Sad to read TN fishermen getting killed by Srilankan Navy

[app_engine]

It's disheartening to see pictures of family members crying over the killing of their family breadwinners, often for no fault of theirs. Obviously Indian / TN Govt. does not do anything and the island's navy seems to be trigger happy thinking that they are acting against terrorists.

There had been debates as to how to prevent / avoid...joint INS / Srilankan patrol? Approved coloring of boats? What else? Why should innocent TN fishermen suffer because of the lankan conflict?

[crazy]

Why should innocent TN fishermen suffer because of the lankan conflict?


:( :cry: :( :cry:

[Nakeeran]

Though I sympathise with them, wonder why do they venture into the waters that belong to another country ?
Damn sure all these fishermen must be quite experienced all these years & must have been aware of the territorial waters .

[manuel]

I wonder why not these things are taken by the central government to discuss with the Srilankan counterparts... May be our media and people are not considering it worth to push forward such things...
Or may be they do not see much of electoral gains in these issues??

[app_engine]

"waters that belong to another country"

-Though there are often conflicting reports about this, these poor fisherman may not have enough measuring devices to confirm exactly where they are (who would want to get killed?)

-The whole gap between TN & Srilanka being so small with ever increasing fishing community / demand, shouldn't the Indian coast-guard offer some kind of cover / guidance for them?

-In any case, why should there be death penalty to straying a little bit in the waters? (This has happened even when there was no armed conflict in Lanka before)

In general, what is the relationship / understanding between India & Lanka in such matters?

[crazy]

In general, what is the relationship / understanding between India & Lanka in such matters?

ZERO!

kettka yaarum illenna shoot thaan seiyvaan(ga)! :oops: :roll:

[app_engine]

http://www.dinamalar.com/2007mar31/specialnews1.asp?newsid=2

...

[madhu]

In general, what is the relationship / understanding between India & Lanka in such matters?

ZERO!

kettka yaarum illenna shoot thaan seiyvaan(ga)! :oops: :roll:

kEtka niraiya pEr irukkAnga.. yAr kEtkaradhu appadinu sandai pottukittu :(

[crazy]

ZERO!

kettka yaarum illenna shoot thaan seiyvaan(ga)! :oops: :roll:

kEtka niraiya pEr irukkAnga.. yAr kEtkaradhu appadinu sandai pottukittu :(

:rotfl:
kettka yaarumkkum manasillai athaan :(

[Parker]

shooting is the worst punishment but nobody is going to shoot without any reason! every country has their own laws, why you need to break them?!

[crazy]

shooting is the worst punishment but nobody is going to shoot without any reason! every country has their own laws, why you need to break them?!
they can arrest those fisherman. why shooting? what crime have they committed? fishing in SL's sea? Aint we(?) neighbors after all?!
I have read news where Russian ship illegally fishing in Norwegian Seas, but never heard that they were shooting each other............

India :sigh2:
SL :roll:

[app_engine]

http://www.kumudam.com/magazine/Reporter/2007-04-08/pg11.php

This article says Srilankan forces are worse than even Pakistani forces...

[smith]

Neither the Srilankan nor the Indian govts are bothered abt the indian (tamil) fisherman dying.

Statements will be made condeming the shooting every time it happens.

The fisherman are best advised not to venture too far. Nobody is there to care for them.

That is the harsh reality.

[podalangai]

I wonder why not these things are taken by the central government to discuss with the Srilankan counterparts... May be our media and people are not considering it worth to push forward such things...
Or may be they do not see much of electoral gains in these issues??

Forget the Central Government. If the so-called "Tamil" parties withdraw their support, the central government will fall. When we have this much negotiating clout, our leaders - the very ones who claim to be soooo Tamil and care sooo much about Tamils - do nothing. What does this tell you about them? :banghead:

[Lambretta]

If the so-called "Tamil" parties withdraw their support, the central government will fall. When we have this much negotiating clout, our leaders - the very ones who claim to be soooo Tamil and care sooo much about Tamils - do nothing. What does this tell you about them? :banghead:
True, podalangai! :( :evil:

[Querida]

shooting is the worst punishment but nobody is going to shoot without any reason! every country has their own laws, why you need to break them?!
they can arrest those fisherman. why shooting? what crime have they committed? fishing in SL's sea? Aint we(?) neighbors after all?!
I have read news where Russian ship illegally fishing in Norwegian Seas, but never heard that they were shooting each other............

India :sigh2:
SL :roll:

That's too true Crazy...there really isn't any need for such extreme action to be taken...Podalangai's point unarguably valid as well...sadly i wish both were not true...

[crazy]

hm...... :( :cry:

[sivaram ram]

Well if the matter is getting worst, sri lanka forces are gona face hell... wat if a similar force like the Tamil Tigers emerge from Tamil Ndu just to deal with the naval force ?

I belief the lankan forces are in the verge of hurting their own anus .

[rocketboy]

Here comes the startling revelation . What was long believed to be true but couldn't be proved has now come to light. Contrary to popular belief that the Srilankan Navy was behind the abduction and killing of fishermen, it is now learnt that the LTTE had a hand in the incident. And this revelation was made by none other than the Chief Minister of Tamil Nadu M.Karunanidi.

Quoting from the Hindu ,

"Now it had been confirmed that the 12 fishermen , including 10 belonging to the Kanyakumari, one each from Tuticorin and Kerala , who set out to sea on March 4 , had been abducted by a group of Sea Tigers and kept in their conrol in a camp .

Preliminary enquiries revealed that the Sea Tigers were behind the killing of five fishermen from Kanyakumari district."

[crazy]

:shock: :o

[Raghu]

Quoting from the Hindu ,

"Now it had been confirmed that the 12 fishermen , including 10 belonging to the Kanyakumari, one each from Tuticorin and Kerala , who set out to sea on March 4 , had been abducted by a group of Sea Tigers and kept in their conrol in a camp .

Preliminary enquiries revealed that the Sea Tigers were behind the killing of five fishermen from Kanyakumari district."

apadi-nu Hindu-ku yaru sonathaam? :evil:, SL news agency 'Lanka Puvath' some crap from the SL government, dont believe such crap, it is the SL goverment evil tactics to turn the Indians against the LTTE, :banghead: :evil:

[rocketboy]

Quoting from the Hindu ,

"Now it had been confirmed that the 12 fishermen , including 10 belonging to the Kanyakumari, one each from Tuticorin and Kerala , who set out to sea on March 4 , had been abducted by a group of Sea Tigers and kept in their conrol in a camp .

Preliminary enquiries revealed that the Sea Tigers were behind the killing of five fishermen from Kanyakumari district."

apadi-nu Hindu-ku yaru sonathaam? :evil:, SL news agency 'Lanka Puvath' some crap from the SL government, dont believe such crap, it is the SL goverment evil tactics to turn the Indians against the LTTE, :banghead: :evil:

:roll: The Hindu has always adopted a negative stance towards the
LTTE. Agreed. I would have not believed had Subramanian Swamy or Jayalalitha levelled such a charge. But Karunanidi who is known to be sympathetic towards Tamils' cause in his official capacity as the Chief Minister of Tamilnadu has made this statement . This followed the arrest of some Sea Tigers by the Coast Guard on March 29. During interrogation the whereabouts of the missing fishermen were spilled out . And efforts are on to secure the release of these fishermen . Since this is a handiwork of LTTE the TN Govt is exploring all 'informal' channels as the Lankan Govt is not involved . Raghu you are requested to go through the news article at

www.hinduonnet.com

[crazy]

Sorry RB anna
but isnt it like every Tamils from Jaffna, r "Tigers" in India :oops:

another q
Karunanidi stated so, but whats the proof actually ........sorry I dont get it :(

[rocketboy]

Thangachi,

Unga first question enakku puriyala

Answer to the second question lies in my previous post. It is not that K is making an allegation . The Sea Tigers, you should be knowing very well , is the naval wing of the LTTE . Reportedly some members were caught by the Coastal Guards ( group of people who patrol the Indian shoreline) and handed over to the 'Q' branch of TamilNadu Police. It was then learnt that the missing fishermen are under the control of LTTE . Maybe Karunanidi is trying to be defensive. I can only speculate
:roll: .

[crazy]

:oops: corrected ......maybe understandable now :roll:

but why would they do like that? maybe ............i should read tamilnet...........they may have got sth to say :roll:

[app_engine]

Is this "blame it on puli" due to some kind of domestic politics?...(read - make cong-I happy, keep position strong in centre / state, arrest vaiko etc...)

