Swine Flu Outbreak

[NOV]

The 2009 swine flu outbreak is an epidemic that began in April 2009 with a new strain of influenza virus. The new strain is commonly called swine flu, but some authorities object to the name and it is also called Mexican flu, swine-origin influenza, North American influenza, and 2009 H1N1 flu.

The outbreak is believed to have started in March 2009 and was classified as meeting the criteria for the World Health Organization pandemic Phase 5 status on 29 April. Local outbreaks of an influenza-like illness were first detected in three areas of Mexico, but the virus responsible was not clinically identified as a new strain until April 24, 2009. Following the identification, its presence was soon confirmed in various Mexican states and in Mexico City. Within days, isolated cases (and suspected cases) were identified elsewhere in Mexico, the U.S., and several other Northern Hemisphere countries.

By April 28, the new strain was confirmed to have spread to Spain, the United Kingdom, New Zealand, and Israel, and the virus was suspected in many other nations, with a total of over 3,000 candidate cases, prompting the World Health Organization (WHO) to change its pandemic alert phase to "Phase 5", which denotes "widespread human infection". Despite the scale of the alert, the WHO stated on April 29 that the majority of people infected with the virus have made a full recovery without need of medical attention or antiviral drugs.

The new strain is an apparent reassessment of four strains of influenza A virus subtype H1N1. Analysis at the United States Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) identified the four component strains as one endemic in humans, one endemic in birds, and two endemic in pigs (swine). One swine strain was widespread in the United States, the other in Eurasia.

In late April both the United Nations WHO and the U.S. CDC expressed serious concern about the situation, as it had the potential to become a flu pandemic due to the novelty of the influenza strain, its transmission from human to human, and the unusually high mortality rate in Mexico.

On April 25, 2009, the WHO formally determined the situation to be a "public health emergency of international concern", with knowledge lacking in regard to "the clinical features, epidemiology, and virology of reported cases and the appropriate responses". Government health agencies around the world also expressed concerns over the outbreak and are monitoring the situation closely.

Mexico's schools, universities, and all public events will be closed from April 24, 2009 to May 6, 2009. On April 27, 2009, a few schools in the U.S. closed due to confirmed cases in students. Two days later the action extended to 18 more U.S. schools as the disease became more widespread in the U.S., the same day WHO Director General Margaret Chan said "It really is the whole of humanity that is under threat in a pandemic," and the Mexican government ordered a shutdown of all non-essential activities in the government and private sector, amounting to a shutdown of most of the country's economy.

According to the WHO, "In annual influenza epidemics 5-15% of the population are affected with upper respiratory tract infections. Hospitalization and deaths mainly occur in high-risk groups (elderly, chronically ill). Although difficult to assess, these annual epidemics are thought to result in between three and five million cases of severe illness and between 250 000 and 500 000 deaths every year around the world. Most deaths currently associated with influenza in industrialized countries occur among the elderly over 65 years of age.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_swine_flu_outbreak

[NOV]

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[irir123]

the symptoms would be just the SAME as for any other flu - only difference lies in the ability of this viral strain to spread quickly, as its an amalgam of different strains and seems to have a higher rate of mutation - usually, it takes close to a year to develop a vaccine as the approximate type strain is decided upon after analysing previous year's viral outbreaks - but in this case, it is an atypical virus strain that is also mutating rapidly - so may not be possible to develop a vaccine this fast

it also remains to be seen, as to which ethnic communities are more susceptible

[app_engine]

Five things you should know about the Swine Flu (from Time magazine) :
http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1894029-1,00.html

[NOV]

Its slightly more than three months since this thread was stated.

Today's record in Malaysia:
About 2,000 infected
26 deaths!

According to a doctor friend, the bad news is that 90% of Malaysians have already been exposed to the virus. What remains to be seen is the severity of the exposure.

[NOV]

India is now seeing an explosion of secondary cases of H1N1 infection --people who haven't travelled to an infected country but may have got the virus from an infected individual.
Of the 3,624 people tested till now, 782 were found to be positive. Of these cases, 511 have been discharged. India has reported two deaths.

[Kalyasi]

India is now seeing an explosion of secondary cases of H1N1 infection --people who haven't travelled to an infected country but may have got the virus from an infected individual.
Of the 3,624 people tested till now, 782 were found to be positive. Of these cases, 511 have been discharged. India has reported two deaths.

The death toll in India is 6 now!!

[Vivasaayi]

Swine flu has atlast found its way to tamilnadu from mexico.

In Chennai and coimbatore,handful of people were tested positive with the virus.

[SoftSword]

[tscii:15a9519d3d]Keep Swine Flu Away with Basic Precautions
•
Swine flu in India is spreading like wildfire, taking the toll to six. Officials say there are currently more than 800 cases of the H1N1 flu strain in India. Governments from all around the world are finding ways to combat this deadly disease. So what can you do to protect yourself? Stay calm and practice these 10 effective prevention tips.
1. Wash your hands frequently
Use the antibacterial soaps to cleanse your hands. Wash them often, at least 15 seconds and rinse with running water.
2. Get enough sleep
Try to get 8 hours of good sleep every night to keep your immune system in top flu-fighting shape.
3. Keep hydrated
Drink 8 to10 glasses of water each day to flush toxins from your system and maintain good moisture and mucous production in your sinuses.
4. Boost your immune system
Keeping your body strong, nourished, and ready to fight infection is important in flu prevention. So stick with whole grains, colorful vegetables, and vitamin-rich fruits.
5. Keep informed
The government is taking necessary steps to prevent the pandemic and periodically release guidelines to keep the pandemic away. Please make sure to keep up to date on the information and act in a calm manner.
6. Avoid alcohol
Apart from being a mood depressant, alcohol is an immune suppressant that can actually decrease your resistance to viral infections like swine flu. So stay away from alcoholic drinks so that your immune system may be strong.
7. Be physically active
Moderate exercise can support the immune system by increasing circulation and oxygenating the body. For example brisk walking for 30-40 minutes 3-4 times a week will significantly perk up your immunity.
8. Keep away from sick people
Flu virus spreads when particles dispersed into the air through a cough or sneeze reach someone else’s nose. So if you have to be around someone who is sick, try to stay a few feet away from them and especially, avoid physical contact.
9. Know when to get help
Consult your doctor if you have a cough and fever and follow their instructions, including taking medicine as prescribed.
10. Avoid crowded areas
Try to avoid unnecessary trips outside. Moreover, avoid touching your eyes, nose or mouth. Germs spread this way.
[/tscii:15a9519d3d]

[NOV]

malaysia's death toll rose by another 6 yesterday!

Death: 32! :frightened:

[Kalyasi]

India Death Toll : 8

[Sanguine Sridhar]

This disease took almost 4 months to reach India. Hope the Governement of India does something before the rainy season. I read that vaccine for this flu would be ready by Novemeber?

Doctors are confused when to give Tamiflu for the affected patients, is that so? Any doctors here?

[NOV]

another 6 deaths here! :shock:

Total fatalities - 38
Infected - 2,253

[Shakthiprabha]

Swine influenza (also called H1N1 flu, swine flu, hog flu, and pig flu) is an infection by any one of several types of swine influenza virus.

