Blind worshipping of Thamizh cinema rasigan

[jaiganes]

Thamizh cinema has reached such a stage that independant films are not being made - actors with fan following virtually hold the creativity, artistic expression of the entire thamizh film world to a siege. So much so that only masala film and pseudo movies of the stars stand any chance of even getting released. Most of the portals and magazines have been publishing watered down generally appreciative reviews fearing the onslaught of 'paasakkara pullaigal'. Is this trend healthy? Is this the trend that a rich literature treasure cove like Thamizh nadu should accept for the rich and limitless art form like cinema?

[sarna_blr]

I guess there are TWO TYPES OF BLIND WORSHIPPING FANS :wink:

[anbu_kathir]

Don't have an opinion on this really, I guess the people have their way irrespective whatever we opine.

But one interesting thing to note in this very hub, Cinema ( tamil and world ) illaina hubla 90% of the active threads would be defunct. That definitely catches my eye. I am really curious about where and what kind of threads in the hub would all that unspent energy would channel into.

Love and Light.

[Querida]

I started a similar thread years ago...i really don't mind hero worship keeping in mind 4 things:

1) you do not turn into bickering, petty children about heroes who frankly don't know who you are...or care! :roll: :roll: :roll:

2) it does not endanger the lives of the actors or fellow fans

3) you are not overstepping the boundaries of your own dignity/self respect in your fan worship..

4) you keep an open mind!!! What/who you like is not going to be liked by everyone else!

[jaiganes]

Don't have an opinion on this really, I guess the people have their way irrespective whatever we opine.

But one interesting thing to note in this very hub, Cinema ( tamil and world ) illaina hubla 90% of the active threads would be defunct. That definitely catches my eye. I am really curious about where and what kind of threads in the hub would all that unspent energy would channel into.

Love and Light.
This is a mirage - an illusion.
cinema illaina?
arasiyal illaina?

Once upon a time people couldn't think
Gandhi illaina
Nehru illaina
Kamarajar illaina

we just move on.
What amazes me is if we hand over a supreme piece of art and ask some one to look at it 4 times for appreciating it - deathly silence. Pidicha nadigar padamnaa, paadavadhiyaanaalum oru 10 12 dhadavai paathu adhai sooper hittunnu oru website solravaraikkum poraadugiraargale andha vidaa muyarchiyai veru engu kaati irundhaalum Vijay Kanth solvadhu pola Vallarasu naadaga maaruvadhu urudhi.

[Wibha]

As long as you are just a fan/ admirer of an actor/actress or whoever then it's okay. A fanatic or complete worshiper is ridiculous. Who are they to us? It just amazes me as to how someone can be so crazy over someone who doesn't even know this person or care about them.

[sarna_blr]

andha vidaa muyarchiyai veru engu kaati irundhaalum Vijay Kanth solvadhu pola Vallarasu naadaga maaruvadhu urudhi.

Oh cinema thurai ivlO perusaa vallamayOda valarndhadhukku idhuvum kaaranam illayaa..... :roll:

[pavalamani pragasam]

The fannaticism is reaching religious fervour: paalaabishEgam for cut-outs!!! :shock: Utter shame! Odious and ridiculous! Least said best about the 'warfare' going on here between rival fan groups! The content of present day cinema & the rubbish churned out in TV is simply deplorable!!! :cry: Story, script, scenes, songs- treacherously dangerously misleading, misguiding youth to dissipation and decadence at an age when they should be gearing up for great, creative activities. What an aura around such harmful personalities!!! An endless lament it is!

[MADDY]

As long as you are just a fan/ admirer of an actor/actress or whoever then it's okay. A fanatic or complete worshiper is ridiculous. Who are they to us? It just amazes me as to how someone can be so crazy over someone who doesn't even know this person or care about them.

then, how are we worshipping god whom most has ever seen??? reminds me of sathyaraj's statement once - "if u can build temples for unseen gods, why not build a temple for a khushboo who can be pretty much seen" :lol: .......

do u see air, electro magnetic waves?? how do mobile phones, satellites work then??? its all "nambikkai" - belief..........ivalavu edhukku, can u see ur soul??? why do u believe in urself then???? ur non-existent right bcos u cant see ur soul.........

there is no wrong in worshipping.....basic problem is education...........an educated fan like me/hubbers will restrict it whereas illiterate people take it too far.........even in european countries and america, we have people getting fanatical and mad.......its just that most are educated and control themselves at some point........

i see GOD in someones' music - i dont think i'm wrong.......i see GOD in his qualities........Lord Ram wont come with "villu" and "ambu" today....only vijay will come with villu........for me, my ram comes with keyboards and songs......

[sarna_blr]

Sudhir :2thumbsup:

<<< an educated fan like me/hubbers will restrict it whereas illiterate people take it too far >>>

the main problem is this only :oops:

[jaiganes]

MADDY - I dont see your appreciation in anyway - blind worship. If Rahman tunes in a crap song - you wouldn't hesitate to call it a trash would you? - you wouldn't say did shankar ganesh not give a crap song - compared to that it is great- kinda arguments - right?

[MADDY]

MADDY - I dont see your appreciation in anyway - blind worship. If Rahman tunes in a crap song - you wouldn't hesitate to call it a trash would you? - you wouldn't say did shankar ganesh not give a crap song - compared to that it is great- kinda arguments - right?

see, everyone has bias in them.......u take any blog, site or any communication channel - u see bias in it.........a reviewer is biased towards a artiste/performer on basis of country/caste/region/language/ or some other influence......it can be pure fanatism as in case of many kamal/rajini fans......this fanatism sometimes is as big as the above factors.........

i would call a rahman song trash if it didnt work for me but yea, since i'm a fan of him, most times, i know the perspective with which he had composed it and it becomes to difficult to blame him.......would u call uliyin osai by IR bad?? based on popular opinion, yea, he gave a uninspiring album but thats what the situation demanded........fans look at that perspective as well..........u cant blame it....

[joe]

ஒரு ரசிகனுக்கும் கலைஞனுக்கும் உள்ள உறவு கலை மட்டும் தான் .அது நியாயப்படி ஒரு சேவை (serve) வழங்குபவனுக்கும் அதை நுகர்வோனுக்குமுள்ள உறவு அளவுக்கு இருப்பது தான் நியாயம் .அதைத் தாண்டி சேவை வழங்குபவரின் தனிமனித பண்புகளையும் சேவையையும் போட்டு குழப்பிக்கொள்ள வேண்டிய அவசியம் இல்லை தான் .

ஆனால் கலை என்று வரும் போது தனிப்பட்ட கலைஞனின் தனிப்பட்ட வாழ்வு கலையையும் பாதிக்கலாம் என்பதால் கலைஞன் மீது ஒரு தனிப்பட்ட அக்கறை ,பாசம் வருவது தவிர்க்க முடியாதது .ஆனாலும் கலை ,கலைஞன் இரண்டிலும் கலையை முன்னிறுத்தி ,கலைக்காக அந்த கலைஞனை நேசிப்பதால் எந்த பாதகமும் இல்லை .

ஆனால் நாளடைவில் கலை பின் தள்ளப்பட்டு ,அந்த கலைஞனுக்காகவே அவன் கலையை விரும்ப ஆரம்பித்தால் அங்கு தனிமனித வழிபாடு ஆரம்பிக்கிறது .இதையும் தாண்டி கலைஞனின் கலை எல்லையைத் தாண்டி அவனின் தனிமனித சமூக ,அரசியல் ,குடும்ப கொள்கைகள் ,கருத்துக்களுக்கும் முழுவதுமாக உடன்பட்டு ,அவனின் கொள்கையே தனது கொள்கையாக , எது வரினும் அந்த கலைஞன் என்ற தனிமனிதனின் ஒவ்வொரு அசைவுக்கும் (கலைக்கு சம்பந்தம் இல்லாத) ஒத்து ஊத வேண்டிய , நியாயம் கற்பிக்க வேண்டுய நிலைக்கு மாறுவது அடுத்த கட்டம் .

அதையும் தாண்டி தன்னிலை முழுவதும் மறந்து கலைஞனின் வாழ்வே தன் வாழ்வாக கொள்வது உச்ச கட்டம் .

நமக்கும் கலைஞனுக்கும் உள்ள உறவு கலை மட்டுமே என்ற தெளிவு வரும் வரை இந்த நிலை மாறுவது கடினமே.

[P_R]

Good post Joe :thumbsup:

[Wibha]

then, how are we worshipping god whom most has ever seen??? reminds me of sathyaraj's statement once - "if u can build temples for unseen gods, why not build a temple for a khushboo who can be pretty much seen" :lol: .......

do u see air, electro magnetic waves?? how do mobile phones, satellites work then??? its all "nambikkai" - belief..........ivalavu edhukku, can u see ur soul??? why do u believe in urself then???? ur non-existent right bcos u cant see ur soul.........

there is no wrong in worshipping.....basic problem is education...........an educated fan like me/hubbers will restrict it whereas illiterate people take it too far.........even in european countries and america, we have people getting fanatical and mad.......its just that most are educated and control themselves at some point........

i see GOD in someones' music - i dont think i'm wrong.......i see GOD in his qualities........Lord Ram wont come with "villu" and "ambu" today....only vijay will come with villu........for me, my ram comes with keyboards and songs......

god is just a belief each person has which makes him feel like something good is going to happen- a support.
how can a celeb be a support? i don't get it. he's a normal person like you and me then why is it that people go crazy over him,fight for him and stuff. Education has nothing to do with this. there are even educated people who behave in a very low way when it comes to a person they're a fan(atic) of. spoiling kids in the name of being a theevira rasigan.

[directhit]

Joe - good post :thumbsup:
Jai - IMO Tamil cinema is slowly moving towards story centric movies with such 'independent' films as u say, are seeing a good run. Though movies like Onbadhu roobai nottu etc are not recognized still movies without the usual 'template' are accepted wholeheartedly by the audience, at the same time rejecting rehashed movies.
As for fanatics, its prevelant not only in movies/tamil - its there in sports/politics and most areas and again not limited to tamil. education also aint gonna change it IMO

[NOV]

thamizh cinemavukku vidivu kaalam koodiya seekkiram varum endru enakku nambikkai illai ... pOra pOkka paaththaa innum mOsamaa thaan aayittu irukku.

as a customer, movie fans' requirements are slowly being given blow after blow. cinema is a wonderful medium but politics has taken control of it.

thirudana paarththu thirundhaa vittaal thiruttai ozhikka mudiyaadhu

[MADDY]

him feel like something good is going to happen- a support.
how can a celeb be a support? i don't get it. he's a normal person like you and me then why is it that people go crazy over him,fight for him and stuff. Education has nothing to do with this. there are even educated people who behave in a very low way when it comes to a person they're a fan(atic) of. spoiling kids in the name of being a theevira rasigan.

oh i never knew ARRahman was a normal person like u and me........wonderful......what is "low way" btw??

i think this will become yet another naan kadavul thread discussions.....there are some wrong assumptions from the "pagathhuarivu side" here:

1. Its the art and not personal character which draws people to a man.......rajinikanth or ajith didnt get fans just becos they were good people, ppl. got attracted to them, and their good behavior is just a value add..........so relationship betn a artist and a fan stays largely "art" and not personal as some think in HUB........
2. converse of it - why shouldnt we support a "criminal" - i mean, if osama bin laden makes a good movie, y shuldnt we appreciate it.......there enters personal perspective......there are people who see cinema people as part of society as well.......jsut like a corrupt politician is stoned by public, if caught (sad it is), a cinemaman with bad behavior will also be criticised......criticism on him based on his wrong public life however shuld be restricted to a social perspective and shuld not let that dominate the view of his product.....but, some people consider, neglecting his product is a token of "disappointment" with his social behavior...........
3. confusion betn real life and cinema life - its a pretty cliched line for educated people atleast for hubbers..........man, do u think a educated rajini fan thinks he can fight off 40 rowdies as he did in sivaji?? or a kamal fan thinks "cancer" can be cured by bullet shots.....or did anyone from a educated family lost career of life because of cinema.....i dont think people confuse cinema life with real life.......atleast educated people.......
4. assumption that jaiganes started for this purpose is wrong....he is peeved with movies getting good reviews just bcos of its fans.......so the line of arguements here are pretty disgressional

i certainly do not encourage fanatism, nobody is more important than urself in ur life but definitely feel education can only bring in this perspective......i'm sure this problem can be eradicated with increase in levels of education..............if someone has a job/career, why would he sit, thinking abt his idol???

[NOV]

maturity

[Corleone]

thamizh cinemavukku vidivu kaalam koodiya seekkiram varum endru enakku nambikkai illai ... pOra pOkka paaththaa innum mOsamaa thaan aayittu irukku.

as a customer, movie fans' requirements are slowly being given blow after blow. cinema is a wonderful medium but politics has taken control of it.

thirudana paarththu thirundhaa vittaal thiruttai ozhikka mudiyaadhu

NOV maathi solreengoo
Cinema and cine industry ppl have taken control over politics.

[NOV]

I dont mean "politics" as in real politics. Just like office politics, you have cinema politics. :)

[pavalamani pragasam]

Good pun!?

[pavalamani pragasam]

Joe - good post :thumbsup:
Jai - IMO Tamil cinema is slowly moving towards story centric movies with such 'independent' films as u say, are seeing a good run. Though movies like Onbadhu roobai nottu etc are not recognized still movies without the usual 'template' are accepted wholeheartedly by the audience, at the same time rejecting rehashed movies.
As for fanatics, its prevelant not only in movies/tamil - its there in sports/politics and most areas and again not limited to tamil. education also aint gonna change it IMO

Absolutely correct! People are crazy, sensation-thirsty!

[crajkumar_be]

Roshan,
naan sollala?? :lol:

[crajkumar_be]

Maddy,
Too bad even you are falling for age-old cliches and myths, even though they have been exposed yet again :(

[selvakumar]

50 வருடங்களுக்கு முன்னால் நம்ம பொம்பளைங்க எல்லாம் ஜாக்கெட்டே போடலை ! சட்டை போடுறது வெள்ளக்காரன் நமக்குக் கத்துக்கொடுத்தது.

அப்போ எது கலாச்சாரம் !

- சண்டியர்

> For me - "matter" - Over !

[kannannn]

thamizhargaL kadaisiyil muttALAkkappattanar.
idhukku melayum __________.......... :(

Bala, appadi enna aachu :roll: ?

[Kalyasi]

50 வருடங்களுக்கு முன்னால் நம்ம பொம்பளைங்க எல்லாம் ஜாக்கெட்டே போடலை ! சட்டை போடுறது வெள்ளக்காரன் நமக்குக் கத்துக்கொடுத்தது.

அப்போ எது கலாச்சாரம் !

- சண்டியர்

> For me - "matter" - Over !

Antha Kalacharatha thaan naama kaapathanum illa....

[joe]

CR,selva,Kannan,Kalyasi ,
Neenga intha thread pathi thaan pesureengaLa? :roll:

[Thirumaran]

CR,selva,Kannan,Kalyasi ,
Neenga intha thread pathi thaan pesureengaLa? :roll:


atha therinjittu enna panna poareenga :huh: :lol2:

[joe]

CR,selva,Kannan,Kalyasi ,
Neenga intha thread pathi thaan pesureengaLa? :roll:


atha therinjittu enna panna poareenga :huh: :lol2:

athu sari :oops:

[MADDY]

Maddy,
Too bad even you are falling for age-old cliches and myths, even though they have been exposed yet again :(

:oops: this thread was tempting to resist :lol:

[jaiganes]

Our scriptures and elders advices ask us time and again to be patient, sweet worded, and thoughtful before every word we say and everything we do. The 'fans' themselves are normal people like you and me, involved in normal activities and perfectly pleasing in their usual daily behaviour. However when it comes to their object of affection - an entity that actually is no beacon of selflessness - just another person who is selfish like you and me, has business priorities in acting in a manner so that the tight irrational mob control over the 'blinded' fans, the nature of fans become like a Mr.Hyde - Frankenstein unleashed. The love they try to exhibit publicly is again becoming a perversion of their actual appreciation that originally made them like their object of reverance. untold manhours are wasted in unnecessary adulation and comparing this with religion and spirituality or even politics is the ultimate degradation of the soul and mind - while true spirituality makes the behaviour better and mind clearer, a fan boy behaviour makes someone irascible, intolerant to the existence of others and other viewpoints. Though religious groups often show this kind of debased attachment to 'identities', the whole society and the majority in the religion themselves condemn the attitude and behaviour as 'fundamentalist'. However the blind fans have no controls that a religion or even a political group has. The object of fixation - the movie star derives all the financial benefits(like a grand opening inspite of a low quality content) of an adulatory mob while having none of the responsibilities to their fans' actions, words and thoughts.

[selvakumar]

However the blind fans have no controls that a religion or even a political group has
:lol:

[dinesh2002]

if u ask me... its ok to be a fan... but building temples for actresses.... totally absurd.... what nansense is all these.... temple is specially for divine powers and not for some artist who gets paid to do that they r suppose to do... to be precise not for actresses who gets paid to show their skin and collect fans... :x ....

and i feel its pure stupidity that fans pour milk for cut outs.... goodness.... do u know how much milk is wasted there?? u can easily donate those milks to the poor childs.... how many kids r on the streets that r hungry and yearning for atleast a cup of water... and these dumbos pour milk on cut outs as if they r some deities .... and sad to say this only happens in Tamil industry....[plz educate me if even Hindi, Telugu, Malayalam, Kannada fans do these same foolishness]....

i get very pisst of thinking of these hardcore blind worshippers of tamil actors/actress..... Kali Yugam mutthi pooche.....

