what's the appeal of going abroad/desi identity crisis

[kannuma]

ive lived outside india practically my whole life, so i really cant say much. but what is the reason ppl want to get out of india. why is it regarded as such a status symbol? true my parents left india, but that was because of family reasons, which i cannot divulge further. that was our reason.
furthermore, why do desis, living in india try to act as if theyve not lived there or try to disengage themselves from their desiness.
take for example this instance:
my cousin went to this girl's marriage. there she wa sputting on this fake american accent, while she had been in india all her life. when my cousin asked how come she had an american accent, she was all offended and said 'typical madras attitude. i hate madras. i just hate it'(her lovely personality really seems to have shone through). my cousin was like no, its not that bad. she said she was dying to get out of india, after all, whi'c stay there.
why do desis have this self loathing? and then look down upon desis who have lived abroad most their lives. apparently living abroad most your life makes you less of an indian(even though we might know more about our culture,religion etc etc than those who look down upon us), but at the same time desis are dying to get out of india.
this sounds very strange and is very paradoxical to me. please share your views

[blahblah]

Very kind of you to brand us as 'Desis'.No different from the North Indian attitude of calling us all 'Madrasis. :x

You do not know the reasons for people wanting to get out of this country because you lived almost all your life abroad.They are many:Poverty,adventurism,ambition all drive us out of our place.

If you ever have the chance to visit this country on a long vacation,I would suggest that you travel a bit.This country has a strange tale to tell you.One of ancient glory,great potential and still miserable life.Some want to escape it,some to explore new frontiers.

Still we know that life will change for the good in this country.Many of us shall not see that day,but our little children will take our dreams to greater heights :) .THE LITTLE BUDS SHALL BLOSSOM AND TOMORROW SHALL BE BRIGHTER THAN YESTERDAY.FROM THEM WILL EMERGE A BETTER WISER INDIA :) and our great motherland will reach the zenith of her glory.Then her ungrateful sons and daughters will not address us with contempt :roll: .

[pavalamani pragasam]

Come on, everybody! Give a standing ovation to blahblah! :) :D :lol:

[Bad Boy]

THE LITTLE BUDS SHALL BLOSSOM AND TOMORROW SHALL BE BRIGHTER THAN YESTERDAY.FROM THEM WILL EMERGE A BETTER WISER INDIA :) and our great motherland will reach the zenith of her glory.Then her ungrateful sons and daughters will not address us with contempt :roll: .

I don't think India will ever blossom, the main reason is: Casteism and the Religion that fosters and cultivates it. There are no uprising against all this and the very worst thing is that people accept it as their fate.

[pavalamani pragasam]

"Hope springs eternal in human breast"
Even the longest journey starts with one step.
Great visionaries like Bharathiar & Abdul Kalam have their dreams realised. The world thrives on the dreams of such altruistic great personalities.
More things can be wrought if only the pessimists will keep their big mouths shut. There is a proverb in Tamil:"uthavi seyyaavittaalum upaththiravam seyyaamal iruppathu nallathu" = if you cant be helpful it is better if you are not a hindrance at least. :banghead:

[Bad Boy]

More things can be wrought if only the pessimists will keep their big mouths shut. There is a proverb in Tamil:"uthavi seyyaavittaalum upaththiravam seyyaamal iruppathu nallathu" = if you cant be helpful it is better if you are not a hindrance at least. :banghead:

But only hoping and hoping tells me of the parrot waiting for the cotton to ripe!

Your proverb reminds me in Englisch of something similar: If you don't do good then avoid doing bad.

[aravindhan]

I don't think India will ever blossom, the main reason is: Casteism and the Religion that fosters and cultivates it. There are no uprising against all this and the very worst thing is that people accept it as their fate.

I wouldn't be so pessimistic, BB-vaal. We tend to forget that as little as sixty years ago in Tamilagam, a periyavar of a lower caste would be forced to bow his head and lower his eyes when speaking to a ilaiyan of a high caste. We've come a long way since then, and things are getting better. You can't change a system that's lasted centuries overnight, but we're headed in the right direction.

[pavalamani pragasam]

well said, aravindhan. Perfectly correct. That is truly sensible attitude to be taken by us all :)

[blahblah]

My earlier post in this thread came out from a heart burdened to speak out words of hope and faith.It is true that many in India today prefer life abroad as the opportunities are many out there.With a large population and little space for everyone :( ,it is only normal.

