Films of Mani Ratnam

[ramsri]

just found it strange that in this entire section on tamil films, no one seems to be talking about one of tamil cinema's favourite sons! hopefully, this thread will fill the gap - so here goes: this discussion is dedicated to one of the greatest filmmakers of our time - his films, their pluses & minuses, the music, the acting, background score, cinematography, editing, whatever ... from "Pagal Nilavu" (or was it "Pallavi Anupallavi") to "Aayitha Ezhuthu" ... if you've got something to say about mani, say it here!

[ramsri]

just so we have a starting point, let's begin with a ranking of the best mani ratnam films. here's my list -

1. Nayagan
2. Iruvar
3. Agni Natchathiram
4. Mouna Ragam
5. Dalapathi
6. Kannathil Mutthamittal
7. Roja
8. Thiruda Thiruda
9. Ayudha Ezhuthu
10. Anjali

[P_R]

just so we have a starting point, let's begin with a ranking of the best mani ratnam films. here's my list -

1. Nayagan ......................................9/10
2. Iruvar ....................................8//10
3. Agni Natchathiram........................5/10
4. Mouna Ragam............................. 6/10
5. Dalapathi........................................6 .5/10
6. Kannathil Mutthamittal.................7/10
7. Roja.............................................. ....8/10
8. Thiruda Thiruda.............................6/10
9. Ayudha Ezhuthu...........................3.5/10
10. Anjali............................................ 6.5/10

Dil Se ................ 7.5/10
Bombay..............4/10
Pagal Nilavu.......1.5/10

What else !

[MovieFan]

Recently my most favorite film of his is ALAI PAYUTHEY! Everything about that film was spectacular!

[desigun]

I think Maniratnam made the following movies (in chronological order.. correct me wherever needed)

1. Pallavi Anu Pallavi (Kanada)
2. Pagal Kanavu
3. Idaiya Thamarai
4. Mouna Ragam
5. Geethanjali (Telugu) or Idaiyathai Tirudathe
6. Nayagan
7. Agni Nakshatiram
8. Anjali
9. Thalapathi
10. Roja
11. Tiruda Tiruda
12. Bombay
13. Dil Se (Hindi)
14. Iruvar
15. Alai Payudey
16. Kanathil Muthamitaal
17. Ayuda Ezhuthu or Yuva(Hindi)

Top five:

1. Roja
2. Nayagan
3. Mouna Ragam
4. Kanathil Muthamital
5. Anjali

Worst five:

1. Dil Se
2. Tiruda Tiruda
3. Iruvar
4. Alai Payudey

Bottomline:
Regardless of the number of hits he gave, Maniratnam is & will be one of the best alltime filmmakers from India. He was instrumental in showing a new approach to film making, and most of current day's films have some kind of benchmark reference to a MR film, it could be from characterization, cinematography, art direction, casting or even delivery style.

IMO, definitely deserves a Dada Saheb Phalke sooner or later...personally he is one director, whose film i am ready to watch with a lot of expectation and many a time he exceeds it.

[Nerd]

:)

[P_R]

I don't think Mani Ratnam directed Idhaya Thaamarai.

The lean mean no-nonsense story teller of Mouna Raagam,Naayagan and Anjali, and the visual experimenter of Agni Natchatram has slowly become afflicted with an mid-life disease called social responsibility.

Roja was good but Bombay ! The racy love story of the first half was ruined by the naivete of the second half.Same's the case with Aayudha Ezhuththu. Dil Se was a welcome relief as the love story dominated the terrorism stuff. There are parts of Kannathhil (eg. Prakash Raj's mini-lecture) that are so academic that they nearly compensate for the Simran-Keerthana performances. Hope he's over terrorism. I'd hate to hear his next film is about a lone man finding love amid the Bosnia-Herzegovina strife.
MR is good I say, we can't afford him becoming unidimensional.

In fact , the life-lesson learning is not restricted to 'social issues' alone. MR is one of my favourite romantic writers (Mouna Raagam,Geethanjali) but the second half of Alaipaayudhey was naked in its learning-the-ropes-of-a-marriage. In removal of doubts he rounds it off with a soliloqui from Madhavan. :(

Iruvar was a class act. Almost up there with Naayagan. Thiruda Thiruda is very underrated. I heard that the script was Ram Gopal Verma's. Informed Hubbers confirm.Damn good film. I don't think we've had such good capers in Indian Cinema.

I bought a first day first show ticket to Aayitha Ezhuththu and was sorely disappointed (save Madhavan and Barathiraja, of course). But again that was because I went with huge expectations. Needless to say, he's among the all-time best, so AE won't discourage me. I'll be advance booking next time too !

[Cinefan]

Prabhu,You are right,Thiruda Thiruda was a collabaration of Mani&Ramgopal varma as far as the script was concerned.A very underrated film,it was a huge hit here in Bangalore.I saw it 5 times at "Urvashi'theatre.I have seen all his films except the mal film with Mohanlal,&the Mohan-Ambika-Radha film in Tamil.His first film in Kannada: Pallavi-Anupallavi was damn good.I remember seeing it in the now defunct Shanti theatre near Southend here as a kid&feeling very sad for Anil Kapoor in the climax.Bombay is his worst film according to me,had a horrible climax,very utopian&unbelievable.Among his recent films Dil se was so-so,Alaipayuthe good,Kannathil very very good&AE was good,don't know why a lot of people didn't like it.Now,I would want him to do a film without the baggage of social responsibility,something like Thiruda Thiruda.

[P_R]

mal film with Mohanlal,&the Mohan-Ambika-Radha film

The Mohan-Ambika-Radha film you are talking about is Kovil Pura (I think so). Don't bother.I think he only directed it, didn't write it.

I didn't know he made a Malayalam film !

[Cinefan]

mal film with Mohanlal,&the Mohan-Ambika-Radha film

The Mohan-Ambika-Radha film you are talking about is Kovil Pura (I think so). Don't bother.I think he only directed it, didn't write it.

I didn't know he made a Malayalam film !

Not Kovil Pura,I think it was called Idaya Kovil.The mal film was called 'Unnaru'-not very sure i got it right.It had IR's music(no surprises)&came right after his debut.Was also dubbed into Tamil some years back,don't know what they called it.

[P_R]

Yeah Idaya Kovil :oops:
My ear led me into it, as I remember the song 'Koottathile Kovil Pura'

[desigun]

Sorry folks, it is not Idhaya Tamarai, it is Idhaya Koil...

[oohlala]

Its a gr8 thread. Infact im also a gr8 fan of Mani. Never miss any of his movies. I dont know y some didnt like AE. and the way he directed the movie was diff. and i felt that im watchin 3 diff movies.
And Kannathil mutthamittal is the only movie which got 5 star rating by Times of india in delhi. And as far as i know it was the only other language movie which was rated in delhi(usually they rate only hindi n eng movies).

[Crab]

I used to like Mani Rathnam until Roja.

But Bombay was a cheap shot. After that, all his movies have been provocative using shock and awe tactics only.

[Nerd]

:)

[P_R]

Guys ! Please please please keep the Thalai-Malai clashes out of this thread. Nearly every other thread is loaded with them.

[ramsri]

The lean mean no-nonsense story teller of Mouna Raagam,Naayagan and Anjali, and the visual experimenter of Agni Natchatram has slowly become afflicted with an mid-life disease called social responsibility.


yeah - i'd say that's an accurate observation on his filmmaking - wouldn't really go so far as to call him one-dimensional, but yes, his penchant for taut storytelling certainly seems to have lost its vim.

i think mani suffers from a syndrome that seems to affect all great filmmakers at some point - if you look at the standards he set for himself with his early films ("Mouna Ragam", "Nayagan") - its tough for anyone to cross (or even reach) that threshold - even if you're mani ratnam !

part of the problem also probably lies with the audience ... every time an MR film is released we go to the theatres expecting to see a "Nayagan" - which probably fuels the disappointment when you get films like "Alai Payuthey".
this is especially true for movies like "Kannathil Mutthamittal" and "Iruvar" which were great films in their own right, but probably failed to win favour with audiences because they fell below the standards set by "Nayagan" ...
i don't think we're being fair to mani if we expect him to dish out a Nayagan every time - so that attitude has probably got to change ...

[ramsri]

this is interesting -

i happened to be reading an article the other day that made an interesting comparison between mani ratnam and another great filmmaker from the west - oliver stone, the man who made memorable films like "Platoon", "JFK" and "Any Given Sunday".

if you make a comparative study, it's strange to see the similarity in their career paths - both achieved tremendous success very early on (mani with "Mouna Ragam", stone with "Platoon", which won him an oscar) - both were hailed, at that point, as brilliant young filmmakers, on course to revolutionise the art.
both went from strength to strength and their films only got better ("Nayagan", "Roja" for Mani, similarly "Wall Street", "Born on the Fourth of July" for Stone).

but somewhere down the line things started going wrong and they started sacrificing their USPs in favour of grandeur - mani ratnam made "Bombay" and Stone "The Doors", "Natural Born Killers" - the canvasses became larger, the storylines more contrived, the plots started losing their unique flavour.

of course, they still show flashes of their brilliance now and then -mani's "Dalapathi", "Iruvar" and stone's "JFK" (possibly one of the greatest films ever to come out of Hollywood). occassionally one gets the eerie feeling that these men are probably past their greatest days as filmmakers. but that doesn't stop us from awaiting with bated breath, the next offering from their stables.

[vincent]

my favorite mani ratnam movie is
NAYAGAN & THALABATHY
B'COZ-
NAYAGAN:
[1]KAMAL
[2]ILAYARAJA'S MUSIC
[3]GREAT STORY(BASED ON A TRUE STORY)

THALABATHY:
[1]ILAYARAJA'S MUSIC
[2]RAJINI(BEST EVER PERFOMANCE THAT I
HAVE EVER SEEN FROM RAJINI)
[3] FIGHT SCENES
[4]MAMOOTY

[suryastrike]

vijay asked mani to make a film for him..while i hear that news i was laughing.and i depressed at mani.wat a great director in india going to do worst job.if mani direct vijay.mani wil lose his name in indian cine industry.
mani directed Rajini..'coz of rajini is the great actor.he is the wonderful entertainer in indian actors.the dialogue delivery of rajini fantastic than any actor.he is the perfect match of DON character.but vijay he don't know how to act.
if mani going direct a new movie.he can direct a movie with surya or ajith.if it is a love story.then it wil be a madhavan .if it is a don character that must be "Ajith" .if it is a normal commercial story.that may be ajith or surya.
if it is film for historical then it wil be for vikram..

vijay can dance for one song in his film.'coz he knows that only.

