Conflicting Theories on Sannyasa

[goodsense]

Some sages understand Saanyasa as the giving up of all actions motivated by desire and other thinkers declare that it consists in relinguishing the fruit of all actions.

The first theory is based on actions containing a measure of evil and is therefore worth giving up. The second is based on acts of sacrifice, charity and penance which are viewed as being worthy of giving up.

Published by Gita Press, Gorakhpur 2003


So what really are we supposed to be giving up, all or part?

[indian224080]

Somehow i think both are related as expecting the fruits of some action is nothing but Desire.
So getting rid of Desire is Sanyasa.

[Raghu]

Sanyasi, is a person who gives up material life (Maya) and indulge him self in Gnana(wisdom) and Isa Bhakthi(Devotion to Ishwar)

[Lambretta]

Sanyasi, is a person who gives up material life (Maya) and indulge him self in Gnana(wisdom) and Isa Bhakthi(Devotion to Ishwar)
Exactly Raghu! :D
I had a talk w/ a friend at the RK mission here recently & he discussed how many of teh commonfolk misunderstand the meaning of Vairagya, thot of as becoming a full-fledged sanyasi & living in solitude etc...but its not nec. true- Vairagya is becoming detached towards materialistic goals/pleasures & developing a more spiritual attitude based on values. Its flexible enuff to the extent tat its possible even for married ppl. to practice this. :)

[Raghu]

lambretta,

It is IMPOSSIBLE for a person to be a Sanyasi, if he/she is attached to this world, such family, money , material, etc etc This is the Maya Cloud that is covering our Gnana(wisdom), we become so Ignorant of Paramatma, and we indulge in Material Pleasues triggered by Maya, so no ONE can be Sanyasi, if he is attached to this world, take Lord Budha, he is an EXCELLENT example of how a Sanyasi should be!!

There are two ways to understand the Paramatma (Isa alias Ishwar), one is by Gnana(wisdom) but this method has LIMITATIONS as our MIND / BRAIN has LIMITATIONS, or the other way is BHAKTHI(Devotion), this is the BEST way, as gnana is very limited

[Lambretta]

Raghu,
yes of course its impossible for a householder to take up sannyasa......& tat wasn't my point- as I said, many mistake vairagya for conventional sannyasa.......but its a more flexible option than sannyasa......therefore can be taken up by ne-one, even those 'attached' to family etc...:)

[Raghu]

Lambretta,

How can some one confuse 'Vairagya(Determination)' from Sanyasi, sorry I am a bit confused :? :?

[Lambretta]

Lambretta,

How can some one confuse 'Vairagya(Determination)' from Sanyasi, sorry I am a bit confused :? :?
Raghu,
I was told tat vairagya means power of dettachment? :?

[Raghu]

Lambretta,

How can some one confuse 'Vairagya(Determination)' from Sanyasi, sorry I am a bit confused :? :?
Raghu,
I was told tat vairagya means power of dettachment? :?

Illapa, I am not sure, ut Vairagya (sanskrit) known as Vairagyam (tamil) means determination/Will power to do some thing, in a way,if u think logicaly, Vairagya is needed for dettachment right?

what do u say Lambretta?

[Lambretta]

Illapa, I am not sure, ut Vairagya (sanskrit) known as Vairagyam (tamil) means determination/Will power to do some thing, in a way,if u think logicaly, Vairagya is needed for dettachment right?

what do u say Lambretta?
If u mean Vairagya as in determination, I agree w/ u! :D

[pradheep]

So what really are we supposed to be giving up, all or part?

The whole exercise is to realize that our real nature is the consciousness, that is the power behind, the awareness, intellect, mind and the body. We have been doing actions and thinking thoughts without knowing the reality.
So giving up this desires, or not doing any actions are really meant to know the reality behind everything.

While watching a TV serial, only when the power |(electricity) goes off , we understand that electricty is the one that powers the working of the television.

Similarly we are asborbed in the continous show of the body, mind intellect, without understanding the real nature of us "The Consciousness". The thought that we are this body, mind intellect and not the consciousness is called Ahamkara or Ego.

The inability to differentiate this reality is called "Maya".

The driving force needed to know the reality is "Vairagya".

So there isnothing to give up, other than the Ego. Even if one goes tothe forest and still thinks he is the body, mind and theintellect and not the consciousness, thereis nopurpose.

But still living in a family life and understanding the reality, is real sanyasa.

This is why most of our rishi's were family people but were living with this sanayasi attitude.

Because the Ego expects the fruit of actions, to curb it, we practice giving up the fruit of actions.

It is the "Ego" that says "I" desire and I am the power behind the actions and so to curb it, we are tld not to desire and stop doing actions.

It is like combined or group study or to study alone. So some people live in a family and practice, while others goalone. But what matters is only the knowledge (Gnana).

Everything becomes clear when we understand the final destination of the purpose of doing all this.

[goodsense]

Thanks for this enlightenment Pradeep. Very much appreciated.

[mahadevan]

Hi Pradheep it has been a long time buddy.
you are saying that the real you is the consciousness, failure of it to see the real itself is because of the viel of maya, once the real 'You' wipes away the mayic veil it sees itself. Self realization, to me it just looks like transfer of identity from one to another, how does it matter if you call table as 'a piece of wood' or 'table' or 'dead tree' or what ever, what happens next ?

[pradheep]

Dear Mahadevan,
An Example....
When an actor acts like a beggar he does not lose his identity. Whole problem happens when he thinks his real identity is the beggar. He will suffer in that wrong identity and cause a whole mess around himself. Now when he self realizes his identity as an actor, it might look just an indentity transfer, but what a relief to be in one own true nature. This is exactly in Self relaization case too. Hope you get it.