Ilayaraja and AR Rahman - A Comparative Study

[complicateur]

interesting to read that ARR displaced Raja in you for some period :roll:

kaNNa yEn urutturInga? vazhi maRaththalum thisai thiruththalum vAzhkkayil nadappathu thAnE. :)


Very interesting to read your thoughts on the quote, especially the point about all this being "dependent on the mind functioning in a manner similar to a human mind."
Thanks equanimus. I find it funny that something is assigned superiority but is still expected to conform to understandability.

[sarna_blr]

interesting to read that ARR displaced Raja in you for some period :roll:

kaNNa yEn urutturInga? vazhi maRaththalum thisai thiruththalum vAzhkkayil nadappathu thAnE. :)

because IR displaced ARR inside me :)

[Roshan]

interesting to read that ARR displaced Raja in you for some period :roll:

kaNNa yEn urutturInga? vazhi maRaththalum thisai thiruththalum vAzhkkayil nadappathu thAnE. :)

because IR displaced ARR inside me :)

For me it was the other way ..with all due respect to IR's isai :)

[thamizhvaanan]

interesting to read that ARR displaced Raja in you for some period :roll:

kaNNa yEn urutturInga? vazhi maRaththalum thisai thiruththalum vAzhkkayil nadappathu thAnE. :)

because IR displaced ARR inside me :)

For me it was the other way ..with all due respect to IR's isai :)

Same here, as in IR rose to the level of being equal favourites with ARR but later realization dawned and now I know I prefer ARR's songs more than anything else. :)

[Roshan]

interesting to read that ARR displaced Raja in you for some period :roll:

kaNNa yEn urutturInga? vazhi maRaththalum thisai thiruththalum vAzhkkayil nadappathu thAnE. :)

because IR displaced ARR inside me :)

For me it was the other way ..with all due respect to IR's isai :)

Same here, as in IR rose to the level of being equal favourites with ARR but later realization dawned and now I know I prefer ARR's songs more than anything else. :)

8-) ARR fanskooda IR'kaaga saNdai pOtta kAlamum uNdu :P I still remember calling up an fm station and expressing my anger and frustration when one of the RJ's was going gaga over ARR. IppO athellAm nenechA :ashamed:

TV, signature nallA irukku :)

[MADDY]

Rahman - The man who easily displaced IR from my consciousness for about 7 years, until I rediscovered and returned to all things rAjA with a vengeance

my only question to Deepak - where do i find the "bodhi maram" where ARR fans(supposedly) go and turn themselves to IR fans? :) or is it too elusive for people like me :lol:

//btw, indha 1981/82 borns tholla thaanga mudiyala paa HUB-la.....thadukki vizhundha ivanga dhaan :P adiyen, LM, Honest, equa(?) and now compli(?) :P //

//Roshan, yehi hai right choice babyy aaahaaa :lol: yes, rahman doesent compose music the way it should be - a big mistake - his imagination is uncanny, my frnd who is a singer is still in awe how different is ARR from IR & rest in chord patterns.........he broke the entire pallavi-anupallavi-charanams or mukda-antra pattern in IFM....fusion-naa, ippadi dhaan irundhadha, eppadi venaalum pannalam-nnu maathhi - Manmohini from yuvvraaj - hindustani classical on trance beats saabbbbbbaaaa.....indha madhiri neraya thappu panni panni engala ellam paithhiyam aakkittaru//

[sarna_blr]

Rahman - The man who easily displaced IR from my consciousness for about 7 years, until I rediscovered and returned to all things rAjA with a vengeance

my only question to Deepak - where do i find the "bodhi maram" where ARR fans(supposedly) go and turn themselves to IR fans? :) or is it too elusive for people like me :lol:


neenga edhukku IR fan'aa maaranum :roll:

PS... I know that u asked to Deepak, but I am assuming u as an ex-guest and asking :)

[MADDY]

neenga edhukku IR fan'aa maaranum :roll:

i just said i wanted to find that tree......i dont have any plans for becoming IR fan in another 7 births atleast :) evalavu jenmathhu punniyamo - i was born in same era and same parliamentary constituency as ARRahman - indha nanri kadan-nna seluthhave 7 jenmam aaidum :)

[complicateur]

my only question to Deepak - where do i find the "bodhi maram" where ARR fans(supposedly) go and turn themselves to IR fans? :) or is it too elusive for people like me :lol:
Sudhir,
I hope I prefaced all my replies on music with the necessary IMOs and I feels. I definitely do not stipulate that music must be composed in anyway, but I prefer - always have and always will - acoustic music and live recording. I am critical even of rAjA and his current obsession with tinny synth sounds.
And I re-iterate what Sarna says above - ethukku mAraNum? Whatever I said was what I feel for rAjA's music. It is a result of the search for who I am. To paraphrase from GuNA and equanimus: "GnAnam enna bOthi maraththadiyilaya irukku, gnAnam manasula irukku". I hope no one misconstrues my notes on music as an attempt at proselytizing. Just a reflection of what gave me succor at a time of need.

[crajkumar_be]

hindustani classical on trance beats saabbbbbbaaaa.....
<Dig type="Nitpick">
Any 12 year old can "put" an alaap on any kind of beat (in fact 'fusion' nu thiriyara neraya peru adha thaan panrainga) and there are people who have done this and more earlier, be it trance or otherwise, like Talvin Singh (even leaving aside Shakti, IR etc aside). I do get your point, aana neenga kudutha description-a sonnen :razz:
Manmohini-ku munnadi 'Fanaa'-ve irukke!

</Dig>

[Roshan]

my only question to Deepak - where do i find the "bodhi maram" where ARR fans(supposedly) go and turn themselves to IR fans? :) or is it too elusive for people like me :lol:
Sudhir,
I hope I prefaced all my replies on music with the necessary IMOs and I feels. I definitely do not stipulate that music must be composed in anyway, but I prefer - always have and always will - acoustic music and live recording. I am critical even of rAjA and his current obsession with tinny synth sounds.

Adhu kAlathin kattAyam enRu ninaikkiREn. IR 90s'la vanthirunthA acoustic music, live recording ellAm paNNi iruppArA enbathu periya kELvi.



And I re-iterate what Sarna says above - ethukku mAraNum? Whatever I said was what I feel for rAjA's music. It is a result of the search for who I am. To paraphrase from GuNA and equanimus: "GnAnam enna bOthi maraththadiyilaya irukku, gnAnam manasula irukku" . I hope no one misconstrues my notes on music as an attempt at proselytizing. Just a reflection of what gave me succor at a time of need.

IdhaithAn namma thalaivar 'vAnam enakkoru bOthi maram'-nu solli irukkAr :)

[crajkumar_be]

Adhu kAlathin kattAyam enRu ninaikkiREn. IR 90s'la vanthirunthA acoustic music, live recording ellAm paNNi iruppArA enbathu periya kELvi.

Roshan,
Even Srikanth Deva CAN do acoustic work. adhukkAga compli (or any IR fan) ku avar favorite aiduvaara?

Sorry for answering out of turn, IR-enbadhaal badhil seyya munaindhen :)

[MADDY]

Sudhir,
I hope I prefaced all my replies on music with the necessary IMOs and I feels. I definitely do not stipulate that music must be composed in anyway, but I prefer - always have and always will - acoustic music and live recording. I am critical even of rAjA and his current obsession with tinny synth sounds.
And I re-iterate what Sarna says above - ethukku mAraNum? Whatever I said was what I feel for rAjA's music. It is a result of the search for who I am. To paraphrase from GuNA and equanimus: "GnAnam enna bOthi maraththadiyilaya irukku, gnAnam manasula irukku". I hope no one misconstrues my notes on music as an attempt at proselytizing. Just a reflection of what gave me succor at a time of need.

i really was curious to know where does the change happen - u must be the 50 or 51st person i have met in my life who has said that he was a ARR fan but realised IR's music and went to him........curiosity killed sudhir :wink: ofcourse, by god's grace, thalaivar is still blessed with lot of fans and love and support.....so not trying to trend any pattern here :)

ofcourse in music, Bala made me realise that everything is IMO and i feel only :bow:

[crajkumar_be]

Ayyayo Maddy, i didn't try to reinforce the hub mantra of adding IMO to your posts. All posts are obviously IOO.
I was just nitpicking on your description. I have already told you my craze for 'fanaa' and my fights with DJs and sundry over this song.
Rahman-fusion isaiya pathi kuraiva sollala, just added some context...

[complicateur]

Adhu kAlathin kattAyam enRu ninaikkiREn. IR 90s'la vanthirunthA acoustic music, live recording ellAm paNNi iruppArA enbathu periya kELvi.

Roshan,
Even Srikanth Deva CAN do acoustic work. adhukkAga compli (or any IR fan) ku avar favorite aiduvaara?

Sorry for answering out of turn, IR-enbadhaal badhil seyya munaindhen :)

Bala,
Thanks for sharing the burden. Yes that is very much the point. Even in terms of electronica there is quite a bit of trash floating out there. ellArum Rahman AyiduvAngaLA? As Guitar Prasanna said in some interview, it usually takes someone of rAjA's understanding [w.r.t to WCM] to talk about writing "invertible counterpoints on the 10th". [Don't ask me what that means, some research led me to this link (http://books.google.com/books?id=wj9y4OxGxGoC&pg=PA102&lpg=PA102&dq=invertible+counterpoints+on+the+10th&source=web&ots=F5QTn2Qknl&sig=VyP8ny4ofS4hbHIMlTAe3_8J27w&hl=en&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=1&ct=result) which I am still in the process of deciphering.]