[vincent]

vijay asked mani to make a film for him..while i hear that news i was laughing.and i depressed at mani.wat a great director in india going to do worst job.if mani direct vijay.mani wil lose his name in indian cine industry.
mani directed Rajini..'coz of rajini is the great actor.he is the wonderful entertainer in indian actors.the dialogue delivery of rajini fantastic than any actor.he is the perfect match of DON character.but vijay he don't know how to act.
if mani going direct a new movie.he can direct a movie with surya or ajith.if it is a love story.then it wil be a madhavan .if it is a don character that must be "Ajith" .if it is a normal commercial story.that may be ajith or surya.
if it is film for historical then it wil be for vikram..

vijay can dance for one song in his film.'coz he knows that only.
NO MIKE MANIRATNAM WILL CHANGE VIJAY'S
NORMALGET-UP

[vincent]

MANIRATNAM-KITTE MAATNA
AVALEVUTHAN
PITCHI PEAN PARTHERUVAARU
HE WILL TEACH VIJAY HOW TO ACT! :mrgreen:

[suryastrike]

but manirathnam wil take atleast 10 months for one film
it is not possible for vijay.'coz he acts 3 films per year and earn more money.and mani will not allow any provoke dialogues against any actors in his movies.and also he is a decent director.but vijay wants dappa kuthu song..and introduction song (it is only for rajini in indian cinema :lol: )
and mani want perfect acting.that he wil not expect frm vijay.vijay never do like that acting.and he wil not take risk.vijay's irritating dialogues r not possiblr in mani's movie..
first vijay has to learn more in real life and also acting.
he doesn't know how to behave others.his route is not correct.he hides all what he is doing behind the scene
ELLARUKKUM ARADI KULITHAN.
ADATHA ATTAM POTTAVANELLAM ENNA ANNNNU TERIUMA

[ramsri]

if it is a love story.then it wil be a madhavan .if it is a don character that must be "Ajith" .if it is a normal commercial story.that may be ajith or surya.
if it is film for historical then it wil be for vikram..


interesting point about the historical ... i remember reading somewhere that mani ratnam's dream project is to adapt Kalki's "Ponniyin Selvan" to screen ...

hmmm ... if this were to materialize, i wonder who would play the title role ?!!

don't know how accurate this is - informed hubbers please shed light !

[danny]

hi hubbers ..this one is really a good thread ..

well lemme tell u the only malayalam film that MR took was "UNARU" staring mohanlal...

got a feeling only a few here have seen the movie " IRUVAR ".. eventhough the movie wasn't accepted by the mass, it was critcally
acclaimed...

i wud rate nayagan,iruvar,kannathil muthamittal and roja as the top 5 MR movies..

nayagan is definitely on top inspite of some scenes taken directly from the eng movie "the godfather"

[ramsri]

nayagan is definitely on top inspite of some scenes taken directly from the eng movie "the godfather"

talking of The Godfather ... it really would be interesting to find out to what extent mani was actually influenced by coppola's film. you know, i saw Nayagan much before i saw The Godfather ... both films are equally engrossing and i've seen both many times since ... but frankly, i'm yet to figure out the scenes in Nayagan which were lifted directly. except maybe the killing incident which makes him a "dada" - in Nayagan it was inspector kelkar, while in Godfather it was vito corleone killing the local don fanucci.

[trivik12]

Mani's Unnaru in Malayalam was based on Labour struggles. Typical Mallu concept in 1984. Very early days of Mohanlal. He was good. Movie was so-so.

MR was a classic.Great dialogue/screenplay and ofcourse music.
Geetanjali was another beauty.Best music in a mani movie ( I love oh papa laali) and great performances.

nayagan/agninakshatram are Mani movies where he deviates from typical commercial formats.Kamal was great in nayagan and so was karthik in AN.

Anjali was brilliant.Sheer magnitude of making movie with so many kids.Great screenplay.Great photography as well.

Roja/Bombay/Dil se were of same concept normal man in midst of terrorism.Roja was the best.Other 2 were ok.

I liked Thiruda Thiruda a lot.Superb entertainment and best music by ARR in a Mani movie.No classic but pure fun.

Iruvar was sheer poetry. It went way over audience head. But Mohanlal/Prakashraj, dialogues took the movie to another level.

Alai payuthe was ok again not great so was Kannathil Muthamital.
I have not seen Yuva/AE so I can't comment but reliable sources were dissapointed.

My top 5 Mani movies (chronological order)
1) Mouna Raagam
2) Geetanjali
3) Anjali
4) Thiruda Thiruda
5) Iruvar.

[nkv]

I think Nayagan is Mani's best movie till date.. Mounaragam depended heavily on Ilayaraja alone.. Without Ilayaraja music, it would have gone for a toss. But Nayagan was excellent.. The way he portraid Kamal, the scenes with Karthika etc was really good... Geethanjali, Agninatchathiram, Anjali, Dalapathy are all more musicals.. and masala-mixed

[ramsri]

well lemme tell u the only malayalam film that MR took was "UNARU" staring mohanlal...

got a feeling only a few here have seen the movie " IRUVAR ".. eventhough the movie wasn't accepted by the mass, it was critcally
acclaimed...


interesting - i know mani made a kannada film to begin with, but a malayalam film with mohanlal?! didn't know that ... i thought Iruvar was the only film they had collaborated on.
and talking of Iruvar, mani actually went on record to say he was disappointed that mohanlal didn't get the national award for his brilliant performance in that film ...

[selvakumar]

Is it true? I have a doubt ramsri. Kalki's 'ponniyin selvan' is a superb historical novel that portrays the tradition of tamil kings. I have read that more than thousand times. The narration of kalki was simply superb. Lot of twists and tricks.. oh.. what a talented story writer he is.. I think current directors should opt for separate dialogue writers rather than writing their own ugly dialogues.

I still have a doubt whether Mani can bring the same unique style which Kalki used in his novels to the silver screen. The characters in the movie should be played by matured actors and I think Mani knows this clearly. But the problem might be the budget. Producers might not feel very good to spend crores and crores for this film even if it has popular actors.



if it is a love story.then it wil be a madhavan .if it is a don character that must be "Ajith" .if it is a normal commercial story.that may be ajith or surya.
if it is film for historical then it wil be for vikram..


interesting point about the historical ... i remember reading somewhere that mani ratnam's dream project is to adapt Kalki's "Ponniyin Selvan" to screen ...

hmmm ... if this were to materialize, i wonder who would play the title role ?!!

don't know how accurate this is - informed hubbers please shed light !

[ramsri]

I still have a doubt whether Mani can bring the same unique style which Kalki used in his novels to the silver screen. The characters in the movie should be played by matured actors and I think Mani knows this clearly. But the problem might be the budget. Producers might not feel very good to spend crores and crores for this film even if it has popular actors.


you are absolutely right ... maybe that's why it's still a DREAM project !!
but if this really is mani's big dream, then i seriously hope it materializes ... bcos as you say, he must be aware of the enormous complexities that a project of this magnitude will involve. and he would never step into a project like this KNOWING that he can't adapt it to screen. so if he does end up doing it, i'm sure we'll be in for a treat !!

[nickraman]

Hope that he directs more Hinidi films! :)

[Sinthiya]

[tscii]Manirathinam on his film ‘Guru’ IndiaGlitz [Monday, January 08, 2007]

Manirathinam is a man of few words. He lets his movies do all the talking.

With Guru set for release this Pongal, Manirathinam has opened his heart out on the movie and his forthcoming plans.

Speaking about Guru, the director said that it is a movie that traces the life of two characters. The film is an account of the events that occur in their life from their teens till they grow old. Abhishek Bachchan and Aishwarya Rai play couples while Mithun Chakraborthy is cast as a veteran journalist. Madhavan plays a cub reporter under the tutelage of Mithun Chakraborthy. Vidya Balan plays his wife.

The movie has six songs. “It is my 20th directorial venture,” he said.

Manirathinam says, “All the artistes have lived the characters. The story begins in 1950 and is set around Mumbai.” What next? Manirathinam says, “Once I complete a movie, I take rest for the next six months and spend my time with my son Nandha.”

On rumours that Mani would soon direct a Hollywood movie, the director in his usual style, said, “Why should I, when Hollywood movies are turning towards India?”

One of the few directors to have emerged a successful producer,
Manirathnam said, “It is for my comfort that I became a producer. I need not compromise when I direct my own movie.”


http://www.indiaglitz.com/channels/tamil/article/28305.html

[Saamy]

The Promos of Mani Ratnam's Guru are disappointing. All the scenes seem to be very similar to his earlier scenes from various movies. The music is ordinary compared to his previous movies.

[great]

The Promos of Mani Ratnam's Guru are disappointing. All the scenes seem to be a replica of his earlier scenes from various movies. The music is ordinary compared to his previous movies.

Can you name those movies :?:

[Saamy]

The Promos of Mani Ratnam's Guru are disappointing. All the scenes seem to be a replica of his earlier scenes from various movies. The music is ordinary compared to his previous movies.

Can you name those movies :?: same rain dance, thirumalai naayakkar mahal dance. abishek speaking like the lead pair in iruvar.

[great]

The Promos of Mani Ratnam's Guru are disappointing. All the scenes seem to be a replica of his earlier scenes from various movies. The music is ordinary compared to his previous movies.

Can you name those movies :?: same rain dance, thirumalai naayakkar mahal dance. abishek speaking like the lead pair in iruvar.

Are they using the same dialogues :o :huh:

your point is " All the scenes seems to be a replica of various movie " . There might be different reason for using the particular location , just becoz mani is using the same location does it mean ALL THE SCENES are replica of various movie :huh:

[Saamy]

The Promos of Mani Ratnam's Guru are disappointing. All the scenes seem to be a replica of his earlier scenes from various movies. The music is ordinary compared to his previous movies.

Can you name those movies :?: same rain dance, thirumalai naayakkar mahal dance. abishek speaking like the lead pair in iruvar.

Are they using the same dialogues :o :huh:

your point is " All the scenes seems to be a replica of various movie " . There might be different reason for using the particular location , just becoz mani is using the same location does it mean ALL THE SCENES are replica of various movie :huh: okie replica is not the exact word to use... i will edit my post now..

[arunyss]

Mani to do a Tamil film after Lajjo


My film is not a bio-pic": Mani Ratnam
By Moviebuzz
Happy News! Mani Ratnam, one of the finest directors in mainstream commercial cinema is back with Guru in Hindi and its dubbed version in Tamil. The path-breaking director is one to be admired. He has kept the flag of uncompromised cinema flying against all odds.

Mani sir as he is affectionately called by friends, is a film maker whose calling card remains his artistry and intellectual disposition. On the eve of the release of Guru, sitting in his aesthetically done up posh office at Boat Club area in Chennai, casually dressed in a blue jeans and a printed cotton shirt, Mani took time off to speak exclusively to Sify.com.

Any pre-release jitters?
(Laughs) Not at all. But as a producer like anyone else I am anxious. Guru is getting premiered at Toronto on Thursday (Jan 11) at Elgin and Winter garden theatre centre. It is the place where most Hollywood films are premiered and I think that Guru will be the first Indian film to be premiered there.

How different is Guru from your earlier films
Guru is my 20th film in a career spanning nearly 24 years. It is the opposite of Yuva, my last release as it is the journey of a single person. The character is shown from his 15 to 70th year.