It is only recently that the world has started taking us seriously.Azim Premji and Narayanamurthy have shown us that we can have better jobs and lifestyle here itself :) .The scene is changing rapidly.The emergence of India as an economic power may come as soon as a decade or two :) .As the poverty decreases and people get better education,the casteism and communalism will disappear to a great extend.You should keep in mind that ethnic or religious divisions among people exist in many countries.

India has a great potential to become a pluralistic, tolerant economic power.It will happen sooner than later.I put my hope in our children the way our forefathers put it in us.They are our hope and all we have.That's why my heart leaps with joy when I see a primary school with all smiling little faces around :) .They are our future and will create a future for themselves too with out having to depend on foreigners for their food.As I repeat,many of us shall perish before the dawn breaks,BUT I KNOW,YES I KNOW,IT WILL COME FOR SURE.And mother India will face the new world with dignity. :thumbsup:
There was a slogan which we used to raise when I was a wreckless lad with more blood in my veins than I could hold :wink: .Though I could not understand the real meaning of it at that time it goes like this:

"Union Jackinal kazhuvetta sodare,
Ningalil pookkatha mohangal pookkuvan
Ningade pinmurappadayaniyunditha",roughly translated as

"Oh Comrades who were hanged by the Union Jack,
To fulfill the dreams that you couldn't,
Here we come,your children".

************************************************** ***
We must accept finite disappointment,but we should never lose eternal hope-Martin Luther King.

[pavalamani pragasam]

Very well said, again,blahblah :D

[nirosha sen]

Well many had left Mother India for greener pastures either willingly or wilfully as indentured labour to so many new lands. They include the Caribbean, Malaya, Singapore and the Fiji Islands. While we are many generations down the line from those first migrants, we never lose respect or love of the Motherland!! :cry:

On both my parents' side, I was the very first to have visited India to date!! But sadly, my parents are no more to share my wondrous tales of what I had seen, savoured or lament!! It took four generations before one of us took the first step back into the old country and I must confess to have mixed feelings abt it!!

Unlike the new breed of Indians, who land in so many First World countries, flying in jumbo jets, ours is a sad tale of blood, sweat and tears which many are too ashamed to acknowledge and hence try to sweep under the rug of the forgotten!!

Very few of us have any real knowledge of our history here in Malaysia, as many of our old-timers are dead and gone. Still, the few who are around and feel the need to record our early struggles, have taken the trouble to write for the papers, magazines, etc!! Some archive materials are also there.

A newly found friend of mine, who is well into the 70s has just written a book entitled aptly, "Shore to Shore"!! It's a dear little book, where I found my own family's saga, so beautifully told and mirrored! But books like this is few and far between, that unless someone records all that oral history, ours would indeed be another generation of lost Indians, far from our roots! :cry: :cry: :cry:

[Roshan]

nirosha

That was a good and profound post !!

[kannuma]

Very kind of you to brand us as 'Desis'.No different from the North Indian attitude of calling us all 'Madrasis. :x

You do not know the reasons for people wanting to get out of this country because you lived almost all your life abroad.They are many:Poverty,adventurism,ambition all drive us out of our place.

If you ever have the chance to visit this country on a long vacation,I would suggest that you travel a bit.This country has a strange tale to tell you.One of ancient glory,great potential and still miserable life.Some want to escape it,some to explore new frontiers.

Still we know that life will change for the good in this country.Many of us shall not see that day,but our little children will take our dreams to greater heights :) .THE LITTLE BUDS SHALL BLOSSOM AND TOMORROW SHALL BE BRIGHTER THAN YESTERDAY.FROM THEM WILL EMERGE A BETTER WISER INDIA :) and our great motherland will reach the zenith of her glory.Then her ungrateful sons and daughters will not address us with contempt :roll: .

i didnt know being called desi was offensie. here at uni we just apply it to anyone whos south asian. im sorry if you took offense, ut i dony see why being desi is so bad.

now i have a queation to as ppl who say living abroad = better. some ppl lose their jobs here(desis) live with such little money etc etc. can't find a new job. are kinda miserable. how is this any different than in india. but the though of going back to india where thy might find a job is not an option for those poor souls. i dont understand why living abroad is so glorified

[kannuma]

and also id like to say that its a huge misconcepion that desis who settled in first world countries do not have any tales of blood sweat and tears. i think thats a rather strange view.