[P_R]

:roll: The Hindu has always adopted a negative stance towards the LTTE. Agreed. I would have not believed had Subramanian Swamy or Jayalalitha levelled such a charge. But Karunanidi who is known to be sympathetic towards Tamils' cause in his official capacity as the Chief Minister of Tamilnadu has made this statement. Karunanidhi has been under some pressure since it was alleged that there is more to the Tidivanam blasts than meets the eye.The opposition has always maintained that law & order is not among his strong points because he has an image of being emotionally close to groups like the LTTE, TNLF, PW etc. So this may be a way to sound 'neutral' and get some law & order points. All said, I wouldn't be too surprised if it were true.

[crazy]

Was watching TTN news yesterday and they were saying like "Tigers" have nothing to do with it :roll: and they aint responsible for this killing of Tamil fishermen from India :roll:

[joe]

Crazy,
Right now ,I couldn't beleive both sides ..But I still beleive the chances for Tigers did this is very very less ,even if it is done by some Tamils ,I suspect there may be a hand of Karuna group ,doing this to put the blame on Tigers.

[crazy]

Karuna groups ..........yeah so possible. just for a week ago i read Karuna's interview with BBC :evil:

I dont really find any motivation back this killing of Tamil(Indians) fishermen by the Tigers! :roll:

[dsath]

Not sure if this is relevant to this thread, but thought might post it anyway.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/south_asia/6617035.stm

[crazy]

read that news ....yesterday :)

[Roshan]

Ithu eppadi irukku :wink: There is always two sides for anything and with LTTE there are many sides always and ever. This may be the reason why the so called TN Tamil leaders are shutting up without raising the issue at central level.

http://idlyvadai.blogspot.com/2007/05/blog-post_03.html

[crazy]

:roll:

[Nakeeran]

Its official now that it was LTTE which had killed 5 fishermen of TN .

Here is the confirmation from Q-Branch Police affirming the findings :

CHENNAI: The Tamil Nadu `Q' branch police on Thursday reiterated that it was the LTTE which shot dead five fishermen off Kanyakumari on March 29 and also abducted 12 fishermen some days prior to the shooting incident.

A `Q' Branch official said involvement of the banned outfit was confirmed from statements given to the police by Sea Tigers who were nabbed by the Coast Guard on April 11 and later handed over to the Tamil Nadu police for further investigation. The reiteration by the police came in the wake of the reported denial by LTTE that it was involved in the incidents. The special unit also released portions of, what it said, were statements of three islanders, Robinson, Bonipas and Arul, which were recorded.

The official said following the interrogation of one of the arrested Sea Tigers it was now strongly suspected that he was among those involved in the abduction.

A few days ago, Director-General of Police D. Mukherjee said that the arrested Sri Lankans had told the `Q' branch that prior to the shooting, 12 Indian fishermen were abducted along with their boat by a Sea Tigers group. The hostages were in the custody of the Tigers in one of their camps.

As per the statement released, Bonipas had said that the 12 fishermen were put on a (LTTE) boat. When the fishermen were questioned, they had said they were from Muttom.

Arul had said that he had heard a telephonic conversation that the fishermen, who were shot, had come by the side of a Sea Tigers boat and had insisted that they be given fish when they were fired at by one Manalan (a Sea Tiger).

According to Robinson, Michael (another Sea Tiger) had said that the name Maria on the Sea Tigers boat should be erased to evade detection by authorities.

http://www.hindu.com/2007/05/04/stories/2007050406700800.htm

[Nakeeran]

Its really sad that LTTE is playing against India. This is like entering into a lion's den .

Besides, LTTE's recent air power building is also a big concern for India's security interests.

[crazy]

The official said following the interrogation of one of the arrested Sea Tigers it was now strongly suspected that he was among those involved in the abduction.

http://www.hindu.com/2007/05/04/stories/2007050406700800.htm

:( :cry: :roll:

[crazy]

Its really sad that LTTE is playing against India. This is like entering into a lion's den .

Besides, LTTE's recent air power building is also a big concern for India's security interests

:roll:

[Nakeeran]

Crazy

Tamilnadu has become the easiest target to LTTE now ! Idhu koodavaa puriyala ?

With just arms length distance between Rameswaram - LTTE base in Jaffna, Indians better watch out.

[crazy]

Anna
Why Tamil Nadu our target? :roll:

[Raghu]

I dont know how true the incident is but, NakeeraRe, why is LTTE a threat to India or TN???,

In fact it is the India, Pakistan, Isreal, USA, Uk are all selling arms to SL,

what has LTTE got to do with TN?, i am really confused now!

[crazy]

so do I , raghu :(

[Nakeeran]

Wonder why U both cant realize a simple logic !?

Your neighbour ( who is damn close to your border ) and who has very easy access to your domain , has been building his arms for all these years to strengthen its ground force.

Now they have developed a potent force to strike even air . They seem to have acquainted with even rocket launching tech.

This is a potential threat to TN & ofcourse India's security.

Its not that India should fear this development but a neighbour building such a potent strike force is definitely a cause for concern.

It doesnt matter whether LTTE will strike TN / India's territory but it matters when they have developed such a skill & what deadly weapons they possess.

[Roshan]

Crazy,

Forget the point LTTE being a threat to India. I hope you can read Tamil. So go back and click the link I have given there above and read the whole article. With facts and figures it has been clearly stated that LTTE are responsible for killing of 5 fishermen and abduction of 12.

BTW, you asking Nakeeran 'why TN is "our" target'. What does that mean? Are you a member of LTTE?

[selvakumar]

Still unclear and ambiguous.
Anyway, First of ALL, Indian Govt should stop blabbering a lot about Pak terror camps & pak govt & should ACT SERIOUSLY on the poor fishermen being killed by SL GOVT ( 99.99%) & LTTE (now 0.01%).

Even after our fishermen being killed by SL GOVT, Our govt will still hold talks with them. Welcome their officers with great interest something which even they have not done to Pak.

HOw many SL fishermen have been killed by Indian Navy in the past :?: :roll:

[Nakeeran]

Selva Sir

Q branch of TN police dept have emphatically confirmed the facts that LTTE was behind the killing. What other evidence do you want ?

If it is from a politician, you can dismiss it as politics but if it comes from a police dept, what vested interest do they have ?

[selvakumar]

Selva Sir

Q branch of TN police dept have emphatically confirmed the facts that LTTE was behind the killing. What other evidence do you want ?

If it is from a politician, you can dismiss it as politics but if it comes from a police dept, what vested interest do they have ?

I read the link posted by Roshan. It said "LTTE yaa kooda irukkalaam" That is why I was a bit confused on the concrete info. :wink:

Actually I am thinking about 99.99% (past experience) and the 0.01% ! without leaving anything. :P

[Roshan]

Selva Sir

Q branch of TN police dept have emphatically confirmed the facts that LTTE was behind the killing. What other evidence do you want ?

If it is from a politician, you can dismiss it as politics but if it comes from a police dept, what vested interest do they have ?

I read the link posted by Roshan. It said "LTTE yaa kooda irukkalaam" That is why I was a bit confused on the concrete info. :wink:

Actually I am thinking about 99.99% (past experience) and the 0.01% ! without leaving anything. :P

Selva,

I dont think you have read the entire article ( It's quite lengthy I know). Neenga quote paNNura "LTTE-A kooda irukkalaam" is mentioned at the beginning. Please go back and read line by line till the end. AngE facts, figures, who and who from LTTE have been inquired and what is their response ellaam vilaavariyA irukku.

[Roshan]

Selva Sir

Q branch of TN police dept have emphatically confirmed the facts that LTTE was behind the killing. What other evidence do you want ?

If it is from a politician, you can dismiss it as politics but if it comes from a police dept, what vested interest do they have ?

I read the link posted by Roshan. It said "LTTE yaa kooda irukkalaam" That is why I was a bit confused on the concrete info. :wink:

Actually I am thinking about 99.99% (past experience) and the 0.01% ! without leaving anything. :P

Selva,

If you dont mind can you tell me what kind of experience you've had with SL military and LTTE ?

[selvakumar]

Selva,

If you dont mind can you tell me what kind of experience you've had with SL military and LTTE ?

NONE.
"Past Experience" refers to "Various NEWS ITEMS ON OUR GOVT's approach towards SL govt when many fishermen were killed by them".

[selvakumar]

Selva,

I dont think you have read the entire article ( It's quite lengthy I know). Neenga quote paNNura "LTTE-A kooda irukkalaam" is mentioned at the beginning. Please go back and read line by line till the end. AngE facts, figures, who and who from LTTE have been inquired and what is their response ellaam vilaavariyA irukku.

