo4) in the same tune (presumably set by Tagore) all over the net. But the tune we hear in the movie is something I don't see elsewhere. Is it Raja's?

[jaiganes]

The hand cutting scene - and the final image of krishnaswamy balancing himself on the blood soaked knife - endha korean film makerum yosichu paakkaadha
oru image - for 1993/4 it is an awesome imagery - adhu onnu poadhum - worth a million bucks (GVM idhu dhaan worth a million bucks purinjudhaa).
It symbolizes so many things in one stroke. The helplessness of a common man (just, fair playing by the rules) against a corrupt system/society - which is
typically referred in thamizh as "Kaiyaru nilai" - Kamal goes full blow and gives an arresting visual metaphor for the "kaiyaru nilai" - Awesome.
BTW.. is it lottaangai or soathaangai that he loses?

[venkkiram]

கிருஷ்ணசாமி தனது கையை துண்டித்துக்கொள்வது செயற்கையாக இருக்கிறது.

[sathya_1979]

Why? He is unable to pull dhanush up to cut his hand. But, his angst is to give him the punishment he deserves. vEra vazhi illai. idhellaam pOi artificialnuttu.... ennaa Venkki saar?

[SoftSword]

TR mode மொக்கை: கையை வெட்டிக்கொள்ளும் செய்கைக்கு அடுத்தது செயற்கை கை தானே..

[venkkiram]

சத்யா.. நீங்க ஒரு சூழ்நிலையைச் சொல்லி இதில் இப்படித்தான் எதிர்கொள்ள முடியும் என விளக்கம் கொடுக்கிறிங்க. கமல் என்ற படைப்பாளி இதுபோன்ற சூழ்நிலைக்கே கிருஷ்ணசாமி பாத்திரத்தை கொண்டு சென்றிருக்கவேண்டாம் எனச் சொல்கிறேன் நான். அங்கங்களை இழப்பது/ தியாகம் செய்வது என்னைப் பொறுத்த வரையில் (நான் பார்த்து வரும் (கற்பனை) உலகத்தில்) இயல்புத்தன்மைக்கு ஒத்துவராத ஒன்றாக தென்படுகிறது. கிருஷ்ணசாமியோடு பகிர்ந்து கொண்ட இதுவரை துன்பங்கள்/வருத்தங்கள் போதாது என இதுவுமா? என்ற அயற்சிதான் மேலோங்குகிறது ஒரு ரசிகனாக எனக்கு!

[aceqoxim]

Venki anna,

Haven't we all heard of heaps of cases where a common man does extraoridnary things to save the lives of loved ones? It's not Superhero stuff, ellam oru adrenaline rush kudukurra thairiyamthan.. brain stops thinking rationally for a moment and pushes beyond our threshold for pain. Illai endral oru satharanamana manithan eppadi oru car-ai thooki than pillaigalai kappatruvathu saathiyam? Survival instinct endru varugayil, Aron Ralston than kaiyai oru blunt knife uthaviyudan konjam konjamaga vettavillaiya?

என்னை பொருத்த மட்டும் கிருஷ்ணசுவாமியின் நிலைமையும் இதுதான். ஒரு மனிதன் அவனுடைய thresholdai (தமிழ் வார்த்தை தெரியவில்லை, மன்னிக்கவும் ) தாண்டி தள்ளப்படும்போது மனித பலத்தை தாண்டிய செய்கைகள்/ அவருடைய இயல்புக்கு மாறான செயல்கள் செய்வது ஒன்றும் கேள்விபடாதது அல்ல. தவறு இழைத்தவன் தண்டனை அனுபவிக்க வேண்டும் என்பதில் முனைப்புடன் இருந்த கிருஷ்ணசுவாமிக்கு தன் கைகள் ஒரு பொருட்டாக தென்படவில்லை என்பது அவர் எவ்வளவு துயரத்தை அனுபவித்து இருந்தால் இப்படி ஒரு முடிவுக்கு வந்து இருப்பார் என்பதையே காட்டுகின்றது என்பது என்னுடைய கருத்து.

[sathya_1979]

சத்யா.. நீங்க ஒரு சூழ்நிலையைச் சொல்லி இதில் இப்படித்தான் எதிர்கொள்ள முடியும் என விளக்கம் கொடுக்கிறிங்க. கமல் என்ற படைப்பாளி இதுபோன்ற சூழ்நிலைக்கே கிருஷ்ணசாமி பாத்திரத்தை கொண்டு சென்றிருக்கவேண்டாம் எனச் சொல்கிறேன் நான். அங்கங்களை இழப்பது/ தியாகம் செய்வது என்னைப் பொறுத்த வரையில் (நான் பார்த்து வரும் (கற்பனை) உலகத்தில்) இயல்புத்தன்மைக்கு ஒத்துவராத ஒன்றாக தென்படுகிறது. கிருஷ்ணசாமியோடு பகிர்ந்து கொண்ட இதுவரை துன்பங்கள்/வருத்தங்கள் போதாது என இதுவுமா? என்ற அயற்சிதான் மேலோங்குகிறது ஒரு ரசிகனாக எனக்கு!
The point is - Losing his hand is a very small thing compared to his prior sufferings. So, andha situationla Dhanush kku dhandanai tharaNumngradhudhaan mukkiyam. adhai eppaadu pattaavadhu thandhu vida vEndum - idhudhaan Krishnaswamiyin mana nilai. kai enna, avar uyirE pOyirundhaalum adhai avar senjiruppaar. It's like last ball six to win a match despite all the body blows on a minefield track. Here, there is no victory or defeat - Just pure retribution.

[sathya_1979]

I did not read Stardust's post. But, see - Both the points are same :) perumbaalaana makkaL appadidhaan uNarndhu irukkiraargaL!

[SoftSword]

venkit... kamal manasula krishnasamy'nra character enna pannakkodumnu nenacharo... adha padatthula seyya vechirukkaar... avar epdi andha madhiri nenakkalaamnu kaetta epdi... avaroda freedotthula naama thalayidakkoodaadhu... avaroda enna ottam apdi irukkadhaala dhaan avar kamal.

[P_R]

அங்கங்களை இழப்பது/ தியாகம் செய்வது என்னைப் பொறுத்த வரையில் (நான் பார்த்து வரும் (கற்பனை) உலகத்தில்) இயல்புத்தன்மைக்கு ஒத்துவராத ஒன்றாக தென்படுகிறது. கிருஷ்ணசாமியோடு பகிர்ந்து கொண்ட இதுவரை துன்பங்கள்/வருத்தங்கள் போதாது என இதுவுமா? என்ற அயற்சிதான் மேலோங்குகிறது ஒரு ரசிகனாக எனக்கு!
வெங்கி, படத்தின் முக்கியமான படிமத்தை மிக தட்டையாக உள்வாங்கியிருக்கிறீர்கள். இது ஒரு சோகத் திணிப்பு அல்ல. விளக்க முயல்கிறேன்.

யோக்கியன்-அயோக்கியன் பற்றி முத்துசாமி வீட்டில் நடக்கும் உரையாடல் முக்கியமானது. சமுதாயத்தைக் கேள்வி கேட்கும் துணிவு, உரிமை யாருக்கு உண்டு என்பதைப் பேசும் காட்சி இது. அடுத்தவனை விட யோக்கியன் என்றுதான் சொல்லிக்கொள்ள முடியுமே தவிர, absolute scaleல் சொல்லிக்கொள்ள முடியாது என்று முத்துசாமி, கிருஷ்ணசாமியை வாயடைக்க வைக்கிறார்.

அந்த வசனம் Voice-overஆக வரவர அடுத்த காட்சி பஞ்சாபகேசனும், கிருஷ்ணசாமியும் நேப்பியர் பாலத்தில் நடந்து வருகிறார்கள். வயது மரியாதையைக் கூட ஒரு கணம் மறந்து, பஞ்சாபகேசனை, "குடலை அறுக்கும்" துர்நாற்றம் வீசும் கூவத்தை நுகரச் சொல்கிறான் கிருஷ்ணசாமி.

'லஞ்சம் குடுக்கவில்லை என்றால் இன்னின்ன இழப்புகள் ஏற்படும் என்றாலும் ஏற்கத் தயார் என்று சொல்பவன் தான் கேள்விகேட்க தகுதியானவன். 'வேறு வழியில்லை' என்று சொல்லி, கொடுத்துவிட்டு, 'அநியாயம் பண்றாங்களே' என்று முனகுபவனுக்கும், ex-post சீற்றம் கொண்டு பொங்குபவனுக்கும் அந்த உரிமை கிடையாது. தனிமனித இழப்புகள் இல்லாமல் பிரச்சனைகளுக்கு தீர்வை எதிர்பார்ப்பது வேடிக்கையானது' என்பது தான் கமல் முன்வைக்கும் கருத்து.

சமுதாயத்துக்கும் தனி மனிதனுக்குமான உறவு என்ன? தன் வசதிக்காக அதை பயன்படுத்துகிறான். தன் அழுக்கைக் களைந்து அதில் எரிந்து சுத்தம் எய்த நினைக்கிறான். இதில் கங்கை-கூவம் இரண்டும் ஒன்று. கூவத்தின் துர்நாற்றம் நிதர்சனம், என்பது தான் வித்தியாசம். கங்கையின் முங்கி பாவத்தை களைவது என்பது என்ன? நம் பிரச்சனைகளுக்குத் தீர்வு இது போல 'வெளியிலிருந்து' வரும் என்ற எதிர்பார்ப்பு. தெய்வாதீனமாக நம்மைச் சுற்றி உள்ள அசிங்கங்கள் நீங்கும் என்ற எதிர்பார்ப்பு.

வெங்கடாசலத்தை கொலை செய்ய நெருங்கும்போது கூட, அது தனிநபர் பழிதீர்க்கும் செயலாக இல்லை என்பதை அந்த காட்சியின் வசனங்கள் தெளிவுபடுத்தும். கிருஷ்ணசாமியின் கோபம் ஒரு சமுதாயக்கோபம். அதுவே நம்மை அடுத்த காட்சியை உள்வாங்கத் தயார்படுத்துகிறது.அதன்பிறகு நடக்கும் காட்சி ஒற்றை அர்த்தத்தைத் தாண்டி உயர்ந்து நிற்கிறது.

தன்னளவில் கிருஷ்ணசாமி ஏற்றுக்கொண்ட இழப்பு ஒரு badge of honor. (வேடிக்கை மனிதரைப் போல நான் வீழ்வேனென்று நினைத்தாயோ). மேற்சொன்ன எல்லாவற்றிற்குமான குறியீடாகி, திரைப்படத்தையே அடுத்த தளத்துக்கு உயர்த்துகிறது அந்த முடிவுக் காட்சி. அக்காட்சி வெறும் சோகத் திணிப்பு அல்ல.

[NOV]

An Innocent Man + Hardcore = Mahanadhi?

[P_R]

btw வெங்கி, அதெல்லாம் நம்புற மாதிரி இருக்க தேவல்ல-ன்னு சிலர் சொல்லுவாங்க. எனக்கு அதுல நம்பிக்கை இல்லைன்றது முன்னொரு விவாதத்துலேர்ந்து உங்களுக்கு ஞாபகம் இருக்கலாம். 'நம்பகத்தன்மை எனக்கு ரொம்ப முக்கியம் தான்'. அந்த அளவுல உங்களுக்கு 'நம்பும்படியா இல்லை'ன்னா அதுக்கு நான் எதிர்வாதம் செய்ய விரும்பலை. நம்பகத்தன்மை எதிர்பார்க்கக் கூடாதுன்னு எல்லாம் சொல்லவே மாட்டேன்.

ஆனா அந்த எதிர்பார்ப்புல காட்சியோட கவித்துவ அழகை தவறவிட்டுரக்கூடாது'ன்றதுக்காக சொன்னேன்.
மத்தபடி நம்பகத்தன்மை எல்லாம் கறாரா எதிர்பார்க்க வேண்டியதுதான்.

[groucho070]

Kai vetting idea could have been lifted from Yul Brynner's The Ultimate Warrior. athayE antha kAlattula criticise pannAngga.

[littlemaster1982]

இதில் கங்கை-கூவம் இரண்டும் ஒன்று. கூவத்தின் துர்நாற்றம் நிதர்சனம், என்பது தான் வித்தியாசம். கங்கையின் முங்கி பாவத்தை களைவது என்பது என்ன? நம் பிரச்சனைகளுக்குத் தீர்வு இது போல 'வெளியிலிருந்து' வரும் என்ற எதிர்பார்ப்பு. தெய்வாதீனமாக நம்மைச் சுற்றி உள்ள அசிங்கங்கள் நீங்கும் என்ற எதிர்பார்ப்பு.


Do you know that Kamal initially wrote the daughter-rescue scene to be set in Varanasi? He later changed it to Kolkatta as he felt the business is more in your face there.

[Bala (Karthik)]

Wonderful discussion. Thanks for the posts PR and thanks Stardust for triggering this

[joe]

அங்கங்களை இழப்பது/ தியாகம் செய்வது என்னைப் பொறுத்த வரையில் (நான் பார்த்து வரும் (கற்பனை) உலகத்தில்) இயல்புத்தன்மைக்கு ஒத்துவராத ஒன்றாக தென்படுகிறது. கிருஷ்ணசாமியோடு பகிர்ந்து கொண்ட இதுவரை துன்பங்கள்/வருத்தங்கள் போதாது என இதுவுமா? என்ற அயற்சிதான் மேலோங்குகிறது ஒரு ரசிகனாக எனக்கு!
இது தான் தீர்வு என்பது போல சொல்லப்பட்டதாக தெரியவில்லை ..அது ஒரு நிகழ்வு . இதுவரை நிகழ்ந்த துன்பங்கள் போதாதா என ஆற அமர உட்கார்ந்து யோசிக்கும் நிலையில் கிருஷ்ணசாமி அப்போது இல்லை.

[P_R]

nanRi. B(K), karuththugaL sollunga.

Just watched the Napier Bridge scene again. I feel like Sundarapurushan Vadivelu overwhelmed by the bounty he discovers in the house he enters to burgle: ada pOngadA!

Panchapakesan: appo edhirkaalam?
Krishnaswami: :huh: enna irukku Iyeru
BGM: kazhai koothaadi music starts

ennayyA viLAdureenga. ivvaLavu brilliance-ku chinna vayasulayE pazhakki vittuttA, appuRam piRkaalaththula edhuyyA pudikkum

And just as I was thinking that...

Kamal: enakku indha manushanga mEla irundha nambikkaiyE pOyiduchchu aiyarE
background voice of maNNAngatti announcing his show

It is beyond me, why it is even a debating point that he is the best Tamil filmmaker ever.

[P_R]

பஞ்சு பத்தி கட்டுரையே எழுதலாம். He lives in a world of his own. Naive, heart-wrenching at times.Tries to negotiate the whole world from his quaint and limited point of view. And many times he is in a situation larger than him; Kamal ensures we get that. Caricature paNNaama ezhudhuradhu kashtam, the way Kamal managed it.

about maNNAngatti.
P: அதென்ன புனைப்பெயரா? :rotfl2:

When he tries to offer him money... நாங்க உங்களுக்கு ஏதாவது..இந்த இந்த..இந்த :lol: Poornam rocks

தலைவாசல் விஜய்: அட தப்பு என்துன்னு சொல்றேன்ல.. :lol:

ஆகமொத்தம் நீ இங்க சாப்ட மாட்ட...அதானே (check out Kamal's expression) :lol2:

The frame in தேடியது கிடைச்சாலே when they receive the sleeping child and exit the scene...and the dog leaves...left side there is a kid-goat suckling.
நான் ஒரு சிற்பி மாதிரிடா..எப்படி செதுக்குறேன் பார்த்தியா.

[jaiganes]

வெங்கி, படத்தின் முக்கியமான படிமத்தை மிக தட்டையாக உள்வாங்கியிருக்கிறீர்கள். இது ஒரு சோகத் திணிப்பு அல்ல. விளக்க முயல்கிறேன்.

யோக்கியன்-அயோக்கியன் பற்றி முத்துசாமி வீட்டில் நடக்கும் உரையாடல் முக்கியமானது. சமுதாயத்தைக் கேள்வி கேட்கும் துணிவு, உரிமை யாருக்கு உண்டு என்பதைப் பேசும் காட்சி இது. அடுத்தவனை விட யோக்கியன் என்றுதான் சொல்லிக்கொள்ள முடியுமே தவிர, absolute scaleல் சொல்லிக்கொள்ள முடியாது என்று முத்துசாமி, கிருஷ்ணசாமியை வாயடைக்க வைக்கிறார்.