Swine flu, which was initially only transmitted from pigs to humans, is now traveling through human to human contact, and is one of the most deadly of the flu viruses.

You might have noticed people wearing surgical masks in areas of Mexico to avoid the Swine Flu epidemic. At least 150 people have died from Swine Flu infection in Mexico and clusters of swine flu are found in areas all over the United States and around the World as well. The Swine Flu is currently under investigation by the Centers for Disease Control and the World Health Organization.

Swine flu symptoms include runny nose, muscle aches, lethargy, lack of appetite, fever over 101 and sudden onset. It is difficult to distinguish from other flu types, and does require a diagnosis.

Researchers are not yet sure if antiviral medicines such as Tamiflu or Relenza may remain effective against swine flu, although these antiviral medicines are working against the current strain. The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention(CDC) are currently in the process of developing a vaccine to protect against the Swine Flu.

The Swine Flu is a combination of four known strains including Avian flu, Human Influenza and two other viruses. This new strain of influenza is not only extremely contagious but also deadly, however, there are flu pandemic preparation measures you can take to ensure you do not get the Swine flu.

Instructions

1. Step 1

Stay Home

If you are sick or have any flu-like symptoms, stay home. Do not go to school or work. Swine flu symptoms may mimic those of regular flu and cold symptoms.

2. Step 2

Contain Your Cough

Cough or sneeze into the crook (inside elbow) of your arm. This way you do not transfer the germs to your hands and then to every object you touch. Swine flu is very contagious, and can spread easily by touching an infected object and then touching your face. A flu mask will help you avoid infection in enclosed spaces.

3. Step 3

Wash Hands Frequently

Wash hands constantly to avoid swine flu. Anything you touch may be affected, so keeping hands clean will help you avoid infection.

4. Step 4

Hand Sanitizer

Carry hand sanitizer with you. If you have things others have touched, use your hand sanitizer to avoid swine flu infection. In addition, avoid shaking hands or other hand to hand contact whenever possible. Also avoid kissing on the cheek or other face to face contact as a greeting method.

5. Step 5

Public Facilities

Touch public handles and pens as little as possible. These are loaded with germs that may carry the swine flu virus.

6. Step 6

Air Travel

When you fly, be most diligent about following these guidelines. Transferring any flu, including swine flu, is most likely in close quarters like an airplane.

7. Step 7

Clean Your Produce

The life span of a virus is different for each and can vary from as much as 48 hours to 100 years depending on the hardiness of the virus. Although there have been no known cases of swine flu transmission through fruit and vegetable consumption, there does seem to be some concern about the possibility. The best bet is to buy locally grown fruits and vegetables if possible. Make sure you wash your fruits and vegetables with water, and soak for greater effectiveness. Washes and using chlorinated rinses have not been proven to work. So far there have been no cases of swine flu transmission through fruits and vegetable sources.

8. Step 8

Avoid Crowds

Stay out of crowds as much as possible. Close proximity to other people will heighten your chances of to get swine flu. Wear a surgical mask in areas of high traffic concentration. Try to stay at least 3-6 feet away from people.

9. Step 9

Eating and Drinking

Do not eat or drink after others without complete sanitization of containers or utensils. Swine flu can be transmitted by contact with infected eating utensils.

10. Step 10

Vaccinations

Vaccinations are not effective against the H1N1 virus. If you contract the virus get to the doctor within 36 hours and ask for Tamiflu or Relenza. These antiviral medicines will halt the progression of H1N1 or Swine flu virus.

11. Step 11

Visit Your Doctor

Get to a doctor immediately if you develop symptoms of swine flu including high fever and body aches. Swine flu can be deadly, and it is imperative to get to a physician immediately if you think you have swine flu symptoms and think you might have contracted the swine flu virus. Both Tamiflu and Relenza are antiviral medicines that are currently effective against some strains of Swine Flu. These medicines should be taken within 36 hours of flu infection for maximum effectiveness.

[littlemaster1982]

[tscii:0fb0b98e39]பன்றிக் காய்ச்சல் - ஊடகங்கள்! (http://www.luckylookonline.com/2009/08/blog-post_12.html)

பாரதிக்கு வயது 20. கடந்த மார்ச் மாதம் தான் திருமணம் நடந்தது. கணவர் மாடசாமி. மடிப்பாக்கத்தில் மளிகைக்கடை வைத்திருக்கிறார். ஆடிமாசத்துக்காக தாய்வீட்டுக்கு வந்த பாரதிக்கு திடீர் காய்ச்சல். உள்ளூர் மருத்துவர்களிடம் சிகிச்சைப் பெற்றும் காய்ச்சல் சரியாகவில்லை. சீரியஸான நிலையில் போரூர் ராமச்சந்திரா மருத்துவமனைக்கு அழைத்துச் செல்லப்பட்டார். பன்றிக்காய்ச்சலுக்கான சோதனை அவருக்கு செய்யப்பட்டது. சோதனை முடிவுகளுக்கு முன்பே பாரதி பரிதாபமாக மரித்துப் போனார்.

மடிப்பாக்கம் பகுதியில் தீயென பரவியது பாரதியின் மரணச்செய்தி. ஏற்கனவே கடந்த சில நாட்களாக செய்தித்தாள்களிலும், வார இதழ்களிலும், தொலைக்காட்சி சேனல்களிலும் பார்த்துப் பதறிய பன்றிக்காய்ச்சல் தங்கள் ஊருக்கும் வந்துவிட்டதோ என்று அஞ்சி நடுங்கினார்கள். இடையில் வேளச்சேரியில் ஒரு குழந்தை பன்றிக்காய்ச்சலுக்கு பலியானது நாளிதழ்களின் தலைப்புச் செய்தியானது.

தங்கள் குழந்தைகளை பள்ளிக்கு அனுப்புவதை நிறுத்தினார்கள். மெடிக்கல் ஷாப்களில் விற்கப்படும் ‘மாஸ்க்’ வாங்கி அணிய ஆரம்பித்தார்கள். இன்று மடிப்பாக்கம், வேளச்சேரி சுற்றுவட்டாரங்களில் எந்த மெடிக்கல் ஷாப்பிலும் ‘மாஸ்க்’ ஸ்டாக் இல்லை. தென்சென்னையில் மக்களின் அன்றாட வாழ்க்கை பாதிக்கப்பட்டிருக்கிறது. ”எதுக்கும் உஷாரா இருந்தோப்பமே?” என்று கிங் இன்ஸ்ட்டிட்யூடில் வரிசையில் நின்று பன்றிக்காய்ச்சலுக்கான பரிசோதனையை செய்துக் கொள்கிறார்கள். மொத்தமாக பரிசோதனைக்கு மக்கள் கூட்டம் கூட்டமாக வருவதால் பரிசோதகர்களே திணறிப் போயிருக்கிறார்கள்.

பாரதிக்கு எடுக்கப்பட்ட சோதனை முடிவுகள் இப்போது வெளிவந்திருக்கிறது. அவருக்கு பன்றிக்காய்ச்சல் இல்லையாம்.