[Roshan]

Adhu kAlathin kattAyam enRu ninaikkiREn. IR 90s'la vanthirunthA acoustic music, live recording ellAm paNNi iruppArA enbathu periya kELvi.

Roshan,
Even Srikanth Deva CAN do acoustic work. adhukkAga compli (or any IR fan) ku avar favorite aiduvaara?

Sorry for answering out of turn, IR-enbadhaal badhil seyya munaindhen :)

Bala, my response was to the bolded line of Depauk's response. Naan acoustic work thappunnu solla varala - but synth oru kuRRam enRu solla vanthathu thappunnu sonnEn. And he was making that comparison for a question related to ARR and not any tom, dick or harry. Adhaan koncham tension AyittEn. avarE ellOrum ARR aagi vida mudiyumAnnu appuRam solRaar. Hope you understood. illEnna vitturunga :P

[complicateur]

kuRRam kaNdu pidikka nAn nakkeeran-A? kuRRam enbathalla en vAtham. pidikkavillai enbathE en vAtham.

[Roshan]

kuRRam kaNdu pidikka nAn nakkeeran-A? kuRRam enbathalla en vAtham. pidikkavillai enbathE en vAtham.

Fine Deepauk. Understood :) I infact added a few lines to my previous post to Bala, before seeing this response of yours.

[MADDY]

Ayyayo Maddy, i didn't try to reinforce the hub mantra of adding IMO to your posts. All posts are obviously IOO.
I was just nitpicking on your description. I have already told you my craze for 'fanaa' and my fights with DJs and sundry over this song.
Rahman-fusion isaiya pathi kuraiva sollala, just added some context...

illa - all i meant was ur points regarding defining one's taste as per own feelings instead of a collective feeling pathhi dhaan ingu sonnen......i didnt relate this to ur comment on manmohini :)

yes, my description was a bit misleading - manmohini yen classic-nnu naa innum nalla solli irukkalaam :) to borrow terms from hub periyavaas - the juxtaposition of hindustani vocals, synth riffs, with trance was heavenly which made it special

[complicateur]

Sudhir - avaLO thAn kELviyA? - nInga romba nallavar :)

[MADDY]

Sudhir - avaLO thAn kELviyA?

:lol: yes.....i could have avoided some sarcasm :oops:

[thamizhvaanan]

8-) ARR fanskooda IR'kaaga saNdai pOtta kAlamum uNdu :P I still remember calling up an fm station and expressing my anger and frustration when one of the RJ's was going gaga over ARR. IppO athellAm nenechA :ashamed:

TV, signature nallA irukku :)

Well, there exists an irritating preconception among IR fans that those who prefer ARR over IR have not completely "understood" the depth of IR's music. While there is no doubt of IR's genius and brilliance of his songs, there exists a league who do appreciate IR's music for all that it has to offer, but yet prefer ARR's output.

Maddy, there is a slight advantage for old songs over new songs :wink: . They kind of inspires extra awe when we think that it belonged to a different era. So when one ruminates through a old collection there is a different kind of impact. (None of these factors takes any credit away from the brilliance of the creation tho :P). So its not surprising for you to have met those 51 guys. Doesn't mean that there is some mysterious factor capable of converting ARR fan into a IR fan :P ... ellaa one off case nu dismiss pannidalaam :P

I could linger over the same topic for long, aana oru digression ku idhey too much :P Sorry Compli :oops:

P.S: Roshan, my signature is a Groucho marx quote :)

[complicateur]

So its not surprising for you to have met those 51 guys. Doesn't mean that there is some mysterious factor capable of converting ARR fan into a IR fan :P ... ellaa one off case nu dismiss pannidalaam :P
Thamizh,
I think you are also missing a small section in the diaspora. The surface level listener who doesn't have more than a passing interest in the intricacies or details. While vociferously declaring themselves fans of ARR/rAjA they may be unable to articulate why. IMO these are the people who are most likely to vacillate. Also I would like to add that rose-tinted nostalgia glasses have very little to do with me liking rAjA. :)

[Roshan]

I could linger over the same topic for long, aana oru digression ku idhey too much :P Sorry Compli :oops:

ingEyum adhE - en saarpilum - Sorry Deepauk :oops:



P.S: Roshan, my signature is a Groucho marx quote :)

NallA irukku - like that 'problem with work..' signature mAthiri :)

[sarna_blr]

So its not surprising for you to have met those 51 guys. Doesn't mean that there is some mysterious factor capable of converting ARR fan into a IR fan :P ... ellaa one off case nu dismiss pannidalaam :P
Thamizh,
I think you are also missing a small section in the diaspora. The surface level listener who doesn't have more than a passing interest in the intricacies or details. While vociferously declaring themselves fans of ARR/rAjA they may be unable to articulate why. IMO these are the people who are most likely to vacillate. Also I would like to add that rose-tinted nostalgia glasses have very little to do with me liking rAjA. :)

vociferously - kuruttuththanamaa :? sariya :roll:

articulate - express :)

vacillate - fluctuate - aatthula oru kaalu sEththula oru kaal :roll:

Deepauk, purinja maadhiri irukku :? puriyaadha maadhiri irukku :roll: purinjum puriyaamalumirukku :confused2: puriyaamalum purinjirukku :lol2: purinjadhu yEn puriyaamalE irukkunu theriyala :oops: puriyaadhadhu yEn purinja maadhiri irukkunu theriyala :oops2:

[thamizhvaanan]

So its not surprising for you to have met those 51 guys. Doesn't mean that there is some mysterious factor capable of converting ARR fan into a IR fan :P ... ellaa one off case nu dismiss pannidalaam :P
Thamizh,
I think you are also missing a small section in the diaspora. The surface level listener who doesn't have more than a passing interest in the intricacies or details. While vociferously declaring themselves fans of ARR/rAjA they may be unable to articulate why. IMO these are the people who are most likely to vacillate.
Yup, you are right. Those who get into such intricacies will note that the taste element in ARR's music belongs to a different dimension compared to IR's music(not totally orthogonal, but still not comparable). My preference stems from the fact that ARR covers more dimensions of my musical appreciation than IR does.

Music doesn't begin and end with either IR or ARR, one should understand that. One advantage with ARR is that he is still open, and probable to expand his scope in various musical directions, whereas IR has already defined his borders IMHO.

But I am not sure about your second point. One need not be able to articulate why something appeals to them. Can a mother articulate why she feels affection towards her child? One can still describe his taste in words, but that won't be complete neither would it describe exactly how he is moved by that particular piece of art.

[crajkumar_be]

Adhu kAlathin kattAyam enRu ninaikkiREn. IR 90s'la vanthirunthA acoustic music, live recording ellAm paNNi iruppArA enbathu periya kELvi.

Roshan,
Even Srikanth Deva CAN do acoustic work. adhukkAga compli (or any IR fan) ku avar favorite aiduvaara?

Sorry for answering out of turn, IR-enbadhaal badhil seyya munaindhen :)

Bala, my response was to the bolded line of Depauk's response. Naan acoustic work thappunnu solla varala - but synth oru kuRRam enRu solla vanthathu thappunnu sonnEn. And he was making that comparison for a question related to ARR and not any tom, dick or harry. Adhaan koncham tension AyittEn. avarE ellOrum ARR aagi vida mudiyumAnnu appuRam solRaar. Hope you understood. illEnna vitturunga :P
Roshan,
[Just wanted to add these points. I did read your previous post. This is also in response to TV's post]
Neenga acoustic-a kutram nu sonnadha naan sollala. Your post implied that IR *happened* to use acoustic and live music as he was a product of his times (like anyone else).
My point is that, (even at the risk of me sounding like speaking for compli again) while we have our preference as to what kind of music we love the most (though that may not be the only music we love), it all boils down to how a composer does whatever he is doing, acoustic or otherwise. What's the output.
It should be noted here that IR has also ventured into synth (with pleasing results) in the 80s itself.
I differ from compli in that i don't necessarily always prefer acoustic over others. For instance, i love the sound of electric guitar. So, even in that sense, Raaja has not been entirely acoustic (even while not using synth). He has sizzled with his electric guitar.
For compli, it may so happen that the acoustic aspect is what he prefers the most.



Well, there exists an irritating preconception among IR fans that those who prefer ARR over IR have not completely "understood" the depth of IR's music. While there is no doubt of IR's genius and brilliance of his songs, there exists a league who do appreciate IR's music for all that it has to offer, but yet prefer ARR's output.

Irukkathaanga seyyum, just like there are many Rahman fans for whom contemporary popular music is the only "western" music :)



Music doesn't begin and end with either IR or ARR, one should understand that. One advantage with ARR is that he is still open, and probable to expand his scope in various musical directions, whereas IR has already defined his borders IMHO.

IR vs ARR! :razz:
That can be Ilaiyaraaja's advantage over Rahman! Rooted in context and reaching depths where there connection between the artist and the listener doesn't get any closer than this! How about it?
You want Ilaiyaraaja to do a hip-hop meets bhangra meets blue grass to "prove" (NOW) that he has expanded boundaries? What has he been doing all this while? And you get offended when some IR fan tells you you haven't explored his repertoire fully! What is his age and what is Rahman's?

Mumbai Express (at this age)? And Thiruvasagam does not count in the list of "expanding borders" just because it is 'local'? Or does it always have to be pan-Indian or contemporary western music?