அந்த வசனம் Voice-overஆக வரவர அடுத்த காட்சி பஞ்சாபகேசனும், கிருஷ்ணசாமியும் நேப்பியர் பாலத்தில் நடந்து வருகிறார்கள். வயது மரியாதையைக் கூட ஒரு கணம் மறந்து, பஞ்சாபகேசனை, "குடலை அறுக்கும்" துர்நாற்றம் வீசும் கூவத்தை நுகரச் சொல்கிறான் கிருஷ்ணசாமி.

'லஞ்சம் குடுக்கவில்லை என்றால் இன்னின்ன இழப்புகள் ஏற்படும் என்றாலும் ஏற்கத் தயார் என்று சொல்பவன் தான் கேள்விகேட்க தகுதியானவன். 'வேறு வழியில்லை' என்று சொல்லி, கொடுத்துவிட்டு, 'அநியாயம் பண்றாங்களே' என்று முனகுபவனுக்கும், ex-post சீற்றம் கொண்டு பொங்குபவனுக்கும் அந்த உரிமை கிடையாது. தனிமனித இழப்புகள் இல்லாமல் பிரச்சனைகளுக்கு தீர்வை எதிர்பார்ப்பது வேடிக்கையானது' என்பது தான் கமல் முன்வைக்கும் கருத்து.

சமுதாயத்துக்கும் தனி மனிதனுக்குமான உறவு என்ன? தன் வசதிக்காக அதை பயன்படுத்துகிறான். தன் அழுக்கைக் களைந்து அதில் எரிந்து சுத்தம் எய்த நினைக்கிறான். இதில் கங்கை-கூவம் இரண்டும் ஒன்று. கூவத்தின் துர்நாற்றம் நிதர்சனம், என்பது தான் வித்தியாசம். கங்கையின் முங்கி பாவத்தை களைவது என்பது என்ன? நம் பிரச்சனைகளுக்குத் தீர்வு இது போல 'வெளியிலிருந்து' வரும் என்ற எதிர்பார்ப்பு. தெய்வாதீனமாக நம்மைச் சுற்றி உள்ள அசிங்கங்கள் நீங்கும் என்ற எதிர்பார்ப்பு.

வெங்கடாசலத்தை கொலை செய்ய நெருங்கும்போது கூட, அது தனிநபர் பழிதீர்க்கும் செயலாக இல்லை என்பதை அந்த காட்சியின் வசனங்கள் தெளிவுபடுத்தும். கிருஷ்ணசாமியின் கோபம் ஒரு சமுதாயக்கோபம். அதுவே நம்மை அடுத்த காட்சியை உள்வாங்கத் தயார்படுத்துகிறது.அதன்பிறகு நடக்கும் காட்சி ஒற்றை அர்த்தத்தைத் தாண்டி உயர்ந்து நிற்கிறது.

தன்னளவில் கிருஷ்ணசாமி ஏற்றுக்கொண்ட இழப்பு ஒரு badge of honor. (வேடிக்கை மனிதரைப் போல நான் வீழ்வேனென்று நினைத்தாயோ). மேற்சொன்ன எல்லாவற்றிற்குமான குறியீடாகி, திரைப்படத்தையே அடுத்த தளத்துக்கு உயர்த்துகிறது அந்த முடிவுக் காட்சி. அக்காட்சி வெறும் சோகத் திணிப்பு அல்ல.
indha sequence ellaame - heights of acceptable emotional manipulation - for not a second we have doubt on the intentions of the maker.
naermayin valimayai varpuruththum oru naermayaana padaippu.
krishnaswamy has only one alternative before him because if he leaves venkatachalam - his newly rejoined family is at risk -so he ventures into the final assault in a calculated manner - much like a father who intends to protect his family. still the decent man in him wants to check out if venkatachalam will show a little bit of remorse.
the moment he asks "endha ponnoda appa".. his fate is decided - yet the protracted fight and final kai vetting is as P_R says a sacrifice a person willing to change something
must endure.
P_R - the more i read your posts and recollect the movie in my mind - i am convinced that this movie is the best in Thamizh films and its maker the best in terms of packing word and image in the right proportions.

[Cinefan]

P_R - Wonderful.By your sheer writing,making me yearn for the Kamal who wrote this classic to do something similar again.

BTW,who is the guy who acted as Venkatachalam?Never seen him before or after Mahanadhi.

[Mahen]

PR :clap:...

[venkkiram]

ஆனா அந்த எதிர்பார்ப்புல காட்சியோட கவித்துவ அழகை தவறவிட்டுரக்கூடாது'ன்றதுக்காக சொன்னேன்.

கவித்துவ அழகை தவறவிடவில்லை. நன்றி எல்லோருக்கும்!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=mbXjGVqC9ZM

[venkkiram]

BTW,who is the guy who acted as Venkatachalam?Never seen him before or after Mahanadhi. மோகன் நடராஜன்! நிறைய படங்களில் பார்த்திருக்கிறேன். தயாரித்தும் இருக்கிறார் என நினைக்கிறேன். சட்டென என் தங்கச்சி படிச்சவ படம் ஞாபகத்திற்கு வருகிறது.

[PARAMASHIVAN]

Stardust

I suggest you try out few other movies too, like an Art film called "Kutti" and "Uchithani Mugarnthal".

[PARAMASHIVAN]

Do you know that Kamal initially wrote the daughter-rescue scene to be set in Varanasi? He later changed it to Kolkatta as he felt the business is more in your face there.

Varanasi is sacred place , it is good he did not use that :x

[Cinefan]

மோகன் நடராஜன்! நிறைய படங்களில் பார்த்திருக்கிறேன். தயாரித்தும் இருக்கிறார் என நினைக்கிறேன். சட்டென என் தங்கச்சி படிச்சவ படம் ஞாபகத்திற்கு வருகிறது.

Thanks but still unable to place him.

[radiochandra]

Thanks but still unable to place him.

Watch Thala's citizen . There is Nizhalgal Ravi, the IAS guy, one police guy, one arasiyalvaathi and one judge who get saani treatment from Athipetti makkal in flashback. The judge is ur guy.


My thoughts on the epic Mahanadhi which converted several atheists like me into theists will follow soon.

[kid-glove]

Hey PR, Nice posts. But tone it down before ppl propose to marry you.

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

ஆயிரம் காரணங்கள் சொல்லுங்க, நான் ஏற்கனவே கேட்டிருக்கேன். டிடிஆருக்கு லஞ்சம் கொடுக்குறவனும் ப்ளாக்ல சினிமா டிக்கெட் வாங்குறவனும், எப்படி பார்த்தாலும் சின்னப்பெண்களை விபச்சாரத்தில் தள்ளும், பயன்படுத்தும், மற்றும் அனைத்து அயோக்கியங்களின் மறு உருவமாக இருக்கும் தனுஷ், அந்த அரசியல்வாதி, இவங்களுக்கு ஈடாக மாட்டாங்க.

அப்படியே, சிறு துளி தான் ஸ்விஸ் பேங்கில் வெள்ளமா அடிச்சிக்கிட்டு போகுது என்ற (சற்றே முட்டாள்தனமான) வாதத்தை வைத்தாலும், கிருஷ்ணசாமி, செய்யாதுஅ தப்புக்கு தானும் தன் குடும்பமும் சீரழிந்து, மேலும் செய்யாத தவறுக்கு மறுக்கா கிருஷ்ணசாமி சிறைக்கு செல்லவேண்டும் என்னும் நிலையில், இந்த ட்ரெயின் டிக்கெட், சினிமா ப்ளாக் டிக்கெட் லாஜிக் எல்லாம் எப்படி பேச முடியும்?!? அதுக்காக கிருஷ்ணசாமி கொலை செய்தது சரி என சொல்லவரவில்லை. ஆனால், இருக்கும் ஒரே இரவில் வேறு என்ன செய்ய முடியும்?

(குறிப்பு:- நான் திரியை படிக்கவேயில்லை)

[joe]

(குறிப்பு:- நான் திரியை படிக்கவேயில்லை)
அது நீங்க சொல்லாமலேயே தெரியுதே :)

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

சரி அப்ப என்ன தான் செய்யணும்? நேர்மையானவன்னு ஒருத்தனும் கிடையாது, ஸோ? அதனால? அடுத்து என்ன? எதையும் தட்டிக்கேக்காம இருந்துடுவோமா?!? எனக்கு புரியலை

மை.ம.காமராஜன் க்ளைமேக்ஸ் காட்சி
நாலில் ஒரு கமல்:- அப்பா நமக்கு சொந்தமில்லாத பொருளை நாம வெச்சிக்க கூடாதில்லையா?!
கமலின் அப்பாவி அப்பா:- ஆமா, இந்தா உன் துப்பாக்கி, நீயே வெச்சிக்க(நாசரின் கைக்கு துப்பாக்கி போகிறது)

ஒருக்கா, நேர்மையானவன்ன்னு சட்டிகேட் வாங்கினப்புறம் அநியாயத்தை தட்டிக்கேக்கலாமா

[sathya_1979]

Certificate vaanuradhu irukkattum, adhai yaaru koduppadhu?

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

And now in addition to Krishna,Kaveri,bharaNi, Narmada,Saraswati,Yamuna,Panchabi.. I just realized the madam's (Ganga!) daughter's name is Jalaja
:bow:

And the title font, like parallel water flow. I remember cutting the title font in dhinathanthi ads and pasting inside my cup-board. Its still there

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

He gave an intruu in dailithanthi. He mentioned about the sona gaachi experience. "அங்கிருந்த பெண்கள் என்னிடம் நட்பு பாசத்துடனும் பழகினார்கள். என்னை சாப்பிட அழைத்தார்கள், சப்பாத்தியும் கறியும். நன்றாகத்தானிருந்தது...." I equate this to krishnaswami happily eating at Mannaangatti(thalaivaasal vijay)'s place. The ladies there, wud have felt happy and content of a star visiting their place. It would be staying in their memory for ever...

Also another one, after the movie released, Junior Vikatan had an interview. Madhan interviewed kamal. Vaguely remember, they discussed about Blue Matte etc, those days itself...

Badly miss those interviews.

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

ஃபீயார், உங்க கடுரைகளை லேசா பட்டி டிங்கரிங் பாத்தா, ஒரு பொஸ்தகமே போட்றலாம். தமிழ்பேப்பரில் மஹாதேவன் போன்ற _ _ _ _ கள் கமலைப்பற்றி எழுதும் சூழலில் உங்களுது போன்ற கட்டுரைகள் அவசியம் தேவை

[joe]

ஃபீயார், உங்க கடுரைகளை லேசா பட்டி டிங்கரிங் பாத்தா, ஒரு பொஸ்தகமே போட்றலாம்.
தமிழில் இதுவரை வெளியான எந்த திரைப்பட திறனாய்வு புத்தகத்துக்கும் குறைச்சலாக இருக்காது என்பது என் எண்ணம்.
பி.ஆர் ..தொகுத்து எடுங்க ..பத்ரி சேசாத்ரிய பார்த்துடுவோம் :)

[P_R]

நன்றி சகல.


தமிழ்பேப்பரில் மஹாதேவன்
அவர் உளரலைப் படிக்கும்போது கடுப்பாக தான் செய்யுது. ஆனா சண்டை போடுற ஆர்வம் வரலை. அதுவும் ஒரு கருத்து-ன்னு விட்ற தோணுது. வயசு ஆகுதில்லை.
ஆனா மகாநதி பத்தி எத'ன்னு எழுதுறது? ஒரு தடவை, மகாநதி மேல உள்ள காதல் வேகத்துல, துண்டு துண்டா எடுத்து பேசலாம்னு கூட ஒரு யோசனை வந்து யூட்யூப்ல தக்குணூண்டு க்ளிப் போட்டேன். புஸ்ஸுனு போச்சு. பேசிகல்லி நான் சோம்பேறி.


And what I like is - and I will never tire of saying this - Kamal wants us to get all the subtleties. If we don't get everything the film will still work at some level for us. But he will give us enough leads to get deeper.

Just recall the first line: My name is Kaveri, like the river Kaveri

மனப்பாடப் பகுதி மாதிரி அதை சொல்ல வச்சது ஒரு sleight of hand. எழுத்தாளர் கமல் சொல்ல வர்ற metaphor அது தான். அதை அதைவிட வெட்டவெளிச்சமா சொல்ல முடியாது. ஆனா அதை ஒரு philosophicalஆ சொல்லாம, குழந்தை மூலமா சொல்ல வைச்சு...பின்றான்பா பின்றான்பா!

முதல் ஃப்ரேம்ல ஓடுற காவிரி, கூவத்துல dissolve ஆகுறது ஏன், அது எப்படி படத்தோட கதையைக் குறிக்கிதுன்றதெல்லாம் அப்புறம்.

கங்கையைப் பத்தி பாடல் வரி.
கூவம் பத்தி மட்டும் தான் நேரான வசனம்:
பஞ்சு:சமுதாயம்ன்றது....
கி: (doesn't even let him complete) அப்பொ அதை உங்க பூஜை ரூம் மாதிரி இல்லை வச்சிருக்கணும்

Oh, it is all there, how didn't I put it together the first time 'ன்ற மாதிரி தோண வைப்பார்.
ரொம்ப கஷ்டப்பட்டு ஒருத்தர் அர்த்தம் சொல்வார். அவர் சொல்றா மாதிரியும் சொல்லலாம், புய்ப்பம்னும் சொல்லலாம் 'ன்ற மாதிரி விட்றமாட்டார்.

இப்படியே நம்மளை எல்லாம் கெடுத்து குட்டிச்சுவர் ஆக்கிட்டார் :lol2:

Relevantஓ இல்லையோ, எனக்கு எதுக்கெடுத்தாலும் கவுண்டர் தான் ஞாபகத்துக்கு வரார்:

ஜெயராம்: shaking his feet அண்ணேன்...இதுலேர்ந்து என்ன தெரியுது?
கவு: நீ இதுக்கு முன்னாடி தையல்கடைல வேலை பார்த்தேன்ன்னு தெரியுது
ஜெ: அதில்லை...கால் அமுக்கி விட்டு அம்மா பழக்கப்படுத்திருச்சு...இங்க கால் அமுக்குறதுக்கு அம்மா கிடைக்குமா?
கவு: ஆங்...நீ முதல்ல அம்மா கேப்ப, அப்புறம் அம்மணி கேப்ப... நீ ட்ரைவர்,ட்ரைவர்,ட்ரைவர்...காலைல ட்ரைவர்னு கூப்டதும் எந்திருச்சு ஓடி வரணும்

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

தமிழில் இதுவரை வெளியான எந்த திரைப்பட திறனாய்வு புத்தகத்துக்கும் குறைச்சலாக இருக்காது என்பது என் எண்ணம்.
பி.ஆர் ..தொகுத்து எடுங்க ..பத்ரி சேசாத்ரிய பார்த்துடுவோம் :)

அவரோட தசாவதாரம் விமர்சனம் ஞாபகம் இருக்கில்ல! நீங்க கூட பின்னூட்டம் போட்டிருக்கீங்களே! தமிழ் பேப்பரில் என்ன நடக்கிறது தெரியுமா? ஒருமுறை அவரை சந்தித்து பேசியிருக்கிறேன், அப்பகூட கமல் எதிர்ப்பு என்பது தென்பட்டது! வேற பப்ளிஷர்ஸ் நெறைய இருக்காங்க ஜோ, இருக்கவே இருக்காரு "கமல் நம்காலத்து நாயகன்" பதிப்பிச்ச மனுஷ்யபுத்திரன், வண்டிய உயிர்மை பதிப்பகத்துக்கு விடுங்க பாஸ்

[PARAMASHIVAN]

P_R

Ungal sEvaiku :thumbsup:

[P_R]

நம்ம சுரேஷ்65 சொன்ன ஒரு தெலுங்கு பழமொழி ஞாபகத்துக்கு வருது: ஆளு லேது, சூலு லேது, கொடுக்கு பேரு சோமலிங்கம் :lol2:

[joe]

சகல,
மனுஷ்யபுத்திரன் நல்ல சாய்ஸ் தான் ..சமீபத்துல "ஒரு முட்டை புரோட்டவும் ஒரு சாதா புரோட்டாவும்" :lol: புத்தகம்(உயிர்மை பதிப்பகம்) வெளியிட சிங்கப்பூர் வந்திருந்த போது ஓரிரு வார்த்தைகள் பேச முடிந்தது ..பத்ரி தன் சொந்த கருத்தையெல்லாம் வியாபாரத்தில் திணிக்காத கெட்டிக்காரர் என்றே நினைக்கிறேன் ..கிழக்குப் பதிப்பகமும் கமல் பத்தி புத்தகம் போட்டிருக்காங்க.

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

.கிழக்குப் பதிப்பகமும் கமல் பத்தி புத்தகம் போட்டிருக்காங்க.

