Audio market - All time low

[app_engine]

http://sify.com/movies/tamil/fullstory.php?id=14255448

[app_engine]

If one goes by the article, it looks like music alone does not sell nowadays, even if it has the name tag of ARR...All of these need visuals and movie's success to perk them up...

[MADDY]

i dont think we need a 3rd grade site like sify to tell us that audio market is down.....we all know that.......that article was just to make a dig at ARRahman's godfather..........i still remember the first day when GF released on coolgoose, i tried to download and i was getting the "server busy" message for almost the whole day and could download the song next day only.....

really guys, heart in heart i dunt think HJ and YSR are giving the kinda music that ARR and IR gave in their peak..........i would attribute this as the foremeost reason rather than piracy and other nonsenses.........can anyone explain y piracy is not a problem for Himesh and S-E-L in HFM? though they are not selling as much as Anu Malik and Nadeem-Shravan did in 90's but still they are selling very well.....

[aruvi]

Piracy is a huge problem, as far as Tamil/Malayalam industries are concerned. People are willing to buy cheaper pirated versions than buy originals. They are more willing to download. There are so many sites open to download songs. I am sure that if Piracy was curbed, we would see at least 50% increase in sales then now.

But that's high thinking...

[Nitya]

I'm sure this is a natural consequence of people in the industry as a whole taking the art of composing music as a joke. Most of the people in the industry nowadays are living a lie of one kind or another: the lie that [youths] will only consume their products if they cater to their basest nature, and/or the lie that if they can make quick bucks they'll be alright.

I know that I will sound preachy with what I have to say next, but I don't care.

Very little of our music gives glory to The Living God (whatever you want to call Him). It's been this way since the heyday of Ilayaraja, or maybe even longer. We chose to write songs glorifying something other than God: sex out of marriage, 'turn-on love', competition, or idolizing mere men, from Rajnikanth to Sathyaraj to Vijay to Simbhu. I'm sorry to say, but this approach will in the long run destroy us, just like it has destroyed the music industry.

If I have riled anyone up writing this, then that's fine. I'd rather be truthful than politically correct.


Regards,
Nitya

[umaramesh]

Nowadays people can access net and hear the song. He can decide whether to buy genuine CD or copy it . You have FM which broadcasts right from the morning to midnight with mixture of old songs to latest one. Like this people have so many option.

Very difficult to sell nowadays unless you have combination of big names(AVM/Rajini/ARR/Shankar). I dont think repeated buying will not sustain more than a week. Those days are over. We need big wave like ARR to make people turn around.


regards
ramesh

[nilavupriyan]

in old days a film ran for 400 days easily...

during rajni kamal days its 200 days

ippo 100 naal odradhe periya vishayam..its a similar issue!

[aruvi]

Trouble is, film industry is a chaotic and selfish place. No one cares beyond their personal goal. An actors salary is just for the film. A music director gets his salary and that's how far he will strain himself. Even I am surprised when I hear that music directors get paid so much when their music isn't even selling to good levels. Sure, reviews will be there, good or bad. But then, that's because media needs something to write/talk about. And producers, well, they just want that extra money from audio sales.

I agree with Nitya about the downfall of music. It has steadily increased with every other hero coming up with self-glorifying songs, from Rajni to the latest Arya. How much can you hear that crap?

And like Ramesh says, music is heard on fm stations and online everywhere. That's because of copyright and laziness of music directors.

I think they should charge FM stations for playing songs. And internet music sites should be charged as well. It might take time, but it is a good way to curb all the audio problems. The reason people aren't buying is because they are getting everything free. These days, fans glorify music, but nothing is that good. I last bought ARR's Rang De Basanti, and it was just all right. Nothing compared to most of his other albums.

But even when you go to stores that sell audio cds, the store owners are selling pirated copies and have originals out for show and tell. Tamil music industry is becoming zero.

Even today, films will run 100/200 days. Especially in India. Problem is lousy theaters, high ticket prices, piracy, and tv. TV is a problem not because of mega serials, but because when TV has cinema 18hrs a day, why will people go to theaters. Film industry needs to look at all these issues.

Telugu industry still has films that run more then 100 days in more than 100 centers. Every year, several films run like that. The ticket prices are lower, the theaters are good and they are making good end products(technically), compared to Tamil. Their music industry has not been affected as badly as Tamil industry yet. There is still good market for music there.

Beyond everything, these music directors should come out and fight for copyright issues.

[selvakumar]

i dont think we need a 3rd grade site like sify to tell us that audio market is down.....we all know that.......that article was just to make a dig at ARRahman's godfather..........i still remember the first day when GF released on coolgoose, i tried to download and i was getting the "server busy" message for almost the whole day and could download the song next day only.....

really guys, heart in heart i dunt think HJ and YSR are giving the kinda music that ARR and IR gave in their peak..........i would attribute this as the foremeost reason rather than piracy and other nonsenses.........can anyone explain y piracy is not a problem for Himesh and S-E-L in HFM? though they are not selling as much as Anu Malik and Nadeem-Shravan did in 90's but still they are selling very well.....