[selvakumar]

and i feel its pure stupidity that fans pour milk for cut outs.... goodness.... do u know how much milk is wasted there?? u can easily donate those milks to the poor childs.... how many kids r on the streets that r hungry and yearning for atleast a cup of water... and these dumbos pour milk on cut outs as if they r some deities .... and sad to say this only happens in Tamil industry....[plz educate me if even Hindi, Telugu, Malayalam, Kannada fans do these same foolishness]....

The milk that we pour on our GODS can also be very well given to poor children. I agree with you on the 'Act' and why it should be stopped. Again, BELIEFS are restricted to a set of few. If one can ACCEPT milk abhisekam for our GODS, they can't question the BELIEF of a normal fan. It should be LEFT as a BELIEF.

Moreover, I am damn sure that welfare activities done by fan clubs (be it blood donation, helping blind children etc) won't be done by most of the PETERS who SIT in A/C rooms and criticize poor fans. There could be few exceptions. AFAIK, this is the general thing.

Dinesh - I had the same opinion of yours couple of years back. I have changed. It is little complicated and I don't know how to put it in right words.

[selvakumar]

Also, the time we spent for *our* favorites in the online world by writing our views can be easily spent for playing mokkai games in the system during office hours or by chatting

[sarna_blr]

Moreover, I am damn sure that welfare activities done by fan clubs (be it blood donation, helping blind children etc)

:yes: :exactly: I have seen a lot a welfare activities by FANS... for those FANS :bow: :bow: :2thumbsup:



won't be done by most of the PETERS who SIT in A/C rooms and criticize poor fans. There could be few exceptions. AFAIK, this is the general thing.


enga pOnaalum vida maatteengalaa :lol: but the bolded line is true.... :D

[raaja_rasigan]

Also, the time we spent for *our* favorites in the online world by writing our views can be easily spent for playing mokkai games in the system during office hours or by chatting

:exactly: hub-la edhukku thevai illama sandai poduroam... can be used for some study purpose also...

it is just like India cricket-la thoakkumnu therinje match pakkura madhiri... a kind of vetti interest

[MADDY]

it is just like India cricket-la thoakkumnu therinje match pakkura madhiri... a kind of vetti interest

that was right on the face - brutally honest :rotfl: :rotfl:

[dinesh2002]

and i feel its pure stupidity that fans pour milk for cut outs.... goodness.... do u know how much milk is wasted there?? u can easily donate those milks to the poor childs.... how many kids r on the streets that r hungry and yearning for atleast a cup of water... and these dumbos pour milk on cut outs as if they r some deities .... and sad to say this only happens in Tamil industry....[plz educate me if even Hindi, Telugu, Malayalam, Kannada fans do these same foolishness]....

The milk that we pour on our GODS can also be very well given to poor children. I agree with you on the 'Act' and why it should be stopped. Again, BELIEFS are restricted to a set of few. If one can ACCEPT milk abhisekam for our GODS, they can't question the BELIEF of a normal fan. It should be LEFT as a BELIEF.

Moreover, I am damn sure that welfare activities done by fan clubs (be it blood donation, helping blind children etc) won't be done by most of the PETERS who SIT in A/C rooms and criticize poor fans. There could be few exceptions. AFAIK, this is the general thing.

Dinesh - I had the same opinion of yours couple of years back. I have changed. It is little complicated and I don't know how to put it in right words.

Selva.... true... but i myself do not approve on the abhishegam for Gods as well. In the name of tradition cum religion, they r actually wasting many food product which could be used for useful purposes.... <---- this may be sensitive to the ardent devotees ... sorry for it, but just expressing my view...

yes Selva, that is the good part in a fan club. doing charity and blood donating.... like in ARR grp, I see many fans r doing anadhanam very often... thats a good sign.... :)

in every aspect or matter , there will be GOOD and BAD... everything.... so im pointing on the bad aspect and want some changes in it at least.... :)

[selvakumar]

Selva.... true... but i myself do not approve on the abhishegam for Gods as well. In the name of tradition cum religion, they r actually wasting many food product which could be used for useful purposes.... <---- this may be sensitive to the ardent devotees ... sorry for it, but just expressing my view...

yes Selva, that is the good part in a fan club. doing charity and blood donating.... like in ARR grp, I see many fans r doing anadhanam very often... thats a good sign.... :)

in every aspect or matter , there will be GOOD and BAD... everything.... so im pointing on the bad aspect and want some changes in it at least.... :)

Perfectly fine Dinesh. I don't have any problems with your views. But don't assume that fans who do that are all BAD and can harm the societal structure. They have their SPACE and room unlike religious fanatics and political rowdies. Fans are not what they are projected outside. As you said, there are fans in your group who consider Rahmaan as god. Similarly, many do charity works. Every aspect or matter has its own set of +ves and -ves. Be it actors, directors or music directors.

[jaiganes]

the point is that still there is a condition in our country that means there needs to be dhaanams to poor. If we keep spending crucial time on watching repeat after repeat the same movie, paalabishekams, wasting time on coordinating theatre visits and planning vitriole campaign on competitor films, there will be poverty that requires anna dhaanam , TV dhaanam etc., When will the poor of our country learn to go up in life without accepting status quo. What have the fans who are not all illiterates doing for that - they can use their intelligence to creating a generation that needs no dhaanam or one that gives no dhaanam to show their antrholpological side or that of their 'STAR'.
adhai vittuttu AC roomla okkandhu ezudharaan, fan keezhe okkaandhu ezudharaan is sappai kattu argument.

Also the over hyping of limited talent of a 'STAR' actually crushes real talent and blocks real talent from getting visibility or commercial viability. Indha 'STAR' irundhaa podhum kadhaye venaam andha aravekkaadu directorum padam eduthu First day grand openingle laabam paatudalaamgara kevalamaana situation ozhnjaa dhaan, cinema as a true art will become visible to our audience - till that date - it will be only a spectacle held hostage by - forgive my wording - visiladichaan _____ gal.

[lord_labakudoss]

I have a completely different take on this...
Gone are the days of one (or few) benevolent patrons of art. Now if you want to see good art, then that art form (good or bad) must be commerically viable.

People usually say good movies compete with bad movies. but they usually forget that *movies* compete with other forms of entertainment too. The Star system ensures that the industry as a whole (Producers, directors, Distributors, Theatre owners) all can make a living. It is because some movies/stars can create festive atmospheres out of movie watching that they compete so effectively with sports events, rock concerts etc. I think it is because of the Star system that movies in our part of the world earn so much revenue compared to other forms of entertainment.

Next, not all money earned disappears into the pockets of the stars. On average, I would guess that between 70-90% of a movie's collection goes to some one other than the star himself. I think that is still a great ratio!

[jaiganes]

70 to 90%? I doubt that.
Producers complain that the biggest chunk of movie making cost is consumed by the star. the first person to raise the salary if a film succeeds is the star. Add to that the new phenomenon of stars demanding a percentage of their film's total sales as the salary - this is nothing but post release payment /kappam for the star. What is the star going to do with that much money? make more high quality films? - No - and the money is ultimately the hard work of their fans who in the limited time they have for earning money toiled and put together. Finally the whole money they spend on a black ticket, hyped up FDFS ticket set by the theatres is another form of addiction like smoking, drinking, lottery etc., the creators have to still beg and plead with another producer. The producer - actor - distributor nexus is what is stopping the film world from unleashing creative genius pent up in our film world. I have seen many a writer and director who has seen gems from around the world like 'Midnight Cowboy' still yearning to make a movie atleast half that good - and midnight cowboy was released way back in 1970s. It is how backward we are as far as quality is concerned. Whenever low quality output is made a mega success - it destroys 10 other high quality films from being produced. Like one George bush vistory setting the whole world back by a decade.

[Wibha]

oh i never knew ARRahman was a normal person like u and me........wonderful......what is "low way" btw??

i think this will become yet another naan kadavul thread discussions.....there are some wrong assumptions from the "pagathhuarivu side" here:

1. Its the art and not personal character which draws people to a man.......rajinikanth or ajith didnt get fans just becos they were good people, ppl. got attracted to them, and their good behavior is just a value add..........so relationship betn a artist and a fan stays largely "art" and not personal as some think in HUB........
2. converse of it - why shouldnt we support a "criminal" - i mean, if osama bin laden makes a good movie, y shuldnt we appreciate it.......there enters personal perspective......there are people who see cinema people as part of society as well.......jsut like a corrupt politician is stoned by public, if caught (sad it is), a cinemaman with bad behavior will also be criticised......criticism on him based on his wrong public life however shuld be restricted to a social perspective and shuld not let that dominate the view of his product.....but, some people consider, neglecting his product is a token of "disappointment" with his social behavior...........
3. confusion betn real life and cinema life - its a pretty cliched line for educated people atleast for hubbers..........man, do u think a educated rajini fan thinks he can fight off 40 rowdies as he did in sivaji?? or a kamal fan thinks "cancer" can be cured by bullet shots.....or did anyone from a educated family lost career of life because of cinema.....i dont think people confuse cinema life with real life.......atleast educated people.......
4. assumption that jaiganes started for this purpose is wrong....he is peeved with movies getting good reviews just bcos of its fans.......so the line of arguements here are pretty disgressional

i certainly do not encourage fanatism, nobody is more important than urself in ur life but definitely feel education can only bring in this perspective......i'm sure this problem can be eradicated with increase in levels of education..............if someone has a job/career, why would he sit, thinking abt his idol???

low way-cheap way. doing paal abihshekham, karpoora pooja,worshiping,fighting for him/her. seriously it's not needed. are u sure that all those who have a job or career don't do all these things and think only about their work? well i'm stopping here. :)

[sarna_blr]

low way-cheap way. doing paal abihshekham, karpoora pooja,worshiping,fighting for him/her. seriously it's not needed. are u sure that all those who have a job or career don't do all these things and think only about their work? well i'm stopping here. :)

Kaalam kaalamaa nadandhuttu varudhu Arshu :wink: idha paththi pEsanum'naa kuraindhadhu 12 aam nootraandu varayil sella vEndum :lol2: 800 varushangalukku appuramum nee sonna (bolded lines) STOP aagala :lol:

[Roshan]

Roshan,
naan sollala?? :lol:

Yeah naanum idhayEthaan nenechEn :lol: :wink:

[Alek Niranjan]

70 to 90%? I doubt that.
Producers complain that the biggest chunk of movie making cost is consumed by the star. the first person to raise the salary if a film succeeds is the star. Add to that the new phenomenon of stars demanding a percentage of their film's total sales as the salary - this is nothing but post release payment /kappam for the star. What is the star going to do with that much money? make more high quality films? - No - and the money is ultimately the hard work of their fans who in the limited time they have for earning money toiled and put together. Finally the whole money they spend on a black ticket, hyped up FDFS ticket set by the theatres is another form of addiction like smoking, drinking, lottery etc., the creators have to still beg and plead with another producer. The producer - actor - distributor nexus is what is stopping the film world from unleashing creative genius pent up in our film world. I have seen many a writer and director who has seen gems from around the world like 'Midnight Cowboy' still yearning to make a movie atleast half that good - and midnight cowboy was released way back in 1970s. It is how backward we are as far as quality is concerned. Whenever low quality output is made a mega success - it destroys 10 other high quality films from being produced. Like one George bush vistory setting the whole world back by a decade.

Jaigaru

Now i can understand the intention of this thread.

[crajkumar_be]

Maddy,
Too bad even you are falling for age-old cliches and myths, even though they have been exposed yet again :(

:oops: this thread was tempting to resist :lol:
Maddy,
I meant something else :)
Anyway, never mind.. PM la solren

[Vivasaayi]

the issue starts when an actor starts to misuse his fans for his own benifits and the fan expects extra benifits from the actor other than entertainment.

this type of fanatism shouldnt make the actor feel like a king or god and shouldnt make the fan feel like a disciple of the actor in real life going by his onscreen personality

[crajkumar_be]

the issue starts when an actor starts to misuse his fans for his own benifits

[jaiganes]

70 to 90%? I doubt that.
Producers complain that the biggest chunk of movie making cost is consumed by the star. the first person to raise the salary if a film succeeds is the star. Add to that the new phenomenon of stars demanding a percentage of their film's total sales as the salary - this is nothing but post release payment /kappam for the star. What is the star going to do with that much money? make more high quality films? - No - and the money is ultimately the hard work of their fans who in the limited time they have for earning money toiled and put together. Finally the whole money they spend on a black ticket, hyped up FDFS ticket set by the theatres is another form of addiction like smoking, drinking, lottery etc., the creators have to still beg and plead with another producer. The producer - actor - distributor nexus is what is stopping the film world from unleashing creative genius pent up in our film world. I have seen many a writer and director who has seen gems from around the world like 'Midnight Cowboy' still yearning to make a movie atleast half that good - and midnight cowboy was released way back in 1970s. It is how backward we are as far as quality is concerned. Whenever low quality output is made a mega success - it destroys 10 other high quality films from being produced. Like one George bush vistory setting the whole world back by a decade.

Jaigaru

Now i can understand the intention of this thread.

Forget my intentions - post what you think - I just opened the thread - i am not moderating it. I guess this post and thread would equally offend fans of other big stars who have been churning out junk and still meeting BO success. If it offends - then that is the intention- satsfied?

[Alek Niranjan]

70 to 90%? I doubt that.
Producers complain that the biggest chunk of movie making cost is consumed by the star. the first person to raise the salary if a film succeeds is the star. Add to that the new phenomenon of stars demanding a percentage of their film's total sales as the salary - this is nothing but post release payment /kappam for the star. What is the star going to do with that much money? make more high quality films? - No - and the money is ultimately the hard work of their fans who in the limited time they have for earning money toiled and put together. Finally the whole money they spend on a black ticket, hyped up FDFS ticket set by the theatres is another form of addiction like smoking, drinking, lottery etc., the creators have to still beg and plead with another producer. The producer - actor - distributor nexus is what is stopping the film world from unleashing creative genius pent up in our film world. I have seen many a writer and director who has seen gems from around the world like 'Midnight Cowboy' still yearning to make a movie atleast half that good - and midnight cowboy was released way back in 1970s. It is how backward we are as far as quality is concerned. Whenever low quality output is made a mega success - it destroys 10 other high quality films from being produced. Like one George bush vistory setting the whole world back by a decade.

Jaigaru

Now i can understand the intention of this thread.

Forget my intentions - post what you think - I just opened the thread - i am not moderating it. I guess this post and thread would equally offend fans of other big stars who have been churning out junk and still meeting BO success. If it offends - then that is the intention- satsfied?

IMO

Nothing wrong in meeting BO Success. If there is no BO Success, the Creator will be forgottn.

[jaiganes]

70 to 90%? I doubt that.
Producers complain that the biggest chunk of movie making cost is consumed by the star. the first person to raise the salary if a film succeeds is the star. Add to that the new phenomenon of stars demanding a percentage of their film's total sales as the salary - this is nothing but post release payment /kappam for the star. What is the star going to do with that much money? make more high quality films? - No - and the money is ultimately the hard work of their fans who in the limited time they have for earning money toiled and put together. Finally the whole money they spend on a black ticket, hyped up FDFS ticket set by the theatres is another form of addiction like smoking, drinking, lottery etc., the creators have to still beg and plead with another producer. The producer - actor - distributor nexus is what is stopping the film world from unleashing creative genius pent up in our film world. I have seen many a writer and director who has seen gems from around the world like 'Midnight Cowboy' still yearning to make a movie atleast half that good - and midnight cowboy was released way back in 1970s. It is how backward we are as far as quality is concerned. Whenever low quality output is made a mega success - it destroys 10 other high quality films from being produced. Like one George bush vistory setting the whole world back by a decade.

Jaigaru

Now i can understand the intention of this thread.

Forget my intentions - post what you think - I just opened the thread - i am not moderating it. I guess this post and thread would equally offend fans of other big stars who have been churning out junk and still meeting BO success. If it offends - then that is the intention- satsfied?

IMO

Nothing wrong in meeting BO Success. If there is no BO Success, the Creator will be forgottn.
churning out junk part doesnt bother you or does it?
if it doesn't then we have no fiurther discussion - you have your well informed opinion and i have mine. OTOH if it does bother you to look at a 'favourite star's' BO hit film that is definitely a low quality one - then we have a discussion on

[m_23_bayarea]

Jaiganes, Just a few points that strike my mind... Not even sure if it applies to this thread in any way!

* A person becomes a fan of an actor, because he/she likes the works of that actor. But just because someone is a fan of an actor, it doesnt mean he/she "should" like all the movies of that actor by default. And it would be very unfair for that actor to take his fans for granted and expect them to like whatever movie he comes out with! It's the fan's choice to like or dislike his favorite actor's movie. Does it make him less of a fan or not a fan at all? Heq No!

* It would also be unfair for that fan to be ruled out by other fellow-fans for being honest abt his likes and dislikes!

* Basic concept: The job of an actor is to give good movies, if he wants to be liked by his fan! Only when a movie is good, it will be liked by the audience no matter how big the star is.

* An actor should take every movie seriously. He cannot just live with his past work/image for too long. If the actor does not put in the needed effort on the character, but just uses his image, it only will disappoint his fans more!

* Being a crazy fan is not a mistake! But just because you're a crazy fan, if you just approve of anything and everything your favorite does, whether it on-screen or off, then it's a mistake!

[jaiganes]

SPOT on - bay.
Being a fan is fine - but to worship only the star and disregard other priorities is not fine. if you fall at the feet of your parents just because a star told you- then there are two problems with you.
a- you weren't paying attention to all the right things screaming at you in the first place and
b- you let another entity take control - tomorrow the same star might start telling you what you should believe or not believe, whom to vote or not vote for - all dangerous forms of contorl you put on your head for sake of a 'fave star'.