Nayakan was also similar..
Yes to a certain extent, they are in the same genre as far as the concept of a person’s life time from youth to old age is depicted.

What is the one-line story of Guru?
The tagline says it all- “ Villager, Visionary, Winner”. The story is about Gurukanth Desai or Guru, a guy from a village, crossing all obstacles that come his way and how he triumphs against all odds. Just after Independence up to the 70’s, the country as a whole was turning to the left of the centre. For a lot of people, it had an old world charm about it. Suddenly Guru comes and shakes the edifice as we see what happened, in the late 70‘s and 80’s. We became individualistic and right of centre. It happened to us before we realize that times have changed. In the film, we see all these changes through the character of Guru.

There is an uncanny resemblance to the life and times of late Dhirubhai Ambani the man who changed our system. Please comment
It could be anybody. I am definitely trying to connect the character with real life. Why Ambani, it could be Mittal? Let us make it clear that my film is not a bio-pic. Guru is taken from different spirits and attitudes of a handful of people who have changed our society and business environment. A lot of visionaries spirit and attitude may have gone to create the character of Gurukanth Desai.

Everybody in the unit has been raving about Abhishek Bachchan‘s performance. Having worked with so many talented actors in India, what is your opinion on him as an actor?
He was always my first choice to play Gurukanth Desai. Let me tell you that Abhishek carries the entire film on his shoulders and he is remarkable for his body language and gradual transition from a young ,man to a matured old man. There is a lot of nuances and subtlety in his seamless performance. While watching the first copy of the film, I could get the touch and feel of Guru in him.

What about Ash?
She has been underrated as an actress. I know her from Iruvar days when she brilliantly etched out two dramatically opposite characters. I’m even more happy with her performance now. Her character of Sujatha is a strong willed woman and is the conscience of Gurukanth Desai. There is a lot of ease and grace that goes into her performance. It looks real.

How was working with Mithun Chakravarthy?
He plays Manikdas Gupta or Nanaji a 60 plus character. He is an eccentric man who believes in old school values and ideals. Initially he helps Guru in his growth but later falls out with him over principles, Only Mithun da could play my Nananji with conviction.

What is the secret of great partnership with A.R.Rahman?
(Smiles) Every time we work together it is like our first film. We understand each other perfectly.

The songs are the best we heard in recent times and with Mani’s picturisation they are sure to become more popular after the release? Please comment?
(Just Smiles)

Tell us why you had Mallika Sherawat in the film and the song ?
I am showing an episode in Guru’s early life. The whole song is in a concise form of his life in Turkey and so Rahman has given it a middle eastern flavour. The song actually helps me to move the story forward.

What about the Shreya Gosal classic Barso Re…
Guru comes back from Turkey to his village. It brings rural India back to focus. We are cutting from Turkey to India with this song that is also the backdrop of Guru meeting Sujatha for the first time. I would like to say that the background score of Guru is very good. It brings out the aggressive and determination traits of my protagonist. We have used a lot of rhythms and voices in the music.

In Guru you have gone back to your favourite cameraman Rajeev Menon(They had last done Bombay ) How is Guru visually?
Absolutely brilliant. Rajeev’s camera has given the film an authentic look. Please note that it is a period film and his camera need to evoke that feel from 50’s to 80’s. The early period he has given a yellow hue and as the film progresses it turn into blue hue. Even the camera from a hand held becomes steady in the later half. Rajeev has been able to provide the look and feel of the period .

Why did you prefer the veteran Sreekar Prasad as the editor?
I believe in a single style for a film and will never resort to any gimmicks. Story telling requires a particular rhythm in editing and it should not interfere with narration. I think Sreekar Prasad is the best in the country.

Why did you decide to dub Guru into Tamil
I feel that there is a market for it. Our audiences will definitely to be able to relate to the film.

After Guru, what are your plans?
I have a commitment to make Lajjo a film with Aamir Khan and Kareena Kapoor. I will be working on the script of the film which will start rolling from October.

Why are you not doing any Tamil films?
As I told you earlier, I have a commitment to keep After Lajjo I will do a Tamil film.

Any plans to make your production company, Madras Talkies go public as entertainment industry is booming?
No chance. I want to make movies the way I want to do it. I am not here just to do business alone, I want to make good cinema.

[joe]

Guru - Review by a notable blogger

http://icarus1972us.blogspot.com/2007/01/mani-ratnams-guru-review.html

[Nerd]

Guru - Review by a notable blogger

http://icarus1972us.blogspot.com/2007/01/mani-ratnams-guru-review.html

Looks like the reviewer does not know anything about ambani. I know very well that not all people can enjoy and relate to this movie. Anyway I am going to watch the film tomorrow :D

[thimuru]

Guru - Review by a notable blogger

http://icarus1972us.blogspot.com/2007/01/mani-ratnams-guru-review.html

Looks like the reviewer does not know anything about ambani. I know very well that not all people can enjoy and relate to this movie. Anyway I am going to watch the film tomorrow :D

padam paakanumna ambaniya pathi therinja than paakanumna ...idhu nyayama...well known story of MGR-KARUNANIDHI ye namma makkalai kulapeeduchu...idhula stock market,import subsidy,machinery export,permit raj...idhellam velanguma?

:roll:

MBA padichituthan padam paarkonum

[joe]

Guru - Review by a notable blogger

http://icarus1972us.blogspot.com/2007/01/mani-ratnams-guru-review.html

Looks like the reviewer does not know anything about ambani. I know very well that not all people can enjoy and relate to this movie. Anyway I am going to watch the film tomorrow :D

Nerd,
The reviewer is a well known figure in Tamil blog world..He is running a company which provides data for many notable companies including some central govt organisation like BHEL. Once Nanayam Vikatam published an article on him.

one more info ,He is a hardcore Rajini fan :D

[Saamy]

Guru - Review by a notable blogger

http://icarus1972us.blogspot.com/2007/01/mani-ratnams-guru-review.html

Looks like the reviewer does not know anything about ambani. I know very well that not all people can enjoy and relate to this movie. Anyway I am going to watch the film tomorrow :D

padam paakanumna ambaniya pathi therinja than paakanumna ...idhu nyayama...well known story of MGR-KARUNANIDHI ye namma makkalai kulapeeduchu...idhula stock market,import subsidy,machinery export,permit raj...idhellam velanguma?

:roll:

MBA padichituthan padam paarkonum i agree most of the B and C audience may not be able to relate with these terms. but, MR least cared abt them. If this movie wins the appreciation of the critics, then its a success. The multiplex audience must have no trouble in understanding this movie. 8-)

[Nerd]

Well well.. If you dont know anything about ambani I dont see how can it TICKLE you! Thats what the reviewer had said as well. And it has got a very good review from Ted Murphy, who is a noted reviewer for hollywood movies 8-)

And Joe, fair enough. I am not saying that the movie is one of the best ever, let me watch it first and then comment.

[joe]

And Joe, fair enough. I am not saying that the movie is one of the best ever, let me watch it first and then comment.

Nerd,
He has given 6/10 rating and the review also almost postive..I don't think he is much aginst the movie or Mani :)

[thimuru]

And Joe, fair enough. I am not saying that the movie is one of the best ever, let me watch it first and then comment.

Nerd,
He has given 6/10 rating and the review also almost postive..I don't think he is much aginst the movie or Mani :)

but I know u dont like :lol: j/k

[Nerd]

No Joe. I am surprised with a 6/10 for the movie since it is being hyped as the best ever by mani by many including maddy ( the actor :lol: ) Anyway its good that the movie is not disappointing atleast. Will atleast be worth my money !!

[Saamy]

http://www.mouthshut.com/product-reviews/Guru-925069958.html

Reviews from Mouthshut.com .. only two reviews so far. that too from tamilians. it seems like a good but not great movie.

[thimuru]

nerd..dont expect greatly....something like nayagan or iruvar!

because the film looks the like addition of those two movies...remember ..he took it for north indian audience...so he may had many shots and followed the style which he had done in tamil movies!

[Nerd]

All the reviews so far have atleast lauded abhishek's performance. I always knew that he can ACT :thumbsup:

And please dont review the movie watching the tamil version. Its not south indianish at all. Wonder why mani decided to dub :o

[joe]

but I know u dont like :lol: j/k

Puriyalla (am I a tube light?) :oops:

[thimuru]

but I know u dont like :lol: j/k

Puriyalla (am I a tube light?) :oops:

indha vishayamlam enaku theriyadhu!

i meant that u dont like maniratnam(like us)

[Nerd]

[tscii:3e86ebcfda] Guru - Jubilee of imagination and inspiration
IndiaGlitz [Friday, January 12, 2007]

‘Daring to dream’ is probably the larger motif of the movie Guru. In a sense, that has also been the underlying impulse of Mani Rathnam himself as he has dreamed into reel about the life and times of a man who had an outrageous idea and even more outrageous desire to make them into reality, come hell or high water.

If Gurukanth’s chase of fantasy (to make it as a businessman) puts him and those who reposed faith in him on the path of riches, then Mani’s own cinematic odyssey into the pioneering story of modern-Indian business world rewards us with an unforgettable experience of artistic entertainment.

A business missionary and a visionary, is what Gurukanth is. For him, no rule or norm is an impediment to the path of progress that he has charted for him, his company, which for him is also the metaphor for the newly emergent India.

Mani’s genius lies in incorporating a cute and impish love into the broader ambit of an emotionless world of shares and supplies. Mani’s other great success is in getting the best out of his team. It is Abhishek Bachchan who leads the pack with a show that is surely the best of his career so far. In a de-glamourised ‘bania’ look, Abhishek packs all the right punches in a character that is far more complex than the dandified exterior would otherwise lead us to believe. The Abhi-Aish chemistry is well known and needs no repetition here. But the sub-text of the duo’s romance to the larger theme of a man with a mission keeps the film from slipping into the slipshod stream of stereotyped consciousness. And then there is A R Rehman. In Mani’s company, Rehman becomes magical and his beautiful songs get an even more compelling contextual beauty. Rajeev Menon has the true ‘eye’ of Mani, bringing into images the ideas in the director’s mind.

The story is obviously a takeoff from Dhirubhai Ambani’s life and times. But that is just a starting thread. Using that, Mani’s spins a yarn (just about the right term to describe about a story that is about success in spinning mills and polyester fibre) that gives a feeling of comfort and warmth.

‘Guru’ begins with the young Gurukanth (Abhishek) setting off to the arty and raucous Istanbul. In a sense, Istanbul proves to be what South Africa became eventually for the other great Indian dreamer ----Mahatma Gandhi ----- a seed of inspiration. Appropriately, Guru too invokes the ideas (though not the idealism) of ‘Bapu’ when he is towards the end pinned down by Indian authorities for transgressions of laws that are in the book.