I agree with you Maddy ! Sify is one crap site that should be deserted forever. There are lots of mindless idiots in its side who give news from a streetfighter perspective. For heaven sake, sify should learn what a site should do to earn the good will and name which can be there for a long time. It is becoming more like a forum where they post their news and with a disclaimer.. :banghead:

I think no one in TFM or HFM can bring back the good old days of IR and ARR.
Infact, there are no symptoms for such third wave in TFM as well as in HFM.
Recent Audio Blockbuster RDB is a perfect example of what makes ARR special when it comes to HFM.

Sify is proclaiming as if the previous years were golder era in TFM :banghead: so that we have no hits this year. to be precise, this is purely bcoz of several problems in entire TF.

It is people like IR and ARR who have the ability to bring it back with their brand !

[MADDY]

I think no one in TFM or HFM can bring back the good old days of IR and ARR.Infact, there are no symptoms for such third wave in TFM as well as in HFM.Recent Audio Blockbuster RDB is a perfect example of what makes ARR special when it comes to HFM.

yes selva, but in HFM there is clearly a wave......Himesh is really rocking, S-E-L are doing gr8, Pritam is doing good and they have MM.Kreem also......HFM is pretty good......there is a Dearth of Talent in TFM........whether ppl. want to acknowledge it or not.....


It is people like IR and ARR who have the ability to bring it back with their brand !

i dont think so......ARR is very much out of place in this current TFM and TF setup........i wud really be surprised if he wud succeed again in TFM as he did in 90's......IR, well, for me his days were over long back........he cannot create any waves now........immediate future for TFM is indeed very bleak.........hope for someone who can repeat 76' or 92' will come in future......

[MADDY]

I think no one in TFM or HFM can bring back the good old days of IR and ARR.Infact, there are no symptoms for such third wave in TFM as well as in HFM.Recent Audio Blockbuster RDB is a perfect example of what makes ARR special when it comes to HFM.

yes selva, but in HFM there is clearly a wave......Himesh is really rocking, S-E-L are doing gr8, Pritam is doing good and they have MM.Kreem also......HFM is pretty good......there is a Dearth of Talent in TFM........whether ppl. want to acknowledge it or not.....


It is people like IR and ARR who have the ability to bring it back with their brand !

i dont think so......ARR is very much out of place in this current TFM and TF setup........i wud really be surprised if he wud succeed again in TFM as he did in 90's......IR, well, for me his days were over long back........he cannot create any waves now........immediate future for TFM is indeed very bleak.........hope for someone who can repeat 76' or 92' will come in future......

[aruvi]

Well, if we look past everyone's personal opinions regarding why the article came up, I would say the subject of the article is very true. TFM is going through a very lean time. All the music directors have spoken about piracy problem, but no one is willing to take time out to solve the issue.

[Dragun]

How much do Telugu CDs cost in India? If you look on kaddvd.com, the USD price is no more than $3.49, while Tamil CDs cost about double that on US retailers' sites.

Most albums (in any language) are disposable. Listen to them once or twice then move on. I download most HJ and YSR albums, listen once or twice, then delete them. Not even worth the hard drive space to keep them :)

[aruvi]

Yes,
But what would we do without the option of downloading? Would we continuously listen to the same songs, or go out and look for something and buy.

We can sit and chat all we want, to justify our individual stands, but piracy is a huge problem. Why not suggest ways to reduce that instead of justifying downloading, especially new albums that are coming out for sale.

YSR and HJ are the 2 popular MDs today, and music stores do say that their albums sell. If it's worth the hard drive space and time to download....blank.:-)

Agreed that Tamil CDs are more expensive in outside, but when most are willing to buy English CDs for $20, with crappy songs, what's wrong in buying Tamil CDs. Within India, Telugu audios and Tamil audios go for about the same prices. I can't see a huge difference in prices. New Telugu CD's are priced a little more. They are cutting down prices due to piracy. Yet, in Andhra music sells because piracy is not as huge as with Tamils. Like I said, if I go to a store to get originals, it's easier to get pirated version because there are so many. Everyone wants a quick buck. It's a problem worldwide, but Bollywood/West are so huge that the impact isn't as huge. But there are billions of dollars worth of loss for the West every year due to music piracy.

As said, it would be better to discuss ways to curb rampant piracy. These music directors/producers should do something about it, something strong. As far as music directors go, Rahman has the place and power to get some strong action going, but I still wonder why he has not taken a big stand on this issue yet. No one is willing to come out with private albums in the South because of piracy. Just 10 years back, the media was going on about a growing pop music scene in South India. That scene disappeared long back.

[MrJudge]

It is people like IR and ARR who have the ability to bring it back with their brand !

I don't think they will turn around anything now. IR is gone and so is ARR. His SOK will bite the dust too.

[MrJudge]

I download most HJ and YSR albums, listen once or twice, then delete them. Not even worth the hard drive space to keep them :)

Well, you are listening HJ/YSR atleast once/twice. But I don't even bother downloading ARR's albums. I don't think I have listened to any of his recent albums even once. So opinions differ my friend.