I read them. I can only appreciate OUR GUYS INTEREST towards this incident while they remained "Blind" towards other incidents reported in the past.

Idhukku Kaattina vegathila oru 0.000001% aavathu matha SHOOTING incidents ukku kaatti irundha Kadal la Suravukku eraiyaagaama, Thuppaakkikku iraiyaana enga meenavargaL ethanayoe per innum uyiroda irunthiruppaargal"

[Roshan]

Selva,

I dont think you have read the entire article ( It's quite lengthy I know). Neenga quote paNNura "LTTE-A kooda irukkalaam" is mentioned at the beginning. Please go back and read line by line till the end. AngE facts, figures, who and who from LTTE have been inquired and what is their response ellaam vilaavariyA irukku.

I read them. I can only appreciate OUR GUYS INTEREST towards this incident while they remained "Blind" towards other incidents reported in the past.

Idhukku Kaattina vegathila oru 0.000001% aavathu matha SHOOTING incidents ukku kaatti irundha Kadal la Suravukku eraiyaagaama, Thuppaakkikku iraiyaana enga meenavargaL ethanayoe per innum uyiroda irunthiruppaargal"


Selva,

ithukku kaattina vEgathila oru 0.0000001% matha vishayangaLukkum kaatti irunthaa LTTE-Oda saayam romba varushathukku munnAdi veLuthu irukkum. kaN ketta piRagu..... . Please dont think that I dont understand your concerns or I am in favour of SL military. atheyum thaandi niRaiya vishayam irukku. There wouldnt be an end if we start discussing. ithu 25 varuda saapakkEdu :cry:

[crazy]

:lol: this is really getting funny :oops:

[selvakumar]

Selva,

ithukku kaattina vEgathila oru 0.0000001% matha vishayangaLukkum kaatti irunthaa LTTE-Oda saayam romba varushathukku munnAdi veLuthu irukkum. kaN ketta piRagu..... . Please dont think that I dont understand your concerns or I am in favour of SL military. atheyum thaandi niRaiya vishayam irukku. There wouldnt be an end if we start discussing. ithu 25 varuda saapakkEdu :cry:

Roshan,
:) Agreed. Ovvoru visayathukku rendu kannottam irukkum. (something which we don't know which applies even to me since we might not have concrete info on the OTHER SIDE VIEW as well ) :)

Let me stop here. ennamoe itha pathi pesunaa orun CATCH 22 situation la irukkira oru feel varuthu. :)

[Roshan]

:lol: this is really getting funny :oops:

Yeah it's funny for people who are comfortably seated in Europe :wink:

[Roshan]

Selva,

ithukku kaattina vEgathila oru 0.0000001% matha vishayangaLukkum kaatti irunthaa LTTE-Oda saayam romba varushathukku munnAdi veLuthu irukkum. kaN ketta piRagu..... . Please dont think that I dont understand your concerns or I am in favour of SL military. atheyum thaandi niRaiya vishayam irukku. There wouldnt be an end if we start discussing. ithu 25 varuda saapakkEdu :cry:

Roshan,
:) Agreed. Ovvoru visayathukku rendu kannottam irukkum. (something which we don't know which applies even to me since we might not have concrete info on the OTHER SIDE VIEW as well ) :)

Let me stop here. ennamoe itha pathi pesunaa orun CATCH 22 situation la irukkira oru feel varuthu. :)

sariyA sonneenga :) . Let me stop as well.

BTW, I am yet to pm you as agreed earlier. Will do it over the week end :)

[selvakumar]

/ dig
Roshan,
Seekiram anupunga movie list ah ! :wink:
/ dig

[Raghu]

Crazy,

Forget the point LTTE being a threat to India. I hope you can read Tamil. So go back and click the link I have given there above and read the whole article. With facts and figures it has been clearly stated that LTTE are responsible for killing of 5 fishermen and abduction of 12.

BTW, you asking Nakeeran 'why TN is "our" target'. What does that mean? Are you a member of LTTE?

Romba Mukiyum :evil:

[crazy]

Crazy,

Forget the point LTTE being a threat to India. I hope you can read Tamil. So go back and click the link I have given there above and read the whole article. With facts and figures it has been clearly stated that LTTE are responsible for killing of 5 fishermen and abduction of 12.

BTW, you asking Nakeeran 'why TN is "our" target'. What does that mean? Are you a member of LTTE?

Roshan Akka,
sirippatha thavira, unga kelvikku yenna bathil sollvathendru theriyala. Member of LTTE ......wish I am!
I asked Nakeeran anna, because I really didnt get what he meant by the next target is TN :roll:


Yeah it's funny for people who are comfortably seated in Europe

Eeshwara,
Yes, iam "comfortably" seated in Europe. But you will never come to know, how much/ many I have lost to live a "comfortable" life here.

I never wanted to bring LTTE/ SL issue, neither wanted to quote ur post Roshan akka......I am sorry, if i hurt you by any means.

Only thing i want it peace to my Tamil people. May the good God, bless us! :)

[crazy]

Q branch of TN police dept have emphatically confirmed the facts that LTTE was behind the killing. What other evidence do you want ?

If it is from a politician, you can dismiss it as politics but if it comes from a police dept, what vested interest do they have ?

Q branch :rotfl: reminds me of their "visit" to every Jaffna Tamils house in Trichy :lol:
Living in India, have taught me lot of lessons ....other than my school syllabus! Q branch'oda story ellam enakkum theriyum anna, if they think they will make it hell!

Police = Politics = Politicians ........is just the one and the same.


Wonder why U both cant realize a simple logic !?

It doesnt matter whether LTTE will strike TN / India's territory but it matters when they have developed such a skill & what deadly weapons they possess.

Anna
You r talking as if India doesn't got those weapons at all!


Pretty sure, this tread is going to be locked :oops:
Maybe i should stop here :roll:
Sorry!

[Roshan]

Crazy,

There is nothing of your posts hurt me. So no worries and no need for apologies :)

While I understand the pains of yours and many of your sorts, I want to reiterate that there are always many sides to such controversial issues specially with the issues of LTTE and people are not so naive to believe the cooked up stories all the time.

Be thankful that you are leading a comfortable life there in Europe at least now - but there are thousands of your brothers and sisters out there who dont even have the minimum luxury of moving out to a better town within Sri Lanka and I do see their pains almost daily. I have very close Jaffna, Batti and Trinco Tamil friends whose lives have been made hell by the LTTE ( LTTE is more capable of making the lives hell as much as the Q branch and IPKF).

I can go on and on writing the miserable lives of nothern Muslims who have been living in extremely poor conditioned refugee camps for the last 15 years.

I can quote with dates and figures the incidents of LTTE butchering Eastern Muslims - threatening them to leave their homeland.

There are thousands such pathetic stories from other sides as well.

You said - you wish you were a member of LTTE . It's easier said than done Crazy. Having said that I am sure you would never understand the feeling of being a brain washed - drug adict - child soldier, who comes from a lower caste, poorest family.

I too am sure that this thread will be locked soon. I had no intentions of getting involved in the discussions here until I saw things getting cooked up as per individual prejudices.

[crazy]

Hell & LTTE :rotfl:

As u said earlier, there is two side of a coin, I see the positive/ good side of LTTE and you see the negative/ bad side of LTTE!

who made whoes life hell or who started to make ppls life hell?
i dont need the answer......let things be the way they are.

Akka, i belong to a family where many were in the LTTE, its impossible for me to agree with you or anybody :oops:
Whatever it may be........to me, LTTE is the only way to get our homeland!

btw i asked you sorry, just to make sure that i never intended to hurt anyone spl you! i still remember your post in a locked tread.......at once i read your post, God know, how bad i felt. Thank God, that tread was locked, just before I could make my second post!


.........threatening them to leave their homeland.
There are thousands such pathetic stories from other sides as well.

:exactly:

mothathil evarum ozhungu illai........kadavul yenna nadakkanum'nu ninachu irukkaaro, apadiye nadanthittu pogattum!

ethu eppadiyo, maadittu muzhikirathu ennavo, paava patta sanangal thaan..... :(
May God bless us All!

[Roshan]

mothathil evarum ozhungu illai........kadavul yenna nadakkanum'nu ninachu irukkaaro, apadiye nadanthittu pogattum!

ithathaanga naan aaramathula irunthu solREn :lol:



ethu eppadiyo, maadittu muzhikirathu ennavo, paava patta sanangal thaan..... :(

appAdA naan aRinju muthal muthalA unga sontha maNNOda baashai pEsi irukeenga. Cheers for that :thumbsup:



May God bless us All!