[aravindhan]

i didnt know being called desi was offensie.

It's not an offensive word. What is insulting is the "why are desis..." sort of attitude, as if all Indians have the same attitudes and Indian attitudes can be summed up in easy sentences. Wouldn't you be upset if someone said, "Why are NRIs so arrogant? My cousin visited from the US and couldn't stop badmouthing India for a minute of her stay. What is it with NRIs that they have so much contempt for Indians who live in India?" Well, what you said in your post wasn't that different, and that's what people are reacting against. "Desis living in India" do not all think the same way any more than all NRIs do; "desis living in India" are not all dying to leave the country; and, going by anecdotal evidence, the majority of "desis living in India" who actually go abroad return to India.

If you're asking why some desis are desperate to leave India, I would say it's a question of their personality. Indian society, especially in the south, is not very individualistic. One is expected to subordinate oneself to society and family in many more ways than one is in European society. One also has far less privacy, and is expected to be (or at least pretend to be) a lot less materialistic. One must also be patient and put up with things that would send people elsewhere into a tizzy. And then there's the poverty and injustice one sees in society, the corruption, the wasted potential, and other such things which one has to learn to live with. This is not everyone's cup of tea, and in my opinion those who talk about "hating Madras" or "hating India" are really saying that they hate these aspects of Indian culture and society; and they would therefore rather live in a place where they don't have to put up with these. NRIs can, in a sense, pick and choose the bits of Indian culture they want to keep and discard the rest. Indians living in India don't have this option. For many, going abroad is therefore an easier option than staying on and fighting to change the things they don't like, or learning to live with them. Which is understandable enough - people are different.

Others go abroad to build a career. The west is much more of a meritocracy than India is, and it's much easier to make a mark there if you have the capability (though this is now changing). Once one has done that, one can return and claim one's place in Indian society. Many do. However, for many, uprooting themselves again is difficult, and they tend to stay on. It's much the same for those who lose their jobs, with the added factor of the loss of face that results from returning as a failure, with one's tail between one's legs (in a manner of speaking).

Status doesn't play such a big role any longer, as far as I can see. The days when "green card holder" in a matrimonial advertisement meant long lines of people queuing up outside your house are long gone, and I do not think they will return. Status was a factor when a person returning from velinadu would bring fine fabrics and gadgets and wonderful little curios which one simply could not get in India, but Indian society has changed and it's no longer so. Today, the only real status which getting a job abroad gives is "Wow look, this fellow is bright enough to get a good job with a top international company", but that's really 'recognition' rather than 'status', and even that's starting to change as jobs in India become more demanding and creative, and consequently carry the same prestige as a job abroad.

Just my observations, as one who's lived a fair amount of time in India, SE Asia, and Europe.


and also id like to say that its a huge misconcepion that desis who settled in first world countries do not have any tales of blood sweat and tears. i think thats a rather strange view.

The travails of the indentured labourers who were shipped to remote destinations and of the average modern economic migrant to Europe or the US are hardly comparable.

[blahblah]

Kannuma,We who live in this country have pride too. You talk about 'desi identity crisis'. Where did you get the idea? :x Did it result from your identity crisis? You said you have been living in Holland and some other country. Which country do you belong to? Do you consider yourself an Indian?

The Indian expatriate community have earned due respect from their respective adopted communities and from the residents of this country.We are glad that you have achieved what you did :) .It comes from the effort of many generations and a lot of sweat and blood stories :( .

Even today your success inspires many to travel to unknown shores in search of opportunities :) .If they fail,they try to hold on irrespective of hardship and poverty. :( But you shouldn't forget that this was the attitude shown by your forefathers once and that is why you are there today :wink: .

===============================================
When the big bell is ringing,no one hears the little one.But that doesn't mean the little one is not ringing[Danish Proverb] :wink:

[kannuma]

Kannuma,We who live in this country have pride too. You talk about 'desi identity crisis'. Where did you get the idea? :x Did it result from your identity crisis? You said you have been living in Holland and some other country. Which country do you belong to? Do you consider yourself an Indian?

The Indian expatriate community have earned due respect from their respective adopted communities and from the residents of this country.We are glad that you have achieved what you did :) .It comes from the effort of many generations and a lot of sweat and blood stories :( .

Even today your success inspires many to travel to unknown shores in search of opportunities :) .If they fail,they try to hold on irrespective of hardship and poverty. :( But you shouldn't forget that this was the attitude shown by your forefathers once and that is why you are there today :wink: .