[MADDY]

I don't think I have listened to any of his recent albums even once

still u pass judgement on ARR's quality in the past few years?? :lol:

judge, idhu unakke nyayama? u send ur ears and brain to onsite project in US whenever u see ARR albums and then pass comment on him , then i dunt think its fair..... :shhh:

[MrJudge]

MADDY:

The point underlying in my statement is we should consider majority of people's opinion instead of taking just one individual's opinion seriously. Because eveyone has his/her own interests and likings. Mr.Dragun may feel that HJ/YSR songs are not worthy of his hard drive. Well, I feel even less for ARR's songs. The general crowd likes HJ/YSR albums, that is the fact. If I am not wrong, this is the very same statement ("songs are good only for a brief period") made by every IR fan when ARR was chruning out songs in 1990s. I think history repeats and ARR fans are at the receiving end :)

[Sanjeevi]

Why you are people are thinking like "Past is super and Present is not good". Open your ears and also hearts or atleast try to this. But i doubt to give credits and respect to today's MDs for their songs and may give some percentage based on originality.

"No one can create such a magic like IR/ARR did in 76 or 92. But I am trying to give my best". This is told by by YSR not by me. But I agree with this.

[MADDY]

MADDY: The general crowd likes HJ/YSR albums, that is the fact.

which lad labakku das said that? it is just media is convincing ppl. that YSR and HJ are gud.......also general crowd will go for the best of the worst and i'm not denying that YSR & HJ are the best now.....come on judge, i cant see any YSR wave, i cant see HJ wave..........but i'm able to see himesh wave, dont give me crap that 90's was the only decade where cassettes cud be sold and movies cud run......infact Himesh is a household name now, can u guarantee me that YSR is a household name in TN now?


If I am not wrong, this is the very same statement ("songs are good only for a brief period") made by every IR fan when ARR was chruning out songs in 1990s. I think history repeats and ARR fans are at the receiving end :)

hello let ur YSR pass this too.......ellame easya kedachiduma?? konjam effort eduthu aaganum....if i post wat all lang. that IR fans used to criticise ARR's music, then ppl. will squirm here.......atleast we are using decent language to criticise......be thankful for that......

[selvakumar]

infact Himesh is a household name now, can u guarantee me that YSR is a household name in TN now?


Maddy,
I think you are degrading YSR and HJ very much. I am not sure whether HIMESH is a household name :? Himesh's music is mainly attracting Youth and I have not yet heard of anyone (elder people) saying anything on Himesh. IMO, he is yet another person in the HFM like YSR AND HJ for TFM

[dinesh2002]

guys guys guys guys!!!!!!!! y???? y must we discuss & debate on the same issue like for million times every year/month.... the whole news on the Audio by Sify was true....EXCEPT the Godfather part,saying not even people wanna download the mp3s...thats a lil too much exeggeration !!! they should check the hits by people on the download pages of Godfather on mp3 sites...its standing the 1st..... its not a proud thing knowing it will affect its sales!! but thats the facts....telling GF a big flop,even the mp3 is not beeing downloaded is def too much...other than that,i think the news is pretty much true....!!

[buggle]

Too funny "Himesh is household name now"..
where? in Bangalore in Mumbai?

[MADDY]

Too funny "Himesh is household name now"..
where? in Bangalore in Mumbai?

dont laugh too much, he is a household name in all India obviously xcept TN........TN is a xception in many cases..........evalavo paesareengala, unga kalaignani,padmashree, doctor thiru kamalhassan avargal preferred Himesh over yuvan or KR.....y ???

and i hope ppl. here get wat household name means........it is someone whom everyone from all crossections know and discuss abt.......even osama bin laden is a household name.............now tell me, how many ppl. from non-musical field know ysr in TN???

[muzammil_fr]

now tell me, how many ppl. from non-musical field know ysr in TN???

Nice Question Maddy :)

Maddy and all ARR tell u one thing, don't fight for sify article , they r stupid, even in my website , there is more then 6000 downloads in my stats

and few download too in megauploads

and go to see in Tamilnapster , they have too big hits download in thier site etc etc

so don't fight for this stupid article, we know that it's not treu and we move from this one, after long time we got a new release SOK :) so let's enjoy with sample and make down on piracy mp3 , plz guys plz plz, try to Buy the cd of SOK

i think NP will not release mp3 after the release, it take time, as there is danger to all site who will release this SOK. and me i will not leave release this full vertion.

[MrJudge]

MADDY,

For you to accept anyone, he has to be a household name all over india. I don't think arguing with you will lead anywhere. Have fun looking out for more household names!

:wave:

[MADDY]

household name is a indication of poularity.......it is a measure of impact caused by the person/his works in the society......IR was once voted as one of the persons who changed the face of TN by outlook mag.....ARR was voted as the most respected person from TN ahead of rajni,kamal in a recent CNN-IBN poll........

:wave:

btw anyone has any new reasson for low audio sales???

[selvakumar]

household name is a indication of poularity.......it is a measure of impact caused by the person/his works in the society......IR was once voted as one of the persons who changed the face of TN by outlook mag.....ARR was voted as the most respected person from TN ahead of rajni,kamal in a recent CNN-IBN poll........

:wave:

btw anyone has any new reasson for low audio sales???

So, Did anyone vote for HR as one of the few people who changed the face of HFM drastically with novel and innovative music? :?