Ameen to that. Kaalamthaan bathil solla vEndum :? :cry:

[joe]

As one from the community lost 5 fishermen ,Ippothaikku naan sollurathu..

Yaarai thaan nampuvatho Pethai Nenjam :oops: :cry:

[Sanguine Sridhar]

indha meenava nanbargaloda kashtatha theethutta appram yaaralayum arasiyal panna mudiyaadhu! indha naatula paadhi prechanaiku vidai kandu pidikama irrukuradhu, verum arasiyal aadhayathukku dhaan.. yaarukum makkal prechanaya theekanum-nu oru enname kedayaadhu.Edhaavadhu prechanai nadandhuchuna, adhula 10 peru sethu poitaangana..3 naal azhudhuttu 4 aavadhu naal kolangal serial paakuradhu namma oorula ezhudha padadha oru vidhi.Innum oru 30 varusham kazhichi paathaalum idhey nelama thaan.Ennamo ponga, nam naatin thala vidhi, saaba kedu! :(

[Madavan]

Ohh no. SL navy killed more TN fishermen! It has been happeing for ages.. They are never satisfied with killing innocent Eezha thamizh. :(

[joe]

indha meenava nanbargaloda kashtatha theethutta appram yaaralayum arasiyal panna mudiyaadhu! indha naatula paadhi prechanaiku vidai kandu pidikama irrukuradhu, verum arasiyal aadhayathukku dhaan.. yaarukum makkal prechanaya theekanum-nu oru enname kedayaadhu.Edhaavadhu prechanai nadandhuchuna, adhula 10 peru sethu poitaangana..3 naal azhudhuttu 4 aavadhu naal kolangal serial paakuradhu namma oorula ezhudha padadha oru vidhi.Innum oru 30 varusham kazhichi paathaalum idhey nelama thaan.Ennamo ponga, nam naatin thala vidhi, saaba kedu! :(

Unamiya sonnenga!

Nenju poRukkuthilliye
Intha Nilai ketta manitharai ninainthu vittaal :cry:

[Raghu]

Ohh no. SL navy killed more TN fishermen! It has been happeing for ages.. They are never satisfied with killing innocent Eezha thamizh. :(

unmaiyileye itha ULAGA AZHAGI Chandrika and CO thaan panirakanumm, this has been going on for decades, infact as early as the 1980's aana antha kaalathila Mookazhagar J.R.Jeywardene irunthirukanum pola :?

[Raghu]

aama, manaarilirunthu ethanai eezhathu thamizharghal sethurukaana yarakavathu theriyuma,

avangala kondathu Indian Navy-ya? illa SL navy-ya?

[Raghu]

Yaarai thaan nampuvatho Pethai Nenjam :oops: :cry:

Ellam Mayai Joe anNe, naama ena panlam vdithi namlal vidaathu,

ehswaraaa :cry2:

[thimuru]

Ohh no. SL navy killed more TN fishermen! It has been happeing for ages.. They are never satisfied with killing innocent Eezha thamizh. :(

unmaiyileye itha ULAGA AZHAGI Chandrika and CO thaan panirakanumm, this has been going on for decades, infact as early as the 1980's aana antha kaalathila Mookazhagar J.R.Jeywardene irunthirukanum pola :?

:rotfl:

[crazy]

raghu :oops: :lol:

[Raghu]

thimuru and Crazy

Kavanam paathu Roshan akka vanthu aduchiduvanga :lol:

[Nakeeran]

Raghu sir

Ridiculing the premier of a country is not in good taste. Wonder how u are doing it !

[crazy]

thimuru and Crazy

Kavanam paathu Roshan akka vanthu aduchiduvanga :lol:

Sollrathuyum sollitu enna oru sirippu :roll:

[Raghu]

Raghu sir

Ridiculing the premier of a country is not in good taste. Wonder how u are doing it !

NakeeraRe,

Nanga (me) including millions of tamilians have suffered more than any1 can imagine in the hands of og ULAGA NAYAGI Chandrika amayar, summa A/C room -la irunthukitu pes nallathaan irukum, poi Eeazthathu thamizharkal padum thonpungangalai anupavithu paarthaal puriyum,

ithaiyellam intha manushan nalla anupavithitenpa, pothu aiya saami, :cry2: :cry2: :cry2:

[joe]

ithaiyellam intha manushan nalla anupavithitenpa, pothu aiya saami, :cry2: :cry2: :cry2:

Don't worry!

Nammai Yeippavar kaiyil athigaaram
irunthidum ennum kathai maarum

namathu vetriyai naaLai sariththiram sollum
ippadai thoRkin eppadai vellum!

[crazy]

Joe Anna :notworthy:

[Roshan]

:rotfl: :rotfl:

[Madavan]

deleted

[Madavan]

It wouldn't be too bad if English invade SL once again have it under their control. They can't be this bad.

[Roshan]

-deleted by author as a respect to the act of Madhavan-

[Madavan]

Its really sad that LTTE is playing against India. This is like entering into a lion's den .

Besides, LTTE's recent air power building is also a big concern for India's security interests.

You know the history? Dont' get me started on this. Do I have to remind you what they(Rajeev's army) did to the innocent tamizh's, after coming here overnight in planes?

[Roshan]

Madavan,

I dont know you much. I have seen a couple of your posts in the World Cup thread and admired the way you defended our team. We were all together in one side there supporting our team as members of one nation and within few days we fight against each other here in another thread. This is not something new but for how longs are we going to fight like this? Our people have been doing this for the last the 30 years and if we are going to continue like this - we would end up fighting for another 30 years. My heart bleeds when I think of it. ithellaam enga pOi mudiyumO - antha iRaivanukkuthaan veLicham :(

[c4ramesh]

Its really sad that LTTE is playing against India. This is like entering into a lion's den .

Besides, LTTE's recent air power building is also a big concern for India's security interests.

You know the history? Dont' get me started on this. Do I have to remind you what they(Rajeev's army) did to the innocent tamizh's, after coming here overnight in planes?

what you say doesn't follow.

1. Top LTTE leaders have said that Rajiv's assassination was a big mistake.

2. LTTE and SL have asked India to play a role in solving the crisis.

Given this doesn't follow that LTTE should play games against India.

[Madavan]

what you say doesn't follow.

1. Top LTTE leaders have said that Rajiv's assassination was a big mistake.

because it was a black mark in their history and it gave them a wrong image in international arena. But the bigger mistake was Rajeev sending his army here. It didn't cop any flak as people dismissed his wrong-doing as a minor blip.


2. LTTE and SL have asked India to play a role in solving the crisis.

Given this doesn't follow that LTTE should play games against India.

I can assure you. If India doesn't play a game against LTTE, LTTE won't.

[Madavan]

what you say doesn't follow.

1. Top LTTE leaders have said that Rajiv's assassination was a big mistake.
Bush one day will admit that it was a mistake to execute Sadam but that one can't deny Sadam massacred hundreds of innocent people. (Even Bush did.. that's a whole different story but I thought it was the best example I could think of) Don't nitpick me and stretch this discussion to Bush-Sadam. I don't want to dwell on this

[Madavan]

Madavan,

I dont know you much. I have seen a couple of your posts in the World Cup thread and admired the way you defended our team. We were all together in one side there supporting our team as members of one nation and within few days we fight against each other here in another thread. This is not something new but for how longs are we going to fight like this? Our people have been doing this for the last the 30 years and if we are going to continue like this - we would end up fighting for another 30 years. My heart bleeds when I think of it. ithellaam enga pOi mudiyumO - antha iRaivanukkuthaan veLicham :(

Thank you. If you were in my shoes, you won't do anything different, I assume, and the vice-versa.

Honestly, I think SL government should take the first step as they are a goverment.

[c4ramesh]

because it was a black mark in their history and it gave them a wrong image in international arena. But the bigger mistake was Rajeev sending his army here. It didn't cop any flak as people dismissed his wrong-doing as a minor blip.


IPKF didn't come to fight with LTTE but to see through the peace treaty went of as planned. LTTE broke the treaty hence the war broke. The rest is history...



I can assure you. If India doesn't play a game against LTTE, LTTE won't.

fine. :D

[c4ramesh]

Bush one day will admit that it was a mistake to execute Sadam but that one can't deny Sadam massacred hundreds of innocent people. (Even Bush did.. that's a whole different story but I thought it was the best example I could think of) Don't nitpick me and stretch this discussion to Bush-Sadam. I don't want to dwell on this

It is funny that you compare this issue with Bush-saddam, so do u agree that LTTE killed innocent people, since u use bush and saddam as a n example?