===============================================
When the big bell is ringing,no one hears the little one.But that doesn't mean the little one is not ringing[Danish Proverb] :wink:
look i asked a simple and logical quetion and now you choose to condescendingly assume that i have an identity crisis and whatnot. no need to get all pissy at the thought of someone asking some questions about her own people.

by identity crisis i mean that they tend to glorify everything western. and plz dont tell me that doesnt happen because that happens abundantly. life abroad is depicted as being glamorous and whatnot. i was merely asking why the whole craze to get out of india was there, when there is equal suffering everywhere. by that i mean why does the desi guy who is out of a job and living on a tiny allowance dread going back to india even though he might be better off there. why do they marry people just to attain green cards etc etc. im asking why returning to ones own country is so bad, when things abroad might be worse.
before you attack me for actually sohwing another not glorified aspect of desiness(and yes im desi, so i can point out stuff which i find peculiar), think about it. am i only allowed to look at the positive and ignore what i think is silly.

i have seen so many desis living abroad shunning all that is indian, and you know what so many desis who have lived in india all their life suddenly have an american(fake) accent, 'coz they went to an english medium school'. i think it is an identity crisis. im asking why this is. is it because the west is over glamourised? is there something ive missed? and stop attacking anyone for having an opinion of their own. i asked a question. if you had problems with it, argue in a normal manner, not in a way that u drag my personal life into it without even knowing the tiniest detail of my life. i ask these questions because i know what i have excountered and am asking other who might have had similar experiences or completely different experiences to debate about this.

and as for the wonderful things some nris have done(and i commend them for that), i have also encountered many who, in their ridiculousness are decide to shun their desiness. there are so much politics involved it makes the whole thing incestuous and makes me ill.

plz do not drag my so called history or lif einto this. you know nothing about me to use as an argument. if you would like to talk about this in a manner where you can share your views without criticising the person asking a question, then please do so. other dont direct me with statements such as 'Did it result from your identity crisis? You said you have been living in Holland and some other country. Which country do you belong to? Do you consider yourself an Indian?'
an observation is an observation, whether it be positive or negative.
im sorry if i seem very annoyed, but its because i am. i just started a topic where i thought i could have a good debate about but people think questioning what i think of myself is their best argument. im not allowed to call South Asians desis. my tone was in the least offensive and i include myself in the desi category in general. when i address things like 'why do desis' i am addressing a large part, but not all of the desis. this in turn was taken offensively. now honestly what did i say that was so bad?

[Bad Boy]

don't you realize that the ForumHub does not require logical abilities?
Where is the logic in "simple logical question"? Or do you mean single logical question? :lol:

[kannuma]

don't you realize that the ForumHub does not require logical abilities?
Where is the logic in "simple logical question"? Or do you mean single logical question? :lol:
it was ligical and simple to follow. i didnt think it would be that difficult to follow

[kannuma]

don't you realize that the ForumHub does not require logical abilities?
Where is the logic in "simple logical question"? Or do you mean single logical question? :lol:
it was logical and simple to follow. i didnt think it would be that difficult to understand

[Bad Boy]

It is more than obvious if I find a button "edit" up above my post on the right corner. It would be logical to make use of it!
Isn't it so, Kannumma?

It is more than logical that you are sticking to logicals and not to logics :lol:

[kannuma]

It is more than obvious if I find a button "edit" up above my post on the right corner. It would be logical to make use of it!
Isn't it so, Kannumma?

It is more than logical that you are sticking to logicals and not to logics :lol:
even the best of us err.

[blahblah]

Hi all hubbers,
I don't know why people call it 'personal attack' :o when their ways are criticised.However I will try not to address any one personally in this thread.
If the Indians in America try to speak with an American accent,it is because they wan't to adapt to the new culture.I can't think of speaking butler English when I am in U.S.. :roll:
The perception that everyone is dying to get out of India is wrong as pointed out by someone else in this thread.Or to say the least,the trend is decreasing.
If someone feels that everything foreign is being glamourised in this country,may be that's the difference between a rich and poor country.
If you say that there is an alarming trend of shunning everything Indian,well,may be I heard about it from the wrong source :wink: .