[nilavupriyan]

household name is a indication of poularity.......it is a measure of impact caused by the person/his works in the society......IR was once voted as one of the persons who changed the face of TN by outlook mag.....ARR was voted as the most respected person from TN ahead of rajni,kamal in a recent CNN-IBN poll........

:wave:

btw anyone has any new reasson for low audio sales???

So, Did anyone vote for HR as one of the few people who changed the face of HFM drastically with novel and innovative music? :?

:lol:

truth is still ilayaraja is the household name for music..

everyone in a family loves his music.....his reach is not restricted to ages....from college guys to thaatha

[rsubras]

maddy, if thatz the thing, even Lallu prasad yadav is a household name...does that mean he is a very talented politician??

anyone who uses gimmicks cud be a household name.. Real talent is far more than that....... and ARR, IR are such kindaa genius... Dont include himesh in that list......... :)

[selvakumar]

anyone who uses gimmicks cud be a household name.. Real talent is far more than that....... and ARR, IR are such kindaa genius... Dont include himesh in that list......... :)

Very true :notworthy:
HR is doing a great job. But it would take much time for him to enter the league of ARR, IR etc.
HR, YSR and HJ are doing a great job. But in HFM, HR is completely dominating. Whereas in TFM YSR and HJ are sharing the place. It is indeed a good trend in TFM. Also, we cannot compare the audio market of HFM with TFM.
It depends a lot on the taste of the then youth !

[selvakumar]

I think MADDY is pointing at the dominance of HR in HFM and comparing the share of YSR, HJ in TFM

[buggle]

Too funny "Himesh is household name now"..
where? in Bangalore in Mumbai?

dont laugh too much, he is a household name in all India obviously xcept TN........TN is a xception in many cases..........evalavo paesareengala, unga kalaignani,padmashree, doctor thiru kamalhassan avargal preferred Himesh over yuvan or KR.....y ???

and i hope ppl. here get wat household name means........it is someone whom everyone from all crossections know and discuss abt.......even osama bin laden is a household name.............now tell me, how many ppl. from non-musical field know ysr in TN???

I guess KH did answer in one of the interview that if he acts in his home productions(RAJ KAMAL) then obviously IR is the MD, whereas when he do movies for other producers/directors he got to go by their preferences.
Dasavatharam is not his own production and KSR is the director he might wanted something new, also KSR did not have any hits with IR and his family(KSR/IR - Periya kudumbam failure, KSR/YSR - Ethiree failure), so he preferred to go with Himesh.

PS: - Coin always got 2 sides....

[Pavan]

watever i feel this article is not a crap..but a person who has lost his mind has written it..

Stupidity at its best

[muzammil_fr]

Pavan word is briliant :)

[MADDY]

maddy, if thatz the thing, even Lallu prasad yadav is a household name...does that mean he is a very talented politician??

anyone who uses gimmicks cud be a household name.. Real talent is far more than that....... and ARR, IR are such kindaa genius... Dont include himesh in that list......... :)

romba late-a vanthirukkeenga? :D

yes, rite, ppl. can do gimmicks and become popular but if u can become a household name with just ur music then that is something amazing isn't it?? which yuvan and HJ have not been able to do and done by himesh........ y has not their music made general public discuss abt it?....i think i'm tired driving home this point.......

himesh is no way a legend and does not want to become one......i'm just telling that he is leagues ahead of mediocre HJ and YSR.......now dont gimme crap that YSR is churning out shankarabaranams, that's y he is less popular and Himesh is giving popular music, that's y he is successful....both are giving "popular music" and himesh is rocking in it, and YSR is ,well - u guys know better........and i attibute this lack of dominance/popularity as the primary reason for low audio sales in TFM..........

[app_engine]

"....both are giving "popular music" and himesh is rocking in it, and YSR is ,well - u guys know better........and i attibute this lack of dominance/popularity as the primary reason for low audio sales in TFM.........."

Agreed. It may be true that HJ-YSR cannot pull people to audio stores to dole out $$$

Still it doesn't explain why even ARR's TFM albums do not sell in TN? Apparently there are other factors involved.

Some chronological info:

-Most listened to music on Radio (that too either vividh-bharathy or IOKS where TFM had more air time and not the regular AIR stations) during pre-MSV / MSV / early IR days. Other than that avenue, people had to wait for some function to listen to record-players...Who, then, really bought albums aka vinyl disks and paid audio companies? Only the `record set' person who had a business playing them for marriages / political functions and a very few elite who could afford a turn-table (but the elite bought bobby-ykb and despised the idea of buying TFM most of the time). I think during this period, light music troupes made more money using TFM than HMV:-) Though people wrote about `elanthappazham' having a record for many years which was broken by `machchAnappAththeengaLA', the numbers weren't any remarkable...(I would say the # of disks produced those days were probably not above 5-10K for most albums, may be MGR-Shivaji albums sold more than the rest. Interestingly, `olichchithram's on disks were sold as well and obviously Shivaji was the best seller - gauravam, thangapathakkam, thiruviLaiyAdal etc. were heard everywhere...16 vayadhinilE also had this honor)

-With technology making cassette players / compact cassettes more affordable (and MD started getting much more recognition than the past) during the IR-dominance era, I think there had been a decent production / sale of cassettes. Still most people preferred high quality Japanese cassettes (TDK-Sony) to the "original" echo/avm kind of stuff sold by audio companies. Result? Unchecked, popular piracy of a different kind, 'recording centers' flourished in every town and people paid the wrong person, who made a sizeable business out of a couple of LP records he bought per month. I remember people buying TDK 90 min cassettes for Rs 40 and then paid Rs 10-15 to the recording center. There were also very cheap (Rs 10) cassettes sold in streets / bus stations which were lapped up by public (especially rural / low income group who could buy a portable cassette player now for the price they earlier used to pay for a transistor radio.)