What is the proof that Rajiv ordered any of the misdoings of IPKF? If you don't have any how could it be right to kill Rajiv?

[Madavan]

IPKF didn't come to fight with LTTE but to see through the peace treaty went of as planned. LTTE broke the treaty hence the war broke. The rest is history...

you wish. because you aren't aware of all the facts that are on my hands. IPKF came overnight and bombed few temples and soon, they abducted innocent tamizh girls, raped, killed and burried them. Actually, their act even infuriated the SL president and it is believed that only with the help of the president LTTE threw IPKF out of SL. IPKF's intention was different.
[/quote]

[Madavan]

It is funny that you compare this issue with Bush-saddam, so do u agree that LTTE killed innocent people, since u use bush and saddam as a n example?
I told you that I overlooked the Bush-killings-of-innocents. The reason for my citing was to give you a clear picture of Rajeev/Sadam was not innocent.


What is the proof that Rajiv ordered any of the misdoings of IPKF? If you don't have any how could it be right to kill Rajiv?
I can't show you video, audio, picture kind of proofs but he was the leader that sent the army here.

BTW, do you have a proof that Thalaivar ordered LTTE to kill Rajeev? see. We can play with words.

[Roshan]

- deleted by author -

[c4ramesh]

you wish. because you aren't aware of all the facts that are on my hands. IPKF came overnight and bombed few temples and soon, they abducted innocent tamizh girls, raped, killed and burried them. Actually, their act even infuriated the SL president and it is believed that only with the help of the president LTTE threw IPKF out of SL. IPKF's intention was different.


I am not dening that the IPKF may have misbehaved, In war these things happen. The required party should be taken to Task.

But please read history as to why the war started. LTTE with initally agreed to the truce latter began to withdraw from it, hence the war. I am not trying to justify anything that happened during the war.

But, the intention was not to fight the LTTE but solve the crisis which turned awry. :(

[joe]

I am not dening that the IPKF may have misbehaved, In war these things happen.

IPKF went there not for war,for peace keeping,I was told

IPKF -Indian Peace keeping Force..isn't it? :roll:

[Madavan]

But please read history as to why the war started. LTTE with initally agreed to the truce latter began to withdraw from it, hence the war. I am not trying to justify anything that happened during the war.
I don't need to read history, I know it. There was history before the time you mentioned here.

Apart from all the people live in the Island, and some..very some people from other countries, nobody wants peace in the Island. The ethnic conflict is a great source to business plans of many countries. They take full advantage of the crisis in the island.

[Roshan]

Anyway this place is getting really hot. 30 varusha yutham maathiri thodarnthu artham illA - mudivillA saNdai pOda pOraanga :lol: I can see the moderator roaming around with a big poottu :lol:

[c4ramesh]

I told you that I overlooked the Bush-killings-of-innocents. The reason for my citing was to give you a clear picture of Rajeev/Sadam was not innocent.


Yes, I overlooked it, sorry.

But the point is just giving a mere example doesn't suffix. you have to prove that your example fits this case.



I can't show you video, audio, picture kind of proofs but he was the leader that sent the army here.


Just because he was the leader so what?

how can he be responsible for things he never wanted to do?



BTW, do you have a proof that Thalaivar ordered LTTE to kill Rajeev? see. We can play with words.


So LTTE is asking the Indian people to forgive them for something that they never did? :twisted:

Funny. Prabakaran, himself said it is something he wants to forget when asked the question why LTTE assassinated Rajiv? he never denied it.

[Madavan]

I am really sorry.. I'm against all the wars and killings..
I want a peaceful world.. Ramesh sir, sorry if I have hurt your sentiments.

Had IPKF not intervened in the crisis, it would not have left a bad taste in our mouth.

[joe]

C4Ramesh,
If you say Prabaharan is responsible for what Sivarasan and thanu did ,then isn't Rajiv ghandi responsible for what IPKF did? :huh:

[c4ramesh]

I am really sorry.. I'm against all the wars and killings..
I want a peaceful world.. Ramesh sir, sorry if I have hurt your sentiments.

Had IPKF not intervened in the crisis, it would not have left a bad taste in our mouth.

NO need to be sorry, I am not hurt.

Cheer up... :D

[Madavan]

Funny. Prabakaran, himself said it is something he wants to forget when asked the question why LTTE assassinated Rajiv? he never denied it.

So all Prabhakaran had to do was deny it, then the speculation would be dismissed?

So anyone here can show me the proof for LTTE killed TN fishermen?

Rajeev was the leader and he sent his force to the island. They bombed many places in the first few days of stay and right away started molesting girls. I think it was the only intention they had when coming here. If they had anything different, they would have not resorted to physical abuse.

As our leader, I regret their killing of Rajeev. But nobody to regret the burial of innocent thamizh.

[crazy]

gosh.....this is getting hotter and hotter

sorry either parties :oops:

[c4ramesh]

C4Ramesh,
If you say Prabaharan is responsible for what Sivarasan and thanu did ,then isn't Rajiv ghandi responsible for what IPKF did? :huh:

I already said why both are not the same.



So LTTE is asking the Indian people to forgive them for something that they never did?

Funny. Prabakaran, himself said it is something he wants to forget when asked the question why LTTE assassinated Rajiv? he never denied it.

[joe]

C4Ramesh,
If you say Prabaharan is responsible for what Sivarasan and thanu did ,then isn't Rajiv ghandi responsible for what IPKF did? :huh:

I already said why both are not the same.



So LTTE is asking the Indian people to forgive them for something that they never did?

Funny. Prabakaran, himself said it is something he wants to forget when asked the question why LTTE assassinated Rajiv? he never denied it.


Atleast prabhaharan has that honesty to take responsibility ..But Indian govt ever regret for their IPKF atrocities? :huh:

[Madavan]

Ramesh sir, I can argue by putting forth illogical ideas points like if Prabhakaran asked the suicide bombers to kill Rajeev, they don't really have to. They are adult, they have sixth sense.. but to me, it sounds not so convincing.

[joe]

I don't agree with LTTE killing Rajiv..It is a absolute blunder ,which worsen the state of LTTE.

But fellow Indian nationals ,pls don't justify whatever IPKF did just for the sake of patriotism ..Too many people killed and raped ..But for you Rajive ghandi is more than thousands of people killed. :cry:

[Nakeeran]

I don't agree with LTTE killing Rajiv..It is a absolute blunder ,which worsen the state of LTTE.

But fellow Indian nationals ,pls don't justify whatever IPKF did just for the sake of patriotism ..Too many people killed and raped ..But for you Rajive ghandi is more than thousands of people killed. :cry:

I am afraid, this thread is heading for a big big LOCK . Amazing, one of the moderators has entered the fray here DEEPLY DIGRESSING FROM THE MAIN TOPIC :lol:

Pathetic :o

[Madavan]

Arguments will lead us to nowhere. We're doomed and have to live with that. My only wish is Thalaivar gets what he wants when he is fully active. He is getting older. We all will give him our youth if he ever needs it. I doubt he needs it.

[thamizhvaanan]

But fellow Indian nationals ,pls don't justify whatever IPKF did just for the sake of patriotism ..Too many people killed and raped ..But for you Rajive ghandi is more than thousands of people killed. :cry:

[joe]

I don't agree with LTTE killing Rajiv..It is a absolute blunder ,which worsen the state of LTTE.

But fellow Indian nationals ,pls don't justify whatever IPKF did just for the sake of patriotism ..Too many people killed and raped ..But for you Rajive ghandi is more than thousands of people killed. :cry:

I am afraid, this thread is heading for a big big LOCK . Amazing, one of the moderators has entered the fray here DEEPLY DIGRESSING FROM THE MAIN TOPIC :lol:

Pathetic :o

when you don't have anything to argue ,You always come up with this slogan "Modeartor blah blah blah" :lol:

Pathetic :)

[Roshan]

Arguments will lead us to nowhere. We're doomed and have to live with that. My only wish is Thalaivar gets what he wants when he is fully active. He is getting older. We all will give him our youth if he ever needs it. I doubt he needs it.

I bet that you will keep saying the same thing even after another 10 or 15 years.

[Madavan]

I bet that you will keep saying the same thing even after another 10 or 15 years.

True. Thamizh's are doomed.

[c4ramesh]

So all Prabhakaran had to do was deny it, then the speculation would be dismissed?


I never said that, but since he himself doesn't deny this when asked directly, what more proof do you want?