[kannuma]

Hi all hubbers,
I don't know why people call it 'personal attack' :o when their ways are criticised.However I will try not to address any one personally in this thread.
If the Indians in America try to speak with an American accent,it is because they wan't to adapt to the new culture.I can't think of speaking butler English when I am in U.S.. :roll:
The perception that everyone is dying to get out of India is wrong as pointed out by someone else in this thread.Or to say the least,the trend is decreasing.
If someone feels that everything foreign is being glamourised in this country,may be that's the difference between a rich and poor country.
If you say that there is an alarming trend of shunning everything Indian,well,may be I heard about it from the wrong source :wink: .

it not a personal attack when you give constructive arguments. it is a personal attack when you tell me my perception is due to the fact that i must hvae went through an identity crisis(rephrased, but thats the gist of it).
i am glad to know the trend is decreasing, but i do know many many people, in india or abroad who diss india. by that i also mean people i stand in the line with at immigration or whtever in india. face it, there are a lot of people who shun indian culture. however there is a part of the desis who shun everything foreign. i was an observation. im just asking to discuss. and im glad to find out the trend for glamourizing the west is decreasing. i can tell you im neither rich nor poor, and the people i meet come from all kinds of backgrounds. just to clarify...

[aravindhan]

so many desis who have lived in india all their life suddenly have an american(fake) accent, 'coz they went to an english medium school'. i think it is an identity crisis. im asking why this is. is it because the west is over glamourised? is there something ive missed?


I think it could just be that you have not seen a representative sample of Indians. My experience has been that those who attended public schools tend to speak with British-ish accents; those who attended the newer, expensive, private schools tend to speak with American accents; and those who attended the normal sort of English schools (such as yours truly) have Indian accents, with varying degrees of thickness.

I've not seen any evidence to suggest that a significant portion of Indians have an identity crisis, let alone "Indians" as a generalised group. As I explained in a previous post, those who are of their nature drawn to a more individual-centred lifestyle are likely to feel more "western", because western culture better reflects their personal values. I have a cousin who is in a similar position, and we've had a number of long chats about why she feels the way she does.


i am glad to know the trend is decreasing, but i do know many many people, in india or abroad who diss india.

I've met a number of Englishmen who diss England, Germans who diss Germany, and Americans who diss the US. What, to your mind, seems qualitatively different about the way Indians diss India?

[mellon]

so many desis who have lived in india all their life suddenly have an american(fake) accent, 'coz they went to an english medium school'.

Pronunciation and accent are the MAJOR issues one needs to work on when trying to adopt a foreign country and living there. We mispronounce several words in English unfortunately. One need to communicate to the people properly to survive in a foreign country. The foreigners may not understand your "native English" accent and they will never come down to learn or understand your accent. So, some are forced to change their accent so that the people with whom they do business or interact with will understand and, for being competent in coummunication as well. This is a positive thought and it is genuine in several cases.

[aravindhan]

We mispronounce several words in English unfortunately. One need to communicate to the people properly to survive in a foreign country. The foreigners may not understand your "native English" accent and they will never come down to learn or understand your accent. So, some are forced to change their accent so that the people with whom they do business or interact with will understand and, for being competent in coummunication as well. This is a positive thought and it is genuine in several cases.

I think Kanuma was talking about Indians living in India, not Indians who've moved to the US. But I'd take issue with your saying that we Indians "mispronounce" words in English. Indian English is a variant of English in its own right, and whilst our pronunciation is different from Standard British and Standard American, it is no more a "mispronunciation" than is Standard Australian. Professor David Crystal even predicted not too long ago that Indian English may eventually come to be the most-used flavour of English internationally...

That having been said, I agree that we often need to moderate our Indian tones if we want to be understood well. To some extent, we owe it to the natives when we travel to a foreign country. However, a Brit from Aberdeen or Cornwall will probably need to moderate their speech a lot more than the average Indian.

[mellon]

However, a Brit from Aberdeen or Cornwall will probably need to moderate their speech a lot more than the average Indian.

Well, a British does not need to change his accent. Because when you are a white and British, or jewish with an accent, it is different at least in north america. Of course he/she will be changing it eventually but it hardly matters.

Indians and chinese are not "treated" like an "English" or an Isreali with an accent. If the British is "african-british" then it is different.

The reason of course is we have completely "unacceptable" arranged marriage culture and most of us fussing about how great being a vegetarian is and WE DONT LOOK LIKE THEM and our NAMES are so weird looking. When they find these issues as so foreign, with a FOREIGN accent with a darker skin or a chinese face, we score very little when you compare yourself with a white, English or Israeli with an accent.