[complicateur]

vociferously - kuruttuththanamaa :? sariya :roll:
articulate - express :)
vacillate - fluctuate - aatthula oru kaalu sEththula oru kaal :roll:
vociferously - aaravaaramaaga, vacillate - nilaiyAna karuththillAmal


Deepauk, purinja maadhiri irukku :? puriyaadha maadhiri irukku :roll: purinjum puriyaamalumirukku :confused2: puriyaamalum purinjirukku :lol2: purinjadhu yEn puriyaamalE irukkunu theriyala :oops: puriyaadhadhu yEn purinja maadhiri irukkunu theriyala :oops2:
En pEra vechchE purinjukka mAttIngaLA? :)



Music doesn't begin and end with either IR or ARR, one should understand that. One advantage with ARR is that he is still open, and probable to expand his scope in various musical directions, whereas IR has already defined his borders IMHO.

But I am not sure about your second point. One need not be able to articulate why something appeals to them. Can a mother articulate why she feels affection towards her child? One can still describe his taste in words, but that won't be complete neither would it describe exactly how he is moved by that particular piece of art.
What I meant by a lack of articulation is something that stems from the lack of understanding ones own "implicit connections" I referred to earlier. It is understanding oneself rather than the art.
And I am not sure about IR having set his borders (either in space or time). But anyway already digressed quite a bit.
Bala makes a very valid point about rAjA's rootedness. And it is not the rootedness to milieu - I mean the rootedness to the origins of why music was created.

[P_R]

I think you are also missing a small section in the diaspora. The surface level listener who doesn't have more than a passing interest in the intricacies or details. While vociferously declaring themselves fans of ARR/rAjA they may be unable to articulate why. IMO these are the people who are most likely to vacillate. For Sale ! Bids accepted from either party. :noteeth:


I would like to add that rose-tinted nostalgia glasses have very little to do with me liking rAjA. Nowadays, I am not able to convince myself that my preferences arch beyond the nostalgic element. But when talking to folks like Compli, I feel that I am able to sacrilege without compuction as above, only because my ear is quite untrained to the nuances of music (I just busted getting a good bid from one side).

[complicateur]

He has sizzled with his electric guitar.
For compli, it may so happen that the acoustic aspect is what he prefers the most.
Another valid point - case in point muththAduthE muththAduthE vAnam from thanga magan. Very very catchy. However it does not hold to me the connection of rAththiryil pUththirukkum from the same album.

PR - nInga vithivilakku. You listened most intently as I thrust my araivEkkAdu theories on you. :)

[crajkumar_be]

A last point :razz:

Film music is primarily not about whether the MD uses jazz, rock, carnatic for a particular scene or a song. It is firstly about how the music/song evokes the feel of the situation and facilitates the maker-audience relationship. Genre is important, no doubt, but it is more as a test of craft and is always with the objective of achieving the primary

[Roshan]

Digress aanalum nalla discussions :)

Deepauk - muthAduthE muthAduthE vaanam is from Nallavanukku Nallavan illaiyA ? :?

[thamizhvaanan]

IR vs ARR! :razz:
That can be Ilaiyaraaja's advantage over Rahman! Rooted in context and reaching depths where there connection between the artist and the listener doesn't get any closer than this! How about it?
lol.. but CR , I dont get what you are saying here :P

You want Ilaiyaraaja to do a hip-hop meets bhangra meets blue grass to "prove" (NOW) that he has expanded boundaries? What has he been doing all this while? And you get offended when some IR fan tells you you haven't explored his repertoire fully! What is his age and what is Rahman's?
No, I don't want him to do anything. Why are we getting this question of proving something :huh: It is just a matter of what we can expect from person A compared to person B. My contention is that person A is more likely and open to be diverse than person B.

Listen to Only time (http://in.youtube.com/watch?v=7ABfV5wB9TE)by Enya. It might put a musicologist to sleep, not much details to ponder over, no elaborate passages of composing virtuosity.. yet the song can make the listener feel like he is floating two feet above the ground. The question is, will raja attempt something like this. He might be able to do it even in his sleep, but will he?

Now something you can relate to much better :) . Listen to this (http://in.youtube.com/watch?v=AXQg7Oir1Bg). Now tell me honestly, do you expect IR to fool around with such a montage of sounds and make music out of it. ARR is renowned for making music out of sounds :cool: . Would you dare to say it is not music? Is it not an aspect of music that is missing from Person B? :P

It is a question of what he is willing to do and what he is not, and also how he does it. Please don't think that I underestimate the extent to which IR explored various genres. I never suggested that he didnt try jazz or blues, but music is a wide ocean without any shores and still there are aspects of it untouched. In IR's case the exploration is no longer happening and to that extent I look forward to a ARR song with more expectation than IR song. I would never dare to say ARR > IR, just that my like for ARR > my like for IR .

Hope it solves the case :)

[thamizhvaanan]

A last point :razz:

Film music is primarily not about whether the MD uses jazz, rock, carnatic for a particular scene or a song. It is firstly about how the music/song evokes the feel of the situation and facilitates the maker-audience relationship. Genre is important, no doubt, but it is more as a test of craft and is always with the objective of achieving the primary

True.. my primary is listening satisfaction. I don't have patience for films, leave alone noticing the finer aspects of it :oops:

[complicateur]

Now tell me honestly, do you expect IR to fool around with such a montage of sounds and make music out of it. ARR is renowned for making music out of sounds :cool: .
You're asking this of a man who slapped his thigh with just the right intonation to create the sound of batasandals hitting tar road to keep beat for an entire song???? The man who knows how to use baselines to give the entire song a "wet" feel??? Seriously thamizh, one must delve before makinggross generalizations.

[thamizhvaanan]

Now tell me honestly, do you expect IR to fool around with such a montage of sounds and make music out of it. ARR is renowned for making music out of sounds :cool: .
You're asking this of a man who slapped his thigh with just the right intonation to create the sound of batasandals hitting tar road to keep beat for an entire song???? The man who knows how to use baselines to give the entire song a "wet" feel??? Seriously thamizh, one must delve before makinggross generalizations.

Hmmm.. I wasn't trying to generalize there :? . But sorry, we are talking about different things here. I still maintain that what I expect is not Raja's forte or his type of music.

Btwn, could you please explain that sandal tidbit more. Never heard of it.. which song is it?

[crajkumar_be]

IR vs ARR! :razz:
That can be Ilaiyaraaja's advantage over Rahman! Rooted in context and reaching depths where there connection between the artist and the listener doesn't get any closer than this! How about it?
lol.. but CR , I dont get what you are saying here :P


TV,
Let me give an example.

1. "yArO yArO dI"
2. SOK "Ambasaudram" song
I felt both these songs were out of place (i think they are very good as 'songs' per se). And no wonder yAro di fit like a glove when the film was remade in Hindi.
This is what i meant when i said IR songs are rooted.

On the other side, just popped off my mind right now. Guna - "unnai naan ariven". Check out the transformations the song goes through and the visuals and the setting.

Rooted in context - milieu (not always), genre/style as required by the situation.
Regarding the connection bit, its all the more subjective though. Song ku enna emotion venum? adha *perfect*-a kudukkardhula ivara minja yaaru? Note the emphasis on rootedness and connection.

The point i'm trying to make here is depending on whose fan you are, you can turn this argument either way.
e.g. A N.Indian can "relate to" (yuck, i hate this phrase! is there a better way of expressing the same meaning?) many of Rahman's Thamizh songs. The pan Indian feel and sound is his advantage.


As for the rest of your post, i simply don't get it. I have a blanket question Why?



No, I don't want him to do anything. Why are we getting this question of proving something :huh: It is just a matter of what we can expect from person A compared to person B. My contention is that person A is more likely and open to be diverse than person B.

You didn't say that. You said Person B has stopped expanding his boudnaries :)
[And 'expanding boundaries' is something which we differ on]



Listen to Only time (http://in.youtube.com/watch?v=7ABfV5wB9TE)by Enya. It might put a musicologist to sleep, not much details to ponder over, no elaborate passages of composing virtuosity.. yet the song can make the listener feel like he is floating two feet above the ground. The question is, will raja attempt something like this. He might be able to do it even in his sleep, but will he?

Well, WHY should he? I mean i can cite an arbit song and ask "Will Rahman do something like this"? What's the point? :huh:



Now something you can relate to much better :) . Listen to this (http://in.youtube.com/watch?v=AXQg7Oir1Bg). Now tell me honestly, do you expect IR to fool around with such a montage of sounds and make music out of it. ARR is renowned for making music out of sounds :cool: . Would you dare to say it is not music? Is it not an aspect of music that is missing from Person B? :P

So, the issue is making music out of 'sounds'? (Adding to compli's examples)
"Paruvame Pudhiya Paadal Paadu" [apart from the footsteps, one can die fot the ludes]
"Punjai Undu Nanjai Undu" (starts off with the sounds of axe cutting wood)
"Paakku Vethala" (Prelude)
"Saandhu Pottu" (Silambatha suthumbothu varra 'woosh')
"Nothing But Wind" (Forgot the track name. Cacophony - iyer odhufying slokams, trains, birds chirping etc etc and some synth sounds)
....
...
Again, what's the point?



It is a question of what he is willing to do and what he is not, and also how he does it. Please don't think that I underestimate the extent to which IR explored various genres. I never suggested that he didnt try jazz or blues, but music is a wide ocean without any shores and still there are aspects of it untouched. In IR's case the exploration is no longer happening and to that extent I look forward to a ARR song with more expectation than IR song. I would never dare to say ARR > IR, just that my like for ARR > my like for IR .

Hope it solves the case :)
1. Like i've mentioned, if you think Mumbai Express and Thiruvasagam are not "exploarations" enough i have nothing much to say
2. Like i said you are comparing Rahman exploring midway in his career and IR at the fag end of his career. Not fair
3. Even if one concedes that Rahman's exploration score is > IR's we go back to the first point in my reply and my earlier post :razz:

[complicateur]

I'm sure you've heard it thamizh - paruvamE puthiya pAdal pAdu - nenjaththai kiLLAthE. That was an impulsive post - Was just that I essentially feel rAjA has a very good grasp of sound and that is what makes him who he is to me. The generalization was with respect to your insinuation that rAjA has not used alternative sounds.
Bala has mentioned some very notable examples as well and said accurately that we are comparing artiste's who are currently in different stages of their ouvre'.