-Then came the real "golden" period for the audio companies, which probably was master minded by some shrewd businessmen (like AVM/KB/MR) and aided by technology. Initially with IR some bright spots like agni*, dhaLapathi, punnagai mannan etc. But the major successes with ARR starting Roja. In fact, ARR's music required good sound and AM radio quality is no more acceptable and FM was not much in vogue. Initially cassettes and later CD's when became more affordable became a roaring success and audio companies were minting money, much like Microsoft...With PVN & co's liberalisation also took place, hi-tech systems / boom-bass TV systems became more affordable and so was the network television and other stuff. All these contributed to the higher popularity & sale of audio. More TN boys working abroad made sure that that sale could fetch huge money thanks to the affordability factor coupled with hunger / thirst for home...

Back to today's status:
MP3. Easy conversion of MP3 to wav in XP to play in commercial players / car. Plus, with the new fibre optic cables in place (that started after 2000), internet / high-speed etc. have become much more affordable / available through out India. Add to this FM stations, like Surya FM (which I think is even available in cities other than Chennai, folks in TN pls confirm)...

ilavasa TV, ilavasa uNavu, ilavasa TFM...

[rashid2raj]

"
Add to this FM stations, like Surya FM (which I think is even available in cities other than Chennai, folks in TN pls confirm)...


I am listening Suriyan FM here in Denmark, Europe..

[vasanth2006]

App_Engine,

Great Post. :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

you reflected most of thoughts.

you missed one major thing.

SUN MUSIC --- this is the another 24 hour free service for Songs with picturisation. whenever u need new or IR song or old song, u can see in this channel.This increases popularity of song and decreases the sales.

[thamizhvaanan]

why are u guyz frettin over declining audio sales. namma thalaivar album release aaga podhu :redjump: :bluejump: . sales will pick up once again. when it comes to sales, none can challenge our master :notworthy: :noteeth:

[app_engine]

Interesting info, Rashid!

This is what the suntv website say:

===================
The top slot is a result of a carefully planned thoroughly enjoyable, round-the-clock, wholesome entertainment-oriented package. The interactive element will encourage everyone to make their own broadcasting. There will be substantial localization of content to retain the regional flavour. The Frequency Modulation broadcasting will be through state-of-art, high power transmitters to provide fine aural output. In order to maintain tonal fidelity and sound clarity, Suryan FM has bid good bye to playing tapes and compact discs. The entire programme will be digitized and broadcast from a sensitive computer server, eliminating sound impurities and disturbances totally.

The reach of Suryan FM stations is more than a 120 Km radius thereby providing high quality entertainment for most of the neighbouring districts. The Coimbatore station will cover four districts- Coimbatore, Nilgiris, Erode and Salem- in Tamil Nadu and three districts- Palakad, Waynad and Trissur- in Kerala. The reach of the Tirunelveli station will include Tirunelveli, Nagerkoil, Tuticorin and Virudunagar in Tamil Nadu and Thiruvanathapuram and Kollam districts of Kerala. Chennai will reach out to Kanchipuram and Thiruvallur, Vellore, Tiruvannamalai and Villupuram as well as the Union Territory of Pondicherry.

So tune in at 106.8 Mhz for the Tirunelveli station, 105.8 Mhz for Coimbatore, 93.5 for Chennai and 105.6 for Visakha FM stations.
=====================================

[app_engine]

Thamizhvanan,
sify says 'Rahman rocks':-)
================================================== =====
http://sify.com/movies/tamil/fullstory.php?id=14260064

....The lyrics are superbly conjured by Vaali as they tumble out like pelting raindrops on a mellow monsoon morning. Rahman displays an unusually strong melodic flair in all the tracks.

But the bottom line of the audio depends on how the songs are packaged and the visual impact that they are able to create on the audience. If the audience like the film and it turns out to be a hit, then Rahman and his Sillunu Oru Kadhal album will be a chartbuster...

================================================== =======
Let's wait and see...

[aruvi]

app_engine,

Nice analysis. Rounds up everything. Whatever said and done, audio sales are low. Good for Sify for coming up with the article,but they should have done a bigger coverage with detailed facts of sales.

[app_engine]

vasanth2006,
Agreed, to a degree, that visual experience in general has replaced aural experience in many areas...Ofcourse, excessive cine dosage by network TV channels had made audio systems collect dust in most TN homes most of the time:-(

However, this didn't reduce audio sales all these years. OTOH, it made more people "cine addicts" (unlike the days of our childhood where even turning on radio was often met with disapproval by parents and any exposure to cinema was limited)...and they got to listen to music during travel (in cars), on occasions, at gatherings etc., where TV mostly won't do as entertainment has to be in the background. So audio sales actually perked up higher in the sat TV era.