இஜிட்?!? தேடிப்பார்க்கிறேன் :)

[joe]

சகல,https://www.nhm.in/shop/978-81-8493-356-7.html

https://www.nhm.in/img/978-81-8493-356-7_b.jpg

[P_R]

ரெண்டும் புஸ்தகமும் படிச்சிருக்கேன்.
கிழக்கு புஸ்தகம் பா.தீனதயாளன் 'ன்றவர் எழுதிருக்கார். அவ்வளவு terrorஆன ஒரு நடையை நான் படிச்சதே இல்லை.
படிக்கவே முடியாதபடி இருக்கும். ஆனா ரொம்ப consciousஆ தான் எழுதியிருப்பார்.

படர்க்கைல எழுதற விஷயத்துக்கு கூட அவரா நேர்ல இருந்து பார்த்தா மாதிரி வசனம் எழுதுவார். அப்போது வாணி சொன்னார்: இதோ பாருங்க கமல், நாம இன்னைக்கு டின்னருக்கு போறோம்.... ன்ற மாதிரி. படுபயங்கர காமெடி.

சிலபல அரிய தகவல்களுக்காக பல்லை கடிச்சுகிட்டு படிச்சு முடிச்சேன்.

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

முன்னுரை ஆரம்பமே நல்லாருக்கே! -> "அதிரடியான, பாக்ஸ் ஆபிஸ் ஹிட் படங்களையும் அமைதியான கலாபூர்வமான படங்களையும் ஒருங்கே ஒருவரால் அளிக்கமுடியும் என்பதை கமல்ஹாசன் அளவுக்கு ஆணித்தரமாக நிரூபித்த இன்னொரு நடிகர் இங்கே இல்லை."

சீக்கிரம் வாங்கணும்... நன்றி ஜோ!

[P_R]

சீக்கிரம் வாங்கணும்... நன்றி ஜோ!
நான் சொல்ல சொல்ல கேக்காம படிக்கிறீர். மேற்கொண்டு நடக்குறதுக்கு நான் பொறுப்பு கிடையாது.

[venkkiram]

ரெண்டும் புஸ்தகமும் படிச்சிருக்கேன்.
கிழக்கு புஸ்தகம் பா.தீனதயாளன் 'ன்றவர் எழுதிருக்கார். அவ்வளவு terrorஆன ஒரு நடையை நான் படிச்சதே இல்லை.
படிக்கவே முடியாதபடி இருக்கும். ஆனா ரொம்ப consciousஆ தான் எழுதியிருப்பார்.

படர்க்கைல எழுதற விஷயத்துக்கு கூட அவரா நேர்ல இருந்து பார்த்தா மாதிரி வசனம் எழுதுவார். அப்போது வாணி சொன்னார்: இதோ பாருங்க கமல், நாம இன்னைக்கு டின்னருக்கு போறோம்.... ன்ற மாதிரி. படுபயங்கர காமெடி.

சிலபல அரிய தகவல்களுக்காக பல்லை கடிச்சுகிட்டு படிச்சு முடிச்சேன்.

:rotfl:

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

ஒரே நேரத்தில் நாம போஸ்ட் பண்ணிட்டோம், அதான்! சரி இது போகட்டும், இன்னொண்ணும் அப்படித்தானா?!? "நம் காலத்து நாயகன்"?? அது முழுக்க கமல் பேட்டிகளின் தொகுப்பு என கேள்விப்பட்டேனே?

அது போக இந்த (யு.டிவி)தனஞ்செயன் என்பவர் ஏதோ ஒரு பத்தகம் எழுதினார், தமிழ் சினிமாவின் சாதனைகள் சம்திக் லைக் தட், அதில் கமல் பற்றியே அதிகம் இருந்ததாக சொன்னார்கள்....

[P_R]

நம் காலத்து நாயகன் பல கட்டுரைகளின் தொகுப்பு அப்படின்றதால கொஞ்சம் unevenஆ இருக்கும்.
விஜய்டிவி, கமல்-50ல பலமணிநேரம் ஓட்டின பேட்டிகளோட எழுத்துவடிவமும் உண்டு. அதுனால பக்தர்களுக்கு தெரியாத புது விஷயம் எதுவும் அதிகம் அதிகம் இல்லை.
ஆனா இதெல்லாம் நாம கூட வாங்கி வச்சுக்கலைன்னா எப்படி?

பல பழைய பேட்டிகள் இருந்துச்சு. எனக்கு ரொம்ப பிடிச்ச பகுதிகள் இதுதான். As an archivist உங்களுக்கு பிடிக்கும். You can see where he is coming from.
In one thing where Gnani says: aren't you winking at the audience when you make your masalas? i.e. even I - the intellectual Kamalhassan - am making these movies.
Kamal's response is something you will like: he completely rejects Gnani. And says he wants to be true to the film he is making. So if he thought he had given the impression of winking, then that would point to his failure as an actor. And many such interesting points.

[aceqoxim]

Stardust

I suggest you try out few other movies too, like an Art film called "Kutti" and "Uchithani Mugarnthal".

Art films endra antha thanipatta genre-ai rasikira alavu naan inga irukira hubbers mathiri intellectually mature endru thonalai. Kamal, padangalaiye art mathiri edukirathala enakku avar theivam mathiri.

Mahanadhi climax-la he balances himself on knife while the voice over repeats the lines of Barathi. Nan sathiyama solren, naan kaiyeduthu kumbitten, antha frame-ai parthu.

PR- whoa, I'm impressed. I would be delighted to see a detailed review written by you. :)

[hamid]

PR,
Arumaiyaana postkalukku naduvula thevai illama post panna kuudathunnuthaan nalla irukkunnu kuuda sollama amaithiya unga ezuththukkala padichittu irukken. Gives the real perspective which was missed for most of the parts like me. If u go ahead and publish a book u can becsure i will buy one copy for sure. There will be so many like me here and outside.

Please continue

[PARAMASHIVAN]

One of Fav song is from this movie !

Shri ranga nathanin paatham by SPB and the kid :thumbsup:

[PARAMASHIVAN]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BeAr9BUa6Ms&feature=player_detailpage

[aceqoxim]

I apparently loved the 'peigalai nambathe' song when I was a kid. I don't remember much, but mum always said I used to wrap my head with the kitchen towel and jump around the house like Mario whenever that song came on. :mrgreen:

[jaiganes]

ppl pls dont digress from the discussion on mahanadhi into silly segways.. oru nalla flowla poittu irukku...
This movie is the real "derailed".. oru chinna sabalam - leading to "pulam peyarvu" and the impacts of it -
Pretty much like silappadhigaaram - the story of a derailed family resulting in a "punishment" of sorts.
Ultimately both were about "Aram" - while silappadigaaram was about "paandiyan's aram", mahanadhi
in a democratic setup is about general "aram" of society - this decades before such activist thoughts
entered our mainstream society and before any writer started making a living out of "delivering aram" on a blog...

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

All songs are fav! Even sumaar songs grew on and later understood they r not sumaar! Btw, i remember alanjufying for the audio casette. it became available, only after 2/3 weeks after the movie released.

PeigaLai nambaathe is a suberb song! Filled with creative stuff! SN Lakshmi Paatti kooda kalakkiruppaanga! Other songs are as sweet. Baarathiyaar lines are goosebump givers.

Sriranganaathan - Aathigar kamal would show the beauty of the temple, along with the beautiful song. I even like the postion sung by Uma ramaNan, whihc was not in the film.

Along with this, there are 2 other songs went un picturised.

I remember Vikatan lines for BGM -> படம் முழுக்க நம்மையும் அறியாமல் ஒரு சக்தி நம்மை இயக்குகிறது, படத்துடன் ஒன்றச்செய்கிறது. அதுதான் ராஜாவின் பின்னணி இசை! Of course, its the same for other raja films too!

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

Wow Thiraipaadal lists all of them!

http://www.thiraipaadal.com/album.php?ALBID=ALBIRR00331&lang=en

How many have listened to the 1st one?

Anbana
Enggeyo thekku
Peigala Bhoodhama
Pongal(Chitra)
Sri Ranga Ranga
Thaipongalum
Thanmanam Ulla Nenjum
Thediyathu
Thookam

[venkkiram]

மகாநதியில் எனக்கு மிகவும் பிடித்த பாடல் வரிகள்!

பேய்களை நம்பாதே பிஞ்சிலே வெம்பாதே நீ யோசி டோய்..
நாளொரு பொய்வாக்கு சொல்பவன் புண்ணாக்கு கால் தூசி ஹோய்
அச்சங்கள் எனும் பூதம் உனை அண்டாமல் அதை ஓட்டு..
பூச்சாண்டி தினம் காட்டும் அவர் பேச்செல்லாம் விளையாட்டு..
அதில் ஏமாந்தால் மனம் தினம் கெடும்..

எதை யாரு சொன்ன போதும் எதிர்க்கேள்வி ஒன்று கேளு
பெரியோர்கள் சொன்ன பாடம் அறிவாலே எடை போடு..
ஓர் நாளும் உனக்கு கூடாது பயமே...
ஆராய்ந்து எதையும் நீ காணு நிஜமே..
மூட எண்ணத்தை தீவைத்து மூட்டு..
அச்சமில்லைன்னு நீ வாழ்ந்து காட்டு...

உழைக்காமல் வம்பு பேசி அலைவானே அவன் பேய்
பணம் சேர்க்க பாதை மாறி பறப்பானே அவன் பூதம்
வீராதி வீரன் நீ என்று உலவு..
ஓர் நாளும் திசையை மாற்றாது நிலவு..
நீ நேருக்கு நேர் நின்று பாரு..
எதையும் ஏனென்று ஏதென்று கேளு...

[V_S]

P_R,
Wonderful write-ups! :clap: You are bringing every inch of Mahanadhi and the giant filmaker Kamalhaasan before us through your incredible thoughts. PadikkumbOthe KaNNu kalanguthu, office'la irrukarthunaala, I have to re-read at home. Yes, you should publish your writings, more than willing to buy and relish. :D: Great discussions everyone! :thumbsup:

[radiochandra]

MAHANADHI ------ CONVERTING ATHEISTS ------ SINCE 1994


- pONGAL DAY 1994 ..... Me in standard 11. Standing outside Ajantha theatre in Pondicherry ( now Hotel Athithi )

Dad already arranged for first day fans show tickets. After 2 hours, comes the disappointing news ..... "Potti varala". "Padam naalaikku thaan". Ahaa.... "potti" illaamal thavithu pona vaalibanaanen naan. ( No double meaning intended )

Frustration ...... depression ...... evening added to depression ...... dad saw my plight and said " Vaada .... vera ethaavadhu cinema pogalaam ".

BALAJI THEATRE ---- AMAIDHIPPADAI houseful

ANANDA THEATRE --- Sethupathi IPS ----- Vijayakanth padam paarpathukku "depression" is much better. So i said "No"

Jeeva - Rukmani complex ---- Prabhu's 100th film RAJAKUMARAN

Vera vazhi ? poi ukkandhaachu ..... dad vera NT fan aache .... "Sodhanai mel sodhanai, pothumadaa saami" ..... first time in my 16 years of life , saw dad scolding NT for letting such a stupid movie happen as his son's 100th movie. Ilayaraja and Gounder were the saving grace. ( Though i had a fascination for Nadia and Meena ...... Pathinaaru vayasaache enakku .....)

Next day .... dad has to go to office ( Pothu Pani thurai ). So, me and mom go to the 3rd rated AJANTHA theatre.

# Krishnaswamy , the prisoner posing for the still photo with the black board in his hands, and a blacker look in his eyes ...... theatre goes into raptures

# Nee Naathiganaa ?? and the scornful look from KH, the flashbacks ..... we soon realise this is not just a movie,,,,,, it is a heavy poetry on celluloid

# Sundar @ Iyer friend family from London ...... 7 minutes duration ...... 7000 hours of impact on the story line ...... Benz car, Handycam, Air conditioner, London english, better doctors, "seevalkaaran", the term used to address Krishnaswamy ...... avery frame poisoning the rustic minds into yearning for city life for the very first time

# Watch the scene where the boy rushes towards the foreign chocolate bars on the table, the slight eye direction from Krishna and the boy withdrawing ..... "Manners , boy .... manners " KH thinks, but then ..... is it becos the boy studies in a village school ?

# The change of expression when he imagines his wife in place of the daughter who adorns the red silk saree over her head ...... The seriousness when the mother in law sheds tears in front of the wife's photo at the end of the title song ....... ( Ingu nadippu pichai podappadum.... )

# Enter Dhanush ...... the mother in law who shows her dislike from the first frame on the highway road ..... folllowed by her displeasure when Krishna offers meals to the strangers from the city " enna vala valannu pechu ..... avanga kaalaila oorukku poravanga .....".

# the transition from "Puthusaa oruthar chit fund aarambikkanumna evalo selavaagum? to the Pooja in Chennai for the new company

# Venkatachalam giving a cheque for 10000 rupees, kamal trying to reach for it in the group still photo, but a $ inch gap between his fingers and the cheque

# The dog whining ominously in the new house at night

# Drunk Krishna crying with his daughter's feet on his forehead ( Every time his daughter speaks in her sleep, the scene carries heavy meaning )

# "Watch" edutha "Watchman" looking at the time and then recognising the owner of the watch Krishna

# Dhanush verum supply. Nee thaanda demand. ....... Krishna to Venkatachalam

# Typewriting lower pass panna pothaathaa ..... upper kooda pass pannanumaa ...... Kaveri to Dhanush

# Tiger vegetarian aayiduchu.

# Ilayaraja's Shenai re recording when the puberted daughter comes into the picture, with KH close up behind the bars


A spell bound audience ........ an atheist starts believing in God, the talent.

Kamal .... Kamal ...... where are you ? is it the same yourself here ?? No No >>>> i dont believe ...... Am losing faith ......

"Krishnaa ....... nee vegamaai vaaraai" ......... please

[venkkiram]

அன்புள்ள கமல்.

படம் பார்த்து வெளியே வந்ததும் உன்னிடம் நிறைய பேச வேண்டுமென்று நினைத்தேன். ஆனால் முடியவில்லை. 'மகாநதி'யின் ஆக்கிரமிப்பினால் என் கண்கள் குளமாயிருந்தது மட்டுமல்ல. பிரமிப்பினாலும், தாக்கத்தினாலும் வாயடைத்துப் போய் வெளியே வந்தேன். ஆகவேதான் 'பிறகு பேசுகிறேன்' என்று சொல்லி வந்து விட்டேன்.

கமல், 'மகாநதி' என்கிற ஒரு உணர்வுகளின் பிரவாகத்தை தமிழ்த் திரைக்குத் தந்த உனக்கு ரசிகர்களின் சார்பில் ஆயிரமாயிரம் நன்றி சொல்ல வேண்டும் போல் தோன்றுகிறது. நீ என்னை ஆசான் என்பாய். ஆனால் நீ தான் இந்தப் படத்தின் மூலம் பலவிதங்களிலும் திரையுலகிற்கே ஆசானாக எனக்குத் தெரிகிறாய்.

திரைக்கதையமைப்பில் இந்தப் படம் ஒரு சாதனையென்றால், நடிப்பில் நீ சிகரத்தைத் தொட்டிருக்கிறாய். அத்தனை குணசித்திரங்களையும் அற்புதங்களாக நிகழ விட்டிருக்கிறாய்.

யாரைப் பாராட்டுவது? யாரை விடுவது...உன்னோடு தோள் கொடுத்து நின்ற அத்தனை கலைஞர்களுக்கும், கலை நுணுக்க வல்லுநர்களுக்கும் எனது பாராட்டுக்களும் வாழ்த்துக்களும்.

உனது நடிப்பை 'பதினாறு வயதினிலே' படம் பார்த்துவிட்டு, உன்னை 'ராஸ்கல்' என்று அன்புடன் அழைத்து ஒரு பாராட்டுக் கடிதம் எழுதிய நினைவு வருகிறது.

அதே வார்த்தையை இன்றும் சொல்ல வைத்துவிட்டாய்.

என் அன்புள்ள ராஸ்கல்!
நீ வாழ்க!

அன்பன்
கே.பாலசந்தர்

[venkkiram]

அன்புள்ள அய்யா,

கடிதமெழுத அமர்ந்து, வார்த்தைகளே இடையூறு செய்ய, கசங்கிய காகித உருண்டைகள் மேடாய் குவிந்ததே மிச்சம். கடிதம் வேண்டாம், நன்றியை நேரிலேயே சொல்லி விடலாம் என உறுதிபூண்டு கண்ணாடி முன் ஒரு ஒத்திகை, மனைவியிடம் ஒரு ஒத்திகை என்று பார்த்ததில் எனக்குப் பேச்சை விட அழுகை நன்றாக வருகிறது என்பது மட்டுமே தெளிவானது.