Guru, though appreciated for his work ethic, is consumed by the desire to make his work come good for himself rather than waste it for others (in this context, the whites). So he throws up his job in Istanbul and comes down to his dusty hamlet in Gujarat. But here again, the roadblocks before the takeoff are many (parental disapproval, monetary dryness and a general small-minded approach).

Guru, who sees Sujatha (Aishwarya) in quaint circumstances, falls in love with her and marries her. But the bigger love is for the money that she brings along as dowry (it is a truth that he will come to face at an unexpected crossroad). This would be his opening gambit on a complex, chequered board of a game in which every coin is deemed a pawn by vested interests. Guru of course wants to be the king. He understands the system. More importantly, he understands men and their minds. He strikes up friendship, by chance, with a maverick press baron Mangaldas (Mithun Chakraborthy). It is what launches him into a tumultuous world and it is what holds him back later. It is an enigmatic relationship that even amidst the no-holds-barred fight, Guru is able to strike a beautiful and bouncy relationship with the multiple-sclerosis ridden daughter of Mangaldas (Vidya Balan).

The initial days in the market are hard slog and slugfest. Guru manoeuvres them all with commonsense and conviction. But he has to subvert the system (mind you, those were the times of license raj and quota rules). This is what gets the goat of the Mangaldas, an old-world journo, who, despite his outward brusqueness, likes to play within the rules.

What ensues is a high-stakes cat and mouse game with Mangaldas using his hotshot scribe Shyam (Madhavan) to dredge up details of off-the-book dealings of Guru. It is a fight between two equal enemies. Guru, despite playing by his own rules, wins popular support. It is on these crutches that he eventually hobbles out.

The story’s strength is in the details that are too difficult to explore and experience in words and overzealous adjectives. But in Mani’s expert eyes, everything parade out in a panache-filled procession.

In the end, the film is indeed a biopic, without the attendant dreariness.

Like all truly great directors, Mani says a lot when he doesn’t say much. The story between the lines is what holds the attention as it is where the drama is…the action is.

For Abhishek, this is the performance of a lifetime. He lives the complex character of Guru with rare ease. Abhishek has managed to convey the underlying energy and enthusiasm of a businessman who romances the idea of being the best in the world.

The Abhi-Aish love story, cool and crisp at the start, grows up to be warm and wistful towards the end. It is a study in dignity and charm. Aishwarya, as ever, looks ravishing in song sequences.

Mithun brings to life a media baron who hides his essential simplicity and sweetness in practised roughness. Madhavan, as the howitzer journo of Mithun, flies into the target unerringly. His restraint, caught between the high-fire exchanges of two worthy rivals, is beautiful. Vidya Balan, in a weepy role, looks comfortable.

As ever, you have technical virtuosity all around in Mani’s movie. Rehman’s songs sound even better on screen and have been lovingly picturized by Mani and Menon. Be it Madurai, Istanbul or Karnataka, all places come out in alluring clarity.

The Hariharan ghazal just lifts you to heights that only monastery monks reach at their moments of high inspiration. Sreekar Prasad’s editing is crisp. The belly dance of Mallika (in Istanbul) is a treat to eyes craving for aesthetic satisfaction.

So, is there nothing wrong with Guru at all? Like the man Guru, the film too has warts and all. But that is the charm of it. It is what adds the agreeable spice.

The dubbing voices all fit just perfectly. Suriya’s full-throated backing to Abhishek is really splendid. The details of the story have not been lost in translation. For, what is narrated is a universal tale of human effort.

Mani has used all his sensibilities and sensitivities to unspool a tale whose drama lies in the men and not in their methods. Guru is unpretentious and doesn’t labour to make a point. Affected artifices are not for him.

Guru is a study of a man who is not afraid to chase the rainbow of imagination. Guru, the film too, is a jubilee of imagination and inspiration.[/tscii:3e86ebcfda]

[nerdy]

All the reviews so far have atleast lauded abhishek's performance. I always knew that he can ACT :thumbsup:

And please dont review the movie watching the tamil version. Its not south indianish at all. Wonder why mani decided to dub :o

Nerd

I am waiting for your review . Naan unga reviewa Romba Madhikkaren. 8-)

[thimuru]

All the reviews so far have atleast lauded abhishek's performance. I always knew that he can ACT :thumbsup:

And please dont review the movie watching the tamil version. Its not south indianish at all. Wonder why mani decided to dub :o

Nerd

I am waiting for your review . Naan unga reviewa Romba Madhikkaren. 8-)

yen...unga rendu perukkum ore per..adhunalaya?

[Nerd]

I dont appreciate sarcasm, please :notworthy:

[thimuru]

I dont appreciate sarcasm, please :notworthy:

ungaloda thannadakatha paathu poorichu poyiten

[nerdy]

All the reviews so far have atleast lauded abhishek's performance. I always knew that he can ACT :thumbsup:

And please dont review the movie watching the tamil version. Its not south indianish at all. Wonder why mani decided to dub :o

Nerd

I am waiting for your review . Naan unga reviewa Romba Madhikkaren. 8-)

yen...unga rendu perukkum ore per..adhunalaya?


Though i am a new hubber , i have been reading his posts for the past 6 months.

I liked his VV's review. That is why i said, i am admirer of his reviews. :P

[Saamy]

Just saw a program called " Guru's day today" in Headlines Today.

The movie Maniratnam's Guru had opened to a very poor response all over india. only abt 25 to 30% opening in cities like Mumbai and Delhi.

[Ulaganayagan]

http://www.mtvindia.com/mtv/movies/reviews/07/guru/

STORY: Gurukant Desai (Abhishek) goes to Istanbul, dances with Mallika and returns to his village hoping to set up a business. He marries Sujata (Ash) only because with the dowry money he gets to set up his own business. He rises, rises and rises till he gets a paralysis attack. In between he sings songs with Ash, takes takkar with Mithunda, has weird talks with Vidya Balan about marrying her, sings another bhaang wala song etc etc.

REVIEW: This film belongs to Abhishek. Period. He carries the sometimes shaky film, with great panache - even the negative shades of his characters are wonderfully potrayed. Ash is just about tolerable while Mithun is first-rate. Yes, the film is clearly based on Dhirubhai's life. And what's with the final speech of Guru - a guy who runs international petrochemicals business doesn't understand terms like "excise" when spoken in English? A pacy first half, a slow second half, some excessive melodrama and a letdown of a climax is what sums up this film.

EDIT PLEASE: The unnessecary bhaang wala song, after the birth of Guru's twin daughters, is completely ghusaoed in the movie. Please, please cut that out - it sticks out like a hair in biryani.

WHAT?: A wheelchair bound Vidya Balan kisses on-screen. Full on lip-to-lip, baba! Call me names, but I found it kinky. Also what's with the obsession with rains - Ash's entry, Vidya's kiss, shareholders meeting, first factory set up - it rains in virtually half of the movie. People actually clapped in the theatre, when Ash & Abhishek got married in the film.

A not so good review for Guru

[osama_sword]

I heard from friends who watched in chennai that Guru was very boring.

[nerdy]

I heard from friends who watched in chennai that Guru was very boring.

Really? :shock:

[nerdy]

Bulb_Mani

Have you seen the movie ?

[nickraman]

-deleted-

[nickraman]

http://www.mtvindia.com/mtv/movies/reviews/07/guru/

STORY: Gurukant Desai (Abhishek) goes to Istanbul, dances with Mallika and returns to his village hoping to set up a business. He marries Sujata (Ash) only because with the dowry money he gets to set up his own business. He rises, rises and rises till he gets a paralysis attack. In between he sings songs with Ash, takes takkar with Mithunda, has weird talks with Vidya Balan about marrying her, sings another bhaang wala song etc etc.

REVIEW: This film belongs to Abhishek. Period. He carries the sometimes shaky film, with great panache - even the negative shades of his characters are wonderfully potrayed. Ash is just about tolerable while Mithun is first-rate. Yes, the film is clearly based on Dhirubhai's life. And what's with the final speech of Guru - a guy who runs international petrochemicals business doesn't understand terms like "excise" when spoken in English? A pacy first half, a slow second half, some excessive melodrama and a letdown of a climax is what sums up this film.

EDIT PLEASE: The unnessecary bhaang wala song, after the birth of Guru's twin daughters, is completely ghusaoed in the movie. Please, please cut that out - it sticks out like a hair in biryani.

WHAT?: A wheelchair bound Vidya Balan kisses on-screen. Full on lip-to-lip, baba! Call me names, but I found it kinky. Also what's with the obsession with rains - Ash's entry, Vidya's kiss, shareholders meeting, first factory set up - it rains in virtually half of the movie. People actually clapped in the theatre, when Ash & Abhishek got married in the film.

A not so good review for Guru

Hence it's coming from MTV Generation. Give them another DON and they'll shut up.

[osama_sword]

May be dude... i have no idea but my friends r not worshippers of masala.... they said the movie is technically superior but screenplay is slow it seems.

Dont know it might click in sometime :)

[Ulaganayagan]

Did you see the movie Nick?

[nerdy]

[tscii:e9d9491335]Guru


By Moviebuzz


Mani Ratnam’s Guru is undoubtedly a gutsy and outstanding film. He may have denied it before the release of the film but Guru is definitely a bio-pic on Dhirubhai Ambani, the Reliance industry founder.
It is all about Ambani’s rags-to-riches story from early 50’s to mid 80’s. Mani tells us about the life and times of a man who became a messiah for the middle class in the country. Mani’s Gurukanth Desai brilliantly portrayed by Abhishek Bachchan dares to dream big. To realize his dreams he crosses many hurdles, often cutting corners and is accused of making the system corrupt by using morally questionable means to achieve his goals.

Lets face it. Dhirubhai, like our protagonist Gurukanth Desai was a real hero for millions of Indians as he believed in sharing his wealth with the very same people who contributed to his company initially. Mani has used this larger-than-life figure of Guru to not only glorify him but also make us root for him when he lands in conflict with the government and its agencies along with rivals who are out to crush his spirit and company.

The film works in a similar pattern to the way that superheroes in a mass masala film beats up more than a dozen guys and wins against all odds. The tagline of the film clearly conveys the story of Guru - Villager, Visionary, Winner! And Mani sir the king of romance has weaved a beautiful love story with several magical moments-the bedroom scene where the couple playfully smack each other, the scene when he presents her a swing as Guru tells her his future dreams or the kitchen scene when he hugs her while she cooks- all stay in your mind.

Mani is one of the few directors in Indian cinema who understands the intimate portraits of love and human relationships which he conveys subtlety and effectively. Abhishek-Ash on screen chemistry has never been so good, as unlike other directors Mani is not carried away by their star status that both look so natural and real.

The scene where Guru comes to ManekDas Gupta’s (Mithun Chakravarthy as the late legendary Ramnath Goenka) house and the confrontation scene that happens is brilliant. No loud background score, no shouting, no melancholy - just an exchange of words which convey the break up between the two is one of the best scenes in the film.