[m_23_bayarea]

* The star should also realize how "embarassing" it is for an ardent fan in front of his friends and foes when he comes out with a bad movie! :oops:

* The problem is, calling a movie good or bad is very subjective, and just because a few fans dislike a movie, it doesnt always become a flop, and when it becomes a hit on the contrary, the star fails to realize he has come up with a bad movie, and continues to not put in the effort to come up with good ones! :cry:

[lord_labakudoss]

...
Whenever low quality output is made a mega success - it destroys 10 other high quality films from being produced. Like one George bush vistory setting the whole world back by a decade.
Would we ever say:
* When a <put yr 'favorite' bad book here> is published, it prevents 10 other potential 'Shakespeare's or 'Bernard Shaw's from being published.
* When a Kumudam/Ananda Vikatan become successful, the publishing industry is set back by a decade.

Why do we think that in the movie industry alone, people will choose one movie over another? Seriously, how many people decide "I will only watch 10 movies this year" (OK - NRIs may do this for movies in the theatre bcos of the exorbitant pricing, but those in India?)

My points were:
The industry will automatically scale to fulfill demand. If our stars do not provide this, other forms (non-movie forms) may step in and consume our thirst for entertainment.
Good movies do not have to compete on the same level as regular masala movies. They can choose to charge premiums based on an intro by the director. They can chooseto charge premiums for discussion circles or DVD-sharing/viewing groups. It is a choice they make to screen these movies in a densely populated theatre that offers the same environment that is offered to a masala movie.
Regards,
LL

[jaiganes]

The parallel stream from where a Rajini and Kamal came to their limelight has been not only abandoned by them, but frequently abused. Even last night, saw 'Aval Appadiththaan' and was amazed at the restrained, meaningful performances by Kamal and Rajini - the film was ahead by million miles the later work both the actors have done. Now they are not doing even one film like that - the reason - 'image' - a gauntlet put on their necks by their 'adoring' fans. While Rajini has a macho image - Kamal has a different image - an image that means that his films if they veer off in certain lines, will not be appreciated by their fans and that means will not be saleable - This is their bane. Even after some 15 years on top of this so called 'industry' they cannot do what they want to - hey ram bombed, Baba flopped - while Hey Raam failed because it was too much of a 'Kamal' movie, Baba flopped because it was not fully Rajni movie enough. This blind worshipping by their fans in a creative control which has kept the wonderfult artistes in shackles and is yet another reason why the 'blind worshipping' should stop and the actors be what they are. The fans enjoy the 'sadistic' pleasure of getting their stars do only what 'they' want their stars do onscreen. Meaning it is repeated kiss scenes for the heck of it for Kamal and completely unrealistic stunt scenes at 60 for Rajini - As far as other heroes are concerned - they are asked to a good measure of stupid things themselves - This is fine if it is pure entertainment like 'record dance' - this is cinema - most modern form of art - that has so much of talent in India but only a handful to show for in terms of achievment. Our cinema too like our dirty roads and poor hygene a matter of shame that we have learnt to not just tolerate - but celebrate!!! :oops: :oops:

[crajkumar_be]

Some Simple facts:

Fans alone HAVE NOT, DO NOT and CANNOT make a film a hit.
Kamal cannot do Hey Ram NOT because the fans don't want it, but rather, the general public does not want it. Some people don't know that there are quite a few FANATICS (rikshaw karan, pazha vandi kaaran, kasaappu kadai kaaran types) have watched films like Guna and Mahanadhi 30+ times (IN THEATERS, not DVDs).
Till recent times, fans could guarantee only the opening, no matter who the actor is - Rajini, Kamal, Ajith, Vijay. In today's scenario of wide releases, even the fans strength will not fill up all the theaters for the opening itself. Nowadays, the general public can go for a FDFS unlike in the past.
Its the general public who decide the fate of a film at the box office. Its always been that way

Kamal is trapped not by his fans but by the harsh realities of the market. To win a war, you might have to lose some battles. And he's doing one hell of an awesome job straddling the dichotomous divide in a tight-rope walk. He is peerless in this.


P.S: Fans did have an influence on Aandavar when they influenced him to change the title of "Drogi" to "Kurudhippunal" and also modify his character compared to the original.

[jaiganes]

but have influenced him to keep a intro song and fight in VV?
I dont dispute your facts of kasappukadai kaaran watching Guna 30 times in theatre as having been a person who has watched Guna in thatre 2 times and revisiting it on my DVD some 10 times myself.
However from 'Aval Appadithaan' to his recent films, his market clout and 'influence' has increased upwards and this means that he cantry out something new right - something better than 'Aval Appadithaan' - but touch your heart and say if such a movie has been made by him - Agreed - he is putting his money back into cinema - is it the cinema he set out to make with 'Aval Appadithaan'? there are reports how he contributed financially to the making of this movie as well as so many good ones of late 70s nd early eighties - when he did not enjoy the 'star' status.
When he acquired 'star status', fan base - a base with fans like you and me - who are ready to consume whatever he gives, while we got our 'Pushpaks' and 'Mahanadhi's they were still not enough - and why the need for grandiose projects? what happened to 'Aval Appadithaan' type of films that are relevant even now? why did they die out - because the young and talented Kamal and Rajini simply showed their backs to such projects as they would not be accepted by their ' fans ' a good sample of the paying public - isn't it - by your own admission - kasappu padaikaaran, rickshaw kaaran, software engineers and doctors - al who want to be the best in their fields, but would not appreciate if their heroes do a 'Aval appadithaan' now. If they would then by market dynamics such movies with either kamal or rajini should have happened in large numbers by now.

[m_23_bayarea]

Some Simple facts:

Fans alone HAVE NOT, DO NOT and CANNOT make a film a hit.



Sorry to disagree! But I think there are a ton of crap movies that have become huge hits or atleast mediocre hits just cos the lead actor has/had a lot of fans...

On the other hand, many "great" movies have gone without a trace just because the lead actor doesnt have enough "mass" support! :oops:

Or atleast a big difference in the revenue/profits... Fans just increase the market size quite easily!

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

fans can never make a movie a hit, its like, thondars can never make a party win. its general audience both ways.

if a star gives continious hits, some part of general audience too slides as his fan and watch even his crap movies. but once some movie doesnt click, they are the 1st one to pullout themselves, whereas fan will be finding hard positives and will project thr movie as a good one. thats the difference, so sometimes a general audience who has a more liking on an actor is mistaken as a fan. No. never.

whatever it is, fans never have the power to make a movie hit. its all in the hands of general audience.

[m_23_bayarea]

if a star gives continious hits, some part of general audience too slides as his fan and watch even his crap movies. but once some movie doesnt click, they are the 1st one to pullout themselves, whereas fan will be finding hard positives and will project thr movie as a good one

I guess you're proving the title of this thread! :P 8-) :P

[sakaLAKALAKAlaa Vallavar]

i dont know what u mean but i gladly have posted negative news on kamal, dasa, vv or whatever. i am neutral and always ready to prove that. infact ppl like bala and DM rub with me sometimes when i said something different about kamal. a search will tell truth

at the same time, YES, I AM ONE GREAT FAN OF KAMAL HAASAN

[crajkumar_be]

If you feel no movie of his has bettered AA, its fine. unga karuthu (i rate AA very highly myself, one of the very best ever made).
AnA, it does not mean its been only downhill since then. Being one of the two biggest stars in the state, avar edutha muyarchigal ellam vera yarum eduthirukka mudiyadhu (of course NT apart).

"can try something new"-a? Come on, avar try pannaadhadha? And what is wrong with grandiose projects?

And avar remba naalaikkappuram ippo dhaan seriyaana paadhayil poikkondirukkiraar. Konjam porumaya irunga. Unga porumaya veen poga veikka maattaar!




but have influenced him to keep a intro song and fight in VV?
I dont dispute your facts of kasappukadai kaaran watching Guna 30 times in theatre as having been a person who has watched Guna in thatre 2 times and revisiting it on my DVD some 10 times myself.
However from 'Aval Appadithaan' to his recent films, his market clout and 'influence' has increased upwards and this means that he cantry out something new right - something better than 'Aval Appadithaan' - but touch your heart and say if such a movie has been made by him - Agreed - he is putting his money back into cinema - is it the cinema he set out to make with 'Aval Appadithaan'? there are reports how he contributed financially to the making of this movie as well as so many good ones of late 70s nd early eighties - when he did not enjoy the 'star' status.
When he acquired 'star status', fan base - a base with fans like you and me - who are ready to consume whatever he gives, while we got our 'Pushpaks' and 'Mahanadhi's they were still not enough - and why the need for grandiose projects? what happened to 'Aval Appadithaan' type of films that are relevant even now? why did they die out - because the young and talented Kamal and Rajini simply showed their backs to such projects as they would not be accepted by their ' fans ' a good sample of the paying public - isn't it - by your own admission - kasappu padaikaaran, rickshaw kaaran, software engineers and doctors - al who want to be the best in their fields, but would not appreciate if their heroes do a 'Aval appadithaan' now. If they would then by market dynamics such movies with either kamal or rajini should have happened in large numbers by now.

[crajkumar_be]

Sorry to disagree! But I think there are a ton of crap movies that have become huge hits or atleast mediocre hits just cos the lead actor has/had a lot of fans...

On the other hand, many "great" movies have gone without a trace just because the lead actor doesnt have enough "mass" support! :oops:

Or atleast a big difference in the revenue/profits... Fans just increase the market size quite easily!
Bay,
neenga solra maadhiri irundha oru Aalavandhaan-o, Baba-o nadandhirukkaadhu. yen indha rendu padatha solrennaa the tremendous hype and expectation these films had. After a certain level, the general fublic have to carry the film

[kannannn]

However from 'Aval Appadithaan' to his recent films, his market clout and 'influence' has increased upwards and this means that he cantry out something new right - something better than 'Aval Appadithaan' - but touch your heart and say if such a movie has been made by him - Agreed - he is putting his money back into cinema - is it the cinema he set out to make with 'Aval Appadithaan'? there are reports how he contributed financially to the making of this movie as well as so many good ones of late 70s nd early eighties - when he did not enjoy the 'star' status.
When he acquired 'star status', fan base - a base with fans like you and me - who are ready to consume whatever he gives, while we got our 'Pushpaks' and 'Mahanadhi's they were still not enough - and why the need for grandiose projects? what happened to 'Aval Appadithaan' type of films that are relevant even now? why did they die out - because the young and talented Kamal and Rajini simply showed their backs to such projects as they would not be accepted by their ' fans ' a good sample of the paying public - isn't it - by your own admission - kasappu padaikaaran, rickshaw kaaran, software engineers and doctors - al who want to be the best in their fields, but would not appreciate if their heroes do a 'Aval appadithaan' now. If they would then by market dynamics such movies with either kamal or rajini should have happened in large numbers by now.

I think you are crossing the line from objectivity to subjectivity when you say there has not been a better film than Aval Appadithan. So I won't argue on that.

If your grouse is that he fills gaps between good movies with 'commercial' ventures then I would point you to the review of 'Dark Knight' on Guardian here (http://www.guardian.co.uk/film/2008/jul/25/actionandadventure1). Now anyone following Nolan's career graph would agree that the Dark Knight is a departure from his earlier efforts and would not be particularly relished by his fans. The last paragraph of the review says:
"..at the risk of sounding priggish, I can't help thinking it may be a bit of a career blind-alley for the talented director who gave us brilliant and disquieting movies like Following (1998) and Memento (2000), whose inventions still linger in the mind. The Dark Knight's massive box-office success has surely given Nolan the means to write his own cheque, and in addition something sweeter still - clout. I hope that he will use it to cultivate movies that are smaller and more manoeuvrable than that great armoured Batmobile."

This applies all the more to our movie industry. Inge, 'clout' sambaadhikkiradhu mattum mukkiyam illai. Adhai thakka vaithukkollavum theriya vendum. Adharkkaaga, Oru 'Hey Ram'irkkum 'Virumandi'kkum naduve Panchathandiramum PKS seivathu avasiyamaagirathu.

[crajkumar_be]

Adharkkaaga, Oru 'Hey Ram'irkkum 'Virumandi'kkum naduve Panchathandiramum PKS seivathu avasiyamaagirathu.
I slightly disagree here. Nothing "personal" against P5/PKS but i would rather he did a Dasa (or say, 1/10th of it) between a Hey Ram and Virumaandi than a P5/PKS :)

My wish is simple: Tholvi adainja Hey Ram, Mahanadhi madhiri padam pannittu thothu po, adhu actually vetri. Illai, VV/Dasa madhiri padam pannu. Not that i'm placing VV and Dasa on equal pedestals. No way!

[equanimus]

Just a specific point. (I'd like to stay away from waxing eloquent on how Tamil cinema "should be" and so on. It has always looked like an out-and-out NP-complete problem to me. :))

I'm not sure if the media is actively appreciating only the films of these big stars we're talking about. Of course, it all becomes completely subjective. Depending on how much one appreciates a film vis-a-vis the proverbial "general response." I feel just about every film with even the slightest of artistic ambition is by and large celebrated by the media. The mainstream critics seem to lap them all up. In the past couple of decades, I can pick just a handful of films that I feel didn't get a favourable response overall from the media despite being pretty good.

To put it differently, I don't see media's lapping up 'dasavathAram' -- for example -- as just a case of "not wanting to earn the wrath of a big star." Of course, great hype on these films leads to greater celebration, but that's part of the game. That's why they are hyped at first place.

[crajkumar_be]

To put it differently, I don't see media's lapping up 'dasavathAram' -- for example -- as just a case of "not wanting to earn the wrath of a big star." Of course, great hype on these films leads to greater celebration, but that's part of the game. That's why they are hyped at first place.
Small nitpick :razz:
1. The media's lapping up of Dasavatharam is certainly not commensurate to its success and certainly less than what its skill and craft command, speaking in the context of its relative weighted worth among Tamil films :)
2. "Earn the wrath of a big star" certainly does not apply to Kamal Haasan. No way :)

[jaiganes]

There is a distinct feel of aping hollywood and bollywood when it comes to describing good movies/attempts by top talents like Kamal here. That is the path he does not wish Thamizh film world to take but unfortunately everything he does from creation, packaging to distribution has a huge hollywood after effect - it is market driven and will surely be a big burden for the 99% of talented film makers here to follow with just 10% of the market Hindi cinema has. The market oriented thought process is exactly what people like Rudraiyya , Kamal and KB sought to destroy with avant garde efforts like AA. I brought Aval Appadithaan into picture because it shows that we as artistes made a movie like this in 1978 before the concerned talents had fan worship and 30 years later we haven't churned out one hard hitting drama like this since and that is a sign of decay and deterioration that will precede a fall. What happens after Kamal and Rajini - one more set of stars allright - but have they done something like Aval appadithaan? Answer no - not even in their dreams - then it will follow that good films will become stuff of legends and archives and 'engeyo kelvi patta' facts than 'rare occassions'. Then we will be staring at our own cultural death heralded by decaying tastes - market machinations - the ultimate sell out of creativity. It is certainly not what people who participated in Aval appadithaan did not want to see 30 years since.

[jaiganes]

However from 'Aval Appadithaan' to his recent films, his market clout and 'influence' has increased upwards and this means that he cantry out something new right - something better than 'Aval Appadithaan' - but touch your heart and say if such a movie has been made by him - Agreed - he is putting his money back into cinema - is it the cinema he set out to make with 'Aval Appadithaan'? there are reports how he contributed financially to the making of this movie as well as so many good ones of late 70s nd early eighties - when he did not enjoy the 'star' status.
When he acquired 'star status', fan base - a base with fans like you and me - who are ready to consume whatever he gives, while we got our 'Pushpaks' and 'Mahanadhi's they were still not enough - and why the need for grandiose projects? what happened to 'Aval Appadithaan' type of films that are relevant even now? why did they die out - because the young and talented Kamal and Rajini simply showed their backs to such projects as they would not be accepted by their ' fans ' a good sample of the paying public - isn't it - by your own admission - kasappu padaikaaran, rickshaw kaaran, software engineers and doctors - al who want to be the best in their fields, but would not appreciate if their heroes do a 'Aval appadithaan' now. If they would then by market dynamics such movies with either kamal or rajini should have happened in large numbers by now.

I think you are crossing the line from objectivity to subjectivity when you say there has not been a better film than Aval Appadithan. So I won't argue on that.

If your grouse is that he fills gaps between good movies with 'commercial' ventures then I would point you to the review of 'Dark Knight' on Guardian here (http://www.guardian.co.uk/film/2008/jul/25/actionandadventure1). Now anyone following Nolan's career graph would agree that the Dark Knight is a departure from his earlier efforts and would not be particularly relished by his fans. The last paragraph of the review says:
"..at the risk of sounding priggish, I can't help thinking it may be a bit of a career blind-alley for the talented director who gave us brilliant and disquieting movies like Following (1998) and Memento (2000), whose inventions still linger in the mind. The Dark Knight's massive box-office success has surely given Nolan the means to write his own cheque, and in addition something sweeter still - clout. I hope that he will use it to cultivate movies that are smaller and more manoeuvrable than that great armoured Batmobile."

This applies all the more to our movie industry. Inge, 'clout' sambaadhikkiradhu mattum mukkiyam illai. Adhai thakka vaithukkollavum theriya vendum. Adharkkaaga, Oru 'Hey Ram'irkkum 'Virumandi'kkum naduve Panchathandiramum PKS seivathu avasiyamaagirathu.
To begin with - I am not against an actor doing movie 'X' or movie 'Y' - but when both are being made only to taste commercial success, there sets in a depression that 'I made movie Y - which is ulaga tharam - but people did not accept' argument - not that Kamal is deterred because of that - but it means that the bank balance becomes difficult to manage and it necessitates more 'X' movies - which brings down the overall average quality of our movies even further down - A movie like Aval Appadithaan or 'Thanneer Thanneer' doesn't cost millions and can earn its value back in just film festival screenings and national award money - why not do that? why keep throwing your best work to market and say people have not improved their taste, it is market and lets us not hallucinate that our thazh janagal are all connoisseurs of fine art. The prime bane is the absence of arthouse cinemas and people like Kamal - who have piles of knowledge on this subject should create a parallel movement towards that, free from clutches of market - fans and so called 'general public'. Hollywood or bollywood stars need not do that - however we are regional and to preserve our sensibilities we need to have our own treasure cove.