என்னிடம் தங்களுக்குள்ள எதிர்பார்ப்புகளுக்குத் தகுதியுடையவனாக நான் இனிமேல்தான் ஆகவேண்டும். சத்தியமாய் இது அவையடக்கமல்ல. தன் நிலை விளக்கம்.

தந்தை பாசம் இடைஞ்சல் செய்யாமல் இருந்தால் நீங்களும் இதையே உணர்வீர்கள்.

உங்கள் பாராட்டுதலினால் அகந்தை மிகுந்துவிடாமல் இருக்க, முன்னெச்சரிக்கையாய் நெருங்கிய நண்பர்களிடமும் 'உறவு மற்றும் என் மனைவியாரிடமும் என்னை விமர்சித்துப் பாதுகாக்க வேண்டியுள்ளேன்'.

'அரங்கேற்றம்' படத்தில் நடிக்க வாய்ப்பளித்து, ஊக்குவித்ததைவிட அதிகமான ஊக்கத்தை, நீங்கள் 'மகாநதி'க்களித்த பாராட்டினால் ஏற்படுத்தி உள்ளீர்கள். இதெல்லாம் எழுதிவிட்டதால் சொல்ல வந்ததைச் சொல்லி விட்டதாக அமர்த்தமாகாது.

பல ஆண்டுகளாக, நான் சொல்லாமலே நீங்களும், நீங்கள் சொல்லாமலே நானும் புரிந்துகொண்ட, பல உணர்ச்சி நெகிழ்வுகள் போல் - இம்முறையும் ஏன் இத்தனை நெகிழ்வு கமலுக்கு?

நான் வழக்கம் போல் எனக்குப் பிடித்ததைப் பாராட்டி வாழ்த்துகிறேன் - என நீங்கள் நினைக்கலாம். ஏற்கெனவே உங்களுக்கு எழுதிய உவமை ஒன்று பொருத்தமாக உள்ளதால் - மறுபடியும் பிரயோஜனமாகிறது.

மழையின் பெருமைகளை
மழையிடன் கேட்காதீர்கள்.
இந்த மண்ணிடம் கேளுங்கள், சொல்லும்.

மழையின், மண்ணின் மைந்தன்
கமலஹாசன்
'94 ஜனவரி'.

[SoftSword]

RC :notworthy:

indha thread ellaam padichaa kallum karayum... kamal karaya maattaaraa...
linka email pannungappa...

[aceqoxim]

Oru chinna doubt. Was this movie a hit among the masses during its release? I know it's critically a hit, as no one I've ever met has had a bad word to say about the film, but was it successful commercially?

[SoftSword]

idhukkappuram dhan indha maadhiri padamlaam DD'la sunday madhiyam mattum paakkanumnu illai, theatrelayum pakkalaamnu konjam warm up aachunu nenakkiraen...

[groucho070]

How I wish they'd release a DVD with Kamal's commentary/ interview....one can only wish :sad:

[venkkiram]

# Typewriting lower pass panna pothaathaa ..... upper kooda pass pannanumaa ...... Kaveri to Dhanush

May I know what is so special on this question? Thanks!

[app_engine]

Oru chinna doubt. Was this movie a hit among the masses during its release? I know it's critically a hit, as no one I've ever met has had a bad word to say about the film, but was it successful commercially?

It possibly made decent money - but definitely not in proportion to the quality / critical acclaim.

One of the reasons could be almost zero repeat audience. (One had to be too much kal nenjan to watch it a second time - like many commented, it's not easy to even give a youtube watch for that scene and not weep / cry / get affected for a long time...the 90's audience didn't have that kind of energy & time to invest in this movie I think...Kamal should have done this during uthirippookkaL days - it would have seen silver jubilee).

ayyA, yArachchum konjam SB'kkum oru cup juice kudungappA :-)

[app_engine]

The producer was S A Rajkannu - who made 16 vayadhinilE some 15 years before! (Kamal used to call this Pollachi man as 'modhalALi' it seems). avarukkum oru kOppai thEneer please :-)

[P_R]

:ty: hamid, V_S


:clap: @ radiochandra


# Drunk Krishna crying with his daughter's feet on his forehead ( Every time his daughter speaks in her sleep, the scene carries heavy meaning )
That early morning scene with SNL.Two great performers.


# Sundar @ Iyer friend family from London ...... 7 minutes duration ...... 7000 hours of impact on the story line ...... Benz car, Handycam, Air conditioner, London english, better doctors, "seevalkaaran", the term used to address Krishnaswamy ...... avery frame poisoning the rustic minds into yearning for city life for the very first time
Yeah.


A/c illai?
Illai...pOttukkalai


idhu vasanam :clap:


ivvaLO thamizh patru indha payyanukku is how Sundar recalls the tar-poosing college days. But look at how he prefixes that too: ivan vashtaadhu..ivunga appA periya aaLu

i.e. Even his good friend thinks Krishna could afford to be who he was because was privileged!
Is he actually much different from Panchapakesan? He doesn't think he has any stake in the proceedings. Why didn't he have a political opinion? He has no qualms about saying he wouldn't've expressed his opinion, until he could have afforded it.

namakku edhukku vambu - is exactly what Panchapakesan's attitude also is!

Sundar has -presumably- from beginnings without privilege done well for himself by leaving India. By opting out of the fight in his own way. Panchapakesan considers himself powerless to change his own lot, forget society's. Sundar's is an active escape (avunga oor mannArkudi illai...London!), Panchapakesan's is an escape into his shell of delusional solace.

One other Panchapakesan line which I find extraordinary is: oNNum prayOjanam illai Krishna. thulukkANamA kokkA? ennai vadhaikkaNumnu theermAnam paNNittAn...viduvanA?

It is typical resignation alright, but there is a weird and perverse admiration of the power of his oppressor! The system is so powerful, big and bad - and we better find our corners than do anything to mess with it - what a strong an universal belief.

urimai ellAm irukkuradhA oru eNNamE kidaiyAdhu. valichchA kooda 'ippo seththa thEvalai'nu sollidaNum.
Isn't that how most of us deal with society? Self-preservation - the strongest instinct of all!
Not to be confused with perjorative adjectives like self-serving.

[groucho070]

Let me join the queue and praise P_R for his awesome writing. I avoided second viewing for precisely the reason app gave before this page. I still have the dvd, oru kattam varaikin-thAn pArkamudiyuthu.

[joe]

படம் வந்த போது அழுதாலும் பரவாயில்லைண்ணு 4 தடவை தியேட்டர்ல பார்த்திருக்கேன்.

[Anban]

படம் வந்த போது அழுதாலும் பரவாயில்லைண்ணு 4 தடவை தியேட்டர்ல பார்த்திருக்கேன்.

:clap:

[raajarasigan]

ayyA, yArachchum konjam SB'kkum oru cup juice kudungappA :-)SB was the chief guest in my friend's college function..

Students: sir, mahanadhi kamal thAnE direct pannAru?
SB (with a smiling face): aamappa...athellAm ethukku ippo ? :lol:

[raajarasigan]

as app mentioned, second time pAkkura alavukku ennakku thiraNi illa... but after reading this thread esp P_R & RC's posts, I am going to revisit this.... :D

[joe]

This movie flopped
This is another nonsense that many assumed ..The movie was neither a blockbuster nor a flop ..It was a 100 days movie ..even @Trichy Maris Rock ,it ran for 90 days.

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

Kamal is never a greedy fellow and took less remuneration for this film. This in spite of he donning multiple hats. Of course production values are less, too. Actually, Mr. S.A.Rajkannu, the great man, never complained! He had spoken good about the film, after its release

[selvakumar]

Joe, My uncle who worked in the fan club and a HC kamal veriyan told me once that it was a flop. :) Again, he might be wrong. But just that he doesn't consider that as a hit.

[joe]

Joe, My uncle who worked in the fan club and a HC kamal veriyan told me once that it was a flop. :) Again, he might be wrong. But just that he doesn't consider that as a hit.

Selva,
Mahanathi didn't do well in small towns ,but it had a decent run in cities ..90 days in Trichy in those days was not considered as flop ..As far as i know it did well in my hometown Nagercoil also . IMO , it reached its targeted audience .

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

All the Guna, Mahanathi, Anbe Sivam aren't literally flops. They made some money which, if made with other actors would not even touch this, one thing. Other thing is, kamal donned multiple hats for these films but didn't get a salary like dasavatharam. The movies themselves are kind of low budget. So no great loss or whatsoever. Mainly, nobody complained. Agreed that handful of distributors and theatre owners could have settled by giving them the next kamal's films' rights. Thats an general industry practice. Bottomline is, in end of the day, i guess there is no need for anybody to worry about the financial non-performance. Instead, we shud discuss more about artistic acceptance of the general public.

Mahanadhi released in 1994 Pongal. Guna was before. Anbe Sivam was made at 2003 Pongal. At that time, kamal presided and gave a speech at the Chennai Book Fair. He said something in the lines of this -> "தரமான படைப்புகளை ரசிகர்கள் ஆதரிப்பார்கள் என தொடர்ந்து அத்தகைய படங்களை செய்துகொண்டிருக்கிறேன், ரசிகர்கள் வருவார்கள் என காத்துக்கொண்டும் இருக்கிறேன், ஆனாலும் 25 வருடங்கள் என்பது அநியாயம்."

The next pongal, 2004, he have Virumaandi. 2002, it was Hey Raam. How can we blame this man??

[selvakumar]

Thanks Joe for the additional information.

[SoftSword]

pr...
i was wondering, what would the iyer hav done if he was in a situation to save his daughter from baddies and in a comfortable position to kill them to save her...

[radiochandra]

SOME MORE RANDOM POINTS ON THE MAHA EPIC

---- The movie discussion started with KH, SB, Raaki Rangaraajan et al discussing "Realistic depiction of jail life" as the core subject. KH was supposed to play a post graduate student at college trying to steal a university exam question paper to land in jail. This was the pre evolution concept.

------ Thina thanthi guys said shooting would start on the banks of Ganga, then, proceed to Mahandhi, godavari, krishna and then end with Kaveri. ( Namma mediakku solliyaa tharanum )

------ The girl in Sonagachi is neither shobana nor sangeetha ...... Sangeetha refused to act in that scene exposing and all, so the daughter character and the son character have 3 atrists each playing them.

------- a slight aberration I found in the movie. Sundar, the brahmin friend asks "rendu pasanga thaana ? when he first meets kamal in the village pool side. The next day, while leaving from Krishna's house, he comments on the old family doctor as having killed Krishna's wife and also explains to his wife " indha paiyan porathappothaan ........". Bit of a contradiction there.

------ Kaveri is being misused by Dhanush ( Kerala ) and Venkatachalam ( who speaks kannada with Manju ) ---- does that symbolise the river water dispute ?

------ directaa krishna could have been shown as the prisoner. But, the first frame shows him in squatting position ..... getting his hair shorn like evry other thug in jail. shows the dpth of fall and insult for the family loving educated middle class man.

----- Coovam, which was a beautiful river and now a world famous saakadai also plays a character in the movie just like cauvery and ganges.

------ Prostitution aana piragum the daughter is a small girl , innocent as ever ...... she shows the sppeding train on the Howrah bridge to her dad , as if they were just on a boating trip on the Hoogly during summer vaca

[venkkiram]

வெங்கி, படத்தின் முக்கியமான படிமத்தை மிக தட்டையாக உள்வாங்கியிருக்கிறீர்கள். இது ஒரு சோகத் திணிப்பு அல்ல. விளக்க முயல்கிறேன்.

தனிமனித இழப்புகள் இல்லாமல் பிரச்சனைகளுக்கு தீர்வை எதிர்பார்ப்பது வேடிக்கையானது'[/I] என்பது தான் கமல் முன்வைக்கும் கருத்து.

வெங்கடாசலத்தை கொலை செய்ய நெருங்கும்போது கூட, அது தனிநபர் பழிதீர்க்கும் செயலாக இல்லை என்பதை அந்த காட்சியின் வசனங்கள் தெளிவுபடுத்தும். கிருஷ்ணசாமியின் கோபம் ஒரு சமுதாயக்கோபம். அதுவே நம்மை அடுத்த காட்சியை உள்வாங்கத் தயார்படுத்துகிறது.அதன்பிறகு நடக்கும் காட்சி ஒற்றை அர்த்தத்தைத் தாண்டி உயர்ந்து நிற்கிறது.

தன்னளவில் கிருஷ்ணசாமி ஏற்றுக்கொண்ட இழப்பு ஒரு badge of honor. (வேடிக்கை மனிதரைப் போல நான் வீழ்வேனென்று நினைத்தாயோ). மேற்சொன்ன எல்லாவற்றிற்குமான குறியீடாகி, திரைப்படத்தையே அடுத்த தளத்துக்கு உயர்த்துகிறது அந்த முடிவுக் காட்சி. அக்காட்சி வெறும் சோகத் திணிப்பு அல்ல.

கிருஷ்ணசாமி இழக்காத ஒன்றா? செல்வம், குடும்பமே சின்னாபின்னமாதல், ஜெயில் தண்டனை - அங்கு நடக்கும் கொடுமைகள்.. தனது பெண் போல சொனாகாஜியில் நிறைய.. சமுதாய இழப்புக்களும் ஒன்று சேர.. இதற்கும் மேலேயும் அவனிடம் "நீ இன்னும் சிலவற்றை தனிப்பட்ட முறையில் இழந்தாதான் தனுஷ் - வெங்கடாசலம் கொலைகளுக்கு தீர்வாக இருக்கும்" என எதிர்பார்ப்பது கொஞ்சம் நெருடலாக இருக்கிறது!

இன்னொன்று. கதையை அமைத்த பாணியில் எனக்கு ஒத்துவராத ஒன்று. கிருஷ்ணசாமியின் சொந்த ஊர் ..கிராமம் அல்லது ஒரு மேஜர் பஞ்சாயத்து டவுன் என வைத்துக்கொள்ளலாமா? பரம்பரை பரம்பரையாய் வசித்து வருகிற கிருஷ்ணசாமிக்கு எப்படி கடைசி வரையிலும் ஏன் நண்பர்கள் - சொந்தங்கள் இல்லாமல் எதோ மாமியார் -மகன் - மகள் என்ற சிறு வட்டத்திலேயே! நான் எப்படிவேனாலும் களத்தை செதுககுவேன். ரசிகர்களே நீங்களும் நூல் பிடித்தாற்போல என்னுடன் கூடவே வரணும் என கமல் நினைக்கிறார் போல. ஆயிரத்துல ஒரு களம் கிருஷ்ணசாமியுடையது. பொதுவா இதுபோன்ற சம்பவங்கள் கிருஷ்ணசாமி போன்ற மதிப்புடைய மனிதர்களுக்கு நிகழ்ந்தால் (வியாபாரம் நொடிப்பு - ஜெயில் தண்டனை) கூட உறுதுணையாய் இருப்பது சுற்றமும் நட்பும். அந்த இரு குழந்தைகளும் இந்த அளவுக்கு சிதறிப்போகும் வாய்ப்பு மிகவும் குறைவு. அதிக பட்சம் உறவினர் வீட்டில்/நண்பர்கள் வீட்டில் சரியாக மதிக்கப்படாமல்/கொடுமைகளுக்கு ஆளாக்கப் படலாம். கிராமத்து கிருஷ்ணசாமியை எதோ நகர வாழ்க்கை மனிதர்கள் போல "தானுண்டு தன் குடும்பம் உண்டு!" என்ற அமைப்பிலேயே காட்டுவது எனக்கு விந்தையாக இருக்கிறது.

[app_engine]

கிராமத்து கிருஷ்ணசாமியை எதோ நகர வாழ்க்கை மனிதர்கள் போல (தானுண்டு தன் குடும்பம் உண்டு!) என்ற அமைப்பிலேயே காட்டுவது எனக்கு விந்தையாக இருக்கிறது.

Good point. However, there're also the following 'long-term-realities':
a) patta kAlilE padum / ketta kudiyE kedum
b) aRRa kuLaththin aRu neerppaRavaikaL thingy

Movie making is not about 'average-completely-real' kind of cases. It could highlight one-off cases with some amount of dramatism.

Like you mentioned, there could be some mikaippaduththudhalkaL & some nerudalkaL when watching the movie. However, the jail scenes / kolkota scenes / girl-uRakkaththil-alaRum scene - these three are phenomenal, taking the movie to extraordinary heights - from an average-movie-watcher-PoV (read a_e).

These scenes make one's heart heavy and numbs mind to any "analysis". That's where the maker scores very high!