[crajkumar_be]

Compli mentioned bass:
Show me one composer in the world who revolutionized the purpose and usage of bass guitar and bass lines? He redefined an instrument!

And note that i haven't even started on BGM. That's a no contest anyway

[MADDY]

thalaivar is a pioneer in experiment and making music out of sound - late h.sridhar himself acknowledged that..........he used to retain screeching sounds due to rust in instruments to create a new sound :bow:

yes, when people want him to compose symphony, acoustic, natural instruments, orchestra, rock type songs only - they get disappointed..........indha complaints pala murai kettachu, :)

[MADDY]

And note that i haven't even started on BGM. That's a no contest anyway

Bala, thalaivar has given excellent BGMs for projects which deserved it........RDB, Swades, TLOBS ellam legendary background scores.....i'm hearing SDM is his best - i dont think Danny Boyle chose him only for his songs :P this is another lame accusation thrown at ARR always

[MADDY]

got to agree that i dont agree to the arguements that IR doesent experiment as much as ARR :) ......i think it needs a completely different set of ideologies to analyse these 2 guys.......

[Shakthiprabha.]

got to agree that i dont agree to the arguements that IR doesent experiment as much as ARR :) ......i think it needs a completely different set of ideologies to analyse these 2 guys.......

:bow: Finally!

[HonestRaj]

Good Discussions !!!

[Roshan]

IR vs ARR! :razz:
That can be Ilaiyaraaja's advantage over Rahman! Rooted in context and reaching depths where there connection between the artist and the listener doesn't get any closer than this! How about it?
lol.. but CR , I dont get what you are saying here :P


TV,
Let me give an example.

1. "yArO yArO dI"
2. SOK "Ambasaudram" song
I felt both these songs were out of place (i think they are very good as 'songs' per se). And no wonder yAro di fit like a glove when the film was remade in Hindi.
This is what i meant when i said IR songs are rooted.

Bala, how can you blame the MD alone for this? ippadi examples kodukkuRathA irunthA ellArukkum kodukkalAm. I think Director should be held responsible for this. Karuthamma, Kizhakku CheemaiyilE ithellAm enna?

[P_R]

Bala, how can you blame the MD alone for this? ippadi examples kodukkuRathA irunthA ellArukkum kodukkalAm. I think Director should be held responsible for this. Karuthamma, Kizhakku CheemaiyilE ithellAm enna?

Enna dA ambAsamudram paattu paththi post paNNI 10 nimisham aachchu...ungaLai kaaNOmEnnu ninaichchEn ;-)

[HonestRaj]

Bala, how can you blame the MD alone for this? ippadi examples kodukkuRathA irunthA ellArukkum kodukkalAm. I think Director should be held responsible for this. Karuthamma, Kizhakku CheemaiyilE ithellAm enna?

Enna dA ambAsamudram paattu paththi post paNNI 10 nimisham aachchu...ungaLai kaaNOmEnnu ninaichchEn ;-)

yean.. ambasamudrathula yedhavadhu edam vangi irukkangala?

[MADDY]

got to agree that i dont agree to the arguements that IR doesent experiment as much as ARR :) ......i think it needs a completely different set of ideologies to analyse these 2 guys.......

:bow: Finally!

ARR fans are peace loving people........his music mellows us down, softens us.........infact if u look back at history, the kind of intimidation we got from IR fans, we are not showing that to HJ or u1 fans now..........even in HUB, provokal is always from IR fans side - ARR fans, apart from me, never start a unneccessary arguement........people say we dont know music thats y we dont start arguements, but we know where our heart is

[Roshan]

Bala, how can you blame the MD alone for this? ippadi examples kodukkuRathA irunthA ellArukkum kodukkalAm. I think Director should be held responsible for this. Karuthamma, Kizhakku CheemaiyilE ithellAm enna?

Enna dA ambAsamudram paattu paththi post paNNI 10 nimisham aachchu...ungaLai kaaNOmEnnu ninaichchEn ;-)

:mrgreen: In fact I dont have any complaints regarding that too in terms of fitting according to the situation. yArO yArOdi - othukkuREn.

[P_R]

sari equanimus-ai koopidunga...panjAyaththai aarambikkalAm

prAdhu kuduthavan
biscOthu aka bigilu kuduththavan ellAm wait paNNittu irukkOm

[Roshan]

got to agree that i dont agree to the arguements that IR doesent experiment as much as ARR :) ......i think it needs a completely different set of ideologies to analyse these 2 guys.......

:bow: Finally!

ARR fans are peace loving people........his music mellows us down, softens us.........infact if u look back at history, the kind of intimidation we got from IR fans, we are not showing that to HJ or u1 fans now..........even in HUB, provokal is always from IR fans side - ARR fans, apart from me, never start a unneccessary arguement........people say we dont know music thats y we dont start arguements, but we know where our heart is

IR fans provoke paNRatheyAvathu thAngikkalAm - avangaLukku thaguthi irukku - but IR family fans provoke paNRathuthAn romba kodumaiyAna vishayam intha hubla :evil:

[Wibha]

ARR fans are peace loving people........his music mellows us down, softens us.........infact if u look back at history, the kind of intimidation we got from IR fans, we are not showing that to HJ or u1 fans now..........even in HUB, provokal is always from IR fans side - ARR fans, apart from me, never start a unneccessary arguement........people say we dont know music thats y we dont start arguements, but we know where our heart is

:)

[equanimus]

sari equanimus-ai koopidunga...panjAyaththai aarambikkalAm

prAdhu kuduthavan
biscOthu aka bigilu kuduththavan ellAm wait paNNittu irukkOm
biskOththu aNNE, udanE varavum. Dilli.

[crajkumar_be]

Bala, how can you blame the MD alone for this? ippadi examples kodukkuRathA irunthA ellArukkum kodukkalAm. I think Director should be held responsible for this. Karuthamma, Kizhakku CheemaiyilE ithellAm enna?
I think you got me wrong because i didn't explain it well enough :)
"Out of place" as in, not rooted enough.
Kizhakku Cheemayile is an example of being more rooted and thats exactly why i didnt mention it. Rahman's case la (IMO podren, yaarum kovikkadheenga), sila pala paadalgal *nalla* irukkum, aana lighta rooted a irukkaadhu. This has nothing to do with the director (unless the director wanted the song to sound a certain way)

Eq once countered this point of mine once. Idhellam explain panna varla. "feel" dhaan panna mudiyum :razz:

[Shakthiprabha.]

Eq once countered this point of mine once. Idhellam explain panna varla. "feel" dhaan panna mudiyum :razz:

EXACTLY!! Thats why it should be better left at that!

[crajkumar_be]

ARR fans are peace loving people........his music mellows us down, softens us.........infact if u look back at history, the kind of intimidation we got from IR fans, we are not showing that to HJ or u1 fans now..........even in HUB, provokal is always from IR fans side - ARR fans, apart from me, never start a unneccessary arguement........people say we dont know music thats y we dont start arguements, but we know where our heart is
"ungalukku theriyadhadhilla.. padhinettu jatti.. " :)

Ippo naama enna serious-a pesittom? Just little games of my daddy's stronger. Karuthu parimaatram dhaane? Urayaadal and stuff, you know

[thamizhvaanan]

Sorry guys, kadamai kurikituduchu (Roshan, nalla neram pathu neenga ennoda pazhaya signature remind paneenga :P )


As for the rest of your post, i simply don't get it. I have a blanket question Why?

:lol: CR anney, I agree. Me trying to list "has not done this" songs is as futile as you trying to convince me that IR has done "everything". I know very well that you will continue to enjoy ARR's music and I don't have to prove to everyone that I love IR's songs. :)




It is a question of what he is willing to do and what he is not, and also how he does it. Please don't think that I underestimate the extent to which IR explored various genres. I never suggested that he didnt try jazz or blues, but music is a wide ocean without any shores and still there are aspects of it untouched. In IR's case the exploration is no longer happening and to that extent I look forward to a ARR song with more expectation than IR song. I would never dare to say ARR > IR, just that my like for ARR > my like for IR .

Hope it solves the case :)
1. Like i've mentioned, if you think Mumbai Express and Thiruvasagam are not "exploarations" enough i have nothing much to say
2. Like i said you are comparing Rahman exploring midway in his career and IR at the fag end of his career. Not fair
3. Even if one concedes that Rahman's exploration score is > IR's we go back to the first point in my reply and my earlier post :razz:

1. Normal'a kElviya quote panni badhil poduvaanga.. neenga badhil'a quote panni kElvi kettirukeenga :lol: Read my words again. I have mentioned that I don't undermine IR experimentation factor in IR's music. What I was trying to point out is that, there is a whole world of sound/music outside what IR has done which IR fans refuse to acknowledge. Whatever we query we come up with is met with a cliched reply "IR has already done it already". Clearly the kind of music I spoke of in "Money" song is not the same as clapping of hands or slapping of thighs, yet we are tempted to fit those musical expectations into what IR has already done.

2. Why do you want to bring in so many factors viz. the stage of career, the kind of technology available, precursors in music field etc., etc., and complicate things. Can't we isolate the music alone and appreciate it? In simple words, when I enter a music shop, I wouldn't even blink before deciding whose albums to buy and that is what matters.