I think the blame may be more on FM & MP3...

[MADDY]

Still it doesn't explain why even ARR's TFM albums do not sell in TN? Apparently there are other factors involved.

Some chronological info:

-Most listened to music on Radio (that too either vividh-bharathy or IOKS where TFM had more air time and not the regular AIR stations) during pre-MSV / MSV / early IR days. Other than that avenue, people had to wait for some function to listen to record-players...Who, then, really bought albums aka vinyl disks and paid audio companies? Only the `record set' person who had a business playing them for marriages / political functions and a very few elite who could afford a turn-table (but the elite bought bobby-ykb and despised the idea of buying TFM most of the time). I think during this period, light music troupes made more money using TFM than HMV:-) Though people wrote about `elanthappazham' having a record for many years which was broken by `machchAnappAththeengaLA', the numbers weren't any remarkable...(I would say the # of disks produced those days were probably not above 5-10K for most albums, may be MGR-Shivaji albums sold more than the rest. Interestingly, `olichchithram's on disks were sold as well and obviously Shivaji was the best seller - gauravam, thangapathakkam, thiruviLaiyAdal etc. were heard everywhere...16 vayadhinilE also had this honor)

-With technology making cassette players / compact cassettes more affordable (and MD started getting much more recognition than the past) during the IR-dominance era, I think there had been a decent production / sale of cassettes. Still most people preferred high quality Japanese cassettes (TDK-Sony) to the "original" echo/avm kind of stuff sold by audio companies. Result? Unchecked, popular piracy of a different kind, 'recording centers' flourished in every town and people paid the wrong person, who made a sizeable business out of a couple of LP records he bought per month. I remember people buying TDK 90 min cassettes for Rs 40 and then paid Rs 10-15 to the recording center. There were also very cheap (Rs 10) cassettes sold in streets / bus stations which were lapped up by public (especially rural / low income group who could buy a portable cassette player now for the price they earlier used to pay for a transistor radio.)

-Then came the real "golden" period for the audio companies, which probably was master minded by some shrewd businessmen (like AVM/KB/MR) and aided by technology. Initially with IR some bright spots like agni*, dhaLapathi, punnagai mannan etc. But the major successes with ARR starting Roja. In fact, ARR's music required good sound and AM radio quality is no more acceptable and FM was not much in vogue. Initially cassettes and later CD's when became more affordable became a roaring success and audio companies were minting money, much like Microsoft...With PVN & co's liberalisation also took place, hi-tech systems / boom-bass TV systems became more affordable and so was the network television and other stuff. All these contributed to the higher popularity & sale of audio. More TN boys working abroad made sure that that sale could fetch huge money thanks to the affordability factor coupled with hunger / thirst for home...

Back to today's status:
MP3. Easy conversion of MP3 to wav in XP to play in commercial players / car. Plus, with the new fibre optic cables in place (that started after 2000), internet / high-speed etc. have become much more affordable / available through out India. Add to this FM stations, like Surya FM (which I think is even available in cities other than Chennai, folks in TN pls confirm)...

ilavasa TV, ilavasa uNavu, ilavasa TFM...

app_engine, very patient post....i appreciate that........

but ur arguement that technological advancements and chronology will not cover up the lack of quality in TFM now..........how abt ARR selling 3 lakh units with Boys in tha age of FMs and right-click-to-live? i'm not expecting the 2 gentlemen - YSR and HJ to repeat Boys in every movie they compose but atleast once in a year.......i know everyone including ARR fans will have a answer for this supporting YSR and HJ :wink: ......there will be a lot of "agreed sir" in this forum if u justify inability of YSR/HJ but that doesent take out the reality that their music is not worth buying a CD.........

[Dragun]

Most of the music is disposable. Listen once or twice and forget about it. Who wants to spend money on that? I buy most ARR CDs, though. Bought Godfather, bought RDB. Didn't buy Mangal Pandey. Someone I know visited India recently and I asked her to buy me a bunch of CDs, mostly ARR.

[app_engine]

...but ur arguement that technological advancements and chronology will not cover up the lack of quality in TFM now...

FYKI, I don't care much for current TFM...I listen once in a while to some new song, and most of the times end up getting irritated:-)...aboorvamA sila impressive saththangaL kEttAlum, muzhuppAttukkum eerppu nilaippadhillai... So, no need to cover up anything...I was just trying to explain that most of the time in TFM history, audio companies didn't make great money...in fact most companies no longer exist or were bought by others...I even read on the web somewhere an article (2004) that audio companies in India made crores of loss for 3 years in a row...a brief minting period (mainly during the ARR wave) has apparently ended for them now...with sophisticated means for piracy combined with quality free audio available in broadcast.

[app_engine]

"how abt ARR selling 3 lakh units with Boys in tha age of FMs and right-click-to-live"....I think suryan FM was still in beta in 2003...and that kind of explains it. Or with that experience, people don't trust big names anymore...Otherwise, `Ayutha Ezhuththu' and `anniyan' should have sold similar numbers.