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பன்றிக்காய்ச்சல் காரணமாக ஊரே பிணக்காடாகி விட்டது போன்ற பீதியை ஊடகங்கள் கிளப்பி வருகின்றன. நூற்றி பத்து கோடி பேர் வசிக்கும் நாட்டில் ஆயிரத்துக்கு ஏழு பேர் இறப்பதும், புதியதாக இருபத்து மூன்று பேர் பிறப்பதும் இயல்பாக நடந்து வரும் விஷயம். ஆயிரத்துக்கு ஏழு பேர் என்றால் நூற்றி பத்து கோடிக்கு எத்தனை பேர் இறக்கிறார்கள் என்று கணக்குப் போட்டுப் பார்த்துக் கொள்ளுங்கள். மரணங்களும், பிறப்புகளும் நம் நாட்டுக்கு புதியதல்ல.

சுனாமி பேரிடரின் போது நம் பத்திரிகைகள் நடந்துகொண்ட விதம் உலகுக்கே முன்னுதாரணம். ஆனால் இப்போது பன்றிக்காய்ச்சல் போன்ற அசாதாரண சூழலில் நடக்கும் ஒவ்வொரு சாதாரண மரணமும் கூட ஊடகங்களால் பெரிதுப்படுத்தப்பட்டு உயிரோடு இருப்பவர்களை வதைத்துக் கொண்டிருக்கிறது. இதற்கு உதாரணம்தான் மேலே கண்ட பாரதியின் மரணம். மரணம் கொடுமையானதுதான். ஒவ்வொரு மரணத்தின் போதும் அவர்களது குடும்பத்தார் கதறியழுவது சகஜமாக நடப்பதுதான். இதையெல்லாம் படம் பிடித்து டிவியில் போட்டு, பத்திரிகைகளில் படமாக்கி, பல கோடி பேரை அச்சமடையச் செய்வது நம் ஊடகங்களின் இன்றைய டிரெண்ட் ஆக இருக்கிறது. ’மும்பை 26/11’ சம்பவத்தின் போதே நம் ஊடகங்களின் யோக்கியதை சந்தி சிரித்தது.

போலியோ மருந்து போடப்படும் தினங்களிலும் இதுபோலவே பொறுப்பின்றி ஊடகங்கள் நடந்துகொள்வதால் பல்லாயிரம் குழந்தைகளுக்கு அந்தச் சொட்டுமருந்து போடப்படாமல் போவது கடந்த சில வருடங்களாக நடந்து வருகிறது. ஒவ்வொரு தினமும் தமிழகத்தில் குறைந்தது நான்கு அல்லது ஐந்து குழந்தைகளாவது மரித்துப் போகிறது. போலியோ சொட்டு மருந்து போடப்படும் தினத்திலும் இது தவிர்க்க இயலாதது. ஆனால் சொட்டு மருந்து போட்டுக் கொண்டதால் நான்கு குழந்தைகள் பலி என்று டிவியில் ஸ்க்ரோல் ஓட்டுவதாலும், மாலைச் செய்திகளில் குழந்தையின் பெற்றோர் கதறியழும் படத்தை அச்சிடுவதாலும் ஏற்படும் விளைவுகள் என்ன?

மக்களுக்கு செய்திகளை கொண்டு சேர்ப்பது அவசியமென்றாலும், வீணான வதந்திகளையும் இலவசமாக கொண்டு சேர்க்கும் பொறுப்பற்றத் தனத்தையும் நம் ஊடகங்கள் செய்துவருகிறது. இதுபோன்ற அசாதாரணச் சூழல்களில் பணியாற்றி, பாடுபட்டு வரும் அரசுக்கும், அரசின் ஊழியர்களுக்கும் இவை சிக்கலையும், சோர்வையும், சங்கடத்தையும் ஏற்படுத்தும்.

குறிப்பாக, பிராந்திய மொழி ஊடகங்களிடமே இந்த ’பரபரப்பு’ தொற்றுநோய் அதிகமாக இருப்பதாக தெரிகிறது. தேசிய அளவில் செயல்படும் ஆங்கில ஊடகங்கள் ஓரளவுக்கு பரவாயில்லை. நிபுணர்களின் கருத்துகள், தவிர்க்கும் முறைகள் என்று கொஞ்சம் ஆழமாக செய்திகளை வெளியிடுகிறார்கள். இன்று காலை ஒரு தமிழ் நாளிதழில் பன்றிக்காய்ச்சல் குறித்து ஒரு ஜோசியர் சொன்னதை கட்டம் கட்டி வெளியிடப்பட்டதைப் பார்த்து தலையில் அடித்துக் கொண்டேன். விரோதி வருடம் பிறந்தபோதே, அவர் ஒரு உபன்யாசத்தில் இதை கோட்டிட்டுக் காட்டியிருந்தாராம். பன்றிக்காய்ச்சல் வருவதைத் தடுக்க சிவ வழிபாடு செய்யவேண்டுமாம். சிவன் கோயிலில் கூட்டம் கூட்டமாக மக்கள் கூடப்போகிறார்கள். யாராவது பன்றிக்காய்ச்சல் வந்தவரும் அந்தக் கூட்டத்துக்கு வந்து வழிபட்டுச் சென்றால், முடிந்தது ஜோலி.

உலகளவில் ஊடகங்களிடம் இரண்டு பாணி உண்டு. ஒன்று பிபிசி பாணி. மற்றொன்று சி.என்.என் பாணி. நடந்ததை நடந்ததாக சொல்லுவது பிபிசி பாணி. நடந்த விஷயங்களை வைத்து என்னவெல்லாம் இனி நடக்கும் என்று யூகித்து செய்து வெளியிட்டு, சென்சேஷனல் ஆக்குவது சி.என்.என். பாணி. பன்றிக்காய்ச்சல் போன்ற நோய் பரவும் காலங்களிலும், பேரிடர் சமயங்களில் மட்டுமாவது பிபிசி பாணியை நம் ஊடகங்கள் பாவித்தால் தேவலை. [/tscii:0fb0b98e39]

[Sanguine Sridhar]

Yedhu eppadiyo, konjam thumminaalum suthi irrukuravaingellam yEgiri, distance maintain paanraanunga! :lol2:

[app_engine]

Satellite TV media is in the hands of political parties in TN, so sensationalism and similar aniyAyams are only to be expected.

People should learn to pay attention to "respectable media" and not propaganda channels!

On swine flu, though, we cannot blame the media as the pandemic capability of the virus is undeniable and populous regions could get into catastrophies. So caution is well-founded IMO.

However, proper diagnosis and dissemination of information has to be ensured by the medical community, should not blame it on the media!

[NOV]

six more deaths in Malaysia :cry:
The latest deaths involved a 10-month-old girl, a one-year-old boy, an 18-year-old pregnant woman, a 24-year-old man and two other men in their 60s.

total: 44

[NOV]

heard on the radio that chennai has recorded a casualty. and the govt has declared a ban on pork meat, altho it also said that there is no connection between the two. :(

[Raikkonen]

It's really getting serious now here.. :cry:

[NOV]

yeah, have bought masks for all my children and have advised them to keep at least 1.5 m distance from other people.