3. Again I hope I didn't blurt that ARR has explored more than IR. I am not qualified to rubberstamp such facts. The thing is that he is more likely to do a lot of variety and he has the ability and light head to adapt to deliver any kind of music. That is one reason why I look forward to his music more.

Why did this discussion arise? :confused2: Because I was trying to tell that all those who prefer ARR need not be the one's who didn't pay enough attention to IR's songs :roll:

[thamizhvaanan]

ARR fans are peace loving people........his music mellows us down, softens us.........infact if u look back at history, the kind of intimidation we got from IR fans, we are not showing that to HJ or u1 fans now..........even in HUB, provokal is always from IR fans side - ARR fans, apart from me, never start a unneccessary arguement........people say we dont know music thats y we dont start arguements, but we know where our heart is
"ungalukku theriyadhadhilla.. padhinettu jatti.. " :)

Ippo naama enna serious-a pesittom? Just little games of my daddy's stronger. Karuthu parimaatram dhaane? Urayaadal and stuff, you know

To Bala and Compli's credit they were justifying their side but rarely spoke ill of ARR. Whereas I was hellbent on nitpicking :oops: That was not my real intent though. :)

[MADDY]

ARR fans are peace loving people........his music mellows us down, softens us.........infact if u look back at history, the kind of intimidation we got from IR fans, we are not showing that to HJ or u1 fans now..........even in HUB, provokal is always from IR fans side - ARR fans, apart from me, never start a unneccessary arguement........people say we dont know music thats y we dont start arguements, but we know where our heart is
"ungalukku theriyadhadhilla.. padhinettu jatti.. " :)

Ippo naama enna serious-a pesittom? Just little games of my daddy's stronger. Karuthu parimaatram dhaane? Urayaadal and stuff, you know

''adhula paarunga, yen pasangalakku en alavukku perundhanmai kedaiyadhu''

sure bala - i think it was not meant for this arguement........i said it for SP who thought we realised something now.......ARR fans idhellam eppayo realise pannittaangannu sonnen - 'nyayam' nandhakumar, 'dharmam' dhandapani ellam enga saadhikkara pasanga-nnu solla vandhen :P

[Shakthiprabha.]

sure bala - i think it was not meant for this arguement........i said it for SP who thought we realised something now.......ARR fans idhellam eppayo realise pannittaangannu sonnen - 'nyayam' nandhakumar, 'dharmam' dhandapani ellam enga saadhikkara pasanga-nnu solla vandhen :P

Whether it is arr fans or ir fans or rajni kamal fans or ANY celebrity fans vs his or her rival, elaar fans-um niraiya realise panraanga, ippo illai...EPPAYO pannitaanga, irunthaalum appo appo discussions, enna iruthaalum enga..."ivanga" mathiri varathu nnu sollikarathu, then again marupadiyum realisation dawn aaguthu, that all these are individual tastes and preferences nnu.

ithellam oru vattam thanE :)

[thamizhvaanan]

Nowadays, I am not able to convince myself that my preferences arch beyond the nostalgic element. But when talking to folks like Compli, I feel that I am able to sacrilege without compuction as above, only because my ear is quite untrained to the nuances of music (I just busted getting a good bid from one side).

PR, could you please translate to english :P

[thilak4life]

only because my ear is quite untrained to the nuances of music.

If you're nihilistic towards this, like myself, you might not perceive it as sacrilege. Pardon the desecration, The evaluation of music is strictly arbitrary, says I.

[Roshan]

Nowadays, I am not able to convince myself that my preferences arch beyond the nostalgic element. But when talking to folks like Compli, I feel that I am able to sacrilege without compuction as above, only because my ear is quite untrained to the nuances of music (I just busted getting a good bid from one side).

PR, could you please translate to english :P

:)

athOda sErthu ithaiyum yArAvathu English'la translate paNNidunga :mrgreen:


If you're nihilistic towards this, like myself, you might not perceive it as sacrilege. Pardon the desecration, The evaluation of music is strictly arbitrary, says I.

[MADDY]

Nowadays, I am not able to convince myself that my preferences arch beyond the nostalgic element. But when talking to folks like Compli, I feel that I am able to sacrilege without compuction as above, only because my ear is quite untrained to the nuances of music (I just busted getting a good bid from one side).

PR, could you please translate to english :P

:)

athOda sErthu ithaiyum yArAvathu English'la translate paNNidunga :mrgreen:


If you're nihilistic towards this, like myself, you might not perceive it as sacrilege. Pardon the desecration, The evaluation of music is strictly arbitrary, says I.

p1: indha vyadhiya guna paduthhave mudiyaadha doctor
doc: indha vyadhikku oru operation pannanum, aana adhu amerikka-la dhaan panna mudiyum.........

//just kidding guys - sorry if it sounds offensive//

[Shakthiprabha.]

The difference between reading

"THE HINDU" and "TIMES" :D

[pavalamani pragasam]

ippO intha reNdula ethai culprit-aa suttuRaanga? :roll:

[Roshan]

The difference between reading

"THE HINDU" and "TIMES" :D

But rendumE puriyuRa mAthirithAn irukkum. Only in hub I experience such deciphering difficulties :P

[Shakthiprabha.]

Roshan,

Ive always found "The Hindu", would have technically rare usages :D, with abundant creative writing, where as 'Times' stick to normal communications, keeping no dissapointments for creavitity.

ithelaam sila perukku thaana varuthu :D

All of my cousins write this way (in our yahoo groups closely held), so I am kinda used to these kinda readings, however I do keep some dictionary sites opened :lol2: to keep up with pace few times :lol2:

[HonestRaj]

The difference between reading

"THE HINDU" and "TIMES" :D

But rendumE puriyuRa mAthirithAn irukkum. Only in hub I experience such deciphering difficulties :P

unnai solli kutramillai
ennai solli kutramillai
kaalam seidha koalamadi
kadavul seidha kutramadi




//just kidding guys - sorry if it sounds offensive//

yes.. nanum :)

[Roshan]

Roshan,

Ive always found "The Hindu", would have technically rare usages :D, with abundant creative writing, where as 'Times' stick to normal communications, keeping no dissapointments for creavitity.

ithelaam sila perukku thaana varuthu :D

All of my cousins write this way (in our yahoo groups closely held), so I am kinda used to these kinda readings, however I do keep some dictionary sites opened :lol2: to keep up with pace few times :lol2:

Naanga Officela vElaiyum pAthuttu hubbing'um paNRathE romba siramam idhula dictionary refer paNNi post padikkiRa aLavukku porumaiyum illa - time'um illa. So most of the posts choice'la vittuRuvEn :oops:. Hub meet'pO choice'la vidapadum postkaL paRRi rombavE discuss paNNOm. pala uNmaigaL veLichathukku vanthuchu appO ;)

[Shakthiprabha.]

:lol:

[complicateur]

Deepauk - muthAduthE muthAduthE vaanam is from Nallavanukku Nallavan illaiyA ? :?
Yes avasaraththula thappA type paNNitEn. I meant to compare it with chittukku cehlla chitukku.
Sarna kELvi ellAm overA?

[P_R]

Nowadays, I am not able to convince myself that my preferences arch beyond the nostalgic element. But when talking to folks like Compli, I feel that I am able to sacrilege without compuction as above, only because my ear is quite untrained to the nuances of music (I just busted getting a good bid from one side).

PR, could you please translate to english :P

I will try..

Deepauk said that his preference for IR cannot be simply listed under nostalgia.

I was responding to that. I would like to believe that my preference for IR is also 'objective' and does not owe much to nostalgia. But of late I am not so convinced about that myself.

To say so is probably quite sacrilegious. But I am able to commit that sacrilege without guilt because I am not a nuanced listener of music. If I was indeed as careful and deep listener -like compli - perhaps I may appreciate IR more than I do now.

But by saying so I seem to suggest that "if I were learned I would indeed prefer IR without a vacillating mind". That implies that it is only my "lack of depth" in my mind that even makes me consider ARR and IR on the comparable plane.This statement is likely to come across as quite unacceptable to ARR fans who deem him equally technically accomplished.

As I had put my soul up for sale at the beginning of my post, I realized that by the end of my post I had ruined my chance of receiving a bid from the ARR camp.

poosunaapla sollalAm-nu pAththA vidamAtteengaLE :twisted:

[MADDY]

As I had put my soul up for sale at the beginning of my post, I realized that by the end of my post I had ruined my chance of receiving a bid from the ARR camp.

i always knew u were a IR fan - no surprises...... :) i'm actually surprised that u didnt know that we knew it already :roll:

[P_R]

i always knew u were a IR fan - no surprises...... :) ennanga idhu.....enakkE ippollAm sandhEgamA irukku....appidinnu 2 post-A ezhudhikkittu irukkEn...

EdhO oru group-la,categorize paNNa sari.

SVS: enna pandhayam ?
DuryOdhanan: ennaiyum sErththu nooru kauravargaL
SVS: kauravargaL unnai sErththuppAngaLA ?

[thilak4life]

SVS: enna pandhayam ?
DuryOdhanan: ennaiyum sErththu nooru kauravargaL
SVS: kauravargaL unnai sErththuppAngaLA ?

:lol2:

[thilak4life]

Maddy, you could have proven him wrong, and offered him an invite to join ARR group. :)

[thilak4life]

ARR fanskooda IR'kaaga saNdai pOtta kAlamum uNdu :P

Good times. :D

[complicateur]

[tscii:ce47c8ced5]

1. Normal'a kElviya quote panni badhil poduvaanga.. neenga badhil'a quote panni kElvi kettirukeenga :lol: Read my words again. I have mentioned that I don't undermine IR experimentation factor in IR's music. What I was trying to point out is that, there is a whole world of sound/music outside what IR has done which IR fans refuse to acknowledge. Whatever we query we come up with is met with a cliched reply "IR has already done it already". Clearly the kind of music I spoke of in "Money" song is not the same as clapping of hands or slapping of thighs, yet we are tempted to fit those musical expectations into what IR has already done.