[kannannn]

Adharkkaaga, Oru 'Hey Ram'irkkum 'Virumandi'kkum naduve Panchathandiramum PKS seivathu avasiyamaagirathu.
I slightly disagree here. Nothing "personal" against P5/PKS but i would rather he did a Dasa (or say, 1/10th of it) between a Hey Ram and Virumaandi than a P5/PKS :)
Hmm, actually yes. P5 and PKS are neither here nor there. But, I think that 'genre' has sort of become a safe bet for Kamal. IMO, a film like VV or Dasa carries higher stakes than PKS (even I couldn't help thinking back to AV before Dasa's release). And coming to think of it, PK5 and PKS even offer better scope for creativity than VV or Dasa.

I'd like to stay away from waxing eloquent on how Tamil cinema "should be" and so on. It has always looked like an out-and-out NP-complete problem to me.
:lol: All Indian film industries come under the set. Solve one and you solve them all.

[P_R]

I'd like to stay away from waxing eloquent on how Tamil cinema "should be" and so on. It has always looked like an out-and-out NP-complete problem to me. :) :lol:

[equanimus]

Small nitpick :razz:
1. The media's lapping up of Dasavatharam is certainly not commensurate to its success and certainly less than what its skill and craft command, speaking in the context of its relative weighted worth among Tamil films :)
2. "Earn the wrath of a big star" certainly does not apply to Kamal Haasan. No way :)
Bala,
1. I'm not talking about the box office reports et al. The critical response has been positive enough (!) for 'dasAvathAram' as far as I see.
2. "nEkku adhu theriyAdhu." :P By the way, I was not referring to Kamal Haasan the individual here, but rather "Kamal Haasan" as the whole Tamil film world understands, which I believe was what Jaiganes meant too.

[m_23_bayarea]

Bay,
neenga solra maadhiri irundha oru Aalavandhaan-o, Baba-o nadandhirukkaadhu. yen indha rendu padatha solrennaa the tremendous hype and expectation these films had. After a certain level, the general fublic have to carry the film

CR, :P

But even in those movies, remember the amazing opening! That's possible only with big stars, because of their fans. No matter how bad the movies are, this "opening" factor makes a big difference in the revenue even if that movie fails to make profit. And this is possible only with fans. If a big star comes up with a really bad movie, there is still this opening and a revenue as a result. If some unknown actor comes up with the same movie, it will bite the dust from day 1 itself I guess! :)

[P_R]

>digr>
Warning: Irrelevant analogy ahead.

Track comedies are travesties against film grammar. But without that there would be no Goundamani.

Between grammar and Goundamani I think the choice is eminently clear.

<end digr.<

[m_23_bayarea]

Add to that, there are some actors(?) that are "made" stars only because they have a lot of fans! This is probably the worst proposition... :roll:

I put a "?" after actors here just cos I'm not sure if some of these will exist as actors if only for their talents/skills and not for their fans! :oops:

Whether they're good actors or not again becomes a matter of subjectivity just like good or bad movies. Perhaps, they may even have so many fans because those fans might think these actors have the best skills to entertain them! :P

[jaiganes]

>digr>
Warning: Irrelevant analogy ahead.

Track comedies are travesties against film grammar. But without that there would be no Goundamani.

Between grammar and Goundamani I think the choice is eminently clear.

<end digr.<

Not a totally irrelevant analogy.
It is a peculiarity of Regional cinema/ to an extent Indian cinema stemming from the theatre roots of our stories where there was a vidhooshak cheering the audience while the main players changed into the costumes of the next scene.
When we speak of responsible arthouse ventures, we dont ostracise the tradition of regional cinema, 'Mullum Malarum' had a comedy track with VA moorthy. Keladi Kanmani had fabulous track with Janagaraj and when controlled properly, it can add value to the movie.

[P_R]

Oh I was just being modest :mrgreen: By saying this I guess I have counterbalanced. I was not talking about accomodating the 'traditional'. I was trying to build an anarchic case for the impossibility of overarching objective standards at all. A case I won't buy myself.

I don't understand the film business much but writing in order to understand is what Hubbing is all about !

When the multiplex boom hit us a few years back there was a lot of talk about how this would revolutionize films. How it would make it the preserve of the 'judicious' filmgoers. Indeed Hindi Cinema started having a lot of films which were urbane and quite consciously not catering to the general public. Can't imagine some of the Hindi films released in metros being released in Saharanpur, UP. Yes that is condescending.

Apart from wide market of indhi cinema, one other reason was that film technology was getting cheap. Digital cameras with lesser demands for light and quick processing. I remember some movie that got made by a crew of 12 people ! (Was it Revathi's Mitr)

So even if not the first, the second reason should have seeped into TFI. Has it ? Is that the reason why we saw several small good films in 2007.

If so then 'stars' can make films small enough to be tax write-offs !
But like all artists the lure of a wider applause (and money) is likely immensely attractive even if makes the 'judicious grieve'.
We can all be happily judgemental about that.

Note: I am ware that small is not always beautiful. I had the misfortune of sitting through mind-numbing films like 'White Noise'.Saharanpur brethren may have not been the passive Mumbai audience and would have set the theatre ablaze thereby registering the proper response for that film. I condescend again.

Bottomline: If filmmaking and exhibition are indeed getting cheap, then we will start seeing good (this word is pregnant with arrogance !) films, no matter what.

[crajkumar_be]

CR, :P

But even in those movies, remember the amazing opening! That's possible only with big stars, because of their fans. No matter how bad the movies are, this "opening" factor makes a big difference in the revenue even if that movie fails to make profit. And this is possible only with fans. If a big star comes up with a really bad movie, there is still this opening and a revenue as a result. If some unknown actor comes up with the same movie, it will bite the dust from day 1 itself I guess! :)
Fair enough

[crajkumar_be]

>digr>
Warning: Irrelevant analogy ahead.

Track comedies are travesties against film grammar. But without that there would be no Goundamani.

Between grammar and Goundamani I think the choice is eminently clear.

<end digr.<
:rotfl: :thumbsup:
["Pertinent-ngaraaru"]

[kannannn]

A movie like Aval Appadithaan or 'Thanneer Thanneer' doesn't cost millions and can earn its value back in just film festival screenings and national award money - why not do that?
The costs incurred in making a film is bound by subject matter, technology and presentation. Parallel cinema is mostly restricted to experimentation with subject matter due to cost constraints. The more complex the setting, the more difficult it is to keep the budget small.Throw in the desire to fiddle with new techniques (think graphics) and you are already on your way to building a behemoth. And then there is the matter of wider recognition as PR put it. Rudraiyya and KB didn't have to deal with that.

BTW, do you seriously think Mullum Malarum can be classified as parallel cinema? I think it is blatantly commercial.

[jaiganes]

A movie like Aval Appadithaan or 'Thanneer Thanneer' doesn't cost millions and can earn its value back in just film festival screenings and national award money - why not do that?
The costs incurred in making a film is bound by subject matter, technology and presentation. Parallel cinema is mostly restricted to experimentation with subject matter due to cost constraints. The more complex the setting, the more difficult it is to keep the budget small.Throw in the desire to fiddle with new techniques (think graphics) and you are already on your way to building a behemoth. And then there is the matter of wider recognition as PR put it. Rudraiyya and KB didn't have to deal with that.

BTW, do you seriously think Mullum Malarum can be classified as parallel cinema? I think it is blatantly commercial.

Mullum malarum is arthouse material with arthouse sensibility - If Mahendran had been in Bengal - it would have been arthouse - it even qualifies to be classified as independant film for some portions funded by mahendran and Kamal

[thamiz]

Milk Abishekam + Soodam
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JUScosGFTy8

Crowd
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v1xUitaG9bc

Milk Abishekam 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9r99X2jo2Oc

----------------------------------------

I am sure, this wont be condemned by many who complains about blind-worshipping or whatsoever! :lol:

[Vivasaayi]

Milk Abishekam + Soodam
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JUScosGFTy8

Crowd
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v1xUitaG9bc

Milk Abishekam 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9r99X2jo2Oc

----------------------------------------

I am sure, this wont be condemned by many who complains about blind-worshipping or whatsoever! :lol:

1.the hero dint warrant these type of activities.he is strictly against these galataas.


2.the hero dint maintain the rasigar mandram for the sake of his own benifit and has clear cut visions abt his narpani mandrams and so are his fans.

[jaiganes]

To be true to both Rajini and Kamal - they have stayed away from manipulaing their fan clubs (or narpani mandrams - just a name) for political or selfish gains. However there is an image/culture/sub culture that has been established in thamizh naadu for fans - no matter how hard the concerned heroes wish, fans have to compete and in the process are bound to do all sortsa rubbish. what we can expect from the stars is to follow Sivakumar's path in abolishing all the fan clubs and that takes a lot of guts.

[thamiz]

1.the hero dint warrant these type of activities.he is strictly against these galataas.


2.the hero dint maintain the rasigar mandram for the sake of his own benifit and has clear cut visions abt his narpani mandrams and so are his fans.

Nobody talks about the "hero" here as you can see from the title.

I am only talking about "visiladichchAn kunjukaL"!

[Anban]

To be true to both Rajini and Kamal - they have stayed away from manipulaing their fan clubs (or narpani mandrams - just a name) for political or selfish gains. However there is an image/culture/sub culture that has been established in thamizh naadu for fans - no matter how hard the concerned heroes wish, fans have to compete and in the process are bound to do all sortsa rubbish. what we can expect from the stars is to follow Sivakumar's path in abolishing all the fan clubs and that takes a lot of guts. lots of political dialogues in his movies..
Recent example is the deletion of the so-called matured dialogue in kuselan.

[jaiganes]

political dialogues in movies is commonplace anban!!
If I make a movie with you in the lead or the vice versa there is no escaping the punch dialogue or politicaly loaded dialogue.
What i am saying is the real life.
Even when the baba crisis bloomed, Rajini did not incite violence then, but asked the fans to respond by voting in an election.

[Vivasaayi]

To be true to both Rajini and Kamal - they have stayed away from manipulaing their fan clubs

did rajni make himself clear abt his political stand for all these years to make his fans understand his state of mind?

[Nerd]

To be true to both Rajini and Kamal - they have stayed away from manipulaing their fan clubs

did rajni make himself clear abt his political stand for all these years to make his fans understand his state of mind?
I am sorry but your logic or the lack of it is appalling to say the least. Its not Rajini manipulating his fans, its the other way around. Most of the fans (I mean fans with uRuppiNar attaigaL) wanted Rajini to come to politics before bAbA. After the bAbA debacle and PMK's clean sweep at least 30% of Rajini fan clubs were dissolved. WHY? they were disappointed. Rajini never made any promises and even NOW all the fans are urging him to take the plunge, they'll visited chennai recently only to be sent back. They are again going to meet him in the second week of October. They want Rajini to come to politics, they are citing MGR as an example and right from muRattukkALai days they are seeing him as an MGR but Rajini - not that way 8-)

[crajkumar_be]

To be true to both Rajini and Kamal - they have stayed away from manipulaing their fan clubs (or narpani mandrams - just a name) for political or selfish gains.
You couldn't have been further off the mark in this, sorry to say...

Among the present actors (with considerable fan base), Kamal Haasan and Ajith Kumar are the only ones not to "manipulate" their fan clubs for ulterior gains

[NOV]

I think Sivakumar is to be the only one to be admired in this matter. Surya should follow his footsteps.

[joe]

I think Sivakumar is to be the only one to be admired in this matter. Surya should follow his footsteps.

Do you think Sivakumar had dedicated fans in large number? :roll:
There might be few countable people came and ask Sivakumar ,just for they can be a leader of some organisation and sivakumar could have rejected it .

I don't deny that even if sivakumar had dedicated fans like NT and MT , still there is a chance of his rejection.

But before kamal ,rajini ..only NT and MT had dedicated fans (willing to start mantram)

[NOV]

and I thought Joe is well-versed in these kind of matters. :lol:

Joe, let murali srinivas come and answer your question. I stand by what I said. 8-)

[crajkumar_be]

I think Sivakumar is to be the only one to be admired in this matter. Surya should follow his footsteps.

Do you think Sivakumar had dedicated fans in large number? :roll:
There might be few countable people came and ask Sivakumar ,just for they can be a leader of some organisation and sivakumar could have rejected it .

I don't deny that even if sivakumar had dedicated fans like NT and MT , still there is a chance of his rejection.

But before kamal ,rajini ..only NT and MT had dedicated fans (willing to start mantram)
:exactly:

P.S: Sivakumar influenced Aandavar in the decision to do away with rasigar mandrams and converting them into narpani iyakkams

[NOV]

thanks crajkumar_be for the acknowledgement of Sivakumar's influence. Its definitely not easy to do what he did and the bigger you get the more difficult it becomes.

[crajkumar_be]

To be true to both Rajini and Kamal - they have stayed away from manipulaing their fan clubs

did rajni make himself clear abt his political stand for all these years to make his fans understand his state of mind?
Viv,
Not having a clear political stand is not a crime. However, asking your fans to vote out PMK just because you had a personal problem with them is.
Changing allegiance/support over a period of time is perfectly fine but not if driven by the need to manipulate for personal gains, without any issue-based grounds. As a person, this is acceptable but once in the domain of public/quasi political life with an image-boosting campaign to boot, one becomes fair game

[joe]

and I thought Joe is well-versed in these kind of matters. :lol:

I don't know what does it mean ? :lol:

Being a fan is different from member of Rasigar mantram

In rasigar mantram ,only two category of people

1. Really dedicated fan ,love for the favourite goes beyond just enjoy the movies and just talk about it.

2. People who wanted to use Actor's popularity for their personal benefit ,by just getting a post in the organisation.

Not all actors get reasonable amount of people in first category... If no possibilty of getting much people of first category ,not much people will be interested to be a second category ,since not much benefit can be expected :lol:

I have been a fan of NT and Kamal ,but never been a member of rasigar mantram :wink:

[Nerd]

However, asking your fans to vote out PMK just because you had a personal problem with them is.
He did not ask us to do that, did he! The anti-baba PMK thingi happened first and we rasigargaL felt insulted and were put off. We urged Rajini to say something, he said something - not an effective/clear statement mind you. He was simply provoked by us. You may want to ask other Rajini fans (those who has/had uRuppiNar attaigaL)

Bottomline: Its only we fans who wanted him to lash out on PMK at that time 8-)

[NOV]

I don't know what does it mean ? :lol: it means we are not talking about opinions but facts. and thats why its better that ppl like murali clarify things for you.

[joe]

I don't know what does it mean ? :lol: it means we are not talking about opinions but facts. and thats why its better that ppl like murali clarify things for you.

You can't come to the conclusion of Political party and Fan clubs just by mere statistics ,IMO.

[selvakumar]

I don't know what does it mean ? :lol: it means we are not talking about opinions but facts. and thats why its better that ppl like murali clarify things for you.
I don't understand your point of view. Sivakumar ah mattum eppadi nambureenga ? Athavathu avarukkunnu yaarum cut-out, banner, t-shirt adikalengirathalayaa ? I agree Murali sir might throw more light on this. But if you want to look at facts - this manipulation thing should come out from the respective fans (sivakumar fans) with utmost honesty. Also, *mass* is totally different.

There is a hell lot of difference between masses of kamal, chiru, rajini, ajith, vijay etc and the likes of Sivakumar. This is a fact. This is what CR, Joe are referring to. Those who can do anything for their star. Ivangala use pannama irukkirathu thaan kastam.. 8-)

The greatness lies in controlling the fans and not manipulating them for their benefits.

[NOV]

Greatness lies in ensuring there are no such things as fan clubs (wasting good time) and refusing artificial titles.

[selvakumar]

Greatness lies in ensuring there are no such things as fan clubs (wasting good time) and refusing artificial titles.
It is your opinion. Need not be fact.

[P_R]

Greatness lies in ensuring there are no such things as fan clubs (wasting good time) and refusing artificial titles. paasakkAra pasanga aasappadattu seyyumbOdhu thatta mudiyumA :-)

[equanimus]

I'm reminded of one of the funniest (and profoundest) lines ever spoken in films.

From a scene in Life Of Brian.

BRIAN:
I'm not the Messiah! Will you please listen? I am not the Messiah, do you understand?! Honestly!
GIRL:
Only the true Messiah denies His divinity.
BRIAN:
What?! Well, what sort of chance does that give me? All right! I am the Messiah!
FOLLOWERS:
He is! He is the Messiah!
BRIAN:
Now, f*ck off!
[silence]
ARTHUR:
How shall we f*ck off, O Lord?

[VENKIRAJA]

I'm reminded of one of the funniest (and profoundest) lines ever spoken in films.

From a scene in Life Of Brian.

BRIAN:
I'm not the Messiah! Will you please listen? I am not the Messiah, do you understand?! Honestly!
GIRL:
Only the true Messiah denies His divinity.
BRIAN:
What?! Well, what sort of chance does that give me? All right! I am the Messiah!
FOLLOWERS:
He is! He is the Messiah!
BRIAN:
Now, f*ck off!
[silence]
ARTHUR:
How shall we f*ck off, O Lord?

:rotfl:
:lol:
WOW!

[Vivasaayi]

I think Sivakumar is to be the only one to be admired in this matter. Surya should follow his footsteps.