[NOV]

seven more deaths today!
total 51

[NOV]

India's death rate has reached 16.

[NOV]

EDIT: its 20 in India!

PUNE/BANGALORE: A nine-month-old child and a woman died of the H1N1 virus in India's epidemic epicentre Pune and a woman school teacher was
Bangalore's first swine flu victim, officials said on Thursday, as India's toll climbed to 20 amid hectic efforts to curb the spread of the contagious virus.

[app_engine]

http://edition.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/americas/08/11/costa.rica.president.h1n1.flu/

Costa rica president, a nobel peace prize winner, is affected with H1N1 virus :-(

[app_engine]

Indian woman in UK dies because meningitis wasn't diagnosed (symptoms similar to Swine flu and Tamiflu was administered) :

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/swine-flu/6016166/A-mother-died-from-meningitis-after-medics-said-she-had-swine-flu.html

[Nerd]

The virus is not *air-borne* right. I don't get the purpose of masks. May be that would prevent one from touching his/her mouth/nose. And "TamiFlu" is not an approved vaccine or is it?

[crajkumar_be]

Nerd,
Thummal irumal la spread aagumaam...

[NOV]

Thummal irumal la spread aagumaam...:exactly: just like any other flu virus.
Tamiflu will only work if one is infected with H1N1; it cannot be used as a precautionary medication.

[Nerd]

We were (about 2-3 months back) advised to sneeze/cough on our shirt sleeves or on a tissue paper and dispose it, so that nobody touches it (or your shirt obviously). And we were asked to wash our hands quite often, like once in two hours. Also after you shake hands with someone you are not supposed to touch your mouth/nose before washing your hands. And generally, don't touch your nose or mouth. Touching-la dhaan spread aagudhu-nu ninaikkirEn.

[app_engine]

Tamiflu will only work if one is infected with H1N1; it cannot be used as a precautionary medication.

The theory (in general) is that any viral infection has to be fought by the body's immune system and won, as medicine won't kill the germ. (That's why vaccinations - that use attenuated germs thus help body bulid up resistance to a particular virus).

I've often heard from doc's that cold has to be fought by the body and won, so focus on nutrients / rest etc to help body fight. Also, since the cold / flu virus keeps mutating and bringing out "new versions / releases" all the time, vaccines also need to be likewise produced afresh for each case. And practically no one can be "vaccinated" against "all" forms of cold and flu virusses (as there are at least 40 types it seems).

So, how does the "Tamiflu" work? As medicine - at least in theory - cannot fight virus?

[Nerd]

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Is_the_swine_flu_airborne

Looks like we need special kind of masks. Normal surgical masks won't do. It's extremely scary, especially in a country like India. The population density :shaking:

[app_engine]

http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/05/01/catching-flu-from-money/?em

One more reason to use plastic rather than currency :-)

I wonder how much part the rupee notes play in transmitting various forms of germs :-(

[Shakthiprabha]

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/life-style/health-fitness/health/Homeopathy-can-prevent-cure-swine-flu/articleshow/4870647.cms

"Gelsemium and Bryonia were the two homeopathic remedies that proved to be effective against the H1N1 strain back then. These could be of great use even today," Batra said.

So why WHO (the World Health Organisation) or the health ministry has not taken homeopathy's help in tackling the H1N1 outbreak?

"In Brazil, the homeopathic doctors' community has collected data on the symptoms of swine flu and homeopathic treatments for symptoms and are spreading the word on its effectiveness through internet," he added.

More than 616 people have been detected with H1N1 virus so far in India, of which 487 have been discharged. The disease has claimed one life in India.

People however should not panic. The chances of dying of swine flu are just as low as dying of common flu, homeopathic doctors said unanimously.

http://www.naturalnews.com/026148.html

Homeopathy was successful in treating the flu epidemic of 1918 and can provide answers to questions about the 2009 Swine Flu. Homeopathy can provide quick and inexpensive relief for symptoms of the flu.

[app_engine]

SP,

I agree homeopathy is quite inexpensive and extremely effective for a number of ailments.

It's especially good for children, hardly any side effects :-)

I think one of the homeopathic principles is to "strengthen the immune system" and so I'm not surprised at the effectiveness for flu and such viral diseases. I had a medical rep friend (very senior in his company selling "english" medicine ) who used to treat family members only with homeo!

The only trouble with homeopathy is the capability of the physician to diagnose :-( There are any number of doc's claiming to be homeopaths who can't differentiate between infection and allergy :-(

So, diagnose using popular methods - after confirming the kind of ailment, treat using homeopathy -that physician's diagnosis can also be the 2nd opinion -seems to be a safer approach.

[Shakthiprabha]

So, diagnose using popular methods - after confirming the kind of ailment, treat using homeopathy -that physician's diagnosis can also be the 2nd opinion -seems to be a safer approach.

True app!

Thats the precise reason why I posted it here. In case someone gets infected its better he or she ALSO go in for alternative medicine. It sure wont harm you, when its life saving challenge .

[NOV]

malaysia's latest figures:

death - 62 :cry:
infected - 3,587 :sigh2:

[NOV]

One more died of swine flu in Bangalore on Sunday taking the city''s swine flu death toll to 4. The death toll in India is now at 26.

[dev]

Homeopathy preventive for chikunguniya was quite effective in my experience... so believing tht it would help protect myself from swine flu, I've taken the preventive for it as well... the preventive will be effective for 6 months they say... prevention is better than cure..even though we cant be 100% sure abt its effectiveness, no harm in trying it out when we don't have any other better preventive medicine...:)

[app_engine]

Homeopathy preventive for chikunguniya was quite effective in my experience...

Same with a number of my relatives in India who didn't get affected. As I said, it's quite effective for certain ailments :-)

[littlemaster1982]

[tscii:6f8b5c6686]
What India should do to combat swine flu (http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/News/News-By-Industry/What-India-should-do-to-combat-swine-flu/articleshow/4900500.cms)

H1N1 influenza (swine flu), which has afflicted more than 1,70,000 persons in some 168 countries, first knocked on Indian shores in mid-May, two months after its first appearance in Mexico. According to WHO predictions, a significant number of Indians will be affected in the next two years by this new strain of influenza A virus.

Events of the last 10 days clearly indicate the fear among the masses of a disease that has claimed more than 25 people, many of them children. The fear is further compounded by the concurrent common or seasonal flu epidemic that kills lakhs every year across the globe.

But an objective review of the situation in the light of the epidemiology of the epidemic, the inherent characteristics of this smart virus and experiences of countries like Mexico, USA and the UK should be enough to assure us that there is no need to panic. Let us see why.

True that the H1N1 virus is highly infectious and spreads through a natural activity that everyone does, breathing. Hence, given the overcrowding and poor civic sense, it is almost impossible to prevent its spread. Let us accept this fact.

But then, the seasonal flu affects more readily and kills about 550 people in the country daily. There are hundreds of other viruses that cause flu-like symptoms. Why should we put the H1N1 virus on such a high pedestal that it starts governing our lives? After all, it is just another flu virus with far less fire power (less than 1% death rate)!