2. Why do you want to bring in so many factors viz. the stage of career, the kind of technology available, precursors in music field etc., etc., and complicate things. Can't we isolate the music alone and appreciate it? In simple words, when I enter a music shop, I wouldn't even blink before deciding whose albums to buy and that is what matters.

3. Again I hope I didn't blurt that ARR has explored more than IR. I am not qualified to rubberstamp such facts. The thing is that he is more likely to do a lot of variety and he has the ability and light head to adapt to deliver any kind of music. That is one reason why I look forward to his music more.

Why did this discussion arise? :confused2: Because I was trying to tell that all those who prefer ARR need not be the one's who didn't pay enough attention to IR's songs :roll:

I would say the discussion arose because while IR never categorizes/builds pigeon-holes for himself - his critics are fairly quick to do as much. IR intha mAthiri thAn music pOda mudiyum/pOduvAr-nu solravanga IMO have not really explored the full range of his music - because to insinuate that someone cant make some type of music is in someways to indicate a lack of musical understanding, especially for a "composer". OTOH if you say what Rahman does works more for you, then of course there is no room for argument. Why it works, is something one needs to understand for oneself.

1.I would have to say the sound in money and the thigh slap/hand clap are the same thing. Both are born of the interest to simulate appropriate sound – If money uses the instruments/synthesizers to simulate the ringing of a slot machine and the dispensing of money rAjA uses what was at his disposal to create the sound needed for that scene. The lack of sophistication of technique does not alter the intent at all. If you say Money is superior, you are glorifying the means and neglecting the ends.
Clubbing IR fans as people who are unaware of/refuse to acknowledge music outside rAjA is another gross generalization. If I want to listen to new trends in world music, I will and do. I listen and attend concerts of bands that are fairly unheard of in pop-culture (Broken Social Scene, Dungen, Squarepusher, Sigur Ros, The Shinns, The Wrens .... I can keep going) yet I always return to rAjA. His music is a lynchpin for me.

2.One invariably does bring in the artistic arc. The way ARR composed in the early 90’s is significantly different from his composing now – I think you would agree – the same way that rAjA of the 70’s is different from the rAjA of the 80’s is different from the rAjA of the 90’s-00’s. In fact post-ThaayE Mookambikai rAjA is significantly different from pre-ThaayE Mookambikai rAjA. And yes if one walks into a music shop looking for something new one is more likely to find an ARR album - And if there is a popularity contest held today ARR would probably win in numbers there is no question. But the fact that a large number of people today walk into a music store to buy ARR's music takes nothing away from the satisfaction that rAjA has given me/gives me over the years and to date I still prefer to listen to his stuff when given a choice.

3.I actually have a question with regard to ARR on this “new and exciting” theory. I guess I’ll hold on to it for when it comes my time to ask questions. :)[/tscii:ce47c8ced5]

[MADDY]

Maddy, you could have proven him wrong, and offered him an invite to join ARR group. :)

aana avaru enga saadhikkaararu illaye.........engalukku saadhi sanam romba mukkiyam paa :lol:

[Vivasaayi]

Maddy, you could have proven him wrong, and offered him an invite to join ARR group. :)

aana avaru enga saadhikkaararu illaye.........engalukku saadhi sanam romba mukkiyam paa :lol:

halo...apuram edhuku signaturela enga saadhiyoda kuladheivam pera potrukeenga?

[complicateur]

Ippo naama enna serious-a pesittom? Just little games of my daddy's stronger. Karuthu parimaatram dhaane? Urayaadal and stuff, you know
My daddy stronger-nA nAn viLyAttu-kkE vara mAttenE! I think somewhere the tone shifted to your daddy weaker. That is/was quite unnecessary. :roll:

[complicateur]

thalaivar is a pioneer in experiment and making music out of sound - late h.sridhar himself acknowledged that..........he used to retain screeching sounds due to rust in instruments to create a new sound :bow:
yes, when people want him to compose symphony, acoustic, natural instruments, orchestra, rock type songs only - they get disappointed..........indha complaints pala murai kettachu, :)
MADDY - 2 points
1. Plenty of such experiments with sound can be showcased even for rAjA if one were allowed to delve into what he did and how so pioneer might be the wrong word, but yes Rahman does have a leg up when it comes to his attention to technology and related sounds so in that respect he is a pioneer.
2. No one wants Rahman to compose in anyway. Rahman composes in ways that satisfy him/director/requestor of songs. What one can say (and I repeat like a kiLi piLLai) is whether it is the kind of music one likes or not. ManmOhini is a lovely song - The AbhEri and Vijay prakash usage as well as the ludes are excellent. I remember pointing out how I might have liked it more if the beats were different, but you saw it in a completely different perspective and I understood that POV perfectly well. I wont/cant hold this against Rahman, en manasula thAn viththiyAsam.

Seri pEsi pEsi enakkE bore adikkuthu. If anyone has any more questions, please ask away, or let us grill equanimus.

[crajkumar_be]

darn.. Had typed a long reply from my mobile and the connection got cut.. Tomorrow..
Suffice to say am absolutely shocked seeing TV's posts on this subject!

[complicateur]

In light of all the discussions of music - a relevant article (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/04/04/AR2007040401721.html) [this is not intended as a dig, just the sharing of relevant information]. I am John Picarello.

[MADDY]

2. No one wants Rahman to compose in anyway.

Depauk, are you sure? many IR fans in HUB/orkut have accused ARRahman of working up e-music, fusion, world music only.........infact they dont realise that e-music can have soul, so they term him POP Md.............they always say "rahman-naala symphony kudukka mudiyama? WCM complex bits poda mudiyuma?" - i have even stopped reading fully such posts now.........i'm sure u have a better opinion on ARR

i do agree that ARR fans say IR doesent experiment, doesent use technology as much(IMO too - Om Siva om from NK reqd rahmanisque recording) which might sound hollow.......

[thamizhvaanan]

[tscii:50a07f8b98]
I would say the discussion arose because while IR never categorizes/builds pigeon-holes for himself - his critics are fairly quick to do as much. IR intha mAthiri thAn music pOda mudiyum/pOduvAr-nu solravanga IMO have not really explored the full range of his music - because to insinuate that someone cant make some type of music is in someways to indicate a lack of musical understanding, especially for a "composer".
First things first - I can never say that IR wouldn't be able to do this and that. I am just not qualified enough to enumerate his musical capabilities. But what I can do is, I can express the impressions that I get, impressions of whether he would (not could) do this or not! Ofcourse I may be wrong, but only until proven so. Would he bring himself (down?) to do a rap (not that I want him to do, I m not a big fan of rap) or a full blown trance. I am curious to know what you think of such possibilities.


If you say Money is superior, you are glorifying the means and neglecting the ends. :shock: I never said so. Where did you get that? Why are we always stuck in this rat race of whether A is superior to B. The only quantifiable thing in music would be the impact on listener which is subjective w.r.to listener and his state of mind. I leave it to everyone's judgment whether Money and Paruvamey are comparable.
Speaking of "glorifying the means and neglecting the ends", I understand that you prefer live orchestra over multi track recordings. Would that be the same?


Clubbing IR fans as people who are unaware of/refuse to acknowledge music outside rAjA is another gross generalization. If I want to listen to new trends in world music, I will and do. I listen and attend concerts of bands that are fairly unheard of in pop-culture (Broken Social Scene, Dungen, Squarepusher, Sigur Ros, The Shinns, The Wrens .... I can keep going) yet I always return to rAjA. His music is a lynchpin for me. Please don't take it personally, not to suggest that you are unaware of other music (again I don't remember using the word unaware :roll: ). I made that statement at the risk of generalization, but not without a stimuli. The stimuli is the image projected by IR fans (generalization) that IR's music is all inclusive. People who enjoy MSV, ARR's songs are looked down as people who fail to look beyond the surface, as people who can't understand that IR has "done it already". That is refusal to acknowledge a taste that sits well with MSV or ARR music but not with IR's music. Pink floyd, Enya etc., etc., are cases to point out these different tastes. Again these are generalizations and I will be glad if you don't fit into this :) .


But the fact that a large number of people today walk into a music store to buy ARR's music takes nothing away from the satisfaction that rAjA has given me/gives me over the years and to date I still prefer to listen to his stuff when given a choice.All that matters. In my case, the same satisfaction drives me to prefer ARR album.


3.I actually have a question with regard to ARR on this “new and exciting” theory. I guess I’ll hold on to it for when it comes my time to ask questions. :)

:)[/tscii:50a07f8b98]

[thamizhvaanan]

darn.. Had typed a long reply from my mobile and the connection got cut.. Tomorrow..
nalla vela... seekiram sabhaya kalachiduda soona paana :P

[complicateur]

2. No one wants Rahman to compose in anyway.

Depauk, are you sure? many IR fans in HUB/orkut have accused ARRahman of working up e-music, fusion, world music only.........infact they dont realise that e-music can have soul, so they term him POP Md.............they always say "rahman-naala symphony kudukka mudiyama? WCM complex bits poda mudiyuma?" - i have even stopped reading fully such posts now.........i'm sure u have a better opinion on ARR

i do agree that ARR fans say IR doesent experiment, doesent use technology as much(IMO too - Om Siva om from NK reqd rahmanisque recording) which might sound hollow.......