However the highlight of the film is the climax scene as Guru faces the enquiry commission set up by the government. Mani seems to have been influenced by Martin Scorsese’s classic The Aviator(2004) a bio-pic on the legendary US millionaire Howard Hughes played by Leonardo DeCaprio. Full credit goes to Abhishek who speaks his mind without the aid of a lawyer and gets the audiences on his side when he is accused by the commission of profiteering and breaking customs and income tax laws in the country.

Outstanding performance is extracted from everyone in the cast. Armed with the film’s best written role, Abhishek Bachchan delivers the most outstanding performance of his career. He lives the role of Guru from a vibrant young boy to a responsible man to a successful businessman- he pours plenty of heartfelt emotions into his role. His body language, gait and dialogue delivery are superb.

Aishwarya Rai has never looked so natural in recent times. As Sujatha she is outstanding especially in the second half with a matured performance when she becomes Guru’s biggest support and pillar of strength. Mithun as the newspaper baron is dignified. Madhavan in a cameo is perfect while Vidya Balan looks wasted in an inconspicuous role.

Like all Mani films, technically Guru is awesome with Raji Menon’s camerawork . The look and feel of the film the colour shift from yellow to blue hue, Turkey market, Aishwarya’s introductory song, railway station(Where did Mani get that black beauty steam engine train?) the switch pan court scenes in the climax are eye-catching. Plus Sameer Chanda’s artwork and Sreekar Prasad’s editing are the plus points.

The crisp dialogues of Vijay Krishna Acharya makes it a great film to watch. Though much has been said about A.R.Rahman’s songs, it is the background score which is a winner this time. Mani’s picturisation is good though there is nothing new like the Barso Re… song reminds you of the Roja song. The best among the lot is Mallika Sherawat’s Mayya Mayya….

On the downside the film is too long (2 hr 42 in) and drags in the second half. Too many songs, acts as a speed breaker especially the celebration song post interval Ek Lo Ek Muft… stands out like a sore thumb. The love between Madhavan and Vidya Balan lacks passion and the lengthy scene between the two which ends up in a lip lock is boring and tests the patience of the viewers.

Mani has to be appreciated for making a bio-pic the most difficult genre work. Guru is a mature, professionally made film with great performances. It is stylish, engrossing, classy and a must see for connoisseurs of good cinema.

Verdict: Very Good

:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:





[/tscii:e9d9491335]

[/b]

[kb]

GURU was excellent..

camera work was great so is ARR..

mani has made a very very gud film again..
the maker is back... pretenders step aside :D :D :D :D

[Warden]

Its awesome.I never believed Abi can perform so well :D
And Rajiv Menon :clap: Itll be gr8 if the pait works more often.



GURU was excellent..

camera work was great so is ARR..

mani has made a very very gud film again..
the maker is back... pretenders step aside :D :D :D :D

[nerdy]

Nerd

Have u seen the movie ? Eagerly awaiting for you review.

[great]

Its awesome.I never believed Abi can perform so well :D
And Rajiv Menon :clap: Itll be gr8 if the pait works more often.



Have u seen Guru. If so , tamil or hindi version ?

[kb]

i saw the tamil version..

suryas voice was to the T

i shud say he made another nayakar in gurukant desai..

abishek will get award for sure..

such a confidence building story..

mayya mayya song was very very gud :D to hear and :wink:

[nickraman]

Did you see the movie Nick?

Going for the 9PM show. 8-)
-----------------------------------------
MTV is for Mindless youth. You see, a film like GURU takes brains rather than Brawn. MTV prefers crap like Dhoom 2 and they'll go gaga over it. For movies like Ratnam and so on, they'll degrade it.

Who cares about MTV. Every review (aside from Raja "crap" Sen's purist review) has given GURU (in average) a 4/5 star rating. All commenting on this being Ratnam's finest work.

As for the tamil dub, it's supposed to be bad, but it works because of Suriya's dubbing thats all. The dubbed songs are ear-bleeding, especially Mayya Mayya.

[nickraman]

.... pretenders step aside :D :D :D :D

Yes Vijay, that's mean you to.

*Wonders if Vijay will remake Krrish...

[ajithfederer]

Just saw guru......the movie is good..........abisheikh has delivered a good performance....... :D

[ajithfederer]

:roll:

i saw the tamil version..

suryas voice was to the T

i shud say he made another nayakar in gurukant desai..

abishek will get award for sure..

such a confidence building story..

mayya mayya song was very very gud :D to hear and :wink:

[Kollywoodfan]

AF :roll: :roll:

[nickraman]

The 9PM show was FULL HOUSE! So I didn't get to go . :cry:

But of course, there's tomorrow! 1 PM!

[thimuru]

is there any chance of national award for abishek?

[kb]

there are more chance for an NA for abhishek :D :D

there are lot of similarity between the roles of kamal in nayakan and abhishek in GURU :D :D

[Warden]

Hindhi na.
Movies,too good :D
Madhavan too was good in the small role.His confrontation scenes with ABi were :thumbsup:


Its awesome.I never believed Abi can perform so well :D
And Rajiv Menon :clap: Itll be gr8 if the pait works more often.



Have u seen Guru. If so , tamil or hindi version ?

[Ulaganayagan]

is there any chance of national award for abishek?
UP govt was thinking about conferring a doctorate to AB Jr after Dhoom 2 ! If his performance is even half as good as the raving thats going on,he'll be a front runner for the award.

[thinkfloyd]

As an admirer of Mani Ratnam i'm sorry to say i was disappointed with Guru. Went with expectations

[Nerd]

I went to the movie last evening and I should say I was impressed.
Bottomline: Mani Ratnam is India's best director. Period.

[Saamy]

Mani Ratnam is India's best director. Period.

Entha period-la? What abt Directors like KamalHassan, Baarathi raja etc.

[Nerd]

Saamy, this is NOT a thread for comparison, please. There is a thread in the archives titled MR Vs KH. Unearth that, please :)

[thimuru]

:lol:


is there any chance of national award for abishek?
UP govt was thinking about conferring a doctorate to AB Jr after Dhoom 2 ! If his performance is even half as good as the raving thats going on,he'll be a front runner for the award.

[Sinthiya]

I went to the movie last evening and I should say I was impressed. This probably would be one of the best movies, if not the best, this year.
Kasi, nice review...:clap:...completely agree with you...

[Sinthiya]

I watched Guru on the day of the premiere in Toronto. The stars arrived quite late; Mani sir came with Suhasini and his son (i hope); then ARR passed by fast; then Madhavan and his wife came; then we all waited another 20-30mins before Aish and Abishek came together....

Maniratnam sir introduced Rajeev Mennon, ARR, Madhavan, Aishwarya Rai and finally Abishek Bachan and thanked them all. Madhavan spoke few words about the movie and the opportunity; Aish thanked everyone for coming; and Abishek said something :roll: (i was too busy screaming Madhavan's name...:P) Then the movie finally began at 9pm!! :o (when it was actually scheduled to start at 7-7:30pm)

Maniratnam sir, once again has proven himself and his unique style that I like. He uses ARR's BGM and song to move the story perfectly. Most of the songs were used well, even Mayya Mayya....I really liked that songs had some significance to the story...As in most of Mani sir's movies, this screenplay is slow paced and still well done...

+ve:
Abishek is the star of the movie - his performance is simply superb and real - he is GURU! Aish was good too - her role is significant as the wife of Gurubhai who stands by him...The chemistry between Abi and Aish is cute! Mithun and Madhavan are the antagonists and their performances were well done, though there was not much scope in their characters as I would've liked to see...

-ve:
-In the end, I felt Madhavan and Mithun's character and their story was left hanging and maybe would've liked to see a resolution (if any...); then again, it's the story of GURU so I suppose it's acceptable...
-I didn't feel/see there was any chemistry between Madhavan and Vidya in GURU - even the kiss seemed unreal...then again the movie is not about them...don't feel the kiss was necessary...

Overall, I thoroughly enjoyed the movie for Maniratnam sir's direction - use of ARR's music, Abishek's real acting, Madhavan's simple performance and the camera work of Rajiv Mennon...Despite my comments, the movie was well done...so it's definitely worth a watch!

And the pics of all the stars from the premiere turned out quite well..only one shot of Madhavan but it's still good...

:)

[thinkfloyd]

http://www.mouthshut.com/review/Guru-117339-1.html
http://www.mouthshut.com/review/Guru-117345-1.html

[Scale]

Welcome comeback after the debacle Yuva, A Sure hit! Guru - The Movie (www.scalerevolves.blogspot.com)

[Nerd]

http://www.mouthshut.com/review/Guru-117339-1.html
http://www.mouthshut.com/review/Guru-117345-1.html

There are 29 reviews there and you have picked the worst two :lol:

FYI, rottentomatoes carries 4 reviews from famous american critics and all of them have certified the movie as FRESH 8-)

Sinthiya: Why dont you upload the pics somewhere :)

[thinkfloyd]

http://www.mouthshut.com/review/Guru-117339-1.html
http://www.mouthshut.com/review/Guru-117345-1.html

There are 29 reviews there and you have picked the worst two :lol:

FYI, rottentomatoes carries 4 reviews from famous american critics and all of them have certified the movie as FRESH 8-)



Nerd,
You are right and i know that the mouthshut main link has already been posted here. However, i posted these two because i agree with certain points (not all) mentioned in these two. Plus i don't base my opinion on what other reviewers or critics have to say :)

[Nerd]

Fair enough, floyd!

[thinkfloyd]

Thanks :)

[thinkfloyd]

According to http://www.businessofcinema.com/2007/13jan/box_office.htm, "Mani Ratnam's Guru released this Friday. The opening has been below expectations. The film is expected to do better in Mumbai, the south and overseas."
- This was about the first-day collection

http://www.mid-day.com/news/city/2007/january/150179.htm says "... an attempt to enliven the dismal box office collections of the latest Aish-Abhishek starrer Guru, which opened to less than 50 per cent collections in its first week."

[Sinthiya]

Sinthiya: Why dont you upload the pics somewhere :)
sure Kasi...here they are:

Madhavan and his wife
http://i3.tinypic.com/2du9qop.jpg
not so clear as i would've liked but his smile is there :) :wink:

Aish & Abhi
http://i13.tinypic.com/48nps1j.jpg
She looked perfectly at my camera and smiled :)

Mani sir & family
http://i1.tinypic.com/48h4qyg.jpg

The GURU stars
http://i10.tinypic.com/2aevudf.jpg

stars:
http://i11.tinypic.com/309k0hc.jpg

:)

[nerdy]

I went to the movie last evening and I should say I was impressed. This probably would be one of the best movies, if not the best, this year. These are the highs:

Acting: If you guys think that Abhishek was good in Yuva, watch Guru. He is outstanding. Right from the turkey scenes to the mindblowing climax, he is just too good. The hospital scene where he tries to console Manoj Joshi is a wonderful scene that had lots of scope to express his feelings and he did perfect justice to that scene. The next best actor in the movie is Mithun! Right from his introductory scene to the scene where he silently watches Abhishek who will be suffering with a paralytic attack, he is awesome. Perhaps this might be one of Mithun's best performances. The third best actor in the movie is again a surprise. Aishwarya Rai! This is her best performance till date, easily. She impresses everyone, especially in the hospital scenes and the court scenes. Another actor who impressed me was Maddy, he did his young journalist role to perfection. Two thumbs up to maddy as well. His confrontation scenes with Abhishek were really good.