[visu]

"The reason of course is we have completely "unacceptable" arranged marriage culture and most of us fussing about how great being a vegetarian is and WE DONT LOOK LIKE THEM and our NAMES are so weird looking. When they find these issues as so foreign, with a FOREIGN accent with a darker skin or a chinese face, we score very little when you compare yourself with a white, English or Israeli with an accent. "



Mate what r u saying?
Majority of indians are happy with arranged marriages. Haha i know how liberated marriages work in west! :lol:

What is the need to look like them mate? If we look like them and have western names we r not indians. I think you are smooching their as* too much.

Our english is far far better than russians and east europeans.
No one gives visas to indians like that. They give visas because we have skills and inturn contribute to their economy.
I personally think people here downunder have no problem with indian accent.In turn nowadays all the mobile cutomer service is directed to india. And people say though the language is accented it is good.

[pavalamani pragasam]

The word "unacceptable" makes the meaning very obvious :D Arranged marriages are acceptable to us, unacceptable to them :D Is that clear now?

[blahblah]

[quote]

What is the need to look like them mate? If we look like them and have western names we r not indians. I think you are smooching their as* too much.


Since you said it friend-How can 'Shiv Narayan Chandrapal' become 'Shivnarine Chander Paul' and 'Ram Naresh Sharavanan' become 'Ramnaresh Sharwan'?So may be some of us are really smooching their a** too much and this gives 'some people' a chance to criticise a culture that they understand very little. :wink:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
If you want a symbolic gesture, don't burn the flag;wash it.[Norman Thomas]

[visu]

blah blah brother,
If people like burger let them eat it. I dont like burger but u can't force me to eat one.

Some people go to overseas for a couple of years and pose as if they are born there. When i went home last year people are saying like you haven't changed you are same old visu. What the hell man. Look like some people expect us to change.

[mellon]

Some people go to overseas for a couple of years and pose as if they are born there.

It seems like our vichu aNNA is here to tell us that he has seen abroad and western world. So dont bs around here please. Well, sure I could see that vichu aNNA had seen it all. :lol: :lol:


Look like some people expect us to change

Well, I wonder vichu aNNA DROVE his car in the right side of the road for a CHANGE and not in the left side as he used to drive back home . :lol: :roll: He does not seem THAT STUPID, not to change himself a bit for being alive. Does he? :roll:

BTW, Tell me vichu annA who do you think will win the super bowl??? :roll:

[Bad Boy]

Some people go to overseas for a couple of years and pose as if they are born there.
I have also heard of the same people comming to "overseas" erecting a three-stone-coocker in the dining room! (realy happened) and cooking milk. ( Anyone heard of paalpongal?)

[visu]

It seems like our vichu aNNA is here to tell us that he has seen abroad and western world. So dont bs around here please. Well, sure I could see that vichu aNNA had seen it all. :lol: :lol:



Well, I wonder vichu aNNA DROVE his car in the right side of the road for a CHANGE and not in the left side as he used to drive back home . :lol: :roll: He does not seem THAT STUPID, not to change himself a bit for being alive. Does he? :roll:

BTW, Tell me vichu annA who do you think will win the super bowl??? :roll:

Mellon . Don't simply bluff mate. Its you who is boasting high about looking and behaving like westerner.

By the way i haven't been to your place. So not have to worry about driving rules & superbowls.

[mellon]

By the way i haven't been to your place. So not have to worry about driving rules & superbowls

Thanks, vichu aNNA, for ADMITTING that this is a VERY BIG WORLD indeed and that you have seen and learnt only a VERY LITTLE. 8) :)

[Bad Boy]

Hey Warrior,

You are hard to take! :lol: :thumbsup:

[mellon]

No, I am educating my aNNA, Sekar! :roll:

I dont want him to be dumb until he dies :)

[Rohit]

The main reason, why people want to leave India, lies in over a thousand years of shaming Indian history, made by no outsiders or foreigners, but by her own mean and corrupt people. It was only the Indian people who brought India to her knees by their own insipidity and ignorance and made India vulnerable to waves after waves of foreign invasions.