:lol:

sivakumar mattuma...ravichandran,muthuraman,jaishankar yaarume fan clubsa misuse panla(irundha thana...sattiliye illayam.agappaila epdi varum)

[Vivasaayi]

To be true to both Rajini and Kamal - they have stayed away from manipulaing their fan clubs

did rajni make himself clear abt his political stand for all these years to make his fans understand his state of mind?
Viv,
Not having a clear political stand is not a crime. However, asking your fans to vote out PMK just because you had a personal problem with them is.
Changing allegiance/support over a period of time is perfectly fine but not if driven by the need to manipulate for personal gains, without any issue-based grounds. As a person, this is acceptable but once in the domain of public/quasi political life with an image-boosting campaign to boot, one becomes fair game

what i mean is when lots of fans are meeting satyanarayana and placing requests on starting a political party

adhellam onnum kedayadhu...poyi polappa paarungannu sollalame

:roll:

[thamiz]

what i mean is when lots of fans are meeting satyanarayana and placing requests on starting a political party

adhellam onnum kedayadhu...poyi polappa paarungannu sollalame

:roll:

Not all fans are stupid.

MGR fans of those days became the ministers later.

Some rajni fans want to use Rajni for their advantage!

Are they BLIND?! :lol:

[ajithfederer]

Manipulation eh, Naanga dhan pesavae maatom-la :)


To be true to both Rajini and Kamal - they have stayed away from manipulaing their fan clubs (or narpani mandrams - just a name) for political or selfish gains.
You couldn't have been further off the mark in this, sorry to say...

Among the present actors (with considerable fan base), Kamal Haasan and Ajith Kumar are the only ones not to "manipulate" their fan clubs for ulterior gains

[Vivasaayi]

thamiz,

i am not mentioning that the fans are saint...im just asking why dint rajni put a full stop to their political wishes

[MADDY]

Greatness lies in ensuring there are no such things as fan clubs (wasting good time) and refusing artificial titles.
It is your opinion. Need not be fact.

we need comprehensive data on academic/career success rate of fanatics/non-fanatics......some jokes and comments flaying fanatics here is very irritating and lacks basic understanding of ground realities.....ok, let us make a list of hub-fanatics - we are sure to have 100% success rate :lol:

being a fanatic doesent mean, u have lost ur family or career :huh:

[Nerd]

viv, that was because rajini is not sure himself!!

And the 30% that quit were irritated by his behavior. The remains are mostly *good* now!!

[thamiz]

thamiz,

i am not calling the fans are saint...im just asking why dint rajni put a full stop to their political wishes

The title suggests that fans are stupid and blind worshippers.

Thirunaavukkarasu, and kaalimuththu were MGR fans (blind worshippers??) and became ministers later!

[Vivasaayi]

viv, that was because rajini is not sure himself!!

And the 30% that quit were irritated by his behavior. The remains are mostly *good* now!!

fine :)

[selvakumar]

Some rajni fans want to use Rajni for their advantage!
Are they BLIND?! :lol:
thamiz,
:roll:
Viv was referring to > aama illa - intha kelvikku answer. Fans generally want their star to reach a level above the current position. Avanga nenappu thappu illai. But interest irukka illayaannu sollurathu ovvoru nadigaroda kadamai...mathavangalukku sollattiyum rasigargal kitta mattum sollalaam.. illaya ? :)

[selvakumar]

we need comprehensive data on academic/career success rate of fanatics/non-fanatics......some jokes and comments flaying fanatics here is very irritating and lacks basic understanding of ground realities.....ok, let us make a list of hub-fanatics - we are sure to have 100% success rate :lol:

being a fanatic doesent mean, u have lost ur family or career :huh:

:rotfl:

Pretend to the world that you are not a fanatic. Bash the people who are fanatics. Ask them whether they became fans only because their favorite follows religion 'I'.

appuram itha ellam pannittu, fanatic pannura ella velayum pannanum :lol: athu thaan hub logic 8-)

[jaiganes]

To be true to both Rajini and Kamal - they have stayed away from manipulaing their fan clubs

did rajni make himself clear abt his political stand for all these years to make his fans understand his state of mind?
Viv,
Not having a clear political stand is not a crime. However, asking your fans to vote out PMK just because you had a personal problem with them is.
Changing allegiance/support over a period of time is perfectly fine but not if driven by the need to manipulate for personal gains, without any issue-based grounds. As a person, this is acceptable but once in the domain of public/quasi political life with an image-boosting campaign to boot, one becomes fair game

No not that way!!
Rajini convened the conference where he spoke to his cuddalore dist fans who were seriously manhandled by PMK, many theatres where the movie was screened was mobbed, reels were burnt adn a very tense situation developed. But Rajini intervened and asked his fans not to indulge in any violence. He asked them to respond to PMK (and any alliance that chose to have PMK) at the time of election as he knew politicians are scared only if the vote swings against them. He could have seized the moment and launched a tirade that could have given him a great image and caused much of a damage and another politician added to the list of 'inflammatory' ones we already have. He didn't and as an actor asking his fans to respond in a democratic way is not a sin or something to be ashamed of and definitely not manipulative. Whatever he did at that moment saved crores of public property and a lot of tension. In retrospect, he ended up looking like a fool as many months later PMK had a significant electoral gain. That is maturity for he did not want to manipulate his fans (whom he knew would stick around only till he makes movies that pleases them) and detached himself from the commotion that was unnecessarily being foisted upon him by Maruthuvar Raman adimai. His fans who were so pissed off at his 'pacifist' approach promptly deserted his call to vote against PMK

This incident apart - I am a fan of no actor - However I have friends who are fans of Rajini and Kamal and some younger actors. I see them being more balanced about reality and life - The earlier trend of seeing fan base as vote bank has been baulked by both these actors and as a result the number of people who have wasted their lives on being 'fans' has not been as huge as anyone looking from outside would want to believe. Both Rajini and Kamal have consistently asked their fans to be committed to their family and do good to their immediate community and nothing beyond that. In short - inspite of the stupidity of the fans(dreaming of political presence), the maturity of both these actors in not expoliting them stands out. For if it were any other actor their fan bases would have become already a voting bloc.

[Nerd]

selva, idhu enna kadala mittAyA, venum/venaam-nu solla?? Rajini has interest, but not ready to take the plunge yet. I mean he shudders to think about the possibility of losing. And I repeat, rajini fans (who are still registered, after the PMK sweep) now will be happy with whatever rajini decides and we don't need IIIrd party advises/sympathies!!!!

[crajkumar_be]

some jokes and comments flaying fanatics here is very irritating and lacks basic understanding of ground realities.....
sariya sonneenga!

[crajkumar_be]

Jai,
Let's just agree to categorically disagree :)

[jaiganes]

thamiz,

i am not calling the fans are saint...im just asking why dint rajni put a full stop to their political wishes

The title suggests that fans are stupid and blind worshippers.

Thirunaavukkarasu, and kaalimuththu were MGR fans (blind worshippers??) and became ministers later!
So you want to become a minister because you are a fan?
Kalimuthu was not a fan - he was a party functionary and a good speaker - he had talent. Thirunaavukkarasu was also a literate good speaker and had talent - then he came to politics .. offcourse MGR used them and they used MGR. simple. Vandhappuram enna kizhichchaangannu thamizh naatukku nallaave theriyum adhanaal dhaan solraen - podhu vazhkaile konjamum aarvam illaama, verum oruththar fan - avar sonnaaru adhanaala nalladhu seiyaraennu solravan - suya sindhanayai adagu vekkira aal. suyama sindhikka theriyaadhavanga arasiyalukku varuvadhai vida varaamal iruppadhu dhaan avangalukkum nalladhu, arasiyalukkum nalladhunnaen.
Indunaala dhaan - Aandavane vandhaa kooda. ......

[thamiz]

So you want to become a minister because you are a fan?.....

YES! There are some who want to become ministers and so they want rajni to get into politics.

It is selfishness and not blindness.

[selvakumar]

Nerd,
Mine was not an advise or a sympathy. I hate both of them. Mine was a mere answer to thamiz's doubt (??) or question. As per your words, fans are not clear on rajini's movies. But rajini has a wish. He had some dialogues in kuselan and later removed them. Ithu manipulation illaya ? ithula yaaru blind ah irukkaa.. ? I think we can discuss on this on and on. Kozhila irunthu mutta vanthathaa, illa muttaila irunthu kozhi vanthathaannu.. As CR mentioned, LATD

[jaiganes]

Jai,
Let's just agree to categorically disagree :)

What I would like you to understand is that Rajini might at some times flounder for a fleeting while - but on the long term decision making he has chosen to not indulge into his fans' dreams of being a political force at the cost of his peace of mind or at the cost of his fans being politically misused and become wayward. You have to concede him atleast that much. None of the actors today start their career wanting to have a big fan base and manipulate them. Offcourse there are some who are launched with titles and everyone knows what their target is - that is really condemnable. Apart from the handful few for most of them fanbase naturally happens. Once you have a fanbase what does the actor do with it is the question - he can manipulate it like some have done for personal political gains (money conquered - lets go for power) and for some to simply be in the industry despite string of flops and no shows. Rajini and Kamal stand tall amidst all the other actors on both counts most of the times.

[thamiz]

Some rajni fans want to use Rajni for their advantage!
Are they BLIND?! :lol:
thamiz,
:roll:
Viv was referring to > aama illa - intha kelvikku answer. Fans generally want their star to reach a level above the current position. Avanga nenappu thappu illai. But interest irukka illayaannu sollurathu ovvoru nadigaroda kadamai...mathavangalukku sollattiyum rasigargal kitta mattum sollalaam.. illaya ? :)

Selva:

I am talking in general. I dont think it is obligation.

I laugh at critics like ngAni and chAru when they talk what rajni should do and all!

Are they going to listen what rajni says as they should do? :lol:

[selvakumar]

Selva:
I am talking in general. I dont think it is obligation.
I laugh at critics like ngAni and chAru when they talk what rajni should do and all!
Are they going to listen what rajni says as they should do? :lol:

Inga thaan difference irukku... I think it is an obligation. fansukkavathu.. neenga illenun sollureenga.. sari irukkattum.

<dig> leaving for the day.. :wave: </dig>

[Nerd]

Kuselan issue: It was the fans who went mad and asked rajini to remove the scenes. as far as I can see its us, the fans who are trying to gain some mileage out of making rajini the CM. What i fail to understand is none of the rajini fans are claiming that rajini manipulates us :lol: My last post on this issue :sigh2:

[equanimus]

This incident apart - I am a fan of no actor - However I have friends who are fans of Rajini and Kamal and some younger actors. I see them being more balanced about reality and life - The earlier trend of seeing fan base as vote bank has been baulked by both these actors and as a result the number of people who have wasted their lives on being 'fans' has not been as huge as anyone looking from outside would want to believe. Both Rajini and Kamal have consistently asked their fans to be committed to their family and do good to their immediate community and nothing beyond that. In short - inspite of the stupidity of the fans(dreaming of political presence), the maturity of both these actors in not expoliting them stands out.
Jaiganes,
This is steeped in condescension. Do you really mean to say that "they" -- those fans of that actor (whoever it is) -- need (or needed in the past) to get a better grip of "reality and life" while you and I (err, not sure if I qualify) do? For some reason, I'm reminded of 'subramaNiyapuram'.

[MADDY]

selva, idhu enna kadala mittAyA, venum/venaam-nu solla?? Rajini has interest, but not ready to take the plunge yet. I mean he shudders to think about the possibility of losing. And I repeat, rajini fans (who are still registered, after the PMK sweep) now will be happy with whatever rajini decides and we don't need IIIrd party advises/sympathies!!!!

y cant rajini get this across to his fans atleast......look, i have the interest, but let me wait for time and place to do it or i might drop the idea totally........i think his fans, one of the most loyal ones in history, deserve this explanation atleast........

but i wont go to the extent of calling him selfish and being manipulative but his indecisiveness is certainly irritating......

[Murali Srinivas]

I am not getting into this discussion in spite of NOV wanting me to do (or clear some thing) because I feel that this topic (in spite of its good intentions) is not relevant to the Hub. Where 99% of hubbers are empolyed with many of them taking up postings in off shore, blind worship or not is not going to make any difference to their lives.

Jaiganesh,

On the other hand this question should be addressed to the constituency which is wasting their lives but unfortunately they are outside the perview of the hub. But remember one thing, they also will move away. ஆராதிக்கப்படுபவனும் அவனை ஆராதிப்பவனும் மாறுவார்களேயன்றி, ஆராதனை தொடரும். 1950-களில் இருந்து திரையுலகை பார்த்தால் நான் சொல்லுவது உங்களுக்கு புரியும்.

நான் இந்த திரிக்கு வந்தது ஒரு சில விஷயங்களில் to set the record straight.

ரஜினியின் பா.மா.கா. எதிர்ப்பு பற்றிய சரியான தகவல்கள் இதோ.

2002 - ஆகஸ்ட் - ரஜினியின் திரைப்படங்களில் புகை பிடிக்கும் காட்சிகளை பற்றியும் அது இளைய தலைமுறையிடம் ஏற்படுத்தும் பாதிப்பு பற்றி மருத்துவர் தமிழ் குடி தாங்கி பேச, அதற்கு ரஜினி பதில் கூறுகிறார்.

அதே மாதம் பாபா ரிலீஸ் - பா.மா.க ஆதரவு பகுதிகளில் படத்திற்கு சிக்கல் ஏற்படுத்தப்படுகிறது. பிறகு அமைதியாகிறது.

2002 - அக்டோபர் மாதம் காவிரி பிரச்சனை. நெய்வேலியில் போராட்டம். ரஜினி மீது பாரதிராஜா தாக்குதல்.

மறு நாள் சென்னை சேப்பாக்கத்தில் ரஜினி உண்ணாவிரதம். கவர்னரை சந்தித்து நதிகள் இணைப்பிற்கு ஒரு கோடி கொடுப்பதாக அறிவிப்பு.

இதற்கு பிறகு 18 மாதங்கள் கழித்து 2004 - மே மாதம் பாராளுமன்ற தேர்தல். ஏப்ரல் மாதம் மதுரைக்கு பிரச்சாரத்திற்கு வரும் ராமதாசிற்கு யானைக்கல் அண்ணா சிலையருகே ரஜினி ரசிகர்கள் கருப்பு கொடி காண்பிக்கிறார்கள். ராமாதாசின் காருக்கு பின்னால் வந்த வாகனங்களிருந்து வெளிப்படும் "தொண்டர்கள்" ரஜினி ரசிகர்களை கடுமையாக தாக்குகிறார்கள். 10 பேர் ஆஸ்பத்திரியில் அனுமதி.

காயப்பட்டவர்களை சென்னைக்கு வரவழைக்கும் ரஜினி, பா.மா.க தாக்கியதற்கு கண்டனம் தெரிவிக்கும் விதமாக பாராளுமன்ற தேர்தலில் பா.மா.க. போட்டியிடும் 6 தொகுதிகளிலும் ரஜினி ரசிகர்கள் அந்த வேட்பாளர்களுக்கு எதிராக ஓட்டளிப்பார்கள் என அறிவிக்கிறார். தேர்தல் முடிவு வேறு விதமாக அமைகிறது.

இது தான் நடந்தது.

அன்புடன்

[comments]

Jai,
Let's just agree to categorically disagree :)

What I would like you to understand is that Rajini might at some times flounder for a fleeting while - but on the long term decision making he has chosen to not indulge into his fans' dreams of being a political force at the cost of his peace of mind or at the cost of his fans being politically misused and become wayward. You have to concede him atleast that much. None of the actors today start their career wanting to have a big fan base and manipulate them. Offcourse there are some who are launched with titles and everyone knows what their target is - that is really condemnable. Apart from the handful few for most of them fanbase naturally happens. Once you have a fanbase what does the actor do with it is the question - he can manipulate it like some have done for personal political gains (money conquered - lets go for power) and for some to simply be in the industry despite string of flops and no shows. Rajini and Kamal stand tall amidst all the other actors on both counts most of the times.

Rajini is complicit by silence. There is a group out there expecting that he will join politics. Rajini has fueled it by giving "voice" and via his movie dialogues throughout the 90s, creating the impression that he is going to be entering politics anytime... (it seems to have slowed down after BABA/PMK issues though).

Ultimately it is the fans' fault but Rajini could be a bit more responsible and issue a clear statement (a decade should be sufficient time to make a decision) so that the fans can move on. Sure he is not legally bound to do it but I am sure he is aware of the fans' expectations. Imagine someone is depending on you for something. You haven't promised them anything but if you are aware of their expectations, shouldn't you at least let them know that you don't plan do anything?

The reality is that the fans have to be kept excited to bolster the box-office (applies to all actors). I would be surprised if Rajini clarifies on this until he stops making movies or moves over to character roles.

Coming to the fans, what do these guys expect? Just because they have whistled and did Abhishekam, they should be given political appts? If they have political aspirations, they should join some party or if they want to do social service just work with the several organizations that are already there.

[jaiganes]

This incident apart - I am a fan of no actor - However I have friends who are fans of Rajini and Kamal and some younger actors. I see them being more balanced about reality and life - The earlier trend of seeing fan base as vote bank has been baulked by both these actors and as a result the number of people who have wasted their lives on being 'fans' has not been as huge as anyone looking from outside would want to believe. Both Rajini and Kamal have consistently asked their fans to be committed to their family and do good to their immediate community and nothing beyond that. In short - inspite of the stupidity of the fans(dreaming of political presence), the maturity of both these actors in not expoliting them stands out.
Jaiganes,
This is steeped in condescension. Do you really mean to say that "they" -- those fans of that actor (whoever it is) -- need (or needed in the past) to get a better grip of "reality and life" while you and I (err, not sure if I qualify) do? For some reason, I'm reminded of 'subramaNiyapuram'.