MADDY - Conceded the phrasing on that sentence wasn't the best.

The arguments you have posted can be quelled by the requesting them to define "soul". IMO, what they call soul is the connection rAjA as a creator makes with those who purvey his art. My connection to rAjA does not precede or supersede his music. I adore rAjA purely for his music. To me he is the person in that bass groove, the notes in the melody and what fills the silences between notes in the melody. It begins and ends there - I've said as much on my blog.
Those who raise objections are those that do not connect with ARR's creative impulse. They misconstrue the format and structure as the reason (either that or their connection to him has superseded his music and they are blindly opposed to what ARR does - in that case the loss is theirs). If ARR wanted to compose a symphony (which he very well might based on what he is doing with KM conservatory) he will. But until then he composes what gives him creative satisfaction. If they aren't able to connect with it, that is all they can/should acknowledge. In the same way those that say IR's music doesnt work for me because he can't produce sounds like x,y,z... are externalizing the reason for dislike. If rAjA feels like it he is more than able to compose whatever he wants.

[Nerd]

In light of all the discussions of music - a relevant article (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/04/04/AR2007040401721.html) [this is not intended as a dig, just the sharing of relevant information]. I am John Picarello.
Read it sometime back. One of the most depressing articles I have ever read.

Thamizh, can you stop asking: has IR done this/will IR do this etc? You keep saying that "I don't deny IR has done that" but you come up with such questions in each and every post of yours. Rap music, Vikram kEttadhillayaa? CR and compli are doing a great job here, I shall continue to be a silent observer.

[complicateur]

I would say the discussion arose because while IR never categorizes/builds pigeon-holes for himself - his critics are fairly quick to do as much. IR intha mAthiri thAn music pOda mudiyum/pOduvAr-nu solravanga IMO have not really explored the full range of his music - because to insinuate that someone cant make some type of music is in someways to indicate a lack of musical understanding, especially for a "composer".
First things first - I can never say that IR wouldn't be able to do this and that. I am just not qualified enough to enumerate his musical capabilities. But what I can do is, I can express the impressions that I get, impressions of whether he would (not could) do this or not! Ofcourse I may be wrong, but only until proven so. Would he bring himself (down?) to do a rap (not that I want him to do, I m not a big fan of rap) or a full blown trance. I am curious to know what you think of such possibilities.
Such possibilities dont matter at all. If rAjA wakes up one morning and is moved to compose trance music, he will. And I might/might not enjoy it. What is called "rap"/beatboxing etc... is essentially konnakOl with/without lyrics. I again find no reason to believe that rAjA cannot do it if he is so inclined. I dont understand your line of evaluation which seems to be based on what IR will not do. If you are looking to point out an aspect in what he has done that does not work for you then by all means do so. This projective exclusion based dismissal is fairly pointless.



If you say Money is superior, you are glorifying the means and neglecting the ends. :shock: I never said so. Where did you get that? Why are we always stuck in this rat race of whether A is superior to B. The only quantifiable thing in music would be the impact on listener which is subjective w.r.to listener and his state of mind. I leave it to everyone's judgment whether Money and Paruvamey are comparable.
Speaking of "glorifying the means and neglecting the ends", I understand that you prefer live orchestra over multi track recordings. Would that be the same?
Yes you did just say they were not the same, and the condescension in your tone was inferred (might be my perceptive failure :|). And my analogy wrt live recordings/acoustic sounds was to set a precedent as to the type of music I prefer, thus providing a context for my devotion to rAjA. And w.r.t paruvamE I was just pointing to the use of unconventional sound - in that sense you misunderstood the analogy I was making and hence the use of the term "glorifying the means and neglecting the ends". I hope this clears things up. I apologize for my lack of clarity. If you are looking for unconventional sounds refer some examples cited by Bala - and the opening riff of Senorita in Johnny. And if you consider the ends being moved to tears - Rahman has never done that to me while rAjA has consistently. Now that may not be true for ARR fans, but I see no reason for that to irk them so much. Misinterpreting whatever I write as a positive of rAjA's music as a criticism of Rahman's style is rather unwarranted.

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wQ64NACudvs

Watch Illayaraja speaking abt Yuvan's music(not specifically but generally, though)

[Roshan]

ARR fanskooda IR'kaaga saNdai pOtta kAlamum uNdu :P

Good times. :D

Adhu nAn mudivu paNNa vEndiyathu :P

[thilak4life]

ARR fanskooda IR'kaaga saNdai pOtta kAlamum uNdu :P

Good times. :D

Adhu nAn mudivu paNNa vEndiyathu :P

No, I was speaking for myself. I used to fight with ARR fans for everything. :lol2:

I loved that period in hub. :)

[Roshan]

But neenga athigam ARR songs paththi silAgiRathathAn naan athigamA pAthirukkEn in TF section :P TFM section'a varushathukku nAlu vAtti etti pArpEn. So I dont know much about the happenings here.

[ajaybaskar]

Ippadi oru topic arumbichurukkaangannu theriyama poche!!!!

[ajaybaskar]

what made complicateur to initiate a comparitive study between a music director whose experience is 35 yrs and 800+ films with another one whose exp is just 17 yrs and 100 films?

[complicateur]

what made complicateur to initiate a comparitive study between a music director whose experience is 35 yrs and 800+ films with another one whose exp is just 17 yrs and 100 films?
Ajay - I did not initiate it. If you will go back and check the thread (guest of the week- hubbers lounge) I was responding quite honestly (that might be the problem) to questions posed by others. I only chose to respond when MADDY/thamizh/Roshan insisted on mistaking my basis for liking IR as a criticism of ARR. I was in legal terms "acting in self defense". If you will also notice Bala/myself are very aware of the different stages of creative existence that IR and ARR are and acknowledge as much. I also admit quite freely that I enjoy listening to ARR songs and that my first allegiance is to music rather than to IR or ARR.

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wQ64NACudvs

Watch Illayaraja speaking abt Yuvan's music(not specifically but generally, though) and no one cared this!

[kingvj]

Yempa... konjam genres of songs eduthu, IR epdi panni irukkaar, ARR epdi panni irukkaarnu paakalaama? Pick one genre... pick one song of the same mood.. discuss the nittigritties (instruments used, raga used, singer used, thalam used etc) of that song... observe how two different composers see the same mood.. discuss their style of work... that would enable all of us to enjoy music as a whole..!

Adha vittuttu, ivaru periyavara, avaru periyavaraannu pesittey irundhomna, hub pages-dhaan fill aagum..! :-(

[MADDY]

I only chose to respond when MADDY/thamizh/Roshan insisted on mistaking my basis for liking IR as a criticism of ARR

no, i never said that :roll: please check my posts again......i just questioned why u turned into IR fan after being thalaivar admirer - thats all....... :)

ajay, this was a discussion going on in guest of week thread and MODs cut paste the discussions into a new thread :) ..........ajay, btw, these discussions might seem as if ARR fans are intolerant abt other MDs - ungalakku theriyadhadhu onnum illa - it was ARR fans who nominated U1 and voted him to win in 2005 HUB awards :) we all revere IR and his creations and dont normally react unless provoked :)

[ajaybaskar]

Got it, Complicateur/MADDY... But honestly, I was surprised to see some healthy discussions going on in the first 6 pages. As kingvj rightly pointed out, we can compare the songs of thse two legends of the same genre and that would be more interesting.

I have a difference of opinion on the "rooting" factor in ARR's SOK, Alaipayuthey songs. You find it different from the normal folk tunes bcoz you have been accustomed listening to a particular folk base for quite some yrs. Thats all.. To put it straight, if the "rooting" factor is the most important thing for a song then Paravai Muniyamma and Pushpavanam Kuppusaamy would've easily overtook IR and ARR. Its the innovation that matters... I bet you wouldnt have listened to a song like Yaro yarodi in your life time.

[thamizhvaanan]

I was responding quite honestly (that might be the problem) to questions posed by others. I only chose to respond when MADDY/thamizh/Roshan insisted on mistaking my basis for liking IR as a criticism of ARR. Ayyo Compli, there is no problem. You were quite dignified in expressing the reasons for your preference. And no, I never thought liking of IR = disliking ARR, if so even I would be classified as ARR critic.
My ramblings were a result of accumulated grouse against a mirky, generic image of an obstinate IR fan, into which clearly neither you or CR fit in. Sorry for bothering you.

:D

[complicateur]

thamizh: Finally! :)


no, i never said that :roll: please check my posts again......i just questioned why u turned into IR fan after being thalaivar admirer - thats all....... :)
Apologies MADDY. Though your question was posed in a manner that indicated you didnt really want an answer :) .

If I were to answer the question you have now posed I will have to agree with a somewhat refined version of what ajaybaskar points out. It might be as a result of the early minimal training I had in music I am more likely to enjoy certain arrangements and melodic patterns. Even in something like the La Notte (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RRnZPepDknY), which I really like and is supposedly alien, after a lot of close listening I was reducing to individual parts enjoying them separately and then wowed by the difference in the overall experience. I found myself more drawn to this style of music and composing that rAjA has used excellently. ARR is a lot more free form as a composer. I don't mention this as a detriment just that that style is a little more hit or miss when it comes to me liking it. I dont have nostalgia associated with most of rAjA's songs [except the payaNangaL mudivathillai album] because I wasn't old enough to have had any life experiences when they came out. So I gathered that I have an implicit connection with that style of composing. I am currently trying to learn more about WCM to understand why this is so while I have a better understanding of melodic aspects due to some grounding in Carnatic. [BTW I am listening to La Notte as I type this it is just .... effulgent...Vivaldi :notworthy:]

Yempa... konjam genres of songs eduthu, IR epdi panni irukkaar, ARR epdi panni irukkaarnu paakalaama?
Now this is the best idea I have heard in a long while. I will see if I can break down Vaa NilA (from kAthal Virus) and korangu kaiyil mAlai with some examples to see how the 2 have used "jazz" sounds. Viraivil oru post-u ....