Photography: Be it the sizzling mallika dance or the picteresque locations in the barso re song or the bombay (actually chennai) scenes, the camera is world class. Visual elegance almost comparable with a few Kubrick movies!

Music: All those ARR haters who keep cribbing that ARR cant come up with a good BGM, go watch Guru. Even I am not a fan of his BGM especially in emotional scenes but he just blew me away with his incredible music in Guru. The two bit songs, the jazz piece, the guru bhai piece, the music that plays when Abhishek is paralysed are mindblowing, to say the least.

Direction: Last but not the least, its Mani Ratnam's film. All the scenes have a MR stamp. The romance between Aish and Abhi reminds you of his previous movies (especially bombay) and the scene where abhi loads the polyester into that menon's house reminds you of nayagan but those scenes fitted the movie to perfection. The climax is his best so far, second only to nayagan. A fabulous ending to a great film.

These are the lows:

1. Vidyabalan/maddy romance ate up some 15 mins in the second half which was totally unnecessary.

2. The initial tussle between Aish and Abhi was made up just for the tere bina song and abhi did not even try to explain his stance on that matter.

3. What hapens to his brother in law ??

4. Dialogues, though powerful most of the times (especially the 5 minutes thing) was not so good in a few scenes.

Bottomline: Mani Ratnam is India's best director. Period.

P.S. This movie wont do good in the BO :oops:


Nice review Nerd. :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:

You would have framed this as "Mani is one of the Best director of the country".

I hope this movie would do very good in Multiplexes in Overseas.

[nerdy]

Mani Ratnam is India's best director. Period.

Entha period-la? What abt Directors like KamalHassan, Baarathi raja etc.

<Dig>

IMHO

Kamal could be another maniratnam if he took the direction in full fledge.

Though Kamal directed very good movies like Hey Ram,Mahanathi,Dever magan and Virumandi, he is not on par with Mani.

I hope he would over take Mani in another 2 years.But definitely KH is one of very good writer/Director of Indian cinema.

</Dig>

[sathyaram30]

Guru is in fact a very well made movie out of a simple script. You hvae to appreciate the director for the movie. In fact this movie is a lesson to Kollywood

a) You lose quality directors if the market is crap. We get only directors like Simbu..... who claim they are world class.
b) Heroes like Ajith, Vijay,Visha,Simbu etc.etc. all need to learn what is acting before asking their fans to drench their cutouts in milk,beer and what not.
c)Hindi market takes bigger movies and has got appreciation for it whereas when Kamal took Hey Ram there was no great support though script was brilliant.
d)Tamil cinema if it goes this way will soon become worst than Kannada and will only get pokkiris, alwars and vallavans...

[Hulkster]

Nerd Mani is currently India's best director but compared to adoor gopalakrishnan and satyajit ray at the time and perhaps K Balachander he is still behind the race.

[Nerd]

Hulk and others: I was just talking about contemporary directors, those who still make movies 8-)

[Saamy]

Hulk and others: I was just talking about contemporary directors, those who still make movies 8-) good avatar Nerd. Dr.Strangelove :P

[rocketboy]

Hulk and others: I was just talking about contemporary directors, those who still make movies 8-)
First let him make an honest attempt in scripting an original story.
I am of the opinion that I can write much better screenplays than Saturn .

[osama_sword]

b) Heroes like Ajith, Vijay,Visha,Simbu etc.etc. all need to learn what is acting before asking their fans to drench their cutouts in milk,beer and what not.


AJith poi fansa beer ootha sonarunu neenga patheengala? Dont talk just for the sake of talking without knowing whats happening 8-)

[Nerd]

Hulk and others: I was just talking about contemporary directors, those who still make movies 8-)
First let him make an honest attempt in scripting an original story.
I am of the opinion that I can write much better screenplays than Saturn .

Common. Do it :lol:

Scripts like mouna rAgam, bombay, rOjA, agni nakshaththiram etc.., are original 8-)

All his screenplays are original though most of them are inspirations

[rocketboy]

Hulk and others: I was just talking about contemporary directors, those who still make movies 8-)
First let him make an honest attempt in scripting an original story.
I am of the opinion that I can write much better screenplays than Saturn .

Common. Do it :lol:

Scripts like mouna rAgam, bombay, rOjA, agni nakshaththiram etc.., are original 8-)

All his screenplays are original though most of them are inspirations

Only Mouna Raagam deserves appreciation . He did a commendable job in picturising the blossoming of marital love in a woman who was at loggerheads with her husband. The rest can be dismissed as jokes.

Hey man give me a chance. I'll prove my worth 8-)

[nerdy]

I think mouna ragam also inspired by Mahendiran's Nenjathai killadhey.

[Nerd]

I think mouna ragam also inspired by Mahendiran's Nenjathai killadhey.

No. It isnt. I saw NK very recently, never did that movie remind me of mouna raagam. NK, IMHO is not one of mahendran's best works. 8-)

And rb, you are right about MR, thats his BEST movie, easily. Mani ratnam's presentation skills, technical brilliance, screenplays are unmatchable, IMHO 8-)

[Nerd]

Guru collections pick up

Syed Firdaus Ashraf | January 16, 2007 15:19 IST

The news of Abhishek Bachchan and Aishwarya Rai's engagement has done well for Guru. After a slow opening, it has started picking up at the box office.

Guru saw a 50-60% opening on January 12, the first day of its release, but did increasingly better after the news broke on Sunday.

Guru is a crucial film for Abhishek Bachchan as it is being counted as his first solo success, both critically and commercially.

"Guru is on its way to become a hit," said Taran Adarsh, well known film trade analyst.

Interestingly, only 3 months ago Abhiwarya faced a disastrous flop with J P Dutta's Umrao Jaan.

The difference is in the reviews. While Dutta's film was savaged by critics, Mani Ratnam's film is garnering praise. "Guru so far has been appreciated well, and is a good film too," added Adarsh. Critics have unanimously praised Abhishek and Aishwarya's histrionics, and the word of mouth publicity is making a huge difference to the film.

A still from Guru"The film so far has done well in cities and multiplexes," declared trade analyst Komal Nahta, "and has done reasonably okay business."

Nahta feels the engagement news hasn't had an impact on the box office collections. "Not at all. Everybody knew that they were seeing each other. So, how would that help the film? It is like the story of boy crying about the wolf. Everyone knew that this news would come true. and finally when it has come true nobody is surprised about it. So it has no effect at the box office."

He further said the film's collections have started dropping again.

Unlike other Hindi films, an integral part of Guru's success comes from South India, largely because of Mani Ratnam's great fan following beyond the Vindhyas.

"The film has done well in South India," concluded Vinod Mirani. "Abhishek's performance has been appreciated and he is maturing as an actor day by day."

[Scale]

http://www.time.com/time/arts/article/0,8599,1578636-1,00.html

by Richard Corliss.

The entire article shows how much he enjoyed and analysed MR's films.

Guru, a fine polyester :thumbsup: :notworthy:

[joe]

Nerd,
1.Who is that in your avatar?
2.One blogger in his review mentioned that Abishek's performance in guru is better than kamal's in Nayagan ..what do you think ?how do you compare?

[joe]

More reviews...

http://vavaasangam2.blogspot.com/2007/01/blog-post_17.html

http://madippakkam.blogspot.com/2007/01/blog-post_17.html

[thinkfloyd]

Nerd,
1.Who is that in your avatar?

That is Peter Sellers, in and as Dr.Strangelove

[Scale]

I am of the opinion that I can write much better screenplays than Saturn .

:lol: Sure, you can! And its so easy in FH, everyone can do that in 1 or 2 sentences verdict. Then who will direct? Whatever you script on the paper doesnt transform to film's roll robotically. Doesnt he need a commercial break?
You go and approach SS for Rocky6 or JC for an HK film with your screenplay and presume how they reacts to it. Doesnt they need a commercial break? Thats what MR attempted with his trademark stamp.

[selvakumar]

b) Heroes like Ajith, Vijay,Visha,Simbu etc.etc. all need to learn what is acting before asking their fans to drench their cutouts in milk,beer and what not.


Just including the much needed lines
<dig>

</dig>

btw, Would really appreciate it IF you avoid ajith's name in this thread !

won't you ?

[rockydeva]

b) Heroes like Ajith, Vijay,Visha,Simbu etc.etc. all need to learn what is acting before asking their fans to drench their cutouts in milk,beer and what not.


Just including the much needed lines
<dig>

</dig>

btw, Would really appreciate it IF you avoid ajith's name in this thread !

won't you ?

yep

[Nerd]

Nerd,
1.Who is that in your avatar?
2.One blogger in his review mentioned that Abishek's performance in guru is better than kamal's in Nayagan ..what do you think ?how do you compare?

As floyd mentioned, he is Peter Sellers from a very old comedy movie, Dr. Strangelove. The best comedy movie ever :)

As far as the second question goes, IMHO, nAyakan is not kH's best performance. 16 vayathinilE, DM, MN are better. Abhishek's role is almost similar to that of vElu nayakar (20 - 60). For a non-actor like Abhishek its a dream role and he has done full justice to it. :thumbsup:

[joe]

Thanks Nerd :D

[Saamy]

Hulk and others: I was just talking about contemporary directors, those who still make movies 8-)
First let him make an honest attempt in scripting an original story.
I am of the opinion that I can write much better screenplays than Saturn . are u calling MANI RATNAM a SANIRATNAM :shock: :shock: :shock: :lol:

[NewOne]

Hulk and others: I was just talking about contemporary directors, those who still make movies 8-)
First let him make an honest attempt in scripting an original story.
I am of the opinion that I can write much better screenplays than Saturn . are u calling MANI RATNAM a SANIRATNAM :shock: :shock: :shock: :lol:

Why so much hatred against him? I never knew you could hate someone for being damn good. We don't give credit to our own people and anticipate americans to offer us oscars on a plate.

[Nerd]

The Times review is really good and I am happy that atleast Mani takes our movies to the western countries :clap:

But the point is there are better movies than nAyakan which could not find a place in the Time's list :(

[rocketboy]

Hulk and others: I was just talking about contemporary directors, those who still make movies 8-)
First let him make an honest attempt in scripting an original story.
I am of the opinion that I can write much better screenplays than Saturn . are u calling MANI RATNAM a SANIRATNAM :shock: :shock: :shock: :lol:

Why so much hatred against him? I never knew you could hate someone for being damn good. We don't give credit to our own people and anticipate americans to offer us oscars on a plate.
It doesn't stem out of hatred . Just kidding

[Saamy]

Hulk and others: I was just talking about contemporary directors, those who still make movies 8-)
First let him make an honest attempt in scripting an original story.
I am of the opinion that I can write much better screenplays than Saturn . are u calling MANI RATNAM a SANIRATNAM :shock: :shock: :shock: :lol:

Why so much hatred against him? I never knew you could hate someone for being damn good. We don't give credit to our own people and anticipate americans to offer us oscars on a plate.NO . I dont hate him so much.