Equanimus!
condescending - it might sound!
but I aam saying what I have observed. I have seen young bright men stealing money from house, mortgaging jewelry at home to buy FDFS ticket and end up losing grades in school and college. They are rather smart people otherwise. Guess at any point in time as to why girls score more marks than guys in school in our country and in particular our state - this blinding devotion and fatal attraction is one key reason. I have seen it too many times happening around. Some lucky fans get out of their stupor just in time, many have rich parents and kind uncles to help them regain in their lives - but the poorest of the lot have no other go but to languish in poorly paid jobs with discontent in the heart. I - you - we are very very lucky not to have gotten distracted by the blinding star power that much - that much of equanimity was in our head.

[jaiganes]

selva, idhu enna kadala mittAyA, venum/venaam-nu solla?? Rajini has interest, but not ready to take the plunge yet. I mean he shudders to think about the possibility of losing. And I repeat, rajini fans (who are still registered, after the PMK sweep) now will be happy with whatever rajini decides and we don't need IIIrd party advises/sympathies!!!!

y cant rajini get this across to his fans atleast......look, i have the interest, but let me wait for time and place to do it or i might drop the idea totally........i think his fans, one of the most loyal ones in history, deserve this explanation atleast........

but i wont go to the extent of calling him selfish and being manipulative but his indecisiveness is certainly irritating......

Rajini or Kamal or Rahman or Raja dont have to clarify anything. If something is gonna benefit their market or producers they will play along. It is the fan who must break out of the stupor.

[jaiganes]

Jai,
Let's just agree to categorically disagree :)

What I would like you to understand is that Rajini might at some times flounder for a fleeting while - but on the long term decision making he has chosen to not indulge into his fans' dreams of being a political force at the cost of his peace of mind or at the cost of his fans being politically misused and become wayward. You have to concede him atleast that much. None of the actors today start their career wanting to have a big fan base and manipulate them. Offcourse there are some who are launched with titles and everyone knows what their target is - that is really condemnable. Apart from the handful few for most of them fanbase naturally happens. Once you have a fanbase what does the actor do with it is the question - he can manipulate it like some have done for personal political gains (money conquered - lets go for power) and for some to simply be in the industry despite string of flops and no shows. Rajini and Kamal stand tall amidst all the other actors on both counts most of the times.

Rajini is complicit by silence. There is a group out there expecting that he will join politics. Rajini has fueled it by giving "voice" and via his movie dialogues throughout the 90s, creating the impression that he is going to be entering politics anytime... (it seems to have slowed down after BABA/PMK issues though).

Ultimately it is the fans' fault but Rajini could be a bit more responsible and issue a clear statement (a decade should be sufficient time to make a decision) so that the fans can move on. Sure he is not legally bound to do it but I am sure he is aware of the fans' expectations. Imagine someone is depending on you for something. You haven't promised them anything but if you are aware of their expectations, shouldn't you at least let them know that you don't plan do anything?

The reality is that the fans have to be kept excited to bolster the box-office (applies to all actors). I would be surprised if Rajini clarifies on this until he stops making movies or moves over to character roles.

Coming to the fans, what do these guys expect? Just because they have whistled and did Abhishekam, they should be given political appts? If they have political aspirations, they should join some party or if they want to do social service just work with the several organizations that are already there.

comments! Rajini the superstar he might be, but is powerless if the producers decide against having him in the movie. distributors will go beserk if Rajini issues a categorical statement saying that he will not enter politics. because if he does, he will not be saleable anymore( not after having built up the political image that sold so many movies).

[Nerd]

Hilarious observations comments/jaiganes. Rajini has a decent political image - came baba - flops - elections/PMK - another failure - rajini's political innings became a non -starter - came chandramukhi(without any political dialogues) - blockbuster - sivaji - blockbuster - rajini slowly got the image he lost back - kuselan - flops.

Bottomline: rajini's political dialogues/moves do not play a major role in deciding the fate of his movies.

[jaiganes]

Hilarious observations comments/jaiganes. Rajini has a decent political image - came baba - flops - elections/PMK - another failure - rajini's political innings became a non -starter - came chandramukhi(without any political dialogues) - blockbuster - sivaji - blockbuster - rajini slowly got the image he lost back - kuselan - flops.

Bottomline: rajini's political dialogues/moves do not play a major role in deciding the fate of his movies.
They seemed to do in 90s till padayappa!!
However it is not Rajini whom we want to dissect here - the fans of Rajini and others.

[ajithfederer]

:rotfl: :lol: :rotfl:

I'm reminded of one of the funniest (and profoundest) lines ever spoken in films.

From a scene in Life Of Brian.

BRIAN:
I'm not the Messiah! Will you please listen? I am not the Messiah, do you understand?! Honestly!
GIRL:
Only the true Messiah denies His divinity.
BRIAN:
What?! Well, what sort of chance does that give me? All right! I am the Messiah!
FOLLOWERS:
He is! He is the Messiah!
BRIAN:
Now, f*ck off!
[silence]
ARTHUR:
How shall we f*ck off, O Lord?

[bingleguy]

ஒரு ரசிகனுக்கும் கலைஞனுக்கும் உள்ள உறவு கலை மட்டும் தான் .அது நியாயப்படி ஒரு சேவை (serve) வழங்குபவனுக்கும் அதை நுகர்வோனுக்குமுள்ள உறவு அளவுக்கு இருப்பது தான் நியாயம் .அதைத் தாண்டி சேவை வழங்குபவரின் தனிமனித பண்புகளையும் சேவையையும் போட்டு குழப்பிக்கொள்ள வேண்டிய அவசியம் இல்லை தான் .

ஆனால் கலை என்று வரும் போது தனிப்பட்ட கலைஞனின் தனிப்பட்ட வாழ்வு கலையையும் பாதிக்கலாம் என்பதால் கலைஞன் மீது ஒரு தனிப்பட்ட அக்கறை ,பாசம் வருவது தவிர்க்க முடியாதது .ஆனாலும் கலை ,கலைஞன் இரண்டிலும் கலையை முன்னிறுத்தி ,கலைக்காக அந்த கலைஞனை நேசிப்பதால் எந்த பாதகமும் இல்லை .

ஆனால் நாளடைவில் கலை பின் தள்ளப்பட்டு ,அந்த கலைஞனுக்காகவே அவன் கலையை விரும்ப ஆரம்பித்தால் அங்கு தனிமனித வழிபாடு ஆரம்பிக்கிறது .இதையும் தாண்டி கலைஞனின் கலை எல்லையைத் தாண்டி அவனின் தனிமனித சமூக ,அரசியல் ,குடும்ப கொள்கைகள் ,கருத்துக்களுக்கும் முழுவதுமாக உடன்பட்டு ,அவனின் கொள்கையே தனது கொள்கையாக , எது வரினும் அந்த கலைஞன் என்ற தனிமனிதனின் ஒவ்வொரு அசைவுக்கும் (கலைக்கு சம்பந்தம் இல்லாத) ஒத்து ஊத வேண்டிய , நியாயம் கற்பிக்க வேண்டுய நிலைக்கு மாறுவது அடுத்த கட்டம் .

அதையும் தாண்டி தன்னிலை முழுவதும் மறந்து கலைஞனின் வாழ்வே தன் வாழ்வாக கொள்வது உச்ச கட்டம் .

நமக்கும் கலைஞனுக்கும் உள்ள உறவு கலை மட்டுமே என்ற தெளிவு வரும் வரை இந்த நிலை மாறுவது கடினமே.

Marvelous :thumbsup:

[comments]

Hilarious observations comments/jaiganes. Rajini has a decent political image - came baba - flops - elections/PMK - another failure - rajini's political innings became a non -starter - came chandramukhi(without any political dialogues) - blockbuster - sivaji - blockbuster - rajini slowly got the image he lost back - kuselan - flops.

Bottomline: rajini's political dialogues/moves do not play a major role in deciding the fate of his movies.

Nerd, what is hilarious? Didn't you say that 30% of the fans left after the PMK debacle? Don't the fans contribute towards the box-office? The hard-core fans assure a minimum business. They are the ones who stick posters, do Abhishekam and what not and create the initial interest in the movie. They are the ones who made Baba and Kuselan earn whatever they did.

Ok. If it is not the box-office, why do you think Rajini is mum on this issue?

[thamiz]

I am not getting into this discussion in spite of NOV wanting me to do (or clear some thing) because I feel that this topic (in spite of its good intentions) is not relevant to the Hub. Where 99% of hubbers are empolyed with many of them taking up postings in off shore, blind worship or not is not going to make any difference to their lives.

Jaiganesh,

On the other hand this question should be addressed to the constituency which is wasting their lives but unfortunately they are outside the perview of the hub. But remember one thing, they also will move away. ஆராதிக்கப்படுபவனும் அவனை ஆராதிப்பவனும் மாறுவார்களேயன்றி, ஆராதனை தொடரும். 1950-களில் இருந்து திரையுலகை பார்த்தால் நான் சொல்லுவது உங்களுக்கு புரியும்.

நான் இந்த திரிக்கு வந்தது ஒரு சில விஷயங்களில் to set the record straight.

ரஜினியின் பா.மா.கா. எதிர்ப்பு பற்றிய சரியான தகவல்கள் இதோ.

2002 - ஆகஸ்ட் - ரஜினியின் திரைப்படங்களில் புகை பிடிக்கும் காட்சிகளை பற்றியும் அது இளைய தலைமுறையிடம் ஏற்படுத்தும் பாதிப்பு பற்றி மருத்துவர் தமிழ் குடி தாங்கி பேச, அதற்கு ரஜினி பதில் கூறுகிறார்.

அதே மாதம் பாபா ரிலீஸ் - பா.மா.க ஆதரவு பகுதிகளில் படத்திற்கு சிக்கல் ஏற்படுத்தப்படுகிறது. பிறகு அமைதியாகிறது.

2002 - அக்டோபர் மாதம் காவிரி பிரச்சனை. நெய்வேலியில் போராட்டம். ரஜினி மீது பாரதிராஜா தாக்குதல்.

மறு நாள் சென்னை சேப்பாக்கத்தில் ரஜினி உண்ணாவிரதம். கவர்னரை சந்தித்து நதிகள் இணைப்பிற்கு ஒரு கோடி கொடுப்பதாக அறிவிப்பு.

இதற்கு பிறகு 18 மாதங்கள் கழித்து 2004 - மே மாதம் பாராளுமன்ற தேர்தல். ஏப்ரல் மாதம் மதுரைக்கு பிரச்சாரத்திற்கு வரும் ராமதாசிற்கு யானைக்கல் அண்ணா சிலையருகே ரஜினி ரசிகர்கள் கருப்பு கொடி காண்பிக்கிறார்கள். ராமாதாசின் காருக்கு பின்னால் வந்த வாகனங்களிருந்து வெளிப்படும் "தொண்டர்கள்" ரஜினி ரசிகர்களை கடுமையாக தாக்குகிறார்கள். 10 பேர் ஆஸ்பத்திரியில் அனுமதி.

காயப்பட்டவர்களை சென்னைக்கு வரவழைக்கும் ரஜினி, பா.மா.க தாக்கியதற்கு கண்டனம் தெரிவிக்கும் விதமாக பாராளுமன்ற தேர்தலில் பா.மா.க. போட்டியிடும் 6 தொகுதிகளிலும் ரஜினி ரசிகர்கள் அந்த வேட்பாளர்களுக்கு எதிராக ஓட்டளிப்பார்கள் என அறிவிக்கிறார். தேர்தல் முடிவு வேறு விதமாக அமைகிறது.

இது தான் நடந்தது.

அன்புடன்

நன்றி திரு.முரளி ஸ்ரீனிவாஸ்! :smile2:

[NOV]

Thanks Murali Srinivas. :sigh2:

Things started in the 1950s and its downhill all the way, and has hit rock bottom now.

A Sivakumar/Surya is not going to change things much.

[Nerd]

Nerd, what is hilarious? Didn't you say that 30% of the fans left after the PMK debacle?
They were the worst among the lot. I mean they thought they were there for something big. Losing them has not done anything to us. Many new fanboys, you know!



Don't the fans contribute towards the box-office? The hard-core fans assure a minimum business. They are the ones who stick posters, do Abhishekam and what not and create the initial interest in the movie. They are the ones who made Baba and Kuselan earn whatever they did.
NO denying! But I felt you were hinting that (JG was blatant) the fans do all these only because of rajini's political dialogues/gestures etc.., which is not the case. (Baba - CM - BOSS - Kuselan example)


Ok. If it is not the box-office, why do you think Rajini is mum on this issue?
Thats because he is not sure yet. I mean if he happens to enter, loses he would probably lose all the name/fame he earned all these years and hell a lot of money too. Its not an easy decision to make, put yourself in his shoes.

Let him decide, the fans can wait. Others can watch patiently no need to comment, its between him and his fans. Matter over.

[thriinone]

APeez velaiya konjam thiruchi varai poga vendirunthu. Thiruchi maanadukku poi vanten.
leeoni pattimandram onnu nadanthichu. avunga sonna oru vishayam, intha thirikku othu varumnnu ninaikiren.

athavathu namma hero usaramaana kattadathulerunthu kuthikiraaru. sandai poduraaru. hero stool lerunthu kuthichu padam pudichiruvaayinga.. aana parunga nisamalume kuthikirathu vera oruthan.

avanukku peru "doopu"

enna naayam ya ithu! yaaru doopu? nesathula partha namma hero th aan doopu

avaruku muga selvakku ivlo worsip aam, rasigargalaam.

[joe]

Thiruchi maanadukku poi vanten..
You mean DMK office opening? :roll:

[selvakumar]

Thanks Murali Srinivas. :sigh2:
Things started in the 1950s and its downhill all the way, and has hit rock bottom now.
:confused2: 50 - 80s la thaan worst ah irunthirukkanum. I am damn sure 8-) Appo iruntha alavukku ella fansum ippo react panna mattaanga. Things have improved now and have taken a different shape altogether.

[NOV]

:confused2: 50 - 80s la thaan worst ah irunthirukkanum. I am damn sure 8-)


It is your opinion. Need not be fact.

[selvakumar]

:rotfl:

[joe]

Fact mattum thaan post paNanumna inga hub-a ethuvum discuss panna mudiyaathu :)

[joe]

Selva,
I think MGR-Sivaji period must be the highest time ,since both of them backed by biggest political parties of that time.

[P_R]

Fact mattum thaan post paNanumna inga hub-a ethuvum discuss panna mudiyaathu :) That is your opinion Joe :-)

[joe]

Fact mattum thaan post paNanumna inga hub-a ethuvum discuss panna mudiyaathu :) That is your opinion Joe :-)
:lol:

[selvakumar]

Selva,
I think MGR-Sivaji period must be the highest time ,since both of them backed by biggest political parties of that time.
Itha thaan naanum solluraen... 1 + 1 = 3 nnu naanum prove panna mattaen :) Appo iruntha politics, cinema mela iruntha oru veri ithellam paartha ippo onnumae illa.. infact, fans are more matured these days.

Disclaimer : The views expressed in the above post is an opinion of the author and need not be a fact like 1 + 1 = 3. :)

[NOV]

1 + 1 = 11

[joe]

1 + 1 = 11

No .. 1+1 =10

[selvakumar]

1 + 1 = 11
1 + 1 = "1 + 1"

[NOV]

naa binary la sollala... more like kusElan pasanga... (iththihasam kaadhai)

[Thirumaran]

1+1 = 102 as per Mahabharatha :roll:

[Sanguine Sridhar]

1+1 = 102 as per Mahabharatha :roll:

:rotfl: 105 illa? :roll:

[Thirumaran]

1+1 = 102 as per Mahabharatha :roll:

:rotfl: 105 illa? :roll:

105 :?

[Sanguine Sridhar]

100 Gowravargal, 5 paandavargal :confused2:

[Thirumaran]

100 Gowravargal, 5 paandavargal :confused2:

:rant: I was talking only about gowravas.

Drithirashtran + Kaanthaari == 102 :lol2:

[sarna_blr]

1+1 = 102 as per Mahabharatha :roll:

:ty: for the usefull information TM anna :D

[Srimannarayanan]

100 Gowravargal, 5 paandavargal :confused2:

:rant: I was talking only about gowravas.

Drithirashtran + Kaanthaari == 102 :lol2:


You add one more. 1 + 1 = 103 as per Mahabharatha.. (100 Sons + 1 daughter + 2 (Parents)).

[equanimus]

1+1 = 102 as per Mahabharatha :roll:
Maximum avvLO dhAn pOyirukku 'nRIngaLA?

I'm reminded of a line from 'Crazy Thieves in Palavakkam.'

"mUnRu kozhandhaigaLukku mEl vEndAm, appadi 'nnA oru thadavaikku 'nnu nenachchikkittIngaLA? moththamA oruththarukku avvLO dhAn..." :lol: And, the quintessential S. Ve. Shekar punchline follows. "sAr avasaraththula poster'a padichchittu, vIttukku pOyirukkAr!" :rotfl:

[Thirumaran]

Sriman,
:notworthy: Neengathaan Real Kanakku Puli. Naan Vaal illaatha puli.. Athaan thappaa sollitaen :mrgreen:

[sarna_blr]

1+1 = 102 as per Mahabharatha :roll:
Maximum avvLO dhAn pOyirukku 'nRIngaLA?


enakku andhalavukku kooda puriyala :cry2:

[Thirumaran]

Maximum avvLO dhAn pOyirukku 'nRIngaLA?


appadithaan thoanuthu :roll: Antha alavukku vasathiyum vaera urupadiyaan vaelai illainaa, naan kooda try pannuvaen :roll: Appa kooda 1 + 1 = 103 varaathu.. Vaenumnaa 1 + 10 = 110 vara vaikalaam :?



I'm reminded of a line from 'Crazy Thieves in Palavakkam.'