[thamizhvaanan]

Yempa... konjam genres of songs eduthu, IR epdi panni irukkaar, ARR epdi panni irukkaarnu paakalaama? Pick one genre... pick one song of the same mood.. discuss the nittigritties (instruments used, raga used, singer used, thalam used etc) of that song... observe how two different composers see the same mood.. discuss their style of work... that would enable all of us to enjoy music as a whole..!

Adha vittuttu, ivaru periyavara, avaru periyavaraannu pesittey irundhomna, hub pages-dhaan fill aagum..! :-(

Kingvj, I have been having this idea for a long time now, especially around the different moods and the way in which each of them evoke them. Both of them are good at almost all the moods, yet very strong in few moods. For instance, ARR with Patriotic, Pathos and IR with uvagai (ecstasy), celebration and perhaps few more. Let's see what the connoisseurs come up with :D

[MADDY]

thanks compli - yes, nostalgia is something u cant shrug away - i still cant shrug away my attachment to netru illadha matram or a porale ponnuthai :)

reg comparisons on genre -my personal fav of ARR is arabic/middle-east influence in his music.........Islamic music is so peaceful, even a song that signifies "confusion"/"volatility" has so much melody in it :bow:

http://in.youtube.com/watch?v=MEb-aSjQL7I

has IR ventured into middle east or sufi music styles - really would love to see IR's interpretation of this genre.......

i think jazz is one genre where ARR and IR have a common point.....they both prefer the genre very much i believe :)

[complicateur]

MADDY: :oops: That was a typo about nostalgia - I meant I don't have any because I wasn't old enough during his peak (or at least what I consider his peak output).
Melody/Peace is in nearly all kinds of music. Even hip-hop has come to realize that the songs with a melodic hook work better.
Interesting point on the Middle eastern influence. The first one that comes to mind promptly is En Jodi (http://in.youtube.com/watch?v=5MAIppYy5j4) from Vikram and that quickly descends into comic enterprise and a dance number for Kamal. The second isnt necessarily Arabic but it is islamic - a version called mAppiLLai pAttu in a malayALam film called AchchuvintE Amma. But rAjA alters the form to make it more upbeat (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zf6ei5Ll_kM). The Shehnai is stong in the ludes and the lyrics and singing is quintessentially mAppiLLai pAttu but the song is essentially folksy and upbeat. I wonder if he has exhibited any outright Arabic influence.

[MADDY]

MADDY: :oops: That was a typo about nostalgia - I meant I don't have any because I wasn't old enough during his peak (or at least what I consider his peak output).

oh i'm so saary - so u r impressed with Raaja;s style of composing....fair enough - i too was awe in of acoustics, WCM, bass guitar usage of IR but still felt my love for e-music is far more than the above categories :)


Interesting point on the Middle eastern influence. The first one that comes to mind promptly is En Jodi (http://in.youtube.com/watch?v=5MAIppYy5j4) from Vikram and that quickly descends into comic enterprise and a dance number for Kamal. The second isnt necessarily Arabic but it is islamic - a version called mAppiLLai pAttu in a malayALam film called AchchuvintE Amma. But rAjA alters the form to make it more upbeat (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zf6ei5Ll_kM). The Shehnai is stong in the ludes and the lyrics and singing is quintessentially mAppiLLai pAttu but the song is essentially folksy and upbeat. I wonder if he has exhibited any outright Arabic influence.

ah yea, how can i forget en jodi manja kuruvi from vikram(incidentally the first film i watched in theatres :P ) .........yes, again, its so different from each other - IR with his bass stamp on this genre too and thalaivar more of electronica :lol:

would love to see comparison of jazz usage by both.........

[Sureshs65]

A couple of songs where both Illayaraja and Rahman use similar rhythm to convey different emotions. First listen to this number from 'Jodha Akbar'. http://in.youtube.com/watch?v=Ivo-BsHAw3I . A sense of grandeur is sought to be created by the rhythm which starts the song.

Illayaraja used a similar type of rhythm earlier in 'Avataram' to create a sense of helpless anger. Observe how the addition of the 'udukku' type beat when the pallavi starts the second gives the song a folk feel. You can listen to the 'Avataram' song 'Thondru Thotu' at http://www.thiraipaadal.com/albums/ALBIRR00067.html

Melody takes over in the charanams of the 'Jodha Akbar' song in contrast with the initial sense of grandeur. Illayaraja does that in the Telugu movie Anthapuram : http://in.youtube.com/watch?v=iBz70ItJojc The song per se is very vigorous, with Illayaraja giving us the feel of Rayalaseema. Observe the second charanam, where the female voices come in, lending melody to this robust song and again getting back to the original emotion.

S.Suresh

[Sureshs65]

A couple of songs where both Illayaraja and Rahman use similar rhythm to convey different emotions. First listen to this number from 'Jodha Akbar'. http://in.youtube.com/watch?v=Ivo-BsHAw3I . A sense of grandeur is sought to be created by the rhythm which starts the song.

Illayaraja used a similar type of rhythm earlier in 'Avataram' to create a sense of helpless anger. Observe how the addition of the 'udukku' type beat when the pallavi starts the second gives the song a folk feel. You can listen to the 'Avataram' song 'Thondru Thotu' at http://www.thiraipaadal.com/albums/ALBIRR00067.html

Melody takes over in the charanams of the 'Jodha Akbar' song in contrast with the initial sense of grandeur. Illayaraja does that in the Telugu movie Anthapuram : http://in.youtube.com/watch?v=iBz70ItJojc The song per se is very vigorous, with Illayaraja giving us the feel of Rayalaseema. Observe the second charanam, where the female voices come in, lending melody to this robust song and again getting back to the original emotion.

S.Suresh

[Sureshs65]

Apologies for the multiple posts.

S.Suresh

[Fliflo]

Guys,

this video might help your discussion further, I guess.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S5fgAsvx1Ro

[complicateur]

Suresh - Thanks for the posts.

As a sample at the outset. Here is The Branford Marsalis Quartet playing John Coltrane's A love supreme (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rfHtVgM14sM), one of the finest jazz pieces I have heard. Primarily the free flowing unrestricted sounds of the trumpet and saxophone have come to be associated with the commonly accepted notions of Jazz. But as demonstrated above the Cello, Piano and percussions play a role just as important in giving the melody "body". Jazz is also not all instrumental. Here (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lGgi5E5bnhg) are samples from a predominantly vocal jazz ensemble.
In Vaa Nilaa (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QZ53KQy2nYQ) sets the jazz tone in the prelude with the use of the saxophone/trumpet before jumping in with the beats. The singularly diffferent thing about the singing is that it is almost simulating an instrument. The melody almost seems to be created for an instrument. The Singer (sounds like Devan but I cant be sure) does a commendabl job in bringing out that element. Until the point in the charaNam where he sings rathiyE ratham pOl nadanthEn nI varum vazhi engum, where the singing style is typically Indian with gamakams, the melody could almost easily be a jazz instrumental.
In contrast korangu kaiyil mAlai (http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-7487922645777563038) [excuse the poor clip couldnt find a better one] is a duet with a jazz ensemble backing that intends to invoke Henry Mancini (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CU6p8oaC90c). rAjA prefers to use the piano and vocal backing.

[thilak4life]

Top post(s), Compli et Suresh.

[thamizhvaanan]

Nice posts Suresh & Compli :clap:

[Sureshs65]

Nice songs compli. Thanks.

While Mumbai Express song is good, I think the Yugandhar song that Raja did in late 70s has the jazz feel and a sort of breathlessness which is present in the Kadal Virus song . Both the sax and drumming are very good in the Yugandhar song. Especially watch out for the drumming in the initial part of the charanam.

You need to do some work to get this song. I couldn't get an online link. Download the 'Naa Paruvam' song of 'Yugandhar' from this cooltoad link: http://as07.cooltoad.com/music/song.php?id=368335&PHPSESSID=b9b234c4c0af1c0db949a1c3a3822fda

compli, while the singer does a good job in the Kadal Virus song, there is a fair bit of sound engineering magic as well to get the intended sound.

S.Suresh

[Sureshs65]

BTW, the cooltoad link says that the music of Yugandhar is by Satyam. Ignore it :)

S.Suresh

[Sanjeevi]

BTW, the cooltoad link says that the music of Yugandhar is by Satyam. Ignore it :)

S.Suresh

What do you mean?

who was the MD?

[Sureshs65]

Sorry for not stating it clearly. My mistake. Thanks Sanjeevi for pointing it out.

The MD was very much Illayaraja. No doubt about that. What I asked people to ignore is what was written in Cooltoad. So ignore the credits at Cooltoad and listen to the song.

S.Suresh

[Plum]

Suresh, ah! Yugandhar - I think I posted sometime on your blog about it. Daste daagedha might come close to trance that peeple were demanding.

Actually, ezhu swaram dhaan - namma pandradhu ellame emathu velainu sangeethathai pathi IR solvadhu pola, when it comes to IR-ARR, hub periyavanga already ellam pannittanga.
I remember 10 years back, two titans Srikanth D, a composer and Srinath, a bass guitar player squared off on Rakamma vs Veeravandi Kottaiyile. Srikanth being the expert argued succesfully in favour of the latter. But it is not really appropriate - comparisons cannot be between exactly similar items despite the sueprficial similarities as above - Mani movie, item song, grandeur etc.