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

வெங்கி, கமலின் தளங்கள், கதை நகரும் விதம் இதெல்லாம் சொல்ல வருபவை என்னவென்றால், அவர் ஒரு குறிப்பிட்ட சூழலை நோக்கி கதையை நகர்த்திவிட்டுவிடும் சுபாவமுடையவர். இது அனைத்து கமல் படங்களிலுமே பொருந்தும். ரொம்பவே லாஜிக் பார்க்கக்கூடாது.

அதே சமயம், நிறைய நண்பர்காள் இருந்தும் ஒரு குறிப்பிட்ட (புதிய)நபரை நம்பி பணத்தை முதலீடு செய்யும் மனிதர்களை நான் பார்த்தும் கேட்டும் இருக்கிறேன். பின்னாளில் அந்த வக்கீல் கூட வந்து சொல்வார், காவிரிகரைய்ல் ராஜா போல உட்கார்ந்துகொண்டு நீங்கள் சொன்னால் ச்ய்துதர நாங்கள் இருக்கிறோம் என. ஆனால், கதாசிரியரின் விருப்பம், நாயகன் தானே விரும்பிப்போய் கடைசியில் ஒரு க்ளிஷேவுக்குள் சிக்கிக்கொள்வது என்பதுதான். எல்லாவற்றையுமே கேள்வி கேட்டால் வேலைக்கே ஆவாது!

டாக்ட்டர், முதலில் கமல் ஒரு பெண்ணை விரும்பி அவளை இம்ப்ரெஸ் செய்ய கிரிக்கெட் விளையாடுவதுபோலவும், கிருஷ்ணமாச்சாரி ஸ்ரீகாந்த்தை விட்டு "இவன் நல்ல ப்ளேயர்" என சொல்லவைப்பதுபோல எல்லாம் கதை நீண்டது என கமல் ஜூ.வி பேட்டியில் சொன்னார்

ரா.கி.ரங்கராஜனைப்பற்றியும் கமல் உயர்வாகச்சொன்னார். "காவேரியை தனுஷ் கெடுத்துட்றான்னு சொல்றீங்க, பொண்ணு வயசுக்கு வந்துட்டாளா?" என ரா.கி கேட்டதால்தான், அந்த ஜெயில் மற்றும் அதைத்தொடர்ந்த காட்சிகள், சுகன்யா முதன்முதலில் கமலின் பாட்டி வீட்டுக்கு வரும் காட்சியும் வைத்தார்கள்..

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

கும்பகோணம் அருகில் திருநாகேஸ்வரம் என்ற ஊரில் தான் கிராமத்து காட்சிகள் எடுக்கப்பட்டன. கும்பகோணம் சுற்றியுள்ள நவகிரக கோயில்களுக்கு விசிட் போனால், அந்த வீட்டை காட்டுவார்கள்! நான் பார்த்ததுண்டு.

அதுபோக, இந்த திருநாகேஸ்வரம், மகாநதி கிராமத்து போர்ஷனை தொடர்புபடுத்தி ஒரு சிறுகதை, விகடனில் சில வருடங்கள் முன்பு படித்த ஞாபகம்..


ம்ம்ம், அப்படி இப்படி பார்த்தால், இந்தப்படத்தை சுற்றி எனக்கு பல நிகழ்வுகள், ஞாபகங்கள்!!

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

------- a slight aberration I found in the movie. Sundar, the brahmin friend asks "rendu pasanga thaana ? when he first meets kamal in the village pool side. The next day, while leaving from Krishna's house, he comments on the old family doctor as having killed Krishna's wife and also explains to his wife " indha paiyan porathappothaan ........". Bit of a contradiction there.

maybe he left to berikka, after that!

[rajkumarc]

Wonderful thread and great posts. Finally, I may get the courage to watch this epic again, thanks to this thread.

[hattori_hanzo]

Santhana Bharathi talks about the Jail scene in Mahanadhi

http://www.chennaibest.com/cityresources/entertainment/movies/santhanabarathi.asp

http://www.chennaibest.com/cityresources/entertainment/movies/img/santhanabarathi2.jpg

Which among your movies do you like the most?

Paneer Pushpangal -my first movie and Chinnamappillai among comedies, Guna and Mahanadhi among the serious ones. I knew that Guna would be successful right from the beginning. As far as Mahanadhi goes, Kamal has acted very well in this movie. Certain shots that he has given in this movie, I wouldn't have expected even in my wildest dreams. Particularly the scene where his daughter comes to visit him in jail. He told me to continue to take till he gave the cue. Everybody knew the scene, but nobody knew how he was going to do it. The emotions of a father, his helplessness.... and at the same time the need to hide his feelings from his children was really moving. When the scene got finally over, I had tears in my eyes.

[SoftSword]

naangalaam netthu nite'e kannu mulichu ukkandhu paatthaachu...
i think my heart was strong enuf...

[venkkiram]

கும்பகோணம் அருகில் திருநாகேஸ்வரம் என்ற ஊரில் தான் கிராமத்து காட்சிகள் எடுக்கப்பட்டன. கும்பகோணம் சுற்றியுள்ள நவகிரக கோயில்களுக்கு விசிட் போனால், அந்த வீட்டை காட்டுவார்கள்! நான் பார்த்ததுண்டு.

அதுபோக, இந்த திருநாகேஸ்வரம், மகாநதி கிராமத்து போர்ஷனை தொடர்புபடுத்தி ஒரு சிறுகதை, விகடனில் சில வருடங்கள் முன்பு படித்த ஞாபகம்..

ம்ம்ம், அப்படி இப்படி பார்த்தால், இந்தப்படத்தை சுற்றி எனக்கு பல நிகழ்வுகள், ஞாபகங்கள்!! திருவிடைமருதூரிலும் படப்பிடிப்பு நடத்தியிருக்கிறார்கள் என கேள்விப்பட்டிருக்கிறேன். எனது ஒரு அக்காவினை இங்கேதான் கொடுத்திருக்கிறோம். இந்தப் படம் வெளிவந்தபோது கோவையில் கல்லூரிப்படிப்பு. அர்ச்சனா - தர்ச்ச்சனா சினிமா அரங்கில் வெளியிட்டிருந்தார்கள் என நினைக்கிறேன். முதல் முதலில் இப்படம் ஏற்படுத்திய உணர்ச்சிகள் சொல்லமுடியாதது. கிருஷ்ணசுவாமி, பஞ்சாபகேசன், துலுக்கன், தனுஷ் ரொம்ப சீக்கிரமாகவே மனதில் அமர்ந்து விட்டார்கள். ரொம்ப நாட்களுக்கு விடுதியில் எனது அறையிலிருந்து ஒலிப்பாடல்கள் காற்றில் கலந்துகொண்டே இருந்தது. "சொல்லாத ராகங்கள்.." படத்தில் இல்லையென்றாலும், சிறையின் நடக்கும் சந்திப்பின் போது பின்னணி இசையில் உலவவிட்டிருப்பார் ராஜா.

[Nerd]

Very nice P_R :clap:

Mahanadhi, easily among the best 3 best thamizh films. Kamal's peak. Steady / linear decline after that, up until UPO. MMA was sorta nice so I expect Viswaroopam to be at least at near Anbe Sivam.

[V_S]

MMA was sorta nice so I expect Viswaroopam to be at least at near Anbe Sivam.
+1 I like MMA a lot. Whenever I have free time, I use to watch MMA. My wife and kids love that movie, may be that is another reason. It is a great stress reliever. salikkavE maattenguthu even after 2 years. Even I know it is not one of Kamal's best film as per most of our hubbers, somehow I get dissolved in to that story line and subject. I love Usha Utup's acting even though she comes in only few scenes. Right from the first scene where you can see face and her body language when Trisha gets phone from Surya, matchless. The way she says 'enakku thaangala' I use to laugh like anything.:D Madhavan's acting was effortless. Kamal's performance especially when he chats with Ramesh Arvind and when he pukes, he cuts the call and you have to see his face. You can see how he dies for his real friend. Urvasi, enough said already. Very few non-IR movies where I liked the music very much. DSP impressed me so much in that movie. Sangeetha was too good. It is a perfect entertainer to our whole family.

Only thing I am concerned with Viswaroopam is how in first place he was ready to give this kind of script to Selvaraghavan. That raises lot of doubts. I think once he took over, he might have changed it a lot, still that concerns me. I too hope it will be like Anbe Sivam or Hey Ram or Virumandi.

Sorry for the digression.

[venkkiram]

+1 I like MMA a lot. Whenever I have free time, I use to watch MMA. My wife and kids love that movie, may be that is another reason. It is a great stress reliever. salikkavE maattenguthu even after 2 years. Even I know it is not one of Kamal's best film as per most of our hubbers, somehow I get dissolved in to that story line and subject. I love Usha Utup's acting even though she comes in only few scenes. Right from the first scene where you can see face and her body language when Trisha gets phone from Surya, matchless. The way she says 'enakku thaangala' I use to laugh like anything.:D Madhavan's acting was effortless. Kamal's performance especially when he chats with Ramesh Arvind and when he pukes, he cuts the call and you have to see his face. You can see how he dies for his real friend. Urvasi, enough said already. Very few non-IR movies where I liked the music very much. DSP impressed me so much in that movie. Sangeetha was too good. It is a perfect entertainer to our whole family.

சோழர் பரம்பரையில் இன்னொரு எம்.எல்.ஏ!

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

+1 I like MMA a lot. Whenever I have free time, I use to watch MMA. My wife and kids love that movie, may be that is another reason. It is a great stress reliever. salikkavE maattenguthu even after 2 years.
Eppadi salikkum? PAdam vanthe 1.5 years thaan aachu :lol:

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

Only thing I am concerned with Viswaroopam is how in first place he was ready to give this kind of script to Selvaraghavan. That raises lot of doubts. I think once he took over, he might have changed it a lot, still that concerns me.

Appadi ellaam innumaa paakkureenga?!? Anbe sivam Sundar.C kitta kuduthathu kuuda vitrunga. Unga favourite MMA KSR kitta kuduthaare. athukku enna solreenga?!? I was wondering when even P_R made this point. Isn't Selva much much better than likes of sundar.C, KSR etc?!?

[SoftSword]

venki...iyaam also solar dynasty ya....

[MADDY]

------ Kaveri is being misused by Dhanush ( Kerala ) and Venkatachalam ( who speaks kannada with Manju ) ---- does that symbolise the river water dispute ?

i dont think too much of hanifa character there but a kannadiga "abusing" kaveri is undisputably tempting for kamal.......i have lot of disagreements with kamal's politics in movies including this one......

[venkkiram]

-deleted-

[P_R]

Hanifa's heavy accent suggests he is Malayalee. But any other suggestion in the story? It could have been Kamal (and groucho's) obsession with sondhakkural.
Venkatachalam kooda kannadiga demonization-nu sollamAttEn. oru line-ai vachchu overread paNNamudiyAdhu. If he wanted to do that he would have used more obvious markers. Heavily localized-A portray paNNiyirukka thEvai illai.

Linguistic politics side-taking, is something Hassar has not done. I am everyone's own 'nRa mAdhiri dhaan maindain paNNuvaar.
Hindi- adhu vERa department.

[Plum]

Mahanadhi might be among the best 3 tamil movies ever but Hey Ram would be the best, if not for udhiri pookkal. Decline after mahanadhi OraLavukku uNmai but the absolute peak of Kamal was Hey Ram. ippOdhakku ivLo dhAn solla nEram irukku

[ajithfederer]

Unmaya dhaane sollirukaaru. :)

i dont think too much of hanifa character there but a kannadiga "abusing" kaveri is undisputably tempting for kamal.......i have lot of disagreements with kamal's politics in movies including this one......

[Plum]

Kannada demonization is a paranoid reading :)

Kaveri politicsla nadigargaL rally-la sensibleA pEsinadhu yAru? ControversialA pEsi vambula mAttinadhu yAru?

[P_R]

Guys, let's keep the discussions about readings possible in the film.

[P_R]

Plum, two fights-naala solreengaLA?

Over the years I have come to think of Mahanadhi is the best. romba deeppammA.
HeyRam paththi ezhudhunga. innoru thread aarambippOm.

Actually, if you are all fine I think this can be merged with the Sindhanai Selvar thread.
That's a good repository for such discussions.

[V_S]

P_R,
venkki brought up a good point about why Krishnasamy was left alone with no help from relatives/neighbours (of his village) even in acute situation. Neither he did any consultation with others (at least was not shown) before moving to Chennai, nor they helped him. I know sakala replied saying 'logic'laam romba paakkakoodaathu'.

I know for the kind of story he has to tell through this film, he has to compromise something, but since it is coming from Kamal, I think there should be more reason to this. I too feel it is glaringly obvious.

Would like to know your take on this, if you can please.

[Roshan]

P_R,
venkki brought up a good point about why Krishnasamy was left alone with no help from relatives/neighbours (of his village) even in acute situation. Neither he did any consultation with others (at least was not shown) before moving to Chennai, nor they helped him. I know sakala replied saying 'logic'laam romba paakkakoodaathu'.

I know for the kind of story he has to tell through this film, he has to compromise something, but since it is coming from Kamal, I think there should be more reason to this. I too feel it is glaringly obvious.

Would like to know your take on this, if you can please.

Mahanadhi remains one of my favourite movies till now but the point Venki raised has always been a question in my mind too. In the initial scenes Krishna is shown as a well respected person in his native but when he faces troubles there's no body (ulagam appadithaan kashtapadumpOthu gavanikka yaarum irukka maattaang'ra poali thaththuvam ellaam sellaathu) Irrespective of all good, political and 'philosophical' aspects in the movie - this particular thing remains as a weak link and doesnt let me accept this movie as all time greats of Kamal. And I am unable to come to terms that all sort of worst and cruelest things on earth can happen to such a good man like Krishnasaamy.

[Roshan]

Solla maRanthuttaen..

Very nice posts and interpretations by you Prabhu ! As always :)

[Roshan]

And a good point noted there by Maddy. Avar sonnathukku appuramthaan 'ada aama'-nu thOnuchu.

[SoftSword]

i think the message there is, when a well established family moves out of a village, they shed away their sutramu natpum and they are all on their own...
also high chances that the landlord krishnasamy in his native would have made some enemies out of his relatives who are landlords, like paying more and giving more benefits to the labours and that could have made them to stay away from other landlords... and there always could hav been a coldwar... even during the festival we cannot see any other family with him other than the workers... a similar scene is there in yudhamsei when the family move out of their village... and they are left alone too...

[ajithfederer]

Well these things do happen.

And I am unable to come to terms that all sort of worst and cruelest things on earth can happen to such a good man like Krishnasaamy.

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

Point is, after he gets mild doubts at the party, he loses confidence on that girl. Later, he gets severe doubt and consults his friend'ly lawer Mohan Venkatram. He says Madrasla ithana company irukkurathe doubt, and leaves in urgency. Then, when he tries to take money, the Cash locker is empty. Even before he tries to react, People suspects and beats him badly. Then, as the company is in HIS name and he has lost the money, he is caught up badly. Maybe even if he passes message to his family, after going to jail, to contact that lawer, maybe danush ha Minister's link and may have merattified that lawyer too, making kirshnaswamy helpless..

Point is, Krishnaswamy is not shown as man with great intellect. He is just a pure honest man and things shown in the movie conveys that he is kind of in a shell, though he is too too a honest person. Thatswhy he VEroda Pidungify his links in his native village and totally moves to city, leaving almost nothing in his village. He thought of new life for him and his family, and somehow, may be a (bad) hunch, believed danush toomuch, to very shortly find out that is his life's biggest mistake. Things happen that fast that he is caught in cliche. He sitting in jail, and boht him and his family kind of desserted and knows nobody, and very imp, he is the stake owner of the lost money which creates ppl's anger. Chit fund, emaathittaan, is what everybody would think, no? Actually he has choosen plots very perfect - chit fund. Real life chitfund cheating happened even after this movie came.

[SoftSword]

goodman/badman'kum idhukkum enna sammandham... its just happens....

[app_engine]

In the initial scenes Krishna is shown as a well respected person in his native but when he faces troubles there's no body (ulagam appadithaan kashtapadumpOthu gavanikka yaarum irukka maattaang'ra poali thaththuvam ellaam sellaathu)

:shock:

What I quoted (aRRa kuLaththin aRu neerppaRavai) is not some "thathuvam", it had been a reality and thus became proverbial.

I myself had seen a similar thing happening to a supposedly wealthy family, right in a kukkirAmam, who supposedly had a lot of servants etc. Then at one point of time, nodichchuppOnAnga. The parents died (I don't know how, could have been suicide, but that was before I was born). But I saw all three grown-up children who got mentally affected and roamed around in the very same village almost as beggars - azhukku sattai, pala nAL kuLikkAmal angangE yAchakam kEttu nadappArkaL!

Their house became 'pAzhadaindha veedu' right next to the bus stop in the village. (I am talking about the village where my dad worked & where I grew up). Nobody cared for those three - except may be to give them tea & leftover food!