Rajeev was the leader and he sent his force to the island. They bombed many places in the first few days of stay and right away started molesting girls. I think it was the only intention they had when coming here. If they had anything different, they would have not resorted to physical abuse.

As our leader, I regret their killing of Rajeev. But nobody to regret the burial of innocent thamizh.

I never justified the killing of the Tamils. Those who might have done that are free, i.e. the IPKF personal. But Rajiv had to pay the price.

I apologize on behalf of all Indians for what IPKF may have done, though my apologies isn't going to bring back what they lost. This is the most I can do. :cry:

IPKF was sent to oversee the peace accord but, LTTE withdrew from the accord. SO the intention was not war at the first place.

[thamizhvaanan]

IPKF was sent to oversee the peace accord but, LTTE withdrew from the accord. SO the intention was not war at the first place.


you wish. because you aren't aware of all the facts that are on my hands. IPKF came overnight and bombed few temples and soon, they abducted innocent tamizh girls, raped, killed and burried them.

[Madavan]

I never justified the killing of the Tamils. Those who might have done that are free, i.e. the IPKF personal. But Rajiv had to pay the price.
but some still want Prabhakaran for the murder of Rajeev. Why? He is only our leader, please hang whomever that killed Rajeev. I was certain Prabhakaran was in Thamizh Eezham when all this happened. See how illogical that sounds.

From LTTE's point of view, they had no choice I think. They can't kill the *force's* family or the whole force. Technically, Rajeev was responsible for that.


I apologize on behalf of all Indians for what IPKF may have done, though my apologies isn't going to bring back what they lost. This is the most I can do.

romba nantri.


IPKF was sent to oversee the peace accord but, LTTE withdrew from the accord. SO the intention was not war at the first place.
FYI, war is taking place from early 70s.. but the magnitude was smaller.. during late 80s, it got intensified. But LTTE did not even nod to the idea of IPKF coming to SL.

I don't think a peace-keeping-force will start killing, raping, and buring people right away if its only intention were to restore peace.

[c4ramesh]

I have said everything I need to say. As this is a bit of a sensitive issue, and this board to my knowledge is really conservative, it is isn't suitable to continue on this in here. So I quit. :D

[Sanguine Sridhar]

I dont have any idea about Srilankan army Vs LTTE conflicts. But I have a question.(I may be wrong)

Indians who are supporting tamizh eezham will accept Kashmir terrorism, terrorists? Well, they are fighting for the same rights? :huh:

[joe]

SU.PA.ThamizhSelva interview in this issue

http://eelabarathi-1.blogspot.com/2007/05/blog-post_6805.html

[joe]

Indians who are supporting tamizh eezham will accept Kashmir terrorism, terrorists? Well, they are fighting for the same rights? :huh:

You are comparing Eelam with Kashmir ? :huh:

In Kashmir ,not only equal rights ,but additional rights given (You are indian citizen ,But you can't buy property in kashmir ..Do you know ? .It is only allowed for Kashmiris)

What about Eelam ..Time by time all rights of Tamil withdrawed one by one ..First they tried to make Tamil out of official language ..Then they sidelined Tamils in educational opertunities ..The list goes on and on ..

In the begining ,Tamil people also protested in socalled 'Saathveegam' preached by Mahathma ghandi ..But when mahathma ghandi started a Unnaviratham ,opposite side bristish atleast consider it and respect it ..But what happened when Thileepan started Unnaviratham ,no body cared including India..and he died.

Tamil people are not somebody migrated from India as many think .They are 'Mannin Mainthargal' ..But they are treated as second class citiizens .Their heritages(Eg .Jafna library) were purposely destroyed..

with no other option only ,they started to retaliate.

So don't compare kashmir with eelam ..But if you say Ellam will be given if I agree to give away kashmir ,I don't mind ,let it be.

[Sanguine Sridhar]

As I said earlier, that is just my doubt. Because you are in Tamizhnaadu and more importantly a Tamizhan we know the pain of Eezham makkal(I am no exception). But if you goto Kashmir and ask the same, to the people, they will list the exact answer, the true story.

My second question, why still LTTE requests help from India? Now if Manmohan singh sends a peace troop to Srilanka and say if the history repeats(Mistakes may repeat). Then what is the guarantee to his life? He is our leader and we cant loose leaders anymore?!

What is the standpoint of Tamizhnaadu in this issue? Just like Pakistan --> Kashmir/ Terrorists? (Sorry for comparing, still we dont know the real pain of Kashmir citizens)

[joe]

My second question, why still LTTE requests help from India? Now if Manmohan singh sends a peace troop to Srilanka and say if the history repeats(Mistakes may repeat). Then what is the guarantee to his life? He is our leader and we cant loose leaders anymore?!
:lol:

Sridhar,
LTTE is not seeking help from India or wanted India to send the peace keeping force ( :cry: ) again ..All they requesting (not demanding) is not to help Srilankan Govt with any military operation or provide weapon ,which will be used to kill Tamils.

They wanted India to be neutral and help to solve the problem rather than indirectly supporting Srilanka govt in the name of diplomatic ,Because Srilankan Govt using all weapons against Tamil public.

After the recent LTTE air strikes ,SL officials blamed India ,who provided the radar ,which failed to detect LTTE aircraft ..But I don't know whether they switch on the radar first. :)

[joe]

As I said earlier, that is just my doubt. Because you are in Tamizhnaadu and more importantly a Tamizhan we know the pain of Eezham makkal(I am no exception). But if you goto Kashmir and ask the same, to the people, they will list the exact answer, the true story.

Again Sridhar...I am neither supportive nor against anyside in kashmir issue ..But I can tell you the difference between eelam issue and kashmir issue.

When India got independence and divided in to two (India and Pakistan) the rulers of the territories are asked which side they wanted to join ..Even Hyderabad (andra ,not the one in pakistan) ruler wanted to join Pakistan ,but since it is not in the border ,it is not allowed.

Regarding Kashmir ,Majority of the population were muslim and they some wanted to join with Pakistan otherwise a seperate nation ,but the king was a Hindu ,who decided to Join with India ...

So the claim for seperation started during the independence itself .Mean time pakiatan started a war claiming kashmir is theirs and they invaded some parts and end of the war pakistan defeated ,but some parts they captured still with pakistan.

Now people in kashmir ,few wanted to join pakistan ,few wanted to be with India ,but most wanted to be a seperate nation ..To convince these people ,Indian govt make kashmir as a spl state with additional previlages for kashmiris.

But until now ,there are groups fighting for seperation ,but sure pakistan's hand is there.

Coming to EElam ,almost same time British gave independence to Srilanka ..There was no dispute among singalese and Tamils ..But Later singalese tried to sideline Tamils in all aspects using their power of majority..Tamil fought for equality for long time ..But they were crushed more and more ..So Tamils finally decalred that they can't live as a single country .rest is history.

[Sanguine Sridhar]

Thank you sir! :) Thanks a lot for the explanation. Now, I can understand the difference.

[joe]

Thank you sir! :) Thanks a lot for the explanation. Now, I can understand the difference.

Welcome Sridhar :D

on an additional note ,if you are interested ,I can match bangaladesh problem with Eelam ..It has much similarity.

India was divided into 2 ,but pakiatan has two seperate teritories West and East Pakistan (Now Bangaladesh) ..Eventhough it is one country ,East pakistan people speak bengali .West Pakiatan people dominated east pakiatanis in all aspects ,so east pakistanis protested ..then Pakistan army attacked and killed his own people in east pakistan ..So many people ran for their life and came to india as refugees ..Indira ghandi (then PM) sent India army to east pakistan and finally pakiatan army surrended ..Indira ghandi created a new country called 'Bangaladesh'.

[Sanguine Sridhar]

Yes Joe! I know the history of Bangladesh. :) ..Thanks again!

[c4ramesh]

[tscii:9fe17bb475]


My second question, why still LTTE requests help from India? Now if Manmohan singh sends a peace troop to Srilanka and say if the history repeats(Mistakes may repeat). Then what is the guarantee to his life? He is our leader and we cant loose leaders anymore?!


LTTE aren't asking for peace troops, they are asking Diplomatic pressure:


"The only role which she (India) can play is diplomatically and politically persuading the government of Sri Lanka and the LTTE to seek a negotiated settlement rather than involving in a military confrontation" [Chief rebel negotiator Anton Balasingham, Express India (http://www.expressindia.com/fullstory.php?newsid=70062)]




What is the standpoint of Tamizhnaadu in this issue? Just like Pakistan --> Kashmir/ Terrorists? (Sorry for comparing, still we dont know the real pain of Kashmir citizens)

Firstly the Kashmir Issue can never be compared here.