When India was freed from the rules of their foreign masters, the series of failures of over ten centuries, invited by ignorance and resulting stagnancy, was impossible to salvage through prevailing ancient “way of thinking and doing things”. People remained too indolent for too long to change their thinking mode. They found self-glorification and explaining away the invasions as the cause of destitute condition of India more respectful than to learn from past mistakes and adapt to the demands of time.

While the west and the rest of the world were moving forward in leaps and bounds in scientific and technological front, Indians were still busy in self-glorification, utterly oblivious of the consequences. Indian time was passing by without realisation of what was lost in the past in pursuing such nonsensical quests, resulting in seriously idiosyncratic mindset of the Indian masses.

But time has no mercy. Scientific and technological revolution lead by the West started to knock Indian door again. Economic globalisation was on the way, carrying fierce demands on peoples’ ability to adapt to the changing time. For those who were able and prepared, opportunities available abroad were plenty and financial rewards were great with promise of wealth and comfortable life. India had no choice but to follow the West, carrying with it a massive population of over a billion people, most of them were/are poor, illiterate, ignorant and oblivious. It was/is impossible for India to provide for all. The divide between the rich and poor widened even further, compelling more and more people to seek job abroad, the trend still continues.

So, the difference in the “way of thinking and doing things” between the East and the West is real and consequential; and the mentioned trend only reconfirms the existing stark difference between the two.

It is not wise and prudent for people to take comfort through self-deception when such situations cause dissonance. It is far better to accept and face the reality than to seek comfort in self-deception and create such approach avoidance conflicts.

[lordstanher]

Rohit,
U cudn't hav said it better! :wink: As Annie Bessant had quoted, India shall meet its actual downfall not by foreign invasions but by betrayal of her own children! And tats exactly wats been happening lately! :evil:
Indian IT professionals in particular, who hav already set the US as their 'dream' destination don't realise tat they r being wanted so much by the yanks cos its cheaper for the latter to hire Indians and make them work harder as long as u show em US dollars! :evil: In other words, its just a mild form of exploitation, comp'd to the blatant one by the Brits who ruled us! :evil:
And our ppl. r blinded by the foolish delusion tat going to the US = living in the land of milk & honey! They don't realise wat so many Indian there hav been going thru since 9/11 and even employmtent-wise, like during co. downsizings (very common in the US).

[Raghu]

whwre is kanuma these days :o

[blahblah]

Miss her brother? :lol:

[Cinefan]

blah blah,change of avathar plz,this one is scary.

[Raghu]

Miss her brother? :lol:

Ji huh, aarampichutaanghappa aarampichutngha :evil: :lol:

[Ilavenil]

there she wa sputting on this fake american accent, while she had been in india all her life.

Hi Kannuma,

I thought I could comment on "fake american accent". Well, when we are in America, if we don't use American accent, they cannot understand us. I think it is true with British accent too. Simple example would be the way we pronounce "comment"- In tamilnadu, we call it "kamant" but in US, it is "kaamant". It is always better the follow the English accent in whichever place you are. This makes communication easier. To use the same accent in India, I don't think it is fake as long as you speak in your mother tongue without a new accent. Thai mozhiyil theillivagavum, angilathil, angilaiyar polavum pesuvathu thavarillai. There is nothing wrong in speaking in proper mother tongue and in English with right accent.

[Ilavenil]

Rohit,
U cudn't hav said it better! :wink: As Annie Bessant had quoted, India shall meet its actual downfall not by foreign invasions but by betrayal of her own children! And tats exactly wats been happening lately! :evil:
Indian IT professionals in particular, who hav already set the US as their 'dream' destination don't realise tat they r being wanted so much by the yanks cos its cheaper for the latter to hire Indians and make them work harder as long as u show em US dollars!

Hi Lordstanher,

What are you doing in Singapore, leaving India behind? I was just curious because you were complaining about IT people leaving India for USA, forgetting that any other country (Singapore) other than our own country is a foreign country.

[lordstanher]

Hi Lordstanher,
What are you doing in Singapore, leaving India behind? I was just curious because you were complaining about IT people leaving India for USA, forgetting that any other country (Singapore) other than our own country is a foreign country.