However, like I mentioned in my post to Venkkiram, this is not an "average situation" but possibly one-off.

Which is the case of most movies :lol2: (Does every left-out child in TN runs to Mumbai & become Varadharaja mudhaliyAr - Velu Naicker? Has every sales boy/girl in Saravana stores become the angAdiththeru hero/heroine?)

[V_S]

Good points ss and sakala. Thanks. Since we tend to think so many ways, as the movie did not convey those details about his village relationships and why no one was helping him when he was in a big problem, my question is, does Kamal the writer intentionally wants the viewers to build their own stories. If so then there is no question and in fact we can appreciate the brilliance. As we have even seen some non-indian movies like this for the viewers to fill in the blanks. On the other hand, if that was not intentional and if we think of these possibilities just because we like him so much, then there is a glitch. I don't know if this makes sense, but could not ignore this.

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

The most important point is, a character behaves certain way. Thats what the nature of character is all about. If it acts as what we expect, then its not real. The author defines the character that way. These kinda questions can be asked, and actually is being asked for every other film.

Robo design panna scientist kku athai control panna mudiyaathaa?!? etc

[wizzy]

it is too much of a ask for Krishnasami to roll out supporters from Village and organize a dharna against Venkatachalam & co :lol2:..he is touted as a private guy and it takes him a while to warm up to Panjapakesan.. it will be against his grain to seek help from peeps who know him for the all mess he has created for himself with that decision to seek a better life in city for him/kids..his only kadivalam was S.N Lakshmi..may be if she was around when he came back from jail he might have done things differently.

[Roshan]

Well these things do happen.

I dont believe so.

[SoftSword]

unconvinced'nu edutthukkittaa, i would say i am a little unconvinced on the events which makes him move to the town by selling all his properties...
OPM - other people money, when it is said by haneefa to the kamal first time, he mixes with a sarcasm which very well conveys that oor panatthula vaazhradhu... and when compared with what krishnasamy's friend says abt him during his college days doing poraattams for makkal and his choosing bsc agriculture, he could not be persuaded in a single night... ya, he does it for his kids education and to help them come out of their inferiority in not able to speak peter english, to become engineer and doctor...
even he himself has a conceived inferiority complex when compare to his london friend, which shows in the formula-1 scene... the ambassador wants to beat the benz and say that i have beaten u... which means the ambassador has always been beaten in such races until then... and that complex could have motivated him to go get on par with the rest of his mates in the city... but still, the events are not strong enuf...

[P_R]

P_R,
venkki brought up a good point about why Krishnasamy was left alone with no help from relatives/neighbours (of his village) even in acute situation. Neither he did any consultation with others (at least was not shown) before moving to Chennai, nor they helped him.

kAvErikkarai-la rAjA mAdhiri, kaiyai sodakkinA aayiram pEr unga vElaigaLai pArththukka mAttOmA.
ungaLukku chit-fund aarambikkaNumnA enga kitta sollirukka koodaadhA

says the lawyer MohanRam.

padichchavar neenga, power of attorney-la eppadi kai ezhuththu pOtteenga (recall he was in the process of being wined and seduced when he signed. Brilliant fleshing out of the 'oothi koduththu kai ezuththu vAngittAnga' trope. It is not the physical intoxication that makes people make wrong decision. It is the frame of mind, how you behave differently from how you would otherwise behave/decide.).

Krishna has no response to the lawyer. He can't even make eye-contact. Feels ashamed.

That he is cut-out by everybody - and nobody wants to touch him after his fall is indeed integral part of the story.
Perhaps he didn't want to let his father's name down (as SNL says in the accident scene: avunga appA sambAdhichadhu, ivar kAppAthikittu varaar)
Or it is an indictment of the world, where everyone is just a fair-weather friend.

And Krishna is not shown to be a very intelligent person. paNNaiyArs had people taking care of stuff for them, remember. He thought Dhanush was one such-something SNL saw through. Even the morning scene when he asks for accounts, he doesn't seem to be on top of things. Just trying to sound assertive.

It is quite presumable, the home front is being managed fully by SNL. That their finances were so bad that they had to rent the house - is something he comes to know by chance, remember.
Perhaps SNL was particular about not asking anyone for money. (neenga sonnadhu correctmA, indha oorla mariyAdhaiyE illai - how soon he says that!! In prison. We didn't hear the original conversation but we get an idea about their mode of thinking).

While on that scene - Yamuna sollichu..naalu varusham irukka vENaamaam. reNdu varushathulayE vitruvaangaLaam. naan thiruppadhikku mottai pOduradhA vENdi irukkEn maaple.
Most empathetic approach to the God question.

idhukku mEla plausiblity paththi pEsinA, equar vandhu thittuvaar jockradhai.

[Roshan]

:shock:

What I quoted (aRRa kuLaththin aRu neerppaRavai) is not some "thathuvam", it had been a reality and thus became proverbial.

I am sorry my post was not referring to yours because I have not read yours (I have read only a few here and there due to my busy schedule). I personally dont believe things can happen that way to good people. Wealthy people theruvukku varrathu niRaiya irukku. Being wealthy and being good are different things.

[venkkiram]

The most important point is, a character behaves certain way. Thats what the nature of character is all about. If it acts as what we expect, then its not real. The author defines the character that way. These kinda questions can be asked, and actually is being asked for every other film.
Robo design panna scientist kku athai control panna mudiyaathaa?!? etc Sakala.. I have compatibility issue only with the plot of Krishnaswamy's happy life in Mahanathi. Not on the characters. To be frank, there are no much characters involved in this movie. Kamal as a creator already cut off his dad, mom, his father in law, relatives and friends in the plot. At the end, Kamal even cut Krishnaswamy's hand too.

[SoftSword]

adhula enna empatheticnu pureelayae..

[P_R]

Kamal mentions in an interview that the 'being cheated in a chit fund' experience was something his dance-master Thangappan went through.

[Roshan]

Kamal mentions in an interview that the 'being cheated in a chit fund' experience was something his dance-master Thangappan went through.

Chit fundla niRaiya paer cheat paNNappattirukkaanga...

[P_R]

Panju: aamaam IPC 420-nu pOttirukkE...paNaththai enna paNNe?
Krishnasamy: idho paarunga...naan thirudan illai, muttAL

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

Infact Panjapakesan too is a muttaal, being a Bank employee, looses money and becomes suspect, victim! City la irukkuravaru eppadi emaaruvaaru nnu keppeengaLo?!?

That Junior Vikatan Interview is a bad miss here. Madhan actually asks some question and gets answer, about the issue we are discussing.

[P_R]

I personally dont believe things can happen that way to good people.
:shock:
idhukku enna badhil solradhunnE theriyalai.
enna maadhiri design idhu? kELvigal dhaan ulagathOda default setting.

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

"Oru middle class manushanodda bayam, oru appaavoda bayam thaan Magaanathi" nnu Kamale sollirukkaar. AnthaLavu thaan naama paakkaNum.

Seems somebody, whom kamal calls Cinema Pandithar!, had asked "Jail la irukkuravanukku eppadi kaathal varum?" and Kamal answered that too, in that JuVi Intruu.

[P_R]

adhula enna empatheticnu pureelayae..

Andal: enakku perumaaL dhaan mukkiyam
Govind:enakku manushanga dhaan mukkiyam

idhu caricature.
Mahanadhi is real. Shows how people approach and understand the God concept. Even the points he disagrees with he portrays richly.

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

அய்யர்:- காயத்ரி மந்திரம் சொன்னா கூறைய பிச்சிகிட்டு கொட்டும் பணம்

Kamal's reaction! :lol:

[app_engine]

I personally dont believe things can happen that way to good people.

Being wealthy and being good are different things.

"god sees the truth, but waits" (The famous Aksionov-Semyonich story)
"deivam ninRu kollum" (Thamizh proverb, means good people need to wait long before they get justice)

Besides, there's another fact :

mahAnadhi hero may be good but he "colloborates" (albeit foolishly) with wicked, which results in a lot of innocent people losing their money. He loses his "good" title once for all at that point of time, when he joined hands with a crook (resluting in people getting cheated.)

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

அய்யர்:- சமுதாயம் குறது...
கிருஷ்ணசாமி:- அப்பொ அதை உங்க பூஜை அறை மாதிரில்ல வெச்சிருக்கணும்?!?

:notworthy: :clap:

[SoftSword]

also i was wonderin on what could be the time frame between kamal moves to the city and starts his chitfund, and the day haneefa runs away..
first they move to the city and have one poojai... then they get the place ready and do formal inauguration of the chitfund... annakki night party... and next morning he starts becoming a bit 'strictu'... aduttha scene he consults his advocate friend and the same day when he goes to the office people flocking to return the money back... so many people invested in a new chitfund so quick?

[Roshan]

:shock:
idhukku enna badhil solradhunnE theriyalai.
enna maadhiri design idhu? kELvigal dhaan ulagathOda default setting.

I dont know if I have put my thoughts in the right way.. oru nalla manushanukku ippadiyellaam ulagathula uLLa aththanai kodumaiyum nadakkumgrathu realistic'a illa. May be I would have got convinced if he had stuck to one particular incident. Idhula manaivi saavu, soththu parimuthal, cheating, jail, jail kodumai, daughter ending up in a brothal, son goes missing, maamiyaar saavu, varungaala maamanaar jail'la, Sukanya's life is also not very pleasant, kadaisila kaiyyum vettikittu... oru niyaayam vaenaamaa.. Unrealistic I say..

[SoftSword]

Andal: enakku perumaaL dhaan mukkiyam
Govind:enakku manushanga dhaan mukkiyam

idhu caricature.
Mahanadhi is real. Shows how people approach and understand the God concept. Even the points he disagrees with he portrays richly.

anga he is against God, inga he is 'cat on the wall' illayaa?

: nee naasthiganaa?
: ungalukku epdi irundha sowgariyamo apdinu nenachukkonga...

adhulaam puriyudhu...
andha empathetic point with reference to thirupathikku mottai podrenu vendikkittaen by his mamiyaar... adhu dhan puriyalanu kaeten...

[P_R]

I meant the writer Kamal.
Even though his POV is 'indha muttAL thanaththai engE solli naanum azhuvadhu' he is not in prachAram/ridiculing mode.
He meets people at their level and explores their way of thought. Paints real pictures.

[SoftSword]

I dont know if I have put my thoughts in the right way.. oru nalla manushanukku ippadiyellaam ulagathula uLLa aththanai kodumaiyum nadakkumgrathu realistic'a illa. May be I would have got convinced if he had stuck to one particular incident. Idhula manaivi saavu, soththu parimuthal, cheating, jail, jail kodumai, daughter ending up in a brothal, son goes missing, maamiyaar saavu, varungaala maamanaar jail'la, Sukanya's life is also not very pleasant, kadaisila kaiyyum vettikittu... oru niyaayam vaenaamaa.. Unrealistic I say..

after around 40 yrs dhane ellaa kastamum varudhu... adhu varaikkum nalla sandhosamaana vaazhkai dhanae vaazhndhirukkaar...
adhaninum kodumai... ilamayil varumai... - andha maadhiri kastamlaam varalayae... if measured in a timeline too 1-40: happy life (economy or 4runs/over); 41st year total disaster (batting powerplay got hit for 5 sixers)

(idhu summa oru idhukku dhaan... not exactly a comparision)

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

SS, his nambikkai is fast eroding. That is evident when he sees the wall, right after PoorNam says "kooraya pichukittu kottum" The next scene, flashback -> aathigar Kamal visiting Ranganaathar Temple with family.

[SoftSword]

I meant the writer Kamal.
Even though his POV is 'indha muttAL thanaththai engE solli naanum azhuvadhu' he is not in prachAram/ridiculing mode.
He meets people at their level and explores their way of thought. Paints real pictures.

ah ok... fair then, thanks.

got it sakala... am there.

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

Ennaathu, "Nalla manushanukku pala kodumaigaL nadakkurathu realistic aa illai" yaa?? Appo whatever happened to Tamil innocents?!?

Kekka vechittaanga, naan enna seyya.

[P_R]

also i was wonderin on what could be the time frame between kamal moves to the city and starts his chitfund, and the day haneefa runs away..
first they move to the city and have one poojai... then they get the place ready and do formal inauguration of the chitfund... annakki night party... and next morning he starts becoming a bit 'strictu'... aduttha scene he consults his advocate friend and the same day when he goes to the office people flocking to return the money back... so many people invested in a new chitfund so quick?

Yes. I too think the timeline is not well established.
Only line is: SNL saying that Dhanush keeps saying 'Jayalalitha padichcha school' but is doing nothing.

That early morning chat she says: kaalaila piLLainga ellAm paLLikoodathukku pOyirum. Kinda indicating they have been in Chennai for a while - and have an established routine.

[Roshan]

To be frank, I am DAMN tired of Kamal's Naasthigam Vs Aasthigam stuff. I hope Vishwaroobam will be an exception and will be thoroughtly disappointed if he does Naasthiga propoganda again. If you dont believe in God, be it. You dont have to keep bragging about it and force your ideologies down others throats. Same goes for Aasthigars.

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

feeyaar, enna observation nga! pichu otharreL!

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

Simple. Until Aasthigars does the naasthi, PagutharivaaLar kamal will have to continue.

Suryar is a hint. He is a believer, thats what we all know and no doubt in that. He takes mike and says " Uzhaippu irunthaa pothum, Kadavul kooda thevai illai, ngra maathiri niroobichi kaattinaar paarunga, athaan kamal sir" That evidence/ proof coming from a person whu surely is not showing signs of Pagutharivu,naathigam, is what, the need of hour is.

Anbe sivam - Oru believer Maddy ya, Anbarasu character kku fix panni, story la, antha character oru payyanukku blood kuduthu help panna vechi, romba kashtapattu, kadaisila sethu pogura maathiri kaatti, athai paathu intha maddy character kovathula "enna maathiri design ithu" nnu polamba vittu, kadaisila, athanai confusion kku appuramum, atha character ai appadiye aathigar aave vittudura antha manasu irukke, athaan sir kadavul!

[P_R]

kalainnu vandhuttA, kolai kooda paNNalaam.
azhagA paNNaNum. avvaLavu dhaan en point of view.

[SoftSword]

adhulaam part of Kamal, the writer package...
http://pixelsharing.files.wordpress.com/2010/11/its-not-a-bug-its-a-feature.jpg?w=615

[V_S]

Very interesting posts P_R, sakala, SS, wizzy. Thank you very much. I am even quite convinced now why he moved to chennai mainly because of better eduction for children and wants to get richer as SS stated. I think as P_R stated, we may have to extrapolate Krishnasamy's character from the words of lawyer, SNL, Dhanush. Even if I see, some brittleness in the earlier character of Krishnasamy portrayed, I take sakala's words; author defines the character that way.

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

Namba Cinefan kooda kettaaru, "Viswaroopam hindu name is written in Islamic font. Will kamal write an Islamic title in Hindu font?"

Point is, to both and even other belief sectors, avar adicha aLavukku kooda mathavanga adikkalai. so there is a neutrality, balance.

Cinefan, this is what i was trying to discuss with u!

[P_R]

moved to chennai mainly because of better eduction for children and wants to get richer
Oh there should be no doubt about that at all.
unga poNNu adhunaala indha oorla firstu...idhuvE prime-ministerOda poNNunnA, Indira Gandhi..indhiyAvula firstu

[SoftSword]

adhulaam perfect dialogues... but overnight mind change? evlo determinationoda bsc agri edutthu, oorulayae irundhu factorya nadatthikku irundhiruppaar andha 20 varusamaa... andha determinationa oru london friend'oda visit'um, haneefa'oda oru naal discussion'um kolaikkudhunaa, andha palaya deterinationa illa sandhegappada vendi irukku...

[V_S]

Interesting questions by Roshan, SS and excellent answers P_R and sakala. :thumbsup:
When I was in Mumbai, I showed this movie to some Mumbai friends. First question popped up their mind was the same as Roshan's. They liked it, but one question they asked was, Why Kamal has taken such as pessimistic movie?

[P_R]

yOv overnight mind change-laam illaiyA.
That is a cut.

romba naaLaa naanum yOsoichittu irukkEn-nu solluvaapla
Lots of thoughts, tribulations, factoru adamaanam and al happened

[app_engine]

but overnight mind change?

phew...idhu enna periya vishayam?

16 varusham 'veLi nAdellAm pOga mAtten'nu adam pidichcha nAn ippo inga vandhu kuppai kottalai? idhellAm pointtE illai, thaLLubadi!

[Roshan]

Interesting questions by Roshan, SS and excellent answers P_R and sakala. :thumbsup:
When I was in Mumbai, I showed this movie to some Mumbai friends. First question popped up their mind was the same as Roshan's. They liked it, but one question they askedwas, Why Kamal has taken such as pessimistic movie?