"mUnRu kozhandhaigaLukku mEl vEndAm, appadi 'nnA oru thadavaikku 'nnu nenachchikkittIngaLA? moththamA oruththarukku avvLO dhAn..." :lol: And, the quintessential S. Ve. Shekar punchline follows. "sAr avasaraththula poster'a padichchittu, vIttukku pOyirukkAr!" :rotfl:

:rotfl:

[NOV]

and the conclusion being?

[ajithfederer]

:rotfl:


1+1 = 102 as per Mahabharatha :roll:
Maximum avvLO dhAn pOyirukku 'nRIngaLA?

I'm reminded of a line from 'Crazy Thieves in Palavakkam.'

"mUnRu kozhandhaigaLukku mEl vEndAm, appadi 'nnA oru thadavaikku 'nnu nenachchikkittIngaLA? moththamA oruththarukku avvLO dhAn..." :lol: And, the quintessential S. Ve. Shekar punchline follows. "sAr avasaraththula poster'a padichchittu, vIttukku pOyirukkAr!" :rotfl:

[jaiganes]

When it happened in MGR sivaji time period - there was also an added factor of illiteracy and ignorance in Thamizh Nadu. However thamizh nadu of today (Joe would agree) is much more educated and comparatively prosperous). Yet young people distracted and destroyed by the blind worship is continuing to happen and that is much much more shameful. The number of fan clubs since MGR Sivaji days has mushroomed and 'paal abishekam' has given waqy to 'beer abhishekam'. Earlier illiterate idiots did it - now literate, educated wastrels are doing it .

[Nerd]

EKSI, ellA thread-leyum digerssions :oops:

[selvakumar]

We cannot generalize that only illiterates did all those things during that period. Whatever it is - the number of people who were doing those things and the acts were quite high.

OTOH, what is wrong with literates doing that ? There is no harm in that. 8-) Oru Rs.20/- iruntha pothum.. (Paal pocket vaanga)

Ithanaala church ah kozhuthi, mosque ah yaarum idikka porathu illai

[NOV]

its wrong selva.

[ajithfederer]

:shock: :clap:


Ithanaala church ah kozhuthi, mosque ah yaarum idikka porathu illai

[HonestRaj]

EKSI, ellA thread-leyum digerssions :oops:

Thirumaran :yessir:

[app_engine]

Ithanaala church ah kozhuthi, mosque ah yaarum idikka porathu illai

At least one group of fans were blamed for the mass attack on Bangalore Thamizh's during the Bangarappa rule.

In general, any group of people who "blindly" (as per the title of the thread) follow someone / something can easily be manipulated to turn violent, unfortunately:-(

[jaiganes]

Ithanaala church ah kozhuthi, mosque ah yaarum idikka porathu illai

At least one group of fans were blamed for the mass attack on Bangalore Thamizh's during the Bangarappa rule.

In general, any group of people who "blindly" (as per the title of the thread) follow someone / something can easily be manipulated to turn violent, unfortunately:-(
aptly put!!!

When you are under a spell - it only takes imaginative story creation and effective delivery by some to sway you to do things you thought would never do - it is called 'mob psychology' and when you are a fan - you are a part of a mob - now mob might just laugh and enjoy themselves or shout slogans and get carried away in the end. Whatever they are - one thing is - it is never pleasant to stay around a mob and expect great things to happen.

[NOV]

agreed totally with app_engine and jaiganesh. have personal bad experiences right here in this forum. :cry:

[NOV]

hows the situation outside tamilnadu? are fans of neighbouriing states just as fanatical?

[MADDY]

Ithanaala church ah kozhuthi, mosque ah yaarum idikka porathu illai

At least one group of fans were blamed for the mass attack on Bangalore Thamizh's during the Bangarappa rule.

In general, any group of people who "blindly" (as per the title of the thread) follow someone / something can easily be manipulated to turn violent, unfortunately:-(

there are 2 things:
recent attacks on tamilians were not from raj kumar fans but some other kannada organisation.......so, what happened in 92' was a kannada agitation under blanket of rajkumar - its not remotely anything to do with cinema fans.......

secondly, biggest scales of violence like terror bombings by IndianMujahideen or attack of churches by Hindu organisations in karnataka are not done by cinema fans........violence is a issue, but the crux are other social causes, cinema fanatism has never caused a disturbance of above scales.....paal abhisehkam pannalo, beer abhishekam senjaalo, kudi muzhugi pola, aana bombings and attacks-naala neraya kudi muzhugi poi irukku........

i think we are looking somewhere else......cinema fanatism is going to stay, but get the fanatics educated then u wud see them fighting only in HUB :lol2: ......education is the key.....

again, jaiganes sir, mob psycology, cine fans-kku mattum dhaana??? cricket fans-kku illaya or political party followers-kku dhaan illaya??? mob mentality is not induced by cinema.........

[joe]

ரசிகர் மன்றங்கள் பொது அமைதிக்கு பங்கம் விளைவித்து ,வன்முறைக்கு வழிவகுக்கிறது என்றெல்லாம் குற்றம் சாட்ட முடியாது .

ரசிகர் மன்றங்களில் இருப்பவர்கள் சிலர் தங்கள் பொன்னான நேரத்தையும் ,பணத்தையும் ,உழைப்பையும் தேவையுன்றி செலவழிப்பது அவர்களையும் அவர்கள் குடும்பத்தையும் பாதிக்கிறது என்று கருதப்படுவதால் அது தவிர்க்கப்படவேண்டியது என்று பரவலாக கருதப்படுகிறதேயொழிய வெறென்றும் காரணமில்லை .

ஆக அது ஒழிக்கப்படவேண்டிய கிரிமினல் குற்றமல்ல ..முடிந்தளவு தவிர்க்கபட வேண்டியது .அவ்வளவே.

ரசிகர் மன்றங்களில் இருந்து கொண்டே தன் சுய முன்னேற்றம் ,குடும்பம் பாதிக்காத அளவுக்கு பங்களிப்பு கொடுப்பவர்களும் இருக்கிறார்கள் .அதனால் ஒரு தவறும் இல்லை .ஆனால் சிலர் 'தனக்கு மிஞ்சிய தானம்' மாதிரி தன்னையும் தன் குடும்பத்தையும் மீறி இதற்கு முக்கியத்துவம் கொடுப்பது சில குடும்பங்களை பாதிப்பது மறுப்பதற்கில்லை.

கல்வியறிவு ,விழிப்புணர்வு ,பக்குவம் இதனை தவிர்க்க உதவும் . :)

[MADDY]

கல்வியறிவு ,விழிப்புணர்வு ,பக்குவம் இதனை தவிர்க்க உதவும் . :)

idhu dhaan theerpu :notworthy:

problem is not with cinema, but its with literacy :)

[directhit]

Joe :thumbsup:

maddy - literacy alone wont change it :?

[crajkumar_be]

//dig
Maddy,


Try to tell me
Ultimate, Penultimate :rotfl: :rotfl2:

[crajkumar_be]

"kolai kuthamunna yuthamum kutham"

adhu yen blind worshipping of film stars nu mattum sollanum?

Blind worshipping of gods num sollalaame...

[Kalyasi]

"kolai kuthamunna yuthamum kutham"

adhu yen blind worshipping of film stars nu mattum sollanum?

Blind worshipping of gods num sollalaame...

oru o naaya irunthu partha thaan antha nyaayam puriyum!!

[MADDY]

//dig
Maddy,


Try to tell me
Ultimate, Penultimate :rotfl: :rotfl2:

//dig// :lol: try to match that with my maddy avatar - deadly combo :lol: //end dig//

[hamid]

ரசிகர் மன்றங்கள் பொது அமைதிக்கு பங்கம் விளைவித்து ,வன்முறைக்கு வழிவகுக்கிறது என்றெல்லாம் குற்றம் சாட்ட முடியாது .

ரசிகர் மன்றங்களில் இருப்பவர்கள் சிலர் தங்கள் பொன்னான நேரத்தையும் ,பணத்தையும் ,உழைப்பையும் தேவையுன்றி செலவழிப்பது அவர்களையும் அவர்கள் குடும்பத்தையும் பாதிக்கிறது என்று கருதப்படுவதால் அது தவிர்க்கப்படவேண்டியது என்று பரவலாக கருதப்படுகிறதேயொழிய வெறென்றும் காரணமில்லை .

ஆக அது ஒழிக்கப்படவேண்டிய கிரிமினல் குற்றமல்ல ..முடிந்தளவு தவிர்க்கபட வேண்டியது .அவ்வளவே.

ரசிகர் மன்றங்களில் இருந்து கொண்டே தன் சுய முன்னேற்றம் ,குடும்பம் பாதிக்காத அளவுக்கு பங்களிப்பு கொடுப்பவர்களும் இருக்கிறார்கள் .அதனால் ஒரு தவறும் இல்லை .ஆனால் சிலர் 'தனக்கு மிஞ்சிய தானம்' மாதிரி தன்னையும் தன் குடும்பத்தையும் மீறி இதற்கு முக்கியத்துவம் கொடுப்பது சில குடும்பங்களை பாதிப்பது மறுப்பதற்கில்லை.

கல்வியறிவு ,விழிப்புணர்வு ,பக்குவம் இதனை தவிர்க்க உதவும் . :)

well said Joe. :thumbsup:

[jaiganes]

Joe :thumbsup:

maddy - literacy alone wont change it :?
yup it has been discussed above.

Ponnaana neram and public nuisance - both are important points.
Thavira Thiru joe avargal theatre vaasalil kaththi kuthu pathi yellaam padichadhillainnu ninaikiren.
@crajkumar_be Tamil films threadla ungaLa maadhiri ennaala madha virodha patti mandram nadaththa mudiyaadhu. I think unga bloglayo en bloglayo andha discussion vechukkalaam. My blog is unmoderated and fairly ok place to discuss that. I am not an atheist inspired by any actor or a worshipper because my 'thalaivar' does so.

[joe]

Thavira Thiru joe avargal theatre vaasalil kaththi kuthu pathi yellaam padichadhillainnu ninaikiren.

ஐயா,
தியேட்டர் வாசலில் நடந்த கத்திக்குத்துகளை விட கோவில் திருவிழாக்களில் நடந்த கத்திக்குத்துகளின் எண்ணிக்கை அதிகம் .அதனால் கோவில் திருவிழாக்கள் ஒழிக்கப்பட வேண்டுமென சொல்லுறீங்களா?

[MADDY]

Thavira Thiru joe avargal theatre vaasalil kaththi kuthu pathi yellaam padichadhillainnu ninaikiren.

ஐயா,
தியேட்டர் வாசலில் நடந்த கத்திக்குத்துகளை விட கோவில் திருவிழாக்களில் நடந்த கத்திக்குத்துகளின் எண்ணிக்கை அதிகம் .அதனால் கோவில் திருவிழாக்கள் ஒழிக்கப்பட வேண்டுமென சொல்லுறீங்களா?

:lol: :thumbsup:

[sarna_blr]

appadiyaanaal KOVIL'um THIRAIYARANGUM ondraa :rotfl: :rotfl:
KADAVUL'um KOOTHTHAADIyum ondraaa :rotfl2: blasphemy :sigh2:

[joe]

Sabahaaa :fatigue:

[sarna_blr]

:lol2:

[crajkumar_be]

@crajkumar_be Tamil films threadla ungaLa maadhiri ennaala madha virodha patti mandram nadaththa mudiyaadhu. I think unga bloglayo en bloglayo andha discussion vechukkalaam. My blog is unmoderated and fairly ok place to discuss that. I am not an atheist inspired by any actor or a worshipper because my 'thalaivar' does so.
Jai,
Why do you assume i'm an atheist? :razz:
Anyway, adhu ippo mukkiyam illa.... worship nu vandhutta unga vaadhatha vida enga (fanatics) vadhangalum counter-points um strong-a irukkum (and indha vaadhatha solra naanga ellorum atheist-a irukka vendiya avasiyam illa)

Then Indhiya kalacharathu padi edho jolly-a irundhuttu porom.. idhula enna prachanai? naanga fanaticism la "waste" panra time-a vida indha madhiri vivadham moolama waste agara time dhaan jaasthi :)

[crajkumar_be]

Jai,
ambuttu dhaen. Case closed!



Thavira Thiru joe avargal theatre vaasalil kaththi kuthu pathi yellaam padichadhillainnu ninaikiren.

ஐயா,
தியேட்டர் வாசலில் நடந்த கத்திக்குத்துகளை விட கோவில் திருவிழாக்களில் நடந்த கத்திக்குத்துகளின் எண்ணிக்கை அதிகம் .அதனால் கோவில் திருவிழாக்கள் ஒழிக்கப்பட வேண்டுமென சொல்லுறீங்களா?

:lol: :thumbsup:

[P_R]

>digr.>

KADAVUL'um KOOTHTHAADIyum ondraaa :rotfl2: blasphemy :sigh2:

தில்லையுள் கூத்தனே
தென்பாண்டி நாட்டானே

@ TiruvAsagam via Ilayaraja

<digr<

[ajithfederer]

You are missing the point. One man's meat is another man's poison. :P

appadiyaanaal KOVIL'um THIRAIYARANGUM ondraa :rotfl: :rotfl:
KADAVUL'um KOOTHTHAADIyum ondraaa :rotfl2: blasphemy :sigh2:

[equanimus]

Oh, now, we've shifted gears to point fingers at the illiterates! Seriously, does anyone think education would drive away people from idol worship? (Let's for a moment stop short of debating whether or not it's necessary to drive them in other directions at first place!) Neither is your average literate remarkably individualistic nor is the average illiterate a "wastrel" consumed completely by something that's of no value to his individual life. The notion that formal education will impart sophisticated sensibilities is itself significantly misplaced, and needless to say, an out-and-out 'podhup puridhal' that is regurgitated by all and sundry (perhaps because they feel the urge to add more value to their own inexplicably overlong stint in the school!). Nobody is as blind as they're made out to be. And, nobody is totally sighted either. Even as I'm typing this, I'm influenced by several people and several things.


When it happened in MGR sivaji time period - there was also an added factor of illiteracy and ignorance in Thamizh Nadu. However thamizh nadu of today (Joe would agree) is much more educated and comparatively prosperous). Yet young people distracted and destroyed by the blind worship is continuing to happen and that is much much more shameful. The number of fan clubs since MGR Sivaji days has mushroomed and 'paal abishekam' has given waqy to 'beer abhishekam'. Earlier illiterate idiots did it - now literate, educated wastrels are doing it .
Jaiganes,
Is it so hard to see that they are enjoying themselves doing all that? Maddy, Joe and Bala might have brought up unrelated things in this thread, but clearly there's a larger relevance. It'd be useful to pause and wonder why we are discussing particularly about the "thamizh cinema rasigan" when person-worship pervades the world in so many ways. Isn't it because we're all obsessed with cinema to different degrees? And hence with various artists? My question to you is how less obsessed we are compared to those who are doing pAl abishEgam for their idols. pAl abishEgam paNNi, padam pAththu mudichchappuRam, avar vElaiya pArkka poYiduvArA irukkum! yArukku theriyum? What useful work are we accomplishing here?

[app_engine]

What useful work are we accomplishing here?

Nice observation!

:lol:

[Nerd]

Beer abhishEkam naan pArthadhillai. ChummA sollanumEnu solla vENdiyadhu :lol2:
1. Beer is costly
2. Beer stinks
3. Its illegal!

[jaiganes]

Thavira Thiru joe avargal theatre vaasalil kaththi kuthu pathi yellaam padichadhillainnu ninaikiren.

ஐயா,
தியேட்டர் வாசலில் நடந்த கத்திக்குத்துகளை விட கோவில் திருவிழாக்களில் நடந்த கத்திக்குத்துகளின் எண்ணிக்கை அதிகம் .அதனால் கோவில் திருவிழாக்கள் ஒழிக்கப்பட வேண்டுமென சொல்லுறீங்களா?

kaththi kuththu happens in front of jail, panchayat office, collecetor office and infront of people's house too. Vaarthayai pidichikittu, argue pannaa indha maadhiri thappu thappa argue naan kooda pannalaam.
I just brought to your notice that your notion that blind adulation of cinema fans to a level of fanaticism also has taken a few lives and definitely to be added to the list of fanaticism that our thamizh people have (if we generalize - our indian people). This being thamizh films thread i added this to the discussion. Madha veri paththi vera threadla pesalaam. adhai ingey pesinaa. MAdha veri sari enga veri thappaa? appadinnu kekara maadhiri irukku. Appadi kaettaal, andha veriyum thappu indha veriyum thappu apdingradhu dhaan theerpu. Madha veri paththi pesum boadhu mozhi veriyayum saeththu pesalaam adhai romba naagareegama indha threadla pesa mudiyaadhu - adhu oru periya digression. vera threadla illa blogla naama adhai pesuvom.
@ crajkumar_be - naan ungala naastheegarnu sollave illaye - why do you assume that I did -I spoke generally about people who fashion their thoughts, beliefs and acts blindly on some one else.
@equanimus - as far as illiteracy and its connection with rational behaviour (offcourse what is rational behaviour - I would say that behaviour that doesn't justify causing public greivance and nuisance for some emotional issue) we know from 60 years of post independence Indian history how leaders have cleverly used emotional arguments to side step rational argument on everything from policy discussions to day to day administration and people being illiterates helps them in a big way . In 60s and 70s real paguththarivu vaadhis(rationalists) sincerely believed that education would liberate the iliterates - My argument was that blind fanaticism to movie stars and belief that their onscreen and offscreen persona were one and the same could have been attributed to illiteracy - but modern waste mongrel attitude(attributable to fan club activities) found in semi literate and literate youths in urban and semi urban centers ( I have had no chance to interact with real rural pocket people) is truly baffling. Larger than life has shrinked their life into smaller than reality status and that too while they are wide awake. Now I would feel happy if we all could debate on this 'ullangai nelli kani' rather than debating my fanaticism or (this fanaticism) is just a pichchuvaa kaththi in front of religious hatred and intolerance which is a machine gun. Nevertheless both are irrational and quite harmful is my point and in this forum there is no space or tolerance left to discuss the machine gun matter and therefore lets discuss the root problem of fanaticism which has manifested in a rather small (but still harmful) way as devotion to a film star.