TY for ur query. And I mite let u know tat I've only been studying here in Singapore, never intended to settle down here. I've always wanted to settle down in India come wat may, unlike most other ppl. who came to study here like me but r targeting Australia/NZ/UK etc.....I'm actually done w/ my course and will be returning home forever to India next month (to be precise, my ticket's already booked for 5th apr. :wink: ).....it was my parents' suggestion tat I study further and look 4 a job here in Singapore itself but I opposed them and conveyed to them beforehand tat I wish to settle down in India itself.
Hope tat cleared ur doubt? :wink:
And btw, um....u r in the US, rite? If so, wat r u doing there? R u planning to return to India? :wink:

[Sandeep]

Gone are the says when expatriates where seen as 'brain drain' and so as treason. Now a days the NRI community is actually helping India financially and Image wise in this time of global economy.

When we speak of NRI's we usually consider US or UK only. How about the people in Gulf. Comming from kerala I have to acknowledge their contribution in keeping alive the economy of kerala.

Indians leave because there is not enough opputuinity in India based on their capability. Those who didnt leave inspite of opputuinity where proved wrong by our great beurocracy and politicians.

But now things are changing. There is no doubt India and China are the future economies. What we need is to be more competitive.

You cannot walk in Bangalore MG Road or Forum Mall without bumpng into a foriegner. There are many foriegners working in my company and even in Indian companies like Infosys.

Foriegn business schools have started sending their students to india as part of their curicculam, reason give "they will need to deal with Indian Industries in future"

[Sandeep]

Years back I got a joke mail of how people are queuing up outside Indian embasy in US for Visa to India.

Then it was Joke but now its becomming a reality.

[Ilavenil]

Hi Lordstanher,
What are you doing in Singapore, leaving India behind? I was just curious because you were complaining about IT people leaving India for USA, forgetting that any other country (Singapore) other than our own country is a foreign country.

TY for ur query. And I mite let u know tat I've only been studying here in Singapore, never intended to settle down here. I've always wanted to settle down in India come wat may, unlike most other ppl.
And btw, um....u r in the US, rite? If so, wat r u doing there? R u planning to return to India? :wink:

Good luck with your education and future career in India. Well, since I didn't say that Indians should't leave India, this rule doesn't apply to me :wink: I don't think I came to USA because I wanted to. Like your parents sent you to Singapore to study, we have different reasons, not everybody leaves India because they didn't like India. So, I really don't know when or if I will leave USA.

[lordstanher]

Good luck with your education and future career in India. Well, since I didn't say that Indians should't leave India, this rule doesn't apply to me :wink: I don't think I came to USA because I wanted to. Like your parents sent you to Singapore to study, we have different reasons, not everybody leaves India because they didn't like India. So, I really don't know when or if I will leave USA.

Thanks, I'm glad we cud end this on a more pleasant note! :)
And aside, of course there r ppl. who leave India bcos they weren't fortunate enuff to get proper oppurtunities/employment etc. and not nec. bcos they din't like India....however, I've come across even ppl. who r well-off in India but then r not satisfied, saying tat they want more pay, 'better' quality of life etc. and target the US, thinking tat they can hav the best life there.....but its not nec. true......I've heard abt Indians who faced hardships even after settling down in the US....one of the most common ones for eg. being unemployment due to downsizing of companies. I imagine tat can be a really hard blow on ppl. who r cut off from the organisations!

[nirosha sen]

Hey guys, wherever people are, you can take the Indian out of India but not the India out of the Indian, Pa!! :)

So, don't feel bad if you are far flung. My husband always says, if you can survive in India, you'd survive anywhere else!! That's how strong and resilient we are as people, Pa!! :D

[Guyana]

Comming back to Haunt.

What Nirosha said today and on Jan. 17th and what Aravindhan said on Jan 19th., and some of the same things I would say.

Mainly, I wanted you guys to have a peep at what I look like (my avatar) after reading so many of my post over the years :-)

[nirosha sen]

Hey Guyana!! Glad to read a post from you, Pa!! How's life??? Do drop by to share your thoughts often!!

Let bygones be bygones and carry on hubbing Pa!! :D

[Guyana]

Sorry if I disappointed anyone by not having my avatar up as I thought. Its there now, however small it shows.


>>How's life??? <<

Well I have been treating it with allot of grace which has gotten me through a far way. Starting to have some enjoyment with some sorrow (passing of a close relative (father's brother while my father was undergoing a major surgery the same day of the death of his brother) who was only cremated about a week ago. Don't need any sympathy, as this is all part of life. I am also extremely busy as usual, but much more focused these days. It has been year back here, so, it took some time. Dob't want to get more personal than this for what I am sometime taken to be here.

Have another post to make in another thread. See you there soon.


Urme