Most of such albums used to sell in big quantities within a few days from launch - i.e. if big names are involved, hyped up enough and distribution is fabulous to make them available...though sometimes the songs won't be listened for long, disk will be tossed among the heap...Nowadays people won't jump and buy like that but learned to wait on someone to host on the net or try listening in FM, probably)

[app_engine]

And one last post...quality does not automatically mean more sales...and sales does not mean great quality either...(probably chandramukhi sold lakhs of pieces last year...)

[MADDY]

app_engine, ur posts somehow takes a lot of credibility out of the great Rahman achievement in the 90's........i know u'll deny it vehemently and some 2-3 ppl. will laugh at this post calling me a ARR-fanatic........

i still believe if any new sounds/sweeping sounds is available ppl. will lap it up by buying CDs.........dont u think a s/w engg earning so much will spend Rs.95 for buying something that is worth.....and there are ppl. like me who collect good albums, who dont mind buying CDs......

and where is the fan base, my dear frnds?? ARR's albums are bought just by his fans.......and that itself is a small but significant number which saves washouts........y the current crop of MDs dont have a huge fan base to bail them out??

however u download a song, u cant play it on ur music system easily , it takes a lot of burning/cooling multiplexing/demultiplexing to bring it from ur pc to audio system.....so y cant the current gen make songs that are listenable only in a good system....

moreover FM radios wont play the songs when u really want them.......i know it is pretty tough on these guys as they have to give excellent music to bring up a sales of even 50K-60K units........but still u can give good crowd pulling music and try ur luck.....it doesent hurt, isnt it?

app , i will never attribute someone's success to technology and will neither attribute someone's inability to technology.......i still believe real talent has its own place with/without technology......

lastly, quality cannot be kept away long from success (or audio sales in our context)....... :fatigue: hey apple juice readya? :lol:

[Dragun]

It must be particularly bad in the South. Saregama/HMV hasn't been buying the rights to new South Indian films for a long time, and Sony only distributed two ARR albums (Kadhal Virus and Ayitha Ezhuthu) in Tamil. The business is now left to the local companies like Star, Five Star, AnAk, etc. in Tamil. Tips tried their hand at Tamil with Kannathil Muthamittal but I don't believe they've done any other SI film albums.

[aruvi]

A.R.Rahman to Subhash K. Jha


Q: How does life look to you?

A: Life is always a struggle. I feel I'm just starting out. I can't afford to get lazy at 40. Lots of things have changed. Lots of young people love music, and that's a good thing. But music doesn't sell, and that's a bad thing.

[Jacky]

[tscii:bdccff9b38]I bought cds of Kakha kakha, lesa lesa, kathal konden, Run and few other movies that had decent music. I can’t remember a decent album, forget a good album in recent times and mds should be blamed for leaving TFM in deep shit. I didn't buy GF and wouldn't pay for any album that isnt worth its money.
Make some good music and complain about piracy, it'd still be there but at least genuine music fans would start buying cassettes and cds.

App,
You're stressing excessively on the hype factor for successful albums, going by that logic we can say Anjali and Thalapathy sold more for its hype by GV and Mani than its musical content, which I believe is not the case. That should be deprecating the real talent be it IR or ARR.
[/tscii:bdccff9b38]

[dinesh2002]

[tscii:a40824090c]I bought cds of Kakha kakha, lesa lesa, kathal konden, Run and few other movies that had decent music. I can’t remember a decent album, forget a good album in recent times and mds should be blamed for leaving TFM in deep ****. I didn't buy GF and wouldn't pay for any album that isnt worth its money.
Make some good music and complain about piracy, it'd still be there but at least genuine music fans would start buying cassettes and cds.

App,
You're stressing excessively on the hype factor for successful albums, going by that logic we can say Anjali and Thalapathy sold more for its hype by GV and Mani than its musical content, which I believe is not the case. That should be deprecating the real talent be it IR or ARR.
[/tscii:a40824090c]

"ohhhh no..... GF is not a decent album and jacky didint buy it...wut a waste!!! " :lol: :lol: :rotfl: :devil:

whether u like it or not...GF was def the most quality & most worthy album in 2006... i know truth hurts....but...hey,thats life!! :rotfl:

[inetk]

Couple of things to note here. I do not think quality is an issue when it comes to low sales. Low quality albums/ soundtracks have always sold less - now or in the past. So thats hardly a criteria.

I'd rather talk of alternate methods for disbursing music as a main culprit. That the alternate methods have gained significant foothold is the reason. And add to it the fact that conventional methods have become more cumbersome to follow.

Alternate methods: more FM stations, more TV clippings, easy mp3 downloads available

Convetnional: Going to a store and buying a CD/ tape. Ordering a CD online.

Note that I didnt say alternate methods of buying/ selling music. Merely said 'disbursing' and therein lies the problem. The business aspect is gone and like some of the best things on the net, music is being given for free, in return for watching/ occasionally clicking on google ads, which we may or may not do. But whats the impetus for someone in tamilnapster to continue buying CDs and ripping them and making the mp3s available for us?