[jaiganes]

Oh, now, we've shifted gears to point fingers at the illiterates! Seriously, does anyone think education would drive away people from idol worship? (Let's for a moment stop short of debating whether or not it's necessary to drive them in other directions at first place!) Neither is your average literate remarkably individualistic nor is the average illiterate a "wastrel" consumed completely by something that's of no value to his individual life. The notion that formal education will impart sophisticated sensibilities is itself significantly misplaced, and needless to say, an out-and-out 'podhup puridhal' that is regurgitated by all and sundry (perhaps because they feel the urge to add more value to their own inexplicably overlong stint in the school!). Nobody is as blind as they're made out to be. And, nobody is totally sighted either. Even as I'm typing this, I'm influenced by several people and several things.


When it happened in MGR sivaji time period - there was also an added factor of illiteracy and ignorance in Thamizh Nadu. However thamizh nadu of today (Joe would agree) is much more educated and comparatively prosperous). Yet young people distracted and destroyed by the blind worship is continuing to happen and that is much much more shameful. The number of fan clubs since MGR Sivaji days has mushroomed and 'paal abishekam' has given waqy to 'beer abhishekam'. Earlier illiterate idiots did it - now literate, educated wastrels are doing it .
Jaiganes,
Is it so hard to see that they are enjoying themselves doing all that? Maddy, Joe and Bala might have brought up unrelated things in this thread, but clearly there's a larger relevance. It'd be useful to pause and wonder why we are discussing particularly about the "thamizh cinema rasigan" when person-worship pervades the world in so many ways. Isn't it because we're all obsessed with cinema to different degrees? And hence with various artists? My question to you is how less obsessed we are compared to those who are doing pAl abishEgam for their idols. pAl abishEgam paNNi, padam pAththu mudichchappuRam, avar vElaiya pArkka poYiduvArA irukkum! yArukku theriyum? What useful work are we accomplishing here?

Who knows what useful work we are accomplishing here or there or anywhere? Just thinking and thinking loud - thats all. I want to share this thought and if it was such an invalid thought in your opinion - so be it and as crajkumar would say, lets agree to categorically disagree. I have no qualms with that.

[equanimus]

Obviously, it's a different matter altogether if we're talking about the public nuisance and potential inconveniences such activities cause to others, etc. If that's the case, we've to get into the details. And, as I've no idea about that, I'd duly excuse myself from this discussion.

offcourse what is rational behaviour - I would say that behaviour that doesn't justify causing public greivance and nuisance for some emotional issue
Jaiganes,
As I wasn't talking about our political history etc. in my post, let me just respond to this part. If this is the yardstick, I'm afraid you've not said much about it. I'm no sympathiser for pAl abishEgam et al. (actually, haven't even seen one in life), but I see that they're tring to have fun. And, it might or might not be cause public grievance and nuisance.

Who knows what useful work we are accomplishing here or there or anywhere? Just thinking and thinking loud - thats all. I want to share this thought and if it was such an invalid thought in your opinion - so be it and as crajkumar would say, lets agree to categorically disagree. I have no qualms with that.
No, no, I think you misunderstood that line. I was trying to ask, aren't we "wasting" our time too discussing this? To do useful work all the time isn't the kind of virtue we all aspire for, is it? :) And, I didn't mean to say it is "such an invalid thought" at all! Like you, I'm just trying to share my two cents about it. Cheers.

[Corleone]

Beer abhishEkam naan pArthadhillai. ChummA sollanumEnu solla vENdiyadhu :lol2:
1. Beer is costly
2. Beer stinks
3. Its illegal!

Beer abhishekam is well and truly introduced by THALA fans !!!!!
:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :2thumbsup: :2thumbsup: :2thumbsup: :2thumbsup:
Proud to be a THALA fan.

[ajithfederer]

Corleone

Idhula enna perumai ?? :P

[jaiganes]

Obviously, it's a different matter altogether if we're talking about the public nuisance and potential inconveniences such activities cause to others, etc. If that's the case, we've to get into the details. And, as I've no idea about that, I'd duly excuse myself from this discussion.

offcourse what is rational behaviour - I would say that behaviour that doesn't justify causing public greivance and nuisance for some emotional issue
Jaiganes,
As I wasn't talking about our political history etc. in my post, let me just respond to this part. If this is the yardstick, I'm afraid you've not said much about it. I'm no sympathiser for pAl abishEgam et al. (actually, haven't even seen one in life), but I see that they're tring to have fun. And, it might or might not be cause public grievance and nuisance.

Who knows what useful work we are accomplishing here or there or anywhere? Just thinking and thinking loud - thats all. I want to share this thought and if it was such an invalid thought in your opinion - so be it and as crajkumar would say, lets agree to categorically disagree. I have no qualms with that.
No, no, I think you misunderstood that line. I was trying to ask, aren't we "wasting" our time too discussing this? To do useful work all the time isn't the kind of virtue we all aspire for, is it? :) And, I didn't mean to say it is "such an invalid thought" at all! Like you, I'm just trying to share my two cents about it. Cheers.

all the while we are discussing this it is not as if our paychecks are being torn and we go empty handed or something like that. there is a degree of financial security because we did nto take a day's leave (with loss of pay) to tie thoranams in the theatre or to buy sachets of milk for an upcoming release of a film of an actor. So we are cool.

[equanimus]

all the while we are discussing this it is not as if our paychecks are being torn and we go empty handed or something like that. there is a degree of financial security because we did nto take a day's leave (with loss of pay) to tie thoranams in the theatre or to buy sachets of milk for an upcoming release of a film of an actor. So we are cool.
And do you mean to say they shouldn't be "cool," wasting their time tying thOraNam, as long as they think there is "a degree of financial security" in their life, and are able to do whatever they feel like doing? Buying sachets of milk for a cut-out pAl abishEgam and writing belabored posts on some niche website (I was going to say godforsaken website, but am not sure how people would take that!), I don't see a difference. I'm sure many a milk sachets-buying fan would be bewildered to know that this is what we do, besides work, sitting at our office.

[Nerd]

Have you guys seen Bharathiraja's ennuyir thOzhan ??

[jaiganes]

all the while we are discussing this it is not as if our paychecks are being torn and we go empty handed or something like that. there is a degree of financial security because we did nto take a day's leave (with loss of pay) to tie thoranams in the theatre or to buy sachets of milk for an upcoming release of a film of an actor. So we are cool.
And do you mean to say they shouldn't be "cool," wasting their time tying thOraNam, as long as they think there is "a degree of financial security" in their life, and are able to do whatever they feel like doing? Buying sachets of milk for a cut-out pAl abishEgam and writing belabored posts on some niche website (I was going to say godforsaken website, but am not sure how people would take that!), I don't see a difference. I'm sure many a milk sachets-buying fan would be bewildered to know that this is what we do, besides work, sitting at our office.

By all means yes - if they dont drag another guy who is losing his financial security/education/future and not cause trouble to gen public.

[jaiganes]

Have you guys seen Bharathiraja's ennuyir thOzhan ??

yup (I raise my hand)!!

[Raghu]

Free -a beer kidikumna adutha thala padathuku soli anupunga naa vaal pola varen

:lol2:

[Vivasaayi]

Corleone

Idhula enna perumai ?? :P

sattaila enna bomma

poona saar

idhula enna peruma..get out :lol:

[joe]

Thavira Thiru joe avargal theatre vaasalil kaththi kuthu pathi yellaam padichadhillainnu ninaikiren.

ஐயா,
தியேட்டர் வாசலில் நடந்த கத்திக்குத்துகளை விட கோவில் திருவிழாக்களில் நடந்த கத்திக்குத்துகளின் எண்ணிக்கை அதிகம் .அதனால் கோவில் திருவிழாக்கள் ஒழிக்கப்பட வேண்டுமென சொல்லுறீங்களா?

I just brought to your notice that your notion that blind adulation of cinema fans to a level of fanaticism also has taken a few lives and definitely to be added to the list of fanaticism that our thamizh people have (if we generalize - our indian people). This being thamizh films thread i added this to the discussion. Madha veri paththi vera threadla pesalaam. adhai ingey pesinaa. MAdha veri sari enga veri thappaa? appadinnu kekara maadhiri irukku. Appadi kaettaal, andha veriyum thappu indha veriyum thappu apdingradhu dhaan theerpu. Madha veri paththi pesum boadhu mozhi veriyayum saeththu pesalaam adhai romba naagareegama indha threadla pesa mudiyaadhu - adhu oru periya digression. vera threadla illa blogla naama adhai pesuvom.

:fatigue: :shaking: Pls stop the lecture..மதவெறி பற்றியெல்லாம் நான் இங்கு பேசவில்லை ..கோவில் திருவிழாவில் கத்தி குத்துவதற்கு மதவெறி காரணமாய் இருக்கத் தேவையில்லை .மக்கள் கூடும் இடங்களில் (கோவில் திருவிழா ,சந்தை ) போன்ற இடங்களில் பல்வேறு காரணங்களுக்காக கத்திகுத்து தகராறுகள் நடைபெறலாம் .


kaththi kuththu happens in front of jail, panchayat office, collecetor office and infront of people's house too. Vaarthayai pidichikittu, argue pannaa indha maadhiri thappu thappa argue naan kooda pannalaam.

சரிங்க ஐயா ..நாங்க தான் தப்பு தப்பா வாதம் பண்ணுறோம் .நீங்க மட்டும் தான் சரியா பண்ணுறீங்க .அப்போ தேவையில்லாம நம்மை இழுக்காம இருக்கலாமே :huh:

[ajithfederer]

:lol:


Corleone

Idhula enna perumai ?? :P

sattaila enna bomma

poona saar

idhula enna peruma..get out :lol:

[HonestRaj]

:lol:


Corleone

Idhula enna perumai ?? :P

sattaila enna bomma

poona saar

idhula enna peruma..get out :lol:

poyum poyum poonaya pottan oru singatha potturukka koodadhu

appakooda avan asingamathan iruppan :lol:

[Nerd]

Have you guys seen Bharathiraja's ennuyir thOzhan ??

yup (I raise my hand)!!

There are fanatics like that too. ThannOda kudumbam/kuzhanthaigaLai koodA madhikkAmal field work seyyum makkaL. Have personally seen them. They are just plain stupid. And it can't be denied that this fanaticism spreads hatred among people, provokes them towards violence and more than one life has been lost!

[selvakumar]

Beer abhishekam is well and truly introduced by THALA fans !!!!!
:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :2thumbsup: :2thumbsup: :2thumbsup: :2thumbsup:
Proud to be a THALA fan.
Yes. Apart from that, "Paan Paraag" maalai was also introduced by Thala fans. Not just Beer. "Jin" abhisekam kooda Varalaarukku nadanthathu (Madurai la). Dinamalar reports on this regularly as usual :lol:

[selvakumar]

Beer abhishEkam naan pArthadhillai. ChummA sollanumEnu solla vENdiyadhu :lol2:
1. Beer is costly
2. Beer stinks
3. Its illegal!
:rotfl:

enna aachu Nerd ?? :lol:

BTW, entha kaalathula irukeenga...Banner ae 50K kku vaikkum pothu... Beer enna, whisky, wine ellam follow aagurathu vegu thoorathil illai

[jaiganes]

Thavira Thiru joe avargal theatre vaasalil kaththi kuthu pathi yellaam padichadhillainnu ninaikiren.

ஐயா,
தியேட்டர் வாசலில் நடந்த கத்திக்குத்துகளை விட கோவில் திருவிழாக்களில் நடந்த கத்திக்குத்துகளின் எண்ணிக்கை அதிகம் .அதனால் கோவில் திருவிழாக்கள் ஒழிக்கப்பட வேண்டுமென சொல்லுறீங்களா?

I just brought to your notice that your notion that blind adulation of cinema fans to a level of fanaticism also has taken a few lives and definitely to be added to the list of fanaticism that our thamizh people have (if we generalize - our indian people). This being thamizh films thread i added this to the discussion. Madha veri paththi vera threadla pesalaam. adhai ingey pesinaa. MAdha veri sari enga veri thappaa? appadinnu kekara maadhiri irukku. Appadi kaettaal, andha veriyum thappu indha veriyum thappu apdingradhu dhaan theerpu. Madha veri paththi pesum boadhu mozhi veriyayum saeththu pesalaam adhai romba naagareegama indha threadla pesa mudiyaadhu - adhu oru periya digression. vera threadla illa blogla naama adhai pesuvom.

:fatigue: :shaking: Pls stop the lecture..மதவெறி பற்றியெல்லாம் நான் இங்கு பேசவில்லை ..கோவில் திருவிழாவில் கத்தி குத்துவதற்கு மதவெறி காரணமாய் இருக்கத் தேவையில்லை .மக்கள் கூடும் இடங்களில் (கோவில் திருவிழா ,சந்தை ) போன்ற இடங்களில் பல்வேறு காரணங்களுக்காக கத்திகுத்து தகராறுகள் நடைபெறலாம் .


kaththi kuththu happens in front of jail, panchayat office, collecetor office and infront of people's house too. Vaarthayai pidichikittu, argue pannaa indha maadhiri thappu thappa argue naan kooda pannalaam.

சரிங்க ஐயா ..நாங்க தான் தப்பு தப்பா வாதம் பண்ணுறோம் .நீங்க மட்டும் தான் சரியா பண்ணுறீங்க .அப்போ தேவையில்லாம நம்மை இழுக்காம இருக்கலாமே :huh:

palveru kaaranangaL appadinnu solreengale.
theatre vaasalil kaththi kuththu enbadhu sameebaththil nadandha oru sambavam adhaiththaan kuripittaen. maththabadi ungalai pondra saandrorukku en siru madhiyonin lecture thaevayillai enbadhu enakku theriyum aiyya.
ungal padhivai thavaraaga purindhu kondadharku varundhugiren!!

[selvakumar]

Corleone
Idhula enna perumai ?? :P
nejamaathaan ketkureengala :P

[selvakumar]

Then Indhiya kalacharathu padi edho jolly-a irundhuttu porom.. idhula enna prachanai? naanga fanaticism la "waste" panra time-a vida indha madhiri vivadham moolama waste agara time dhaan jaasthi :)
:exactly:

[Nerd]

Selva, I m still in 2002 (baba release) And I have not seen beer and other crap during my times!! so wasnt sure, thanks for letting me know!

[ajithfederer]

Adhula perumai pada onnum illai :)


Corleone
Idhula enna perumai ?? :P
nejamaathaan ketkureengala :P

[selvakumar]

Adhula perumai pada onnum illai :)
oh ! :)
38K to 50k rasigar mandrathoda sernthu naan perumai paduraen :wink: 8-) :) on the "fun" and "celebration"

[equanimus]

Alright, Jaiganes. I was primarily objecting only to the condescension towards fanboy-groups and gross generalizations about literates vis-a-vis illiterates.

[NOV]

Agree with you completely Jaiganesh. Just look at Selva's post above. I am still reeling with shock. :sigh2:

on another note, I observe that Indians make the most number of fanatics, let it be cinema, politics, religion, language or anything else. Fanaticism leads to violence - its just a slip between the cup and lip.

taking malaysia as an example, indians are the smallest group among the three major races here, but in violence, we are the tops. this is evident in any place indians live. :cry2:

[Thalafanz]

taking malaysia as an example, indians are the smallest group among the three major races here, but in violence, we are the tops. this is evident in any place indians live. :cry2:

True but what it has to do with 'fanatisicm' :confused2:

[directhit]

BTW, entha kaalathula irukeenga...Banner ae 50K kku vaikkum pothu... Beer enna, whisky, wine ellam follow aagurathu vegu thoorathil illai u mean they (fans) spend 50000 rupees for those banners :oops: :?

[MADDY]

the good work that are done by fans dont even get a mention here...........kamal fans are doing a great job in social work, even some of our hubbers are part of such things :clap:

one of my office colleague, rajini fan, lists so many examples of them doing charity work :notworthy:

ada, enga saadhi kaara pasanga - so called peters - yahoo grp rahman fans are also into so much social work......they recently helped out a orphanage.........:notworthy:

so, i would say, cinema fanatics are the only reason for social service........

[ajithfederer]

Ajith fans orkut groupum avanga naala mudinja udhavigalai seyraanga :) .

[MADDY]

Ajith fans orkut groupum avanga naala mudinja udhavigalai seyraanga :) .

sollava venum.........avare evalavu pannuraaru 8-)

[selvakumar]

Agree with you completely Jaiganesh. Just look at Selva's post above. I am still reeling with shock. :sigh2:

irukka koodaathey !


taking malaysia as an example, indians are the smallest group among the three major races here, but in violence, we are the tops. this is evident in any place indians live. :cry2:
ithukkum fanaticism kkum enna relation :confused2:

[groucho070]

taking malaysia as an example, indians are the smallest group among the three major races here, but in violence, we are the tops. this is evident in any place indians live. :cry2:
ithukkum fanaticism kkum enna relation :confused2:

Selva, there is.

I come from a small town called Kluang. There used to be a theatre called Brilliant there. Fighting amongst fan was historic...to one point that it was burnt down. I am not sure which fans these are, but considering the time (early 70s) it must have been the big two. I got to check with my dad, a huge MGR fan (I am sure he will deny involvement in those fights).

Fights in cinema is not a shocking news here. And of the major races in Malaysia, it does not take a brilliant guy to know which fans did it. Brilliant, hmmm.....