So what is the best strategy for containing this epidemic? As a public health expert, I feel we should consider every case of flu-like symptoms as seasonal flu unless swine flu is suspected and diagnosed. This strategy will pick up the swine flu cases too most of the time.

While disease prevention efforts have to continue, preventing complications and deaths in those with flu-like symptoms should be the main focus. For this, we have to ensure that we promptly identify all those who are at risk and quickly put them on treatment.

Thus all patients with flu-like symptoms (fever, cough and sore throat) need to be screened. It is a gigantic task but with the help of general practitioners, the vast network of primary health centres and other public and private sector health facilities, it is doable. Fortunately, the government has already revised its plan in line with this thinking.

H1N1 is a mild virus but let us also accept despite the screen and treat policy, some deaths will occur. That is because the virus does become fatal in a few cases despite timely treatment. Even countries like the USA, Mexico and UK have had hundreds of deaths. Also, don’t a multitude of people die every day of other diseases despite receiving treatment?

With herd immunity rising slowly, H1N1 will soon become a part of our community and we will learn to live with it as we are doing with other seasonal flu viruses, dengue, malaria, chikungunya etc.

Despite criticism about India’s response to this current threat, a closer look reveals that we have not done all that badly. We all know that India’s public health system is not in the best of health. Yet the Union ministry of health, state governments, educational institutions and the civil society responded well in time for prevention and containment efforts.

The print and the electronic media also chipped in. There is a general perception that it did go in a bit of an overdrive after the first swine flu death but overall, it has been a major source of information. The country has been constantly revising guidelines for ensuring an appropriate response.

While these efforts to screen and treat will continue, the education and awareness programmes on swine flu and news about research into indigenous drugs/vaccine products have to be carried by the media. The electronic media must continue its efforts but exercise restraint.

One good way can be that all news channels are directed by the ministry of information and broadcasting to telecast swine flu updates two-three times a day and simultaneously. These bulletins should contain awareness information and can be of between 30-60 minutes. Rest of the times, there shouldn’t be any breaking news or flashes about the number of cases or the deaths (if any) due to flu. India can surely do it!!


Dr Bir Singh is professor of community medicine (public health) at AIIMS. He is also secretary general of Indian Association of Preventive and Social Medicine

[/tscii:6f8b5c6686]

[Shakthiprabha]

Dear all,

As per my doc (homeopathy practioner) Homeopathy medicines can be administered very safely and the effect of its doses stays preventive for one month. Please act as per the adivce of ur medical practioner or ur homeopathic doctor or the ur near by homeopathic chemist for the medicine.

PS: Do carry a hankey with u and swine flu is NOT AIR BORNE, it spreads thro droplets of cough and sneezing of the affected person. So beware.

Take this quiz and check ur awareness.

http://www.swineflu-india.org/swine_flu/quiz.aspx

[NOV]

67 deaths in Malaysia :cry:
and more than 3,000 infected

New Delhi: A record 220 people tested positive for influenza A (H1N1) on Monday, taking the total number of infected persons in the country to 1,928 but no more deaths from the virus were reported in the day, health officials said.
Total so far: 26

[app_engine]

PS: Do carry a hankey with u


எதுக்கு? Even in Indian conditions, unless you're sick, why should one carry this?

I've never been a fan of it and hated to carry it when I was sick as that was the easiest way to do a quick-clean, especially when walking or in villages without sanitation. Thankfully, in U.S. it's unusual to see anyone carry this :-) (as restrooms / Kleenex are always close by)

A hand-sanitizer bottle is possibly a much better option, i.e. for those not sick yet!



Take this quiz and check ur awareness.

http://www.swineflu-india.org/swine_flu/quiz.aspx

I got all of them correct :D

[Shakthiprabha]

Congrats for getting all correct :P I got two wrong :| (when I took it)

app,

I meant when someone falls SICK . Just to be good to others and dont spread the sickness.

[app_engine]

I meant when someone falls SICK . Just to be good to others and dont spread the sickness.

Agreed, especially in Indian conditions. However, it cannot be a "precaution" to carry this :-) Washing the hands periodically / hand sanitizer etc are better methods of prevention...

[Shakthiprabha]

Agreed, especially in Indian conditions. However, it cannot be a "precaution" to carry this :-) Washing the hands periodically / hand sanitizer etc are better methods of prevention...\

True! :thumbsup: My daughter's school has insisted them to carry 2 strip-soaps per day for sanitation.

[NOV]

now something closer at home :frightened:

Confirmed that a teacher has died in my sons school - USJ12 Secondary school of H1N1. One of her students in Form 3 is in ICU. A minimum of 12 students have been infected.
My son is back home now.

[pavalamani pragasam]

Give your son nutritious diet, make him take good rest indoors. Don't panic! God is great.

[NOV]

Thanks PP mam for the concern; he is fine. I just called, instead of studying he is online :x

I am just concerned about the govt's apathy. Latest news I heard, they have closed the school.

[joe]

H1N1 பற்றி மருத்துவர் புருனோ தமிழில் விளக்கம் ,கலந்துரையாடல் (ஒலிப்பதிவு)
http://www.archive.org/details/BadriSeshadriDrBrunoMascarenhasonInfluenzaA_H1N1_p andemic_inTamil_

[NOV]

Country-Cases-Deaths

Argentina - 6,768 - 404
Australia - 30,993 - 118
Brazil - 3,642 - 379
Canada - 11,976 - 67
India - 1,927 - 29
Malaysia - 4,225 - 67
Mexico - 18,861 - 163
New Zealand - 3,056 - 20
Singapore - 1,217 - 11
Thailand - 11,585 - 97
United Kingdom - 12,903 - 49
Total Count: 203,372 - 1,901

Source: http://www.flucount.org/

[ArulprakasH]

பன்றிக் காய்ச்சலை தடுக்க ஓமியோபதி மருந்துகள்

http://www.nakkheeran.in/users/frmNews.aspx?N=14461

[Sanguine Sridhar]

As far as I know from my cousin who resides in Pune, said that Swine-Flu is the least dangerous among the rest of the flu family. The body temperature would be comparatively lesser than the normal flu.

It is dangerous only for the people who already have / combating some other deadly diseases through medication / damaged inner organs etc... Deaths so far happened because the disease was not diagnosed properly. You could probably see that the death count has comprehensively have reduced now. Honestly we are safe!

Media is as usual magnifying this issue. Instead of elaborating the deaths they should also show the people who got cured from this disease.

[joe]

As far as I know from my cousin who resides in Pune, said that Swine-Flu is the least dangerous among the rest of the flu family. The body temperature would be comparatively lesser than the normal flu.

It is dangerous only for the people who already have / combating some other deadly diseases through medication / damaged inner organs etc... Deaths so far happened because the disease was not diagnosed properly. You could probably see that the death count has comprehensively have reduced now. Honestly we are safe!

Media is as usual magnifying this issue. Instead of elaborating the deaths they should also show the people who got cured from this disease.

:exactly:

[ksen]

As for homeopathy - you can take 4 small globules of Influenzin 200 twice a day before food as a preventive. This is also given as a curative. Eupatorium perf. which is very effective for Chikungunya, also works well.