Pessimistic.. yep ! Antha word antha samayathula vara maatenduchu. Though he kills the villain at the end - ivvaLvum izhanthuthaan antha villaingaLa azhikkanum avasiyam illa appadinnu I remember telling my brother who is a die hard fan of Mahanadthi. Having said that, the movie is still one of my favourites. It took a couple of years for me to get over the Kolkata episode. Oru kaalathula TV'la "sri ranga naathar' song vanthaa, channel udanae maathi irukkaen, because the song directly takes me to Kolkata episodes and leaves me with a very heavy heart (eppadi iruntha kudumbam ippadi aayiduchae type sOgam :( )

[app_engine]

I don't think KH (or his team) ever claimed "this is the most, agmark, 100% realistic movie".

It's probably the "over-enthusiastic-others" that tried to portray this that way.

Agreed, SB claims in that interview that he liked to direct preachy movies and was happy that mahAnadhi had the chitfund message. However, that was only the 'message' part. The events / characters / surroundings ellAm one-off situation allAmal "average" illai.

Most of the complaints seem to center like, "it doesn't happen that way to 99% of the people". Yes, agreed. But the movie was about a person who happened to be that 1%. (People love Harischandra story, the play most liked by Gandhiji, didn't all bad things happen to him?)

[SoftSword]

badhil irukkA - apdinu kekkalai, badhil therinjukkalaamnu dhaan...
i think the script is too fast in those scenes...

[Roshan]

Interesting questions by Roshan, SS

Thanks to Venkiram. He deserves the credit for bringing up a very valid point 'against' the movie.

[SoftSword]

PR, indha frame gavanichingalaa??
http://i45.tinypic.com/mtbfnl.jpg

[app_engine]

Perhaps the most pessimistic movie I've ever watched was 'thulA bAram' (the AVM Rajan / Saradha remake of a movie that is considered classic by both Keralites & TN-ers from 60's / 70's, the one with that 'kARRinilE perungARRinilE' song).

Compared to that, mahAnadhi is not that tragic / pessimistic :-)

[app_engine]

If one looks at the 'pessimistic' thingy, there are many movies like that. Take mayilu's case, for e.g.

-loves a man who cheats her and walks away
-mother dies leaving her to a chappAni to take care
-chappAni (after rekindling love in her) goes to jail

traditional method for movie makers to get people cry for their fav character...

[app_engine]

Personally, IMO (though no one cares for it), mahAnadhi had some great scenes but overall a disappointment.

Like I mentioned earlier, the jail scenes / Kolkota / kanavil alaRal are awesome from TF perspective. Matched or exceeded many of the "best old TF / 80's MF scenes" I've seen as well.

I grew up in an environment that most of the time "glorified" jail life. (sekkizhuththa semmal, Gandhi / Nehru / thalaivarkaL siRai vAsam etc). Even when people talked about criminals going to jail, it was more for 'correction', with kaLi thinnal etc.

Until I read a Sujatha story as a teen where he talked about the horrors of jail (forced homo etc), I didn't have any idea of how it was a great place for hardcore criminals / criminals becoming more hardened etc :shock: That way, no movie in TF (per my knowledge) showed some of the jail realities before, in such a shocking way! :thumbsup:

Same thing w.r.t. chitfund mOsadi & the impact :thumbsup:

Human trafficking - the worst crime that shocked me the most when I first heard about - is highlighted in a frightening way via Kolkota. :thumbsup:

Rest of the movie was average / not so satisfactory. Not a fan of the songs (below-average per IR standards). Some forced "shock-value" thingies (late-in-the-game intro of a paedophile villain / kai izhappu etc).

[P_R]

PR, indha frame gavanichingalaa??
http://i45.tinypic.com/mtbfnl.jpg ennadhu? :roll:

[SoftSword]

that mamappayyan 'covering' Kaveri..

[joe]

Regarding why didn't kamal ask for help from relatives and village people ,I think it is evident that he is such a person who feels shy in asking help or accept help in the name of respect ..There is one scene (car) , village people come and trying to support kamal and he says 'onnum illa .neega vidunga .naan paathukiren'

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

Kamal in 5Tricks:- Kelvi kekkurathu romba easy mama, bathil solrathu thaan kastam, neenga sollippaarunga, appo theriyum

nothing wrong in kodaanjifying and asking questions but we guys are asking them sitting on a platform he built from scratch, he brought all of us there. Before, such platform wasn't available

Hope everyone agrees this, without any questions :)

[groucho070]

I don't think this film is pessimistic. As app said, Tulabaram is, Pasa Malar too. This one has a happy ending, in fact. There is hope for the good characters in the movie to move on and start life afresh.

[ajithfederer]

Well, Welcome to India.

I dont believe so.

[radiochandra]

Cant think of many Tamil movies which can give room to 20 pages of thought provoking discussion, criticism, credits, POVs etc, this itself shows the depth in the movie. Excellent views, true the movie has a masochistic nerve line through out. I can also think of Aarulirundhu aruvadhu varai as a less complicated, little crudely dramatic "pessimistic" movie.

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

After all, we didn't discuss much of that jail portion!

[ajaybaskar]

அருமையான பதிவுகள்.. :clap:

உங்கள் சக ஹப்பனாக இருப்பதில் பெருமை.. :anandakanneer:

[wizzy]

also i was wonderin on what could be the time frame between kamal moves to the city and starts his chitfund, and the day haneefa runs away..
first they move to the city and have one poojai... then they get the place ready and do formal inauguration of the chitfund... annakki night party... and next morning he starts becoming a bit 'strictu'... aduttha scene he consults his advocate friend and the same day when he goes to the office people flocking to return the money back... so many people invested in a new chitfund so quick?

long believed the puppy dog from the temple to be the timeline..ellaiye :roll:

[equanimus]

Very good discussion and great posts as usual by P_R. This is my single favourite Tamil film. I'll come back to participate in the larger discussion, but just to respond to Maddy's point here, here's an old post (in which also I was responding to Maddy!):

i dont think too much of hanifa character there but a kannadiga "abusing" kaveri is undisputably tempting for kamal.......i have lot of disagreements with kamal's politics in movies including this one......

[...] (http://mayyam.com/talk/archives/Tamil_Films/t11414_TharaNi_Aalum_Dasavatharam_Kalaignani_Kamal _KSR_Os.html) in Hey Ram, the pimp is shown to be comfortable with all major south Indian languages, even if he's not shown to be speaking all those languages. Kamal Haasan tells the receptionist that he's "from the south of India, Madras" and gives his name as K. Bhairav, when Govardhan starts to follow him. While ascending the stairs, Govardhan starts the conversation with Kannada guessing that "Bhairav" is a Kannadiga. "Good afternoon! My name is Govardhan. Bhairav andharE, KannadigAru 'vA?" Then, he asks if he's Telugu, and finally concludes that he's a Tamilian.

Let me also use this occasion to place my disagreement with a point Maddy made about the Kannada lines in Mahanadhi elsewhere. I completely disagree with Maddy there. If that were supposed to be a stab at the Kannadigas in the wake of Cauvery issue, it would only be a tasteless cheap shot at that, but it clearly doesn't come off that way. Venkatachalam speaks Kannada with Manju, yes, but it's she who's probably a Kannadiga in the film. Again, the detailing of prostitution business as a pan-south Indian enterprise is evident here, like in Hey Ram. That is the subtext.

[MADDY]

0If that were supposed to be a stab at the Kannadigas in the wake of Cauvery issue, it would only be a tasteless cheap shot at that,


yes thats what i think it is........coming rite after 92' cauvery riots, it is so evident.....


Venkatachalam speaks Kannada with Manju, yes, but it's she who's probably a Kannadiga in the film. Again, the detailing of prostitution business as a pan-south Indian enterprise is evident here, like in Hey Ram. That is the subtext.

normally, prostitutes, esp high profile ones are supposed to speak in multiple languages for better client servicing......so, i would think venki knowing manju can speak kannada, he speaks in his mother tongue to her......and the kannada that venki speaks is not the "nambilki, nimbilki" kannada - it comes off good.....and since there is no evidence of both of them speaking another line in kannada after that scene- im entitled to assume it this way......

[equanimus]

Maddy,
That there is no other pointer except a passing line he speaks in Kannada makes you entitled to assume he IS a Kannadiga in the film?! That his Kannada is good is hardly reason enough to claim he's a Kannadiga. Surely his Tamil is also very good throughout the film?! My explanation (admittedly vague, but my point is there's nothing that backs your claim on the other hand) is he's a top-rung businessman, well-travelled, so he probably speaks good Kannada. Why should it be like "nambilki" and so on? Haven't you seen people from TN who speak preliminary Kannada pretty well (like a local speaker) after they spend some years in Bangalore or Mysore for that matter?

If you're talking about the linguistic identity of a character, shouldn't you be looking at much more relevant markers? For starters, is Venkatachalam a common name for a Kannadiga? As far as I've seen, it's prevalent only among Tamils and Telugus.

[MADDY]

If you're talking about the linguistic identity of a character, shouldn't you be looking at much more relevant markers? For starters, is Venkatachalam a common name for a Kannadiga? As far as I've seen, it's prevalent only among Tamils and Telugus.

agreed

[P_R]

MADDY, point is, kannadiga-nu kAttaNumnA innum azhuththamAvE kAttiruppAr. I don't think he was going for linguistic identity.

Regarding Poornam improvisation vs. Kamal conscious crafting, I lean towards the latter

SS, what about that frame??

[P_R]

:ty: @ equa
This is my single favourite Tamil film. I'll come back to participate in the larger discussion

sariyA mooNu varushaththukku munnAdi (http://movielane.blogspot.com/2009/05/behind-bars.html)....

[SoftSword]

Pr, that frame caught my eye becos the very pimp who fought with kamal from taking away kaveri was covering her body with that cloth...

[raghavendran]

I dont know if I have put my thoughts in the right way.. oru nalla manushanukku ippadiyellaam ulagathula uLLa aththanai kodumaiyum nadakkumgrathu realistic'a illa. May be I would have got convinced if he had stuck to one particular incident. Idhula manaivi saavu, soththu parimuthal, cheating, jail, jail kodumai, daughter ending up in a brothal, son goes missing, maamiyaar saavu, varungaala maamanaar jail'la, Sukanya's life is also not very pleasant, kadaisila kaiyyum vettikittu... oru niyaayam vaenaamaa.. Unrealistic I say..never liked this film..thinikapata sogam IMO....i am always concerned with what is said rather than how it is said...very tedious it was

[app_engine]

Very good discussion and great posts as usual by P_R. This is my single favourite Tamil film. I'll come back to participate in the larger discussion

kAththirukkiROm :-)

mudinja aLavu seekkiram vAnga sArE!

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

Going by the trend, it seems one can heavily like Mahaanathi or hate to the core. No 'in betweens'!

[SoftSword]

thats the first person i heard saying he did not like the movie... most of the people hav an opinion thats it was a good movie but would not encourage much in discussing about the movie...

anybody else other than ragav said that here?

[venkkiram]

I do have few friends who stay away (after the first view) from this movie due to its emotional factor!

[San_K]

Still I couldn't forget a comment from a wife to her hubby during interval time of mahanathi at Tirunelveli theatre ~ "Intha padathukku poyi enna koottikkittu vanthutteengalE". Generally i am against generalization but somehow I have come to a conclusion "Ladies don't like Mahanathi". Generally many people (ladies rules here) don't want to see other side of life and hence they hate it. Btw Mahanadhi is in my all-time top-10 list. KH triumphed in his classic AS as a mass masala entertainer OTOH mahanadhi was his brilliant dark side movie. Entertainment thAnE koottamum vasoolum allum.

[venkkiram]

OTOH mahanadhi was his brilliant dark side movie. பகை/சூழ்ச்சி/எதிர்மறை எண்ணங்கள் எப்போதெல்லாம் தென்படுகிறதோ அப்போதெல்லாம் முடிந்தவரையில் காட்சிகள் பளிச்சென இல்லாதவாறு இருள் படர்ந்து இருக்கும். குறிப்பாக சிறைக்காட்சிகள். கிருஷ்ணசுவாமிக்கு பாரதியார் நூல் கிடைக்கும்போது ஒளிக்கீற்று!

[app_engine]

Going by the trend, it seems one can heavily like Mahaanathi or hate to the core. No 'in betweens'!

neenga threaddai ozhungAppadikkalai :-)

iyAm one in-between sArE...

[Saai]

Pessimistic.. yep ! Antha word antha samayathula vara maatenduchu. Though he kills the villain at the end - ivvaLvum izhanthuthaan antha villaingaLa azhikkanum avasiyam illa appadinnu I remember telling my brother who is a die hard fan of Mahanadthi. Having said that, the movie is still one of my favourites. It took a couple of years for me to get over the Kolkata episode. Oru kaalathula TV'la "sri ranga naathar' song vanthaa, channel udanae maathi irukkaen, because the song directly takes me to Kolkata episodes and leaves me with a very heavy heart (eppadi iruntha kudumbam ippadi aayiduchae type sOgam :( )

Pessimistic-a?

His son grow up in a very affectionate environment. He is shown as a sharp, happy boy irrespective of the environment he grow up.

His daughter is rescued and gets married at last.

Kamal, a widower - finds a love-life when he is prison. Remember - He is a widower and a holy cow at his village.

Movie is heavy - but its definitely not a tragedy nor pessimistic. People just move on in the movie.

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

superb reply saai! even panjabakesan is happy, in the final frame!

[app_engine]

Nice post, Saai!

rA-ki-ra wrote a last page series of 'eppadi kathai ezhudhuvadhu' in Kumudam, when he was in the editorial board.

As a typical structure, he mentioned the basic steps :

1. thodakkaththil oru sama nilai (not necessarily paradise, just a normal situation)
2. sikkal(s) coming up (this is when story becomes interesting, writer shows capability here)
3. strategy / counter strategy etc related to sikkal(s) (writer shows more capabilities here)
4. Either solution or nAsam (comedy or tragedy)

There were examples of how many of the world's great stories followed this structure.

One can see how he worked as the consultant to this movie :-)

[Nerd]

Just listening carefully to the dialogues (overlapping dialogues Altman, Woody 'mbAingaLE)

The pimp calling for the madam as these guys are speaking some madarasi language :lol: She asks 'Tamil?' and he affirms. Just the pronunciation difference in that is :lol:
Meanwhile Poornam is saying: ennadhidhu..solliNdE irukkEn ippadi adichchiNdE irukkELE...pommanaattingaLA irundhuNdu :rotfl:

They are taking it out on Kamal precisely because they think he is the worst of the offenders. A man who is abducting Kaveri to make her his own. It is the rage they have felt against all-men. Panchapakesan can't even realize this. He is still standing in the platform of 'how women should behave'!! Where? In which location? The spot where the oppression of patriarchy is the strongest!

oru manushanaala eppadinga ivvaLavu deep-A ezhudha mudiyin? :bow:
Adding to MADDY's point on this particular quote of Panchapakesan - Idhu very normal dialogue, nothing great about this. I mean I can't think of any other line there.


And now in addition to Krishna,Kaveri,bharaNi, Narmada,Saraswati,Yamuna,Panchabi.. I just realized the madam's (Ganga!) daughter's name is Jalaja
:bow:
Also this - idhula bow pannra aLavukku enna irukku? I for one hate this kind of gimmicks. This is comparable to what Mani did in Raavanan (Karthik jumping from one tree to another, because, well he is suppossed to symbolize Hanumaan).

[Plum]

[jaiganes mode]

jalajavodu Jalsa refer paNNi irupPArnu nenaichu Feeyar bow paNdrArO?

[/jaiganes mode]

[P_R]

Adding to MADDY's point on this particular quote of Panchapakesan - Idhu very normal dialogue, nothing great about this. I mean I can't think of any other line there.
That is exactly the idea, right? That is how he reacts and will speak. So it does not seem 'thrust in'. But he is oblivious to the context. To have him say the line "pommanAttingaLA irundhuNdu" is kinda blackhumorous. This is how the society treats this women and yet the expectation is that they should behave properly. And it is not just the stereotypical oppressive male who says that. Even a mildmannered conservative has the same opinion. All this expressed so fluently and without fuss.


I for one hate this kind of gimmicks. This is comparable to what Mani did in Raavanan (Karthik jumping from one tree to another, because, well he is suppossed to symbolize Hanumaan).
I love the gimmicks. Particularly the names. That is the artist kinda smiling that, at the end of the day, this is a universe he created. But doing so unobtrusively.

Ravanan is an example, how it ought not to be done.Thalabathy is sufficien comparison of how loose the coupling should be for it to be effective. Ravanan was reduced to "guess who is who, and what is what".