[joe]

What if ManiRathnam directs 'Periyar' --Just for fun

http://penathal.blogspot.com/2007/01/full-screenplay.html :)

[VENKIRAJA]

The Times review is really good and I am happy that atleast Mani takes our movies to the western countries :clap:

But the point is there are better movies than nAyakan which could not find a place in the Time's list :(

point them plz.

joe:good find.gr8 comedy.any guru collection reports?

[Nerd]

But the point is there are better movies than nAyakan which could not find a place in the Time's list :(

point them plz.


LOTS of b/w movies (I have not seen a lot lately, AFAICR andha naaL)

Bharathiraja's 16 vayathinilE, mudhal mariyAdhai

Mani Ratnam himself's mouna rAgam

Mahendran's uthiri pookkaL, muLLum malarum

Kamal's mahAnadhi, dhEvar magan

Balu mahendra's veedu

These movies deserve a place more than nAyagan, IMHO :)

[Movie Cop]

But the point is there are better movies than nAyakan which could not find a place in the Time's list :(

point them plz.


LOTS of b/w movies (I have not seen a lot lately, AFAICR andha naaL)

Bharathiraja's 16 vayathinilE, mudhal mariyAdhai

Mani Ratnam himself's mouna rAgam

Mahendran's uthiri pookkaL, muLLum malarum

Kamal's mahAnadhi, dhEvar magan

Balu mahendra's veedu

These movies deserve a place more than nAyagan, IMHO :)

Few more Tamil movies I would add to that list are:
Moondram Pirai, Sindhu Bhairavi, Anjali, Roja & Hey Ram! IMO, all these movies are "international" class! :thumbsup:

[thimuru]

anjali...roja???????

:roll: they are of international class?

did he really deal with the terrorism there?...thats a love story!

[thinkfloyd]

My crib against Mani is that he deceives the viewers by appearing to address an issue when all he is doing is 'manipulate' the gullible audience by using the issue to tap their excitable emotions and then completely skirt and romanticize the issue. As a result, the plot suffers and characters become unrealistic.
There are two things film-makers do. Great film-makers.
They either take a stand and pitch for their belief with the help of the movie and its characters. Others don't take a stand. They just take an impartial view and just let the people interpret without being judgemental themselves. Mani does the former (unconvincingly) but says in the interview he's doing the latter. That's the reason some of his films have the most inexplicably dumb and simplistic endings - Roja, Bombay and now, Guru.
He utterly lacks nativity and you always sense a middle-class, elitist 'feel' when you watch his films, probably stemming from his sensibilities, even though the setting may be in a country side.

About international recognition, i agree with Nerd that there are better films than Nayagan. However, from Mani's works, apart from Nayagan, which was a fantastic teamwork involving a few 'greats', i can think of Kannathil Muthamittal which can represent his best. In that sense, there are far better directors than Mani Ratnam who deserve the international recognition, just like there are better movies than Nayagan and definitely much better film scores than Roja.
Infact, we should not get carried away by this international recognition thing. It involves a combination of factors like marketing, lobbying power, accesibility, and the most important thing cultural and regional sensibilities.

Please note that i've only mentioned only some negatives here which does not mean i don't have positive things to say on Mani and his films too. After all, he is one like ARR who doesn TN proud :)

[MADDY]

My crib against Mani is that he deceives the viewers by appearing to address an issue when all he is doing is 'manipulate' the gullible audience by using the issue to tap their excitable emotions and then completely skirt and romanticize the issue. As a result, the plot suffers and characters become unrealistic.

well thats the realistic depiction of a upper middle/middle class attitudes......when we see a issue, we discuss it and leave it right there :lol: .......do we take stand on that and act on that?? no.....thats wat mani does.......many hubbers felt that Surya killing his father in Nanda is reality while Karthik/Prabhu's tolerance of infidelity in Agni Natchithram is unrealistic........trust me, i wont kill my father for having a second wife.... :lol: ......i would embrace that family too......dont u guys think so?? (hope my son also doesent mind infidelity :wink: )


He utterly lacks nativity and you always sense a middle-class, elitist 'feel' when you watch his films, probably stemming from his sensibilities, even though the setting may be in a country side.

if Mani also makes movies like Selva(about womanliness and manliness and how it grows and reacts to each other :lol: ), CSI,encounter,urban cops, raw killings like Gautam, totally unique and never-seen-before characters like Bala, and not to forget the eternal genius of Tamil cinema - cheran who doesent think elitist urban-middle class thinking is neccessary for TN , then wats left for this "poor" middle class people??? who will make movies for us and about us and our viewpoints??? :cry: :cry: .....i think Mani's departure will mark a end to middle class sensibilities/viewpoint in tamil films which is already rampant.....


It involves a combination of factors like marketing, lobbying power, accesibility, and the most important thing cultural and regional sensibilities.

how do u think mani and ARR have a better lobbying power/marketing power than BR and IR??? all of them were from Tamilnadu and were Tamilians, if i'm not wrong........how do u think Mani and ARR broke the barriers while IR and BR couldnt.......wat was so foul abt their recognition??


Please note that i've only mentioned only some negatives here which does not mean i don't have positive things to say on Mani and his films too. After all, he is one like ARR who doesn TN proud :)

mani is making one more Hindi movie after Lajjo and is set to retire after that/....... :lol: ........we(TF) guys have already lost him.....u have btter people, dont worry..... :D ......

btw, dubbing Guru in Tamil is a mistake.......mani should have understood Tamil ppl. sensibilities better......its these small mistakes that get him a huge bad name....... :cry: .....

hope lajjo is also not dubbed.... :lol:

[thinkfloyd]

Maddy,
You needn't have taken this thing as an "us" vs "them" :) Atleast i didn't mean it that way.

Middle-class sensibilities: I never said Mani should not make movies for or about the middle-class. That he has never made a rural subject is also another point. I didn't mean that. Also, it doesn't have to be the case that only village folks should watch village subjects and vice versa. What i meant was even when he tries to depict a rustic setting, or a character from the slum, the language,dialogue, the casting, the production design or art direction as we say it, reflects a certain "richness" or an artificiality about it.

Lobbying etc: I said its a combination of a lot of factors including marketing and lobbying. Its a necessity. Mani is well respected in the north and so is ARR. That wasn't gifted to them. They earned it. Please don't get me wrong. However, my point is that just because Richard Corliss happened to review Guru i wouldn't call it great blindly nor would i dismiss it as a marketing gimmick - i suspect that you think i do. Rather, i didn't find his review enlightening nor did he offer any insight, which is what i'd expect from a critic.

You mentioned IR. For one, his music doesn't have the national reach that ARR has. That's IR's strength as well as weakness depending on how you look at it. He has never acheived nation-wide recognition or adulation that ARR simply because ARR's music was received better in the North. Lobby means the right people, the powerful people trumpeting the movie in the right places. What Bharat Bala is doing is not a crime, but rather a smart thing to do. Not all have the privilege - not all are undeserving of it. The point is, it so happened that Nayagan and Roja got into the Time list, pipping other more deserving candidates in the process. We can use it as an indicator but not as the authority

And why do i get the feeling that you think my statement about Mani and ARR doing TN proud was sarcastic?? Seriosuly, i meant it.
About Mani doing a movie in Tamil or Hindi, going by what i've seen in Guru, i wish he does something much better next time, whatever the language

[Nerd]

That's the reason some of his films have the most inexplicably dumb and simplistic endings - Roja, Bombay and now, Guru.

I will just take this sentance.

Bombay climax was pathetic and you ve hit the bulls eye :)

I dont know how else to end rOjA and guru. Lets take guru for example. How will you suggest MR to have ended that film ?? Seeing gurubhai dying with a background song similar to thenpANdi ?? IMHO, the climax saved the otherwise dull second half.

[thinkfloyd]

That's the reason some of his films have the most inexplicably dumb and simplistic endings - Roja, Bombay and now, Guru.

I will just take this sentance.

Bombay climax was pathetic and you ve hit the bulls eye :)

I dont know how else to end rOjA and guru. Lets take guru for example. How will you suggest MR to have ended that film ?? Seeing gurubhai dying with a background song similar to thenpANdi ?? IMHO, the climax saved the otherwise dull second half.

Roja -
If only terrorists could be transformed like that...... :)

Guru -
1) Do you believe Mani when he says he doesn't take stands and he is just being an objective observer?
2) Did you really buy the lofty noble rhetoric guru comes up with in the climax? What's with the 'inspiring' BGM that accompanies that? That was the epitome of Mani batting for his protagonist :)
So he is this modern day Gandhi who's motivation is to uplift his share-holders? If this climax is acceptable then all of Shankar's climaxes are very well acceptable
3) What's with the Ash being his partner thing? What did those papers in the hands of the committee members have? Straight from a typical everyday Tamil film.....

Its bad enough how he has treated the movie. What's worse is his interviews disclaiming the Ambani connection (understandable) and claiming a stance of objectivity. That means just this - trying to project an image of himself and his film which runs contrary to his work on screen

[Nerd]

Roja -
If only terrorists could be transformed like that...... :)


Can you suggest something else, please. You should watch other pathetic attempts at terrorists movies like the latest Kabul Express. Do you exactly know what runs in the mind of a terrorist and why did he become a terrorist and things like that?


Guru -
1) Do you believe Mani when he says he doesn't take stands and he is just being an objective observer?
2) Did you really buy the lofty noble rhetoric guru comes up with in the climax? What's with the 'inspiring' BGM that accompanies that? That was the epitome of Mani batting for his protagonist :)
So he is this modern day Gandhi who's motivation is to uplift his share-holders? If this climax is acceptable then all of Shankar's climaxes are very well acceptable
3) What's with the Ash being his partner thing? What did those papers in the hands of the committee members have? Straight from a typical everyday Tamil film.....


1. After all its an Indian film and if you show that the protagonist was unethical in his moves to become rich, therein bolstering India's economy, then the movie would have looked dumb and no one would have bought that.

2. His protagonist is a genius. Almost lakhs of people's lives are dependant upon him. What else will he say in those five minutes? Its very normal that you bat for a genius. Would you have been happier if gurubhai had been sent to the prison ??

3. Ash partner, I got no clue, may be there is something which you can do. A business analyst might help us, maNi himself being an mba degree holder woudnt have flunked there, I think.