In general, all homeo medicines for flu work well for swine flu also, as homeopathy goes only by symptoms. There is a medicine AF 200 (Anti-flu 200) which contains Eupatorium, and Gelsmium and Bryonia (as SP said). A combination of these two medicines is quite effective.

Sen had a bout of sickness after a visit to Chennai, sudden extreme tiredness, body pain and mild temperature. He is fine now, after taking these medicines only, with complete rest.
AF 200 is good for any fever, and is always on hand at home.

[Roshan]

As far as I know from my cousin who resides in Pune, said that Swine-Flu is the least dangerous among the rest of the flu family. The body temperature would be comparatively lesser than the normal flu.

It is dangerous only for the people who already have / combating some other deadly diseases through medication / damaged inner organs etc... Deaths so far happened because the disease was not diagnosed properly. You could probably see that the death count has comprehensively have reduced now. Honestly we are safe!

Media is as usual magnifying this issue. Instead of elaborating the deaths they should also show the people who got cured from this disease.

True ! Another problems is lEsA thummal, irumal appadinnu doctor kitta pOnaalum - they are thinking it is swine flu :evil: and people are afraid to go to the doctors because of this hassle. One of my Indian colleagues here had flu two weeks ago and he was badly down - swine flu angle'leye pAkkuraanga hospital pOnA. Finally it was dengi and had to be treated for that. Need to say that he really suffered and has not yet recovered fully.

Last month I had to go to Bangkok and swine flu issue was at the peak during that time. I was told to wear a mask where ever I go. I had it on from Yangon - to BKK airport but could not manage with that for long. It was a hassle and could not breath properly. I have motion sickness and have to take avomine everytime I fly. When coming back I forgot to take the tablet in advance and took only when I was about to leave the hotel. Before I reached the airport I started feeling sick and wanted to throw up badly. But intha swine flu thollaikku bayanthu ethuvum paNNa mudiyala. Wash room pOnaa angeyum oru periya koottam :x Finally I managed to get into the Muslim Prayer room and silently threw up using a plastic bag :evil: :banghead:

[dev]

I'm not too sure of the combination for swine flu... but AF 200 is a must in my medical kit...take it once u get flu symptoms & it works 75% of the times...:thumbsup:

[app_engine]

ksen, dev

You both seem to be knowledgeable on homeo kits...what is "200"? And how is it different from, say, 100, 400 etc?

[ksen]

I am not an expert on homeopathy, but am a staunch believer :D

200 is a potency or strength of the medicine. As far as I know, 100, 400, etc. are not in use, or do not exist. There is 3X, 6X, 30, 200, 1M (1000) and higher. 30 used to be the standard, but is very slow. Nowadays most doctors prescribe 200 potency, which has fast action. 1M and above is best left to doctors.

[app_engine]

ok, now 100 / 400 were some wild numbers I threw, that look alike 200 (possibly you now understood I know nothing about this) :lol:

Thanks for enlightening!

Now, is "potency" the concentration or % of a particular chemical in the solution that enriches the sugar balls to become medicine? Or something else?

[ksen]

:D It looks like it is the "dilution of the substance ! The more the substance is diluted and processed, the more potent it becomes.

I came upon this site yesterday, - interesting reading!

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/homeopathy_advice/index.html

[NOV]

[tscii:9163ccf4dc]Govt in Denial


In PETALING JAYA, Education director-general Tan Sri Alimuddin Mohd Dom said SMK USJ12 in Subang Jaya would remain opened as it was not confirmed if the death of a teacher from the school was due to Influenza A (H1N1).

He said hospital authorities were investigating the cause of death and the Health Ministry would instruct the school to close if the need arose.

Alimuddin was commenting on parents’ request for the school to be closed following news of the teacher’s death.

“I hope parents will not panic as the school is working closely with the Health Ministry,” he said.


http://www.thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=/2009/8/20/nation/4551679&sec=nation[/tscii:9163ccf4dc]

[NOV]

and finally the MOH seals the school....

[html:d8ac7beadc]
http://photos-a.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs129.snc1/5536_132284098656_550233656_2381104_172080_n.jpg
[/html:d8ac7beadc]

[r_kk]

Homeopathy doesn't cure Swine-flu. In fact it doesn't cure any thing. It support the minds of week people who themseves feel they need something to cure them.

For more reading on Homeopathy, please read the following thread.

Alternative medical Therapies: science or pseudo science?

[/url]
http://forumhub.mayyam.com/hub/viewtopic.php?t=4841&highlight=

[Roshan]

Hi r_kk , good to see you :) Hope you are keeping well.

[r_kk]

Thanks Roshan... I hope you are doing well.

Life had become so busy and also lost bit of interest in the web forums. I will try to visit as much as possible...

[P_R]

Homeopathy doesn't cure Swine-flu. In fact it doesn't cure any thing. It support the minds of week people who themseves feel they need something to cure them.

Eh ?
My tonsilitis got cured by homeopathy. I could never peacefully have icecream till I was 14 ! Atleast that can be attributed to 'growing up' as usually tonsilitis goes away when hitting mid teens. But it has been a problem in kids my family. My cousin had to have a surgery !

But my father's migraine - unresponsive to years of allopathic medication - was cured by homeopathy. Touch wood - he has not had to resort to medication in a long long time.


I was pretty skeptical about reiki. Whenever anyone complains about headache, my aunt gets them to sit down and starts brushing the air around them. I used to find it hard to suppress laughs. Till I saw it working for my uncle and then once.....for me !!

I guess I don't have any credibility - or healthy relatives - left. But in flow I will also record this. One of my aunts got cured of an excruciating knee pain by divine healing. Which 'grand as it sounds' is...nothing at all is done by the dealer - it is impossibly counterintuitive. She needed help to walk into the clinic and after the session I walked home.

With each day, I get less and less certain about by rejections of the irrational.

[app_engine]

In fact it doesn't cure any thing.

Outrageous statement!

I had "unnecessary-hair-like" growth of tissue on my face (tens of them all of a sudden) and neck.

Application of 'thuja' (a homeopathic medicine prescribed by a physician) plus intake of those "sugar balls soaked in his tinctures" for 15 days completely cured it.

Never came back again!

யார் கிட்ட கத உடுறீங்க?

In TN, there's this DHMS course by gov and almost all gov hospitals have a homeopathic department. One of my school day play mates is a leading practitioner of homeo in his home town.

[dev]

r_kk, nalla joke!!!... :lol: keep doing ur research on y homeopathy can't & don't cure anything and do post ur research papers here... we'll continue to read them & also continue to go with homeopathy for our health problems...:)

app_engine, not only DHMS...they also have a MD in homeopathy...

[ksen]

Each to his or her opinion ....

[r_kk]

Good Dev & app_engine,
It is good to know that you got cured using homeopathy. Unfortunately such individual claims can not considered as a scientific proof. Scientific proof needs a proof which is repetive in a controlled environement. Most of the individual claimers forget to tell about the other parallel treatments undergone.


The reports I had gone extensively are from world highly reputed medical journals like Lancet and recent scientific challange conducted by BBC Horizon and James Randi Research foundation. I have the entire video and statistical report. I will post some of the snapshots from the video soon.
[/url]
http://www.bbc.co.uk/science/horizon/2002/homeopathy.shtml

http://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140673605671772/abstract



The one million $ challanges against homeopathy by JRF is still available. But unfortunately no homeopathy practicioners are yet to accept it.

http://www.randi.org/site/index.php/1m-challenge.html
[ulr]

I will also explain why these are looking as effective slowly, even from my personal experience.

Many of the World Health Organization doctors advised not to use homeopathy as alternative.

Dr Mario Raviglione, Director, Stop TB Department, WHO
http://www.who.int/tb/about/raviglione_biodata/en/index.html
: "Our evidence-based WHO TB treatment/management guidelines, as well as the International Standards of Tuberculosis Care (ISTC) do not recommend use of homeopathy."

Dr Mukund Uplekar, TB Strategy and Health Systems, WHO: "WHO's evidence-based guidelines on treatment of tuberculosis...have no place for homeopathic medicines."

Dr Teguest Guerma, Director Ad Interim, HIV/AIDS Department, WHO:
http://www.who.int/hiv/mediacentre/bio_teguest_guerma_en.pdf

"The WHO Dept. of HIV/AIDS invests considerable human and financial resources [... ] to ensure access to evidence-based medical information and to clinically proven, efficacious, and safe treatment for HIV... Let me end by congratulating the young clinicians and researchers of Sense About Science for their efforts to ensure evidence-based approaches to treating and caring for people living with HIV."

Dr Sergio Spinaci, Associate Director, Global Malaria Programme, WHO: "Thanks for the amazing documentation and for whistle blowing on this issue... The Global Malaria programme recommends that malaria is treated following the WHO Guidelines for the Treatment of Malaria".

Joe Martines, on behalf of Dr Elizabeth Mason, Director, Department of Child and Adolescent Health and Development, WHO: "We have found no evidence to date that homeopathy would bring any benefit to the treatment of diarrhoea in children...Homeopathy does not focus on the treatment and prevention of dehydration - in total contradiction with the scientific basis and our recommendations for the management of diarrhoea."


http://www.senseaboutscience.org.uk/pdf/SenseAboutHomeopathy.pdf

[app_engine]

Good Dev & app_engine,
It is good to know that you got cured using homeopathy. Unfortunately such individual claims can not considered as a scientific proof. Scientific proof needs a proof which is repetive in a controlled environement. Most of the individual claimers forget to tell about the other parallel treatments undergone.



I didn't use ANY parallel medication in my case. So your statement is incorrect there.

I also don't claim Homeo has cure for EVERY sickness (in fact none of the medical systems has). So, the TB research etc, while may be true, does not disprove the whole system.

My post was like wherever it works, use it. Don't shout "it is useless" etc based on some "papers". They are not even worth the cost of the paper on which they're printed IMSO! (Often people do "studies" and "researches" based on funding by pharmaceutical giants, which are in reality only marketing / ad expenses).

None of the WHO or any doctors is qualified to say in "blanket" terms against ANY medical system (as no one is a "know-all" and every one of their statements don't stand against my own personal experience and that of others. And definitely I'm not talking about "faith-healing", "mind-over-matter" business here).

And your claim of "scientifically proving everything" just brings to my mind how many times the scientists have changed their theories in the past (often 180 degrees on a number of health issues). So, many of these reports may not stand the test of times.

Do you know that science is also a matter of "faith" when it comes to explaining how the first cell originated? :D

[dev]

r_kk, enakku ninaivu therinja mudhal I've used allopathy treatment only 4 times in my life so far...once when I was on a vac & had a severe food poisoning... The other was when I was bit by my cousin I had to take some injection...:lol: the other was when I met with a minor accident I took a TT & some antiseptic was given... & the very recent one was for my pregnancy & childbirth... even there I used homeopathy medicines to improve my chances of normal delivery... In all the situations, I din't have much options other than to go for allopathy treatment...& there's no question of me using parallel medications for the other illnesses I had mentioned earlier... scientific proof or not, it has been effective in my case... so y bother abt scientific proofs???!!!

[app_engine]

I'm also reminded of the recent "whistle blower" lawsuit against Pfizer where a terminated employee got millions from the fine gov imposed on them for their false claims of a medicine. Fraud is there all around in "scientific" community and I won't buy any tall claims by these labs anymore :-)

[ksen]

The one million $ challanges against homeopathy by JRF is still available. But unfortunately no homeopathy practicioners are yet to accept it.
[/url]
http://www.randi.org/site/index.php/1m-challenge.html
[ulr]



Homeopathy is in no way a "psychic, supernatural or paranormal" phenomenon. Then where is the question of accepting any challenge ? It is a scientific treatment, very much similar to how vaccines work in our body, which is why the medicine becomes more potent as the dilution increases. And it works on the principle of using a poison or any substance which creates the same symptoms in our body as the ailment as the medicine - only it is diluted hundreds of times that it can no longer be identified as the original substance.



Joe Martines, on behalf of Dr Elizabeth Mason, Director, Department of Child and Adolescent Health and Development, WHO: "We have found no evidence to date that homeopathy would bring any benefit to the treatment of diarrhoea in children...Homeopathy does not focus on the treatment and prevention of dehydration - in total contradiction with the scientific basis and our recommendations for the management of diarrhoea."


Well, I find homeo medicines to be the best to stop / treat any diarrhoea, without any side effect whatsoever, which cannot be claimed by any antibiotic.

[r_kk]

[tscii:86c2501bb8]One of the basic constant of Chemistry is Avogadro constant 6.022 141 79(30) × 1023 mol^-1. Homeopathy dilution philosophy seriously voilates this. You have either throw Avogadro or Homeopathy. Please read my thread on Alternate medicine to understand more.

Just for example, add 1 drop of snake poison in Gangothri and take 1 drop of Ganga water in Haridwar as Homeopathic medicine for Plague fever. Will you accept as Homeopathic medicine?

Then there are so many claims for miracle cures, cures just due to placebo pills, cures due to x, cures due to y etc in few individual cases. Since there were cures due to unidentified reason, whether we can accept all x and y as proven medical practices?
[/tscii:86c2501bb8]

[ksen]

It is not just diluting, - the substance gets processed at each stage.

Well, I don't see the need for all this explanation - nobody is trying to convert anybody. Like Dev said, you can try all you like :) We are enjoying the entertainment. It was fun reading PR's and app-engine's posts :D

[r_kk]

[tscii:fc5c8d34b0]Thanks for clarifying Ksen.

If you still feel like explaining, please explain about the “substance getting processed” (vigorous shaking) and where we get 100% pure water without any memory effect.

Then, I don’t write any thing just for fun, because in India, many people take these really serious; consider pseudoscience as real and loose health and wealth. I had written just to put an alternative view to the readers, those who read this forum, based on the available scientific approaches. In fact I very well know that it is not easy to change any one. But if any one of you can prove, I will change. The challenges to Homeopathy by James Randi are always available to any one who thinks they have some proof.

I hope you all might have read about the recent bursting of frauds like P Vijayakumar of Travancore Raja Vaidhya Salai in Mylapore, who was running a successful hospital and TV show about his treatment in Vijay TV. Unfortunately many people fall victim (heavy metal poisoning) and lost not only their lakhs of rupees but also their loved one’s health.

As some one said science is also evolving. It is true, for example, we evolved from Newtonian to Quantum, but it doesn’t mean we need to agree to all pseudoscience hoping that it will become true oneday. As on today, based on current scientific theories, homeopathy is not falling under SCIENCE.
[/tscii:fc5c8d34b0]

[P_R]

r_kk, is your claim that no-one gets any cure from homoepathy ? And that any reported cure was a mere fluke ? i.e. that homeopathic drugs will/have failed to be statistically more significant than not having any medication at all (which to me is the logical extension of questioning basic tenets of the system, right ?) . If so, then I think I have just seen too many cases of it working to consider this line of argument any further.

OTOH if your claim is that in most cases allopathic drugs 'outperform' homeopathic ones, then that is a different question altogether.

[app_engine]

Now, r_kk, you've raised another point, of people "losing wealth".

I don't think this applies to Homeopathy at all :-) From what I've seen in Kerala (where this practice has flourished), it's one of the least expensive treatments available.

And for people with certain chronic sickness with absolutely no improvement after spending tons of money with allopathy (except temporary calming down and in some cases progressive worsening of the situation even - like certain docs resorting to steroids), that was one of the incentives to switch to homeo.

So, when we discuss purely on moola, homeo will outscore most other systems with ROI - i.e. for whichever cases it got proved to work :-)

Disclaimer : My this post is not to recommend delaying the "correct" treatment for a specific ailment that CANNOT be cured by homeo, simply because it's cheap and affordable. Rush to emergency where needed :-)

[app_engine]

Want to post another important personal experience where homeo helped tremendously.

As you could've guessed from my posts in this thread, homeo is obviously not the FIRST choice for my family as I take them to regular hospitals (now in U.S., I haven't even located any homeo doc - except that I've seen some of those medicine in vitamin shoppe). And for me as an individual, I take treatment only when it's absolutely necessary - otherwise "தூய காற்றும் நன்னீரும், சுண்டப்பசித்த பின் உணவும்" technology only :-)

When nothing worked for my wife's nausea during first pregnancy in India - she could hardly eat any and had to be even administered drips often - a caring friend suggested homeo and though utterly sceptical, I had no other way but to give it a try. And it worked miraculously.

The 2nd pregnancy is here in U.S. and the situation was worse. Tried all kinds of medicines the hospital recommended (one of the top names in U.S.) and it was a struggle. Guess what - I phoned up my friend in Palakkad and requested to him to go to the same doc, get the miracle medicine and air mail. It DID work and she could start eating and regained most of the lost strength and delivered normally:-) (She visited the homeopath in his 70's during a subsequent India trip with the baby and thanked him for the timely help).

It's not that we didn't try the "scientifically proven glorious allopathy" :-) p is in the p :-)

[r_kk]

app_engine,
next time, in case if you are going for another child (!), just give sugar globes soaked in the solvent generally used for homeopathy without any homeopathic dilution and see (without telling to your wife!).

Then till now I haven't talked about allopathy (first time I am using this word in this thread). I also like you (தூய காற்றும் நன்னீரும், சுண்டப்பசித்த பின் உணவும்" technology only) and allow body to recover as much as possible and then go to doctor when it is really necessary.

There a plenty of demerits with Allopathy and so called vaccination. Hundreds of article can be written against misuse of antibiotics, vaccines and commercialising medical profession. But still we have to accept that it had doubled the average Indian life expectance (1930: 32 years, 2009: 64 years) and prevented world children mortality in large extend.

[app_engine]

I completely agree with the effect vaccinations & antibiotics had / have on prevention of mortality and increase of average life expectancy.

I'm certainly not against that neither do I question the treatment methods as all of us are beneficieries :-)

It's just that I don't dismiss any form of treatment simply based on campaign by competitors.

Ofcourse main aspects of the treatment should be possible to explain "as far as possible" with the current proven science. However, given the fact that science cannot explain EVERYTHING, we'll have to give it to certain treatments the benefit of "future discoveries", as long as they alleviate sicknesses at present :-)

About the Avogadro thingy, I didn't invest time to study. While that approach may disprove certain parts of the homeo philosophy, it may not disprove as a whole. For example, what if there is "no or minimal dilution" for a specific drug / chemical and it works fine for a set of illnesses at that potency level?

We don't have to take the extreme dilution levels (a drop in ganga kind) for every case / sickness. That way, the system needn't stray from science upto a point at least :-)

[r_kk]

[tscii:6878a0652d]Avogadro’s constant is very simple and clear. Number of molecules in a same size container of two different gases is same, at same temperature and pressure.

If dilution principle has to be true, just to trace the medical substance in 12C and 13C homeopathic remedy, we need the following quantity of ideal water (no impurities, water without any trace of so called water memory).

12C: equivalent to adding pinch of salt in entire South and North Atlantic Ocean
13C: One third of a drop of original substance diluted into all the water on earth

So, my comment in adding 1 drop of substance in Gangodri and taking a drop at Haridwar is not enough to create even 10C!

Unfortunately Samuel Hahnemann (1755-1843) was published his “Organon der Rationellen Heilkunde” in 1810, just one year before the publication of hypothesis by Physicist Amadeo Avogadro (1776-1856)
[/tscii:6878a0652d]

[app_engine]

http://www.dinamalar.com/Pothunewsdetail.asp?News_id=17495#

Cow colostrum (சீம்பால்) seems to be building up resistance against swine flu, as per this news.

[app_engine]

On homeopathy :
http://www.kulisz.com/how_does_homeopathy_work.htm

This article seems to agree with my observation on avogadro thingy (i.e. for relatively higher concentrations / low potency, there's explanation. For the controversial one (drop in ganga stuff), though there's no explanation as of the time of this article, similar is the condition for many other traditional drugs as well it seems) :-)

[sathya_1979]

http://ibnlive.in.com/news/who-exaggerated-h1n1-to-benefit-pharma-cos/108641-17.html?from=tn

New Delhi: Was the swine flu scare exaggerated to benefit pharma companies?


Evidence has surfaced that several members of the World Health Organisation's (WHO) vaccine board - which pushed countries to buy the H1N1 vaccine - have had significant ties with pharma companies.


Documents acquired through the Danish Freedom of Information Act revealed that Professor Juhani Eskola - a Finnish member of the WHO board on vaccines called the Strategic Advisory Group of Experts (SAGE) - received almost 6.3 million euros in 2009 for his vaccine research programme from the vaccine manufacturers GlaxoSmithKline.


It has also been reported that six other members of SAGE had financial ties with various pharmaceutical companies which include Novartis, Solvay, Baxter, MedImmune and Sanofi Aventis.


This has given rise to speculation that the swine flu was a fase pandemic, orchestrated by drug companies looking pull in large profits from the vaccines. Experts now say that the classic flu causes more deaths than swine flu.