During the partition the India and Pakistan mainly consisted of princely states.

Decision was taken by the British to leave the matter of annexation to the rulers of these princely states. i.e, they can decide with whom they can join.

The king of Kashmir was undecided on whom to join, as even some Hindu dominant states joined Pakistan [its hindu population in 1947 was 13% but now it is 1 or less than that :shock:].

Pakistan tried to persuade the king to accede Kashmir with Pakistan but he wanted to stay INDEPENDENT.

Pakistan had a Standstill Agreement with the king, allowing him to take the decision, irate pakistan violated the agreement and Sent in its Tribal people and Army masqueraded as Tribals, the King was still undecided. The Kashmiri people were looted. The king army and the people couldn't stop the onslaught. Unable to prevent the raiders from committing large-scale killings, loot and arson, the Maharaja requested (http://www.kashmir-information.com/historicaldocuments/112.html) the Government of India on October 26, 1947 that the State of Jammu and Kashmir be allowed to accede to India.

And he signed (http://www.kashmir-information.com/historicaldocuments/113.html) the instrument of accession. After which the Indian forces entered Kashmir.

India asked pakistan to stop its aid to the attacks Pakistan as usual denied any involvement. India went to the UN, by this time India had got back more than half of the Kadhmir from the Pakistani raiders.

The UN lambasted Pakistan for its illegal action. And a resolution was passed agreed on by both countries.

The Treaty read:
A

1. As the presence of troops of Pakistan in the territory of the State of Jammu and Kashmir constitutes a material change in the situation since it was represented by the Government of Pakistan before the Security Council, the Government of Pakistan agrees to withdraw its troops from that State...

B

1. When the Commission shall have notified the Government of India that the tribesmen and Pakistani nationals referred to in Part II, A, 2 hereof have withdrawn, thereby terminating the situation which was represented by the Government of India to the Security Council as having occasioned the presence of Indian forces in the State of Jammu and Kashmir, and further, that the Pakistani forces are being withdrawn from the State of Jammu and Kashmir, the Government of India agrees to begin to withdraw the bulk of its forces from that State in stages to be agreed upon with the Commission.

2. Pending the acceptance of the conditions for a final settlement of the situation in the State of Jammu and Kashmir, the Indian Government will maintain within the lines existing at the moment of the cease-fire the minimum strength of its forces which in agreement with the Commission are considered necessary to assist local authorities in the observance of law and order The Commission will have observers stationed where it deems necessary.

[U.N. Resolution, source (http://www.kashmir-information.com/historicaldocuments/unresolutions.html)]


The treaty asked for complete withdrawal of Pakistan from POK and asked partial withdrawal of Indian forces so that the people of Jammu and Kashmir can vote to determine whom to accede to.

To this date Pakistan hasn't withdrawn its forces from POK, how in the hell do those pakis accuse India?

More over the biggest political party then, the National conference leader Sheikh Abdullah, wanted Kashmir to be with India. He rebuked Jinnah twice when he asked his support accede to Kashmir to Pakistan. Read his address to the state assembly, where he says why Kashmir should be the part of India, here (http://www.kashmir-information.com/historicaldocuments/122.html). Kashmirs biggest political leader who was himself a Muslim wanted Kashmir to be with India. Pakistan was not willing to accept India's agreement with the king because a Hindu, what now?

Things have changed now, pakistan has changed the demographics of Kashmir, it has moved the real Kashmiris from its side with men from NWFP. The militants have made the lakhs of Hindu pandits refuges in their own land. with a changed demographics an vote in never possible.

Pakistan attacked India in 1965 and put the blame on India, see what their then Air marshal Nur said:

Nur Khan then spoke to Lt-Gen Akhtar Malik, GOC Kashmir, and was told that Pakistan was launching “Operation Gibraltar” with 800,000 infiltrators “to throw out the Indian troops with the help of the local population”.....

........“The performance of the Army did not match that of the PAF mainly because the army leadership was not as professional. They had planned ‘Operation Gibraltar’ for self-glory rather than in the national interest. It was a wrong war. And they misled the nation with a big lie that India rather than Pakistan had provoked the war and that we were the victims of Indian aggression.” [Dailytimes (http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=story_7-9-2005_pg3_1), pakistan]

The biggest joke is to this day Pakistan celebrate 1965 war as their defense day, since they seemingly defended their Nation from Indian aggressors while the truth is far from this.

Kashmir can in no way be compared to the SL problem. where it is an internal matter, here it is a cross border dispute.









[/tscii:9fe17bb475]

[c4ramesh]

After the recent LTTE air strikes ,SL officials blamed India ,who provided the radar ,which failed to detect LTTE aircraft ..But I don't know whether they switch on the radar first. :)

Radars that SL used detect only objects flying at a certain threshold height, the LTTE flew the planes at a lower height that can't be detected. :lol:

[joe]

After the recent LTTE air strikes ,SL officials blamed India ,who provided the radar ,which failed to detect LTTE aircraft ..But I don't know whether they switch on the radar first. :)

Radars that SL used detect only objects flying at a certain threshold height, the LTTE flew the planes at a lower height that can't be detected. :lol:

:lol:

As long as LTTE use air strikes to attack SL army targets rather than appavi civilians ,it is ok..But SL govt air strikes targets not only LTTE ,but also appavi civilians.

[Badri]

As long as LTTE use air strikes to attack SL army targets rather than appavi civilians ,it is ok.

Ok????? :shock:

I can't believe we have actually come to a state where we feel air strikes are ok!

I know Joe, you are talking in relative terms, still the fact that we can believe it to be ok is a bit callous.

By the way, a friend of mine from Melbourne was in Sri Lanka when the recent aerial raid happened during WC finals. The plane flew so low they could actually see it. It was painted dark blue or black, they couldn't tell.

[c4ramesh]

As long as LTTE use air strikes to attack SL army targets rather than appavi civilians ,it is ok.

By the way, a friend of mine from Melbourne was in Sri Lanka when the recent aerial raid happened during WC finals. The plane flew so low they could actually see it. It was painted dark blue or black, they couldn't tell.

No surprises their they had to evade the RADAR.

[joe]

As long as LTTE use air strikes to attack SL army targets rather than appavi civilians ,it is ok.

Ok????? :shock:

I can't believe we have actually come to a state where we feel air strikes are ok!

I know Joe, you are talking in relative terms, still the fact that we can believe it to be ok is a bit callous.

By the way, a friend of mine from Melbourne was in Sri Lanka when the recent aerial raid happened during WC finals. The plane flew so low they could actually see it. It was painted dark blue or black, they couldn't tell.

Badri,
So when SL Govt air strikes on Child care centres,churches ,temples ,libraries and houes of Tamil ,do you think LTTE has no rights to air strike atleast SL Army targets :huh:

Your friend only seen it ..But our brothers were killed even when they sheltered even in churches ,temples :huh:

[joe]

-Deleted-

[Raghu]

IPKF didn't come to fight with LTTE but to see through the peace treaty went of as planned. LTTE broke the treaty hence the war broke. The rest is history...

you wish. because you aren't aware of all the facts that are on my hands. IPKF came overnight and bombed few temples and soon, they abducted innocent tamizh girls, raped, killed and burried them. Actually, their act even infuriated the SL president and it is believed that only with the help of the president LTTE threw IPKF out of SL. IPKF's intention was different.
[/quote]

yes, they did, i will tell u my TRUE story, this happened in the late 80's may b 87, i am not sure, i was around 8 or 9 years old, we lived in a town in Jaffna, close to pallali Airport and kankesanthurai harbour, one night, 5 IPKF members and 3-4 SL army knocked on our door, we lived in massive house, there was my elderly thatha 80+, my paati again 80+, my little sis, my mum, and my self, my dad was in UK working.

they broke the door open, came inside, pushed my thaatha away, went to the kitchen, made them self Tea, sat their drinking , while all of them were staring at my mum, i saw all of these, but i was too young to understand what they were stariing , they sat their all day, asking so many questions about everything while pointing the guns at our faces , and sitting so close to my mum, my mum shivering and chanting Shivapuranam all the way, luckily, they had the orders from some commandor or something, and left and they said, they will come back, and these morons went and raped girls infront of their fathers, mothers, brothers, husbands in the same town, these were all done at gun point any one who went to save them were shot dead or beaten to death!

now i am grown up man, when i heard what they were looking at my mu, my bloody blood boils, if i was grown up man, surely i would have slaughterd those sick perverts, i would have tortued them, :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:
LTTE kep the SL army in their camps, those cowards could not come out those days, so none of this disgusting SICK things ever happend in our country. when u let these dogs loose, this is what happens

[c4ramesh]

:( :( :cry:

[joe]

:x :evil:

[selvakumar]

:cry: @ All those people who suffered at the hands IPKF.

I agree with one of Joe's posts. "Uyir enbathu ondru thaan. There is no diff in killing a human being and a PM. pala perai imsitha IPKF ukku LTTE in oru reaction Rajiv assassination mattum thaan. Is it why they have started killing our fishermen after years of waiting and desperation? :roll: There is a possiblity"

Apart from that, there is a SL tamil refugee camp near my town. I 've been there many times and I have also heard similar things from those friends :cry: :cry: :cry:

It is high time people should realise the basic human feelings forgetting our own sentimental attachments :cry:

[podalangai]

Coming to EElam ,almost same time British gave independence to Srilanka ..There was no dispute among singalese and Tamils ..But Later singalese tried to sideline Tamils in all aspects using their power of majority..Tamil fought for equality for long time ..But they were crushed more and more ..So Tamils finally decalred that they can't live as a single country .rest is history.

There is also a very big difference in the way the dispute is handled. For all the many many wrongs India has done in Kashmir, remember that India has never, ever sent the Air Force to bomb Srinagar, nor has it sent helicopter gunships in over Kashmiri villages. We do not use airpower against our own citizens and we never will. Sri Lanka does. We never refer to militancy-affected parts of Kashmir as "enemy territory" and we never will. The GoSL does this repeatedly. Whatever you may think of the LTTE vis-a-vis Lashkar-e-Toiba, this shows what the real difference between India's treatment of the Kashmiris and the GoSL's treatment of the Tamils is.

[podalangai]

:cry: @ All those people who suffered at the hands IPKF.

Yes. :cry: But in blaming the soldiers, do not forget to assign the blame where it should lie.

There is so much people forget now. Local IPKF commanders wanted to work more closely and directly with the villagers and village committees. They were forbidden to do so. Detachments of the Madras Regiment which spoke against policies of the Indian government were withdrawn. Because the Indian government felt soldiers were getting too close to the SL Tamils, they deliberately posted as few Tamil and Malayalam speakers as possible (no more than one per detachment) so that communication would be difficult. They were expressly ordered to disregard civilian casualties. The truly evil people were the politicians of the time, who deliberately and callously took the decision that the IPKF would be used as the instrument to pursue India's national self interest, never mind the cost to the Tamils. This is base evilness. It is utterly despicable, inhuman and criminal. There is no other way to describe it.

I am not saying any of this justifies anything, but when we talk about the events of that time and the years after, let us not forget this.
_________________
Dharma eva hato hanti
Dharmo rakshati rakshita:

[Raghu]

Podalangai anNe

apadi solunga sir

[Nakeeran]

SELVA :

Is it why they have started killing our fishermen after years of waiting and desperation? There is a possiblity"

Atrocious . :evil: If LTTE is the real culprit for this episode ( as confirmed by Q branch ).

Whatever may be , after our country's leader is assasinated by LTTE, this outfit has lost the sympathy of Indians. Hell with them. :evil: India summa kayyai katti kondu irukka koodaadhu.

Indian govt should take all steps to ensure normalcy in the Indian coastal line. Our security is primary than anything else.

[joe]

:cry: @ All those people who suffered at the hands IPKF.

Yes. :cry: But in blaming the soldiers, do not forget to assign the blame where it should lie.

There is so much people forget now. Local IPKF commanders wanted to work more closely and directly with the villagers and village committees. They were forbidden to do so. Detachments of the Madras Regiment which spoke against policies of the Indian government were withdrawn. Because the Indian government felt soldiers were getting too close to the SL Tamils, they deliberately posted as few Tamil and Malayalam speakers as possible (no more than one per detachment) so that communication would be difficult. They were expressly ordered to disregard civilian casualties. The truly evil people were the politicians of the time, who deliberately and callously took the decision that the IPKF would be used as the instrument to pursue India's national self interest, never mind the cost to the Tamils. This is base evilness. It is utterly despicable, inhuman and criminal. There is no other way to describe it.



Well said Podalangai sir!

[Raghu]

SELVA :

Is it why they have started killing our fishermen after years of waiting and desperation? There is a possiblity"

Atrocious . :evil: If LTTE is the real culprit for this episode ( as confirmed by Q branch ).

Whatever may be , after our country's leader is assasinated by LTTE, this outfit has lost the sympathy of Indians. Hell with them. :evil: India summa kayyai katti kondu irukka koodaadhu.

Indian govt should take all steps to ensure normalcy in the Indian coastal line. Our security is primary than anything else.

aha vanthutaraiya namma naradhauru :banghead:

vidiya vidya raamar kathai vidinchapuram raamar seethaiku enna murai-nu keataanam oruthan, athu mathiri thaan ungaloda posting irruku

Ishwaraa

[Nakeeran]

Raghu sir

Appo enna Tamil nadu police Q Branch peelaa ududhunu solreegalaa ?? What vested interest / prejudice they have towards LTTE ?

Remember the present govt is pro LTTE and if they had wanted, they could have conveniently covered up this issue.

Answer

[crazy]

Podalai anna :)

Raghu, sorry to hear your story ... :(
I guess, we all have a story to tell, but to whom?!

[Madavan]

SELVA :

Is it why they have started killing our fishermen after years of waiting and desperation? There is a possiblity"

Atrocious . :evil: If LTTE is the real culprit for this episode ( as confirmed by Q branch ).

Damn with the Q branch. It is tantamout to what Iran did to the English; Iran's assertion was that English entered their border and the English were pressuarised by Iran to tell in live tvs that they actually entered Iran's border. Who knows what happened? It is a mere attempt of both GoSL ( and maybe Q branch ) to show LTTE in bad lights. After having visited LTTE's places for peace-making reasons, Norway has finally understood who were behind the astrocities and the are trying to show the world the true colours of GoSL.. Soon began the GoSL's protest against Norway negotiators to leave the island. It is a fact that LTTE is acquiring respect from many countries for its decipline, which puts anti-LTTE in jeopardy.


Whatever may be , after our country's leader is assasinated by LTTE, this outfit has lost the sympathy of Indians. Hell with them. :evil: India summa kayyai katti kondu irukka koodaadhu.
Ya hell with Rajeev and his army. unaglukku naangal ethO respect vaichirukira maathir pEsureengalE Nakkeeran sir. We don't respect lustful morons. In fact, under LTTE's control, there was no crime, prostituion or any kind of BS. They respect women. I remember once they shot a male, who molested a girl, in a junction in front of many people. You react harshly to an assasination of a president(and 13 other people on the spot, I think), then guess how my reaction would/should be. hundreds of people man. avangalum manusangal thaanE. I lost our relatives too. enathu vali, ungaludaiya valiyai vida jaasthi :twisted:


Indian govt should take all steps to ensure normalcy in the Indian coastal line. Our security is primary than anything else.
ithE maathiri thaan matRavangalum ninaippaargal. naangal mattum thaan ulagam enRu ninappathu maha thappu. yaarum ingae vanthu kolai, koLLai, katRpazhippu seithaal avargalai vittu vaikka kuudathu :twisted:
naanga seendamalEyE, Rajeev's army vanthu attuuzhiyam seithaargal. LTTE pathiladi mattum thaan koduththathu, athukku ivvaLavu kadupaagireergal neengal, josiththu paarungal, engaludaiya aathirathilum niyaayam uLLathu.

ithu ungalukku, ungaludaiya kudumbathil uLLavargalukku nadanthaal thaan, ithanudaiya vali ungalukku puriyum. oru janaathipathi-in uyir aayiram uyirgalukalai eedu seiya mudiyaathu. :twisted:


Appo enna Tamil nadu police Q Branch peelaa ududhunu solreegalaa ?? What vested interest / prejudice they have towards LTTE ?
ithu Q branch-i keatka vEndiya kElvi. avargaludaiya ilaaba nattangalai patRi engalukku enna theriyum?

Please, move your eye-balls to the left of the window and see who are the two people. MGR kuuda puligalukku aatharavu thanthaar. neengal MGR rasigar thaanE. ithu patRi ungaludaiya karuththu? :)

[Madavan]

I think we better close this thread.

engalukkuL( includes you and us ) pagaimaiyai uruvaakkuthavatkaaga sila irakkamillathavargalaal seiyappatta sathiyE ( I mean putting the blame on LTTE ) ithu enbathu ennudaiya eNNam/karuththu. athatRku irai-yaagaa enakku viruppam illai.