The names are what got me hooked into Mahanadhi -at a deeper level - first.

In Hey Ram he could have chosen any name for the lead character. But the choice Saket Ram (Saket is a name for Ayodhya) points us to the contemporary relevance of the whole story.

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

Some interpretations are skin deep, easy for everyone to understand! Some are bit tough, and only ppl like P_R dives deep and find the gems! And finally some are comic mis-interpretations, like assuming that Hari-Haran is wantedly made to sing Kallai Mattum Kandaal :lol:

Its all up to us. pidicha varaikkum pogalaam. What flexibility yaar! This all river-names, athu puriyaathavanga, purinji pidikkaathavangalum, padathai entha idaiyuoorum illaamal rasikkalaam :clap:

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_FDULgrSOClk/Sn-5uzQ2IaI/AAAAAAAACgM/-Za2Q8q7NTE/s1600/1.jpg

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_FDULgrSOClk/Sn-5vO59fhI/AAAAAAAACgU/PUWHU-pVFxs/s1600/2.jpg

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

http://www.karundhel.com/2011/09/6.html

'மகாநதி' திரைப்படம் வெளியானபோது, ஜூனியர் விகடனில், கமலைப் பேட்டி கண்டார் மதன். அது மூன்று வாரங்கள் வெளிவந்தது. மகாநதியைப் பற்றிய பல சுவாரஸ்யமான தகவல்கள் அதில் இருக்கும். அதில், ஒரு கேள்வியை எழுப்பியிருப்பார் மதன். அதாவது, கமலின் அக்காலத்தைய படங்கள் பெரும்பாலுமே ஒரே விதமான கருவையே கொண்டிருக்கும். ஒரு அப்பாவி மனிதன், தன்னைச்சுற்றிய ஒரு பெரும் சதியில் அல்லது குழப்பத்தில் மாட்டிக்கொண்டு, எப்படி மீள்கிறான் என்பதே அந்தக் கரு. இந்தக் கேள்விக்கு கமலின் பதிலும் சுவாரஸ்யமாக இருக்கும். அதேபோல், மகாநதிக்கு ஆரம்பத்தில் கமல் யோசித்து வைத்திருந்த கதையையும் அவர் சொல்லியிருப்பார். ஒரு பலே திருடன். ஆனால் திருட்டில் நேரடியாக சம்மந்தப்படாமல், திருட்டுக்கு ப்ளான் மட்டும் போட்டுக்கொடுத்து, திருட்டு நடக்கையில், அந்த வீட்டைச் சுற்றிப்பார்ப்பான். அந்த வீட்டின் நூலகத்தில் இருந்து புத்தகங்களைப் படித்துக்கொண்டிருப்பான். இந்த ரீதியில் செல்லும் அந்தக் கதை. ஆனால், நல்லவேளையாக இக்கதை கைவிடப்பட்டு தற்போதைய மகாநதி எடுக்கப்பட்டது.

[equanimus]

Let me post what I wrote about the film last year (with slight changes to connect the loose ends). These are scribblings written at different points, was essentially a work in progress that I later abandoned, so please pardon the lack of coherence and the abrupt manner in which it ends.
_______________

A great moment occurs in மகாநதி (1994) when an image of Krishna behind bars, gazing directly at the audience, dissolves into an image of a deity (Garudar) in the famous Srirangam temple, also “behind bars.” [1] This is not the first instance a prison is juxtaposed with a temple in the film. The film’s opening itself – clear, swift currents of a river (presumably Cauvery?) dissolve into a bird’s eye view of the stagnant Cooum River which in turn dissolves into a high-angle view of the Madras Central Jail – is an inversion of the tradition of opening a film with the image of something auspicious, a temple or a deity. The camera then pans over the prison along its fence wall, and takes us into the prison passing its gates through a series of dissolves.

It is Krishnasami’s first day in jail. “இந்த பாருங்க! நான் திருடன் இல்ல, முட்டாள்.” He snaps at his inquisitive cellmate (Poornam Viswanathan). And the thematic rigour of the film is already set. (This is not a moralistic film that will lament the loss of innocence and wallow in the characters’ misery.) As he’s lying down trying to catch some sleep, his past opens up as if it were a dream with the opening of the gates of his “home,” revealing one of the recurring visual motifs of the film, that of a man trapped in confined spaces. Indeed many of the indelible images of the film are ones that place Krishna “behind bars,” so to say. It wouldn’t be an exaggeration to say that, almost half the film’s running time, the camera “blocks” Krishnasami within an enclosed space and frames him from the outside, which subliminally evokes a sense of many things – that of being in the safe confines of one’s home, that of a fish out of water, that of an imprisoned man. As Krishna finds his way out of or into these enclosed spaces, one of the many questions the film subliminally seems to raise is, what’s a man’s ultimate haven? Can we afford to draw an imaginary line between “the good” and “the bad,” the temples and the outside world, and, in turn, the outside world and the prisons?

Krishnasami is a well-to-do small town businessman, a widower leading a comfortable life with his two children and mother-in-law. Everything is alright but there’s a strange sense of dissatisfaction that life invariably introduces. An NRI friend’s visit to their hometown acts a catalyst to this and Krishna’s sense of a happy bourgeois man/family is suddenly disturbed as he’s reduced to gawk at the sophisticated ways of his old friend’s English-speaking family, check his little son’s eagerness with silent stares, uneasily laugh at their patronizing jokes at the expense of his daughter, reach out to a barely-listening kid his daughter’s age as if she were his peer and clarify, “A/C… போட்டுக்கல.”

He subsequently makes the acquaintance of a crooked businessman who tries to lure him into a more comfortable and prosperous city life. And thus he moves to Madras in the hopes of a more comfortable and prosperous life in the urban sphere and starts a chit fund company in collaboration with a crooked businessman, which lands him in jail.

One needs to pause at this moment and consider Krishna’s migration to the big city. A common reading of the film (a misreading to my mind) is to see the whole of Krishna’s story as a cautionary tale about moving away from one’s roots – i.e. one’s native village to the callous urban spaces or some such thing. Indeed this is precisely the mode in which a lot of standard happy-family melodramas operate. But what this film offer is anything but a fatalistic narrative of a family that’s irretrievably disintegrated once it moves to the big, bad city. (As I intend to argue later, the film never gives its palm to a fatalistic closure at any point. Even as the film closes with an ellipsis of what happens to Krishna later, we’re reassured that the family is indeed reunited.) What we instead get is an archetypal mythical narrative of a headman of sorts who’s taken to a new place and stripped off his powers. In other words, to this film, the essence of Krishna’s stepping-out isn’t an inward-looking tale that manufactures an elegiac melodrama, but an outward-looking tale of what he actually sees when he gets out. Note how seamlessly the film always introduces us to newer scenarios. The film’s second hour, Krishna’s time in jail has very little to do with his past. And the film strikes the kernel of the “ruler wandering outside his kingdom” narrative when Krishna raises his voice against the corruptions and transgressions in the prison. Krishna raises these questions not simply because he can’t stand wrongdoings at a personal level (insofar as one could risk such a coordinate!), but also because he’s not used to being so powerless. This sort of headman-like concerns has always been part and parcel of his social standing.

Krishna: “adhu eppadi sir irukka mudiyum? Edhukku irukkaNumnu kEkkaREn? romba aniyAyamA irukku sir..”
Panchapakesan: “namakku edhukku idhellAm, Krishna…”
Krishna: “adichchadhula andhALukku pottunnu uyir pOyirundhudhunA? appa? idhellAm yArAvadhu oruththar niyAyamnu kEk—”

Many of the standard tropes of “pastoral native village vs. big bad city” is subsequently raised within the film and firmly rejected. The most obvious one’s in fact offered by the villain himself in a crude way, when he says, “ammAvukku pattaNam pidikkAdhO? [...] sAr, kettavan girAmaththila iruppAn, city’la iruppAn… thUNila iruppAn, thurumbilum iruppAn… nAmba dhAn jAkkiradhaiyA irukkaNum.” Which is incidentally another instance where god is juxtaposed with what essentially stands for its opposite. In the prison, Krishna tries to be nice and respectable to everyone, expecting it to work well for him and others too, but he’s repeatedly humiliated, at the hand of Thulukkanam and others. This does make him resent the city at a conscious level, something he’s able to articulate (“nInga sonnadhu dhAmmA correctu, indhap pattaNaththula mariyAdhaiyE kedaiyAdhummA…”), but at a deeper level, he also becomes acutely aware that he was doing well and good in his past life not because he was nice and system-abiding, but merely because he was already well placed in the system.

It’s important to note that it’s precisely at this moment the film introduces the other great supporting character of the film, Muthusamy. Muthusamy is the person at the other end of what the urban space offers to Krishna. A warm friendship, a fraternal relationship devoid of the feudal respects Krishna is likely to be familiar with.

[Nerd]

Thanks P_R.

I don't dispute that the names (not just of Haasan) added value to Hey Raam, but in Mahaanadhi's case - I have a difference of opinion. No value to any of the film's main themes, IMO.

On that Punjabi line, I see where you are coming from. But I don't know how to explain but thats not something I would quote to claim how deep the film really was, because there is no alternate path in that case. Its sort of a win-win situation but I agree to the fact that the scene offered such a beautiful platform for the characters to say layered dialogues.

[equanimus]

As an immediate footnote, I'd like to clarify that I'm not at all happy with the choice of the word "headman" to describe Krishnasami's social standing. It suggest an aggression and a master of a clan of sorts that Krishna clearly isn't. (Krishna's rather 'childlike' personality and how this dimension is put to great use in the later parts of the film deserves an essay on its own.) What I mean by a headman is simply a 'Ur periyavar' of sorts.

[KV]

pr, equar, :clap: :clap: arumai, arumai. thodarattum ungal thondu.

[equanimus]

And oh, by the way, what made me dwell on the "urban vs. country" point as much as I have was Baradwaj Rangan's repeated references to this film as an "innocent village/small-town man caught in the big bad city" film. Which I find to be a puzzling characterization (never read the film that way) even if it's true at the plot level. I wanted to argue that the film operates in a totally different mode and is about a man coming out of his comfort zone and losing track.

[Roshan]

Also this - idhula bow pannra aLavukku enna irukku? I for one hate this kind of gimmicks. This is comparable to what Mani did in Raavanan (Karthik jumping from one tree to another, because, well he is suppossed to symbolize Hanumaan).

I was wondering too at the bowing. Intha paera vechu gimmick paNrathu is another thing am bored of. Kadavul topic, name gimmicks, Ramesh Arvind, Santhana Bharathi, oorvasi, rohini - intha maathiri sila pazhakkangaLa vittu veLiyae varum naaLai aavaludan ethirpaakkiRaen. I hope it happens with Vishwaroobam. I dont want to see reviews mentioning that the names of the lead characters are Vishwam and Roopa for heaven's sake.

[SoftSword]

And oh, by the way, what made me dwell on the "urban vs. country" point as much as I have was Baradwaj Rangan's repeated references to this film as an "innocent village/small-town man caught in the big bad city" film. Which I find to be a puzzling characterization (never read the film that way) even if it's true at the plot level. I wanted to argue that the film operates in a totally different mode and is about a man coming out of his comfort zone and losing track.

my one line of the plot was 'aazham theriyaama kaala vittu adiyOda pOradhu'

btw, superb post above that.

[Roshan]

Pessimistic-a?

His son grow up in a very affectionate environment. He is shown as a sharp, happy boy irrespective of the environment he grow up.

His daughter is rescued and gets married at last.

Kamal, a widower - finds a love-life when he is prison. Remember - He is a widower and a holy cow at his village.

Movie is heavy - but its definitely not a tragedy nor pessimistic. People just move on in the movie.

None of the above stood out through out the movie, is what we are talking of.

[SoftSword]

I was wondering too at the bowing. Intha paera vechu gimmick paNrathu is another thing am bored of. Kadavul topic, name gimmicks, Ramesh Arvind, Santhana Bharathi, oorvasi, rohini - intha maathiri sila pazhakkangaLa vittu veLiyae varum naaLai aavaludan ethirpaakkiRaen. I hope it happens with Vishwaroobam. I dont want to see reviews mentioning that the names of the lead characters are Vishwam and Roopa for heaven's sake.

oorvasi, rohini - u don prefer personally ok...
but indha rendu actors'ayum mattha gang'oda sekkuradhu sari illa... they give their best for the roles they re given..

[Roshan]

Fina frame happiness'ku santhOshapadurathu - is an insult to the movie and Kamal I would say.

[Roshan]

oorvasi, rohini - u don prefer personally ok...
but indha rendu actors'ayum mattha gang'oda sekkuradhu sari illa... they give their best for the roles they re given..

I am not talking of their talent. What I am saying is, he should avoid being repetitive. I am tired of seeing this kind of faces in his movies.

[V_S]

P_R, equa. It seems you don't have to watch the film again. Every dialogue, visuals, the motive, the motifs, insights, all are permanently etched in you and comes out as soon as we raise doubts/questions. Thoroughly enjoying your posts and insights. :clap: Excellent write-up equa.

[SoftSword]

i dont see kamal repetitive unless he does a comedy film...

[Roshan]

i dont see kamal repetitive unless he does a comedy film...

Ovvorutharukku ovvoru vithamaa repetitiveness theriyuthu. That's not a good sign. I want him to avoid that and I am expecting VR to be different.

[Roshan]

The naming of 4 Muslims terrorist in UPO again was hilarious.. naalu paerukkum rhyming'a 'ullah 'ullah-nu mudiyura maathir paer vechiruppaar. It was a very juvenile (but less juvenile compared to the dialogues between Lal and Lakshmi)

[equanimus]

Since we're talking about the film's ending, some fragments of thoughts:

Regarding mahAnadhi, it's debatable whether the ending is tonally inconsistent or not. I don't think it functions like a regular "happy ending." In fact, it's radically matter-of-fact in a sense. Remember, the film cuts to several years later. What makes us think they should still be wallowing in misery? In fact, that's precisely the mode in which standard tearjerkers work. If this were a regular melodrama, there would have been a more definitive full stop put to the lives of at least some of the characters. Krishna himself 'descends' into seeking retribution but is able to redeem his old self in some ways. Also, Kaveri carries on with her life, which is a radical departure in every sense.

And the idea that it's a "picture postcard" ending doesn't hold water at all. Firstly, does it really look like an afterthought? I'm not sure. The film ends where it began, with Krishna's children taking the plunge this time into what life has in store for them. It is not designed to make us 'forget' the past; on the contrary, it is designed to remind us of it. Even in a formal sense, the film doesn't play out that way. It doesn't employ handy techniques like closing with the image of a happy smiling family or something to that effect, but actually cuts to a bird's eye view of the river, pans across the bridge where they are standing and moves away from them along with the river and fades out with a panoramic view of the river bank. As I see it, it is more of a hopeful footnote to the epic arc of the film. The grandchild here is the Parikshit figure who is 'born' at the end of the epic and would carry forward the story. The film offers a closure that is squarely in the tradition of Indian mythology where nothing quite ends in and of itself.

Absolutely. I wanted to touch upon this in a subsequent post. The recurrence of the "தையந் தையந்" chant and the theme song, which runs through the film as Krishna goes through the motions of life, as if it were the 'song of (his) life' itself, as the film draws to a close is crucial in the sense that it invokes all of his past life. None of it is simply a bad dream that's over.

[equanimus]

That is, by the way, primarily in response to a common criticism about the film's ending being a cop-out of sorts.

[P_R]

Lovely posts equa (ellAm pazhaya murukkuthEN-di) :clap:
LightA worku...evening revise paNREn.

[P_R]

On that Punjabi line, I see where you are coming from. But I don't know how to explain but thats not something I would quote to claim how deep the film really was, because there is no alternate path in that case. pommanAttiyA irundhuNdu - I felt was consciously crafted it. Just like that passing shot where he shows a girl, who asks her friend to pay for today. It is normal - you pay today, I'll pay you tomorrow -situation. But the import in that particular scene elevates it a lot.

Its sort of a win-win situation but I agree to the fact that the scene offered such a beautiful platform for the characters to say layered dialogues. adhE

[P_R]

Kadavul topic, name gimmicks, Ramesh Arvind, Santhana Bharathi, oorvasi, rohini - intha maathiri sila pazhakkangaLa vittu veLiyae varum naaLai aavaludan ethirpaakkiRaen. :roll:
Usual suspects vachchu enna seyyuRaar 'ngradhu dhaanE pArkkaNum.
pala vidhamAna edhirpArppugaL. Kamal ennadhaan seyvaarO!

Kamal to me: naama buyers-saiyum happy paNNi aagaNum, customers-aiyum happy paNNi aagaNum....business trend theiryaama pEsureengaLE