And I never thought that he was Gandhi or whatever. He is just a pure genius and I dont think he cried there in the climax, he still had the attitude with him. He just explained his whole life in 5 minutes, I hate to compare that with gandhi :roll:

[kannannn]

Roja -
If only terrorists could be transformed like that...... :)


Can you suggest something else, please. You should watch other pathetic attempts at terrorists movies like the latest Kabul Express. Do you exactly know what runs in the mind of a terrorist and why did he become a terrorist and things like that?
Santhosh Sivan's 'The Terrorist' is one I can recommend. And to really see how terrorists have no concern for sentiments, I recommend 'Arlington Road'. A particular scene in Arlington Road has Tim Robbins trying to make Jeff Bridges see reason for his actions: "In war, children die Michael". I haven't seen Guru, so I can't comment on that, but I think thinkfloyd is right about simplistic solutions to serious subjects in Mani's films. IMHO, he is the most overhyped director in India.

[Scale]

Ratnam skews the argument in Gurukant's favor by making the charges against him ("He converts nonconvertible debentures") too obscure to rouse audience's censure. The real Dhirubhai was the most famous Gujurati after Gandhi, and the film allows Gurukant to compare himself to the Mahatama.

That may be the only reason he is just citing an example. No need for scandalous attacks :notthatway:

:wave: & :sleep:

[m_23_bayarea]

Sounds like GURU is becoming a major hit! Is this like the first direct hit for Mani in Hindi? :D

[Nerd]

Regarding simplistic solutions to serious problems, could well be true in the case of bombay and rOjA. How can you substantiate your argument that he is the most overhyped director in India w.r.to movies like,

mouna rAgam
kannaththil muththamittAl
nAyakan
agni nakshathiram
iruvar et all

Also, who do you think is the best in India then :huh:

[great]

I watched this movie today !!! Good Movie from Maniratnam and Team .

Positive:


Abhishek Bachan : I could not think anyother bollywood actor for the role of Gurukanth Desai. He was perfect for that role , had it been tamil version my choice would be Maddy or Surya

A.R.Rehman: Be it BGM or Songs ARR rocks .

Aishwarya Rai : For the time she ACTED in this movie.

Mithunda nice to see him back after longtime in a meaningfull role.

Madhavan & Abhishek:The scene just before the interval :)

Mithun: will you be able to stop Guru kanth Desai`s Growth?
Madhavan : Yes, I can !!
after few dialogues..

Abhishek walks towards Madhavan and say " If you want to fight against Guru Kanth Desai try to be like Guru Kanth and fight. But there is only Guru kanth Desai " This scene was really cool. BGM used for the particular scene would be amazing, Arr would have used this BGM in few other scene also . :clap:

Rajeev Menon :thumbsup:

Art Direction :thumbsup: recreated Mumbai in Binny Mills .


Negative:

Few scenes reminds Nayagan .

1. Contractor: Thera Naam kya tha?
Guru: Tha Nahi,Mera Naam hai aur rahega its Guru Kanth Desai.

2 obvious one where he keeps his Goods at Pratap Pothan house .

Vidhya Balan romance sequence has slowed down the pace of the movie :(

Ek lo Ek Muft abhishek`s dance :lol2:

I didnt liked the climax, it was not that effective particularly the Abhishek Bachans dialogue :(

[kannannn]

Nerd, MR and Nayagan are pre-90 movies. And they are two of my most favourite movies. So, I wouldn't talk about them. As for Kannathil Muthamittal, one scene speaks for the movie. Prakash Raj explaining to Madhavan the dynamics of the Srilankan war says that it's only the western powers that want the war to continue for the their own interests. Com'on, how childish is that? He doesn't have the guts to point out the true agents of war in the region. As for the children's tantrums, the less said, the better. Only children in Mani's movies can act in the way they do.

Agni Natchatiram: Again, I think he spoilt a very good subject with larger than life situations, unnecessary side track and artificial dialogues.

Iruvar: The worst thing about Iruvar is it's artificiality. I was laughing hard when Prakash Raj was mouthing dialogues in chaste Tamil to Tabu and Mohanlal. Mohanlal was the only saving grace in an otherwise forgettable movie.

About the best director, are you talking about art movies or commercial movies? There are much better directors in both formats. See that's another problem: He tries make his audience believe that he gives them the best of both worlds, which he doesn't. What we get is in contrast, a confused mix of both formats.

Anyway, all of Mani's movies are a coming together of the best. What is his director's mark? Where does his uniqueness lie?

[Nerd]

Vasantha Balan romance sequence has slowed down the pace of the movie :(


:shock: :omg: Kidding bro :)

sujAthA has praised guru in vikatan. He has summed up saying that, This movie will be *heard* till hollywood :shock: :thumbsup:

[m_23_bayarea]

Kannann, whatever I thought of Mani's greatness attributes, you have made them sound negative! We're exactly looking at two diff sides of the same spectrum I think... :cry: :oops: :cry:

[great]

Vasantha Balan romance sequence has slowed down the pace of the movie :(


:shock: :omg: Kidding bro :)

sujAthA has praised guru in vikatan. He has summed up saying that, This movie will be *heard* till hollywood :shock: :thumbsup:

Not only veyyil effect but also due to Night 12o Clock effect :lol:

Did you enjoyed the climax

[kannannn]

Bay :), freeya vidunga! When I see a realistic movie, I want an out and out realistic one. When I see a commercial movie, I want an out and out commercial movie. Avlodhan..

[Nerd]

The problem is, he is making movies on his own banner and I doubt if someone else will be dying to produce his movies. So he doesnt want to take risks therein lose all his hard-earned money :lol:

AFA KM goes, I agree that he wasnt *bold* enough in that movie. But there is a reason behind that. Remember bombay, bal thackerey and the bomb in his house ??

And he was really BOLD in iruvar, projecting PR as a not so good guy and ML as a very good guy. And common, what else do you expect ?? PR to talk in chennai thamiz, given the fact that he is well known for his tamil ?? PR did perfect justice to the role though his dialogue deliver was pathetic at times!

These movies are enough to convince myself that he is one of the best directors india has ever produced:

MR, nAyakan, thaLapathi, agni, IT, KM, rOjA and I am adding guru to the list.

And great, yes I did enjoy the climax. There is no other better way of ending the film, IMHO :)

[m_23_bayarea]

Bay :), freeya vidunga! When I see a realistic movie, I want an out and out realistic one. When I see a commercial movie, I want an out and out commercial movie. Avlodhan..

Makes sense! :D

If that was the case, Mani would not have been discussed now though .. His very skill is in mixing the two ... :)

[great]

The dialogues for Abhishek was not that powerfull could have been better.

Relaince conducts their AGM in wankhade stadium , same way film the film end with Abhishek addressing the crowd in the open ground !!!

[kannannn]

Nerd, I don't know if Karunanidhi really asks his wife 'Oru kuvaLayil kuLambi neer kondu, vaa en komaLame'. But, fair enough!! Maybe, just one of the many things we disagree on :) .

[Nerd]

kannannn: I see that scene as a *cute* scene, if you know what I mean. He wont be talking like that, *everyday*. Anyway lets move on :)

Tale of a dreamer admirably told -- Guru

http://www.hindu.com/fr/2007/01/19/stories/2007011900130200.htm

[OnMyWay]

Nerd, I don't know if Karunanidhi really asks his wife 'Oru kuvaLayil kuLambi neer kondu, vaa en komaLame'. But, fair enough!! Maybe, just one of the many things we disagree on Smile .

kulavi- tumbler
kulambi neer?

[thinkfloyd]

You should watch other pathetic attempts at terrorists movies like the latest Kabul Express. Do you exactly know what runs in the mind of a terrorist and why did he become a terrorist and things like that?

Drohkaal

[thimuru]

Nerd, I don't know if Karunanidhi really asks his wife 'Oru kuvaLayil kuLambi neer kondu, vaa en komaLame'. But, fair enough!! Maybe, just one of the many things we disagree on Smile .

kulavi- tumbler
kulambi neer?

TEA

[thinkfloyd]

About the best director, are you talking about art movies or commercial movies? There are much better directors in both formats. See that's another problem: He tries make his audience believe that he gives them the best of both worlds, which he doesn't. What we get is in contrast, a confused mix of both formats.

Anyway, all of Mani's movies are a coming together of the best. What is his director's mark? Where does his uniqueness lie?
I go with Kannannn.

[Nerd]

You should watch other pathetic attempts at terrorists movies like the latest Kabul Express. Do you exactly know what runs in the mind of a terrorist and why did he become a terrorist and things like that?

Drohkaal

Santosh sivan's terrorist is any day a better movie than DK. DK succumbed to a lot of commercial elements. The point is, no one knows a *complete* terrorist. Who knows, there may be a few good ones like what they showed in rOjA. anbE sivam dialog dhAn. "thIviravAthinA ennaya maadhiri asingamA irukkanumnu avasiyam illa". There is a flip side to everything 8-)

And one more thing is MR haters will hate guru to the core, since guru is almost a medley of a lot of his old movies 8-)

[selvakumar]

I have not seen GURU ! But just found this one on the net

http://thirumoolan.blogspot.com/2007/01/i-went-with-expectation-that.html

[nerdy]

//dig
Guys


I have created a new thread "Best Actor of the Country" in Indian Film Sections.


http://forumhub.mayyam.com/hub/viewtopic.php?t=9120

//dig

[P_R]

Iruvar: The worst thing about Iruvar is it's artificiality. I was laughing hard when Prakash Raj was mouthing dialogues in chaste Tamil to Tabu and Mohanlal. Mohanlal was the only saving grace in an otherwise forgettable movie.

Agree that dialogues (suhAsini) were very very ordinary in Iruvar. Some parts played up the word-tactics well (like the nANayathukku iraNdu pakkam by thamizchelvan in the assembly and nAn mEdai pEchALaNA by Anandhan on stage). But MR seemed to cut every scene short of its greatness (like Nasser commentiing to Prakash Rak ; unga naNbarukky makkaLai eppidi thanvasappaduthaNumnu therinjirukku. Why do you need to say those lines ? It has been mad amply clear in the scene and in the earlier scene on the roof of the house (with RahmAn in great touch). Later, the beachside conversation to Tabu was terrible in its plain-ness.



In the foreword to Sujatha's screenwriting book , MR mentions that he is forced to write because of the paucity of writers. The line you quote from Kannathil MuthamittAl is of course dumb. BombAy climax was as dumb as it gets. But it is the same man who had beautiful dialogues in several other films.

Nayagan was one of BalakumAran's finest and right till Aayitha Ezuthu MR has used Sujatha better than anyone else has.That his dialogues are too short is blown out of proportion. He wrote great dialogues in Mouna Raagam, memorable ones in AlaipAyuthE, even Roja (sujatha ?).SuhAsini had much better dialogues in Indira (MR wrote the screenplay, perhaps he wrote the dialogues too ?).
For a moment try and forget the pesky brats in Anjali (it's hard but try :-) ), the conversations between the brother and sister was really well done.

Iruvar is one of his finest films. To say MohanlAl was the only saving grace in Iruvar is unfair. PrakAsh Raj richly deserved his national award. The scene with the flower crown when the crowd rushes away when Anandan arrives, is beautiful. Even the reaction in the