Donations? Perhaps. Ad money? Possibly. But unless they're idiots, they are not going to continue doing it as a free service incurring hosting and bandwidth charges month after month.

The issue is nothing to do with the kind of music/ genres of music/ quality of music. Its in disintermediating conventional channels of doing business. As a result, the owner of the music (music labels) do not get the revenue they should've legitimately got.

I do understand that internet penetration is not excellent in a state like Tamil Nadu. But the availability of assorted mp3 collections and custom collections by someone in Ritchie street is enough. I remember going through a large volume of Raja hits and selecting my fave tracks and asking my audio retailer in Coimbatore (way back in 80s/ 90s) to burn (is it burn for a cassette too?) me a custom tape of my fave Raja numbers. I believe I have much more in mp3 format now....about 2000 Raja tracks, downloaded painstakingly over the years, tagged, ID3'ed meticulously and burnt in 4 CDs and 1 single DVD as a backup.

I just cannot imagine how much I would have been charged if I were to collect such a compilation legally. Add to it, issues of formats, cassette/ CD availability etc.

So, if you find a very good album (musically) on the market, say, 'Boys', the sale of CDs will surely be there. But not as much as what a Anjali or Dalapathy would have had. Those were the days of the monopoly of music retailers. No other mode of selling music was available. Internet has changed it forever and it'd be prudent for music retailers to find ways to harness it for their benefit. How?

Some suggestions.
Sell music online in a range of formats. Sell it via iTunes. Create or work for the creation of a music retailing portal online where music could be purchased legitimately at nominal rates. Include extra stuff like BGMs or interview on making of the music in the CDs - to make the CD a collector's item kinda thing.

I'm sure our labels will eventually be forced to do such things but the earlier they adapt, the better for them.

[MumbaiRamki]

inetk,

Your analysis is very nice.QUality is not an issue here .
But i guess you are bit optimistic about the future:)

The audio has still more problems.FOr movie ,we can attract people by having a good experience in theatre.But not so for music .The aural expereince may be the same .

1.If i get a mp3 DVD for around 100 Rs and that has around 600 songs ,there is no way our music companies can compete with that .WHatever value we add ,they might pirate it.

2.People living in TN -we need very strict laws for piracy .Like for DVD .(FYI after the government change ,i have been getting pirated DVD quite easily.There is one shop in front of my company :)) )

3.For people living in TN ,FM is more than sufficent.For select music lovers,high price of Audio CD drives them out .

->Probably we can try like this .
(For TN )
1.WHen you buy a CD,you will get it autographed from ARR/IR ( V tough though) .
2.With the music CD ,you can have attractive Hand outs explaining how a song was composed etc .
3.The publicity for audio release has to be more -its very less now .
4.They have to place shops in all software parks .We can expect atleast 5% of the people to buy .Nobody likes to travel and buy these days .But for this as you have suggested ,there should be more value for money.Like interviews,composing sessions ,fun etc .
5.Attractive Prize Money (or u can have dinner with IR/ARR) ,if you buy original CD .
\

[Jacky]

[tscii:904965f232]Dinesh,
I’m not reviewing GF here, just wanted to cite how the buying habits are affected by poor music. When you grow up you'll understand personal preferences can be different and it's not worth debating, Limit your debating skills to generalized topics (IR is the best male singer, GF is the album of 06, Yuvan is ruling TFM) rather than nitpicking someones taste. There are some beautiful topics out there!


[/tscii:904965f232]

[inetk]

Ramki:

Completely agree with the legal part. I read somewhere that New York city alone has more police personnel than the entire troop US deployed in the Middle East!

Thats the kind of unflinching focus required in enforcing the law that we have. Law itself is not an issue, enforcing it is a major issue here. This applies for every other thing in India, not just music piracy :-) Without stringent enforcement, law merely becomes a mockery and look what kind of democratic anarchy (ok, thats being very pessimistic, but let me use it as a figure of speech!) we're in!

[app_engine]

Jacky (& Maddy), I'm not trying to take away any credit from IR/ARR w.r.t album sales. It's just an analysis as to why an above-average album like Anjali/dhaLapthi sold more# than a phenomenal album like Sindhu Bhairavi or MTK. There could be similar comparisons among ARR albums too.

May be it's basics...publicity and availability (apart from quality and price) are essential marketing elements to sell any product.

Looks like "prevention of theft" has become the most critical factor for sales at present, as inetk has nicely pointed out.

It may be possible to get a fee paid from FM stations each time they broadcast a song (they may already be paying a good sum to audio companies, and probably it's proportionate to # of times aired). And sale of pirated cassettes / MP3's can be curbed by Govt. The only uncontrolled culprit is internet which makes every individual with a PC a potential "recording center" which charges nothing and pays nothing...

[app_engine]

"it takes a lot of burning/cooling multiplexing/demultiplexing to bring it from ur pc to audio system"

It used to be. Not anymore, with Microsoft simplifying things.

I've seen one of my relatives performing the following steps and it cannot be simpler than that:

1. Download MP3 from web. (piece of cake)
2. Open Windows media player in XP and select the MP3's and save them into an audio CD. (It asks which format you want to save, MP3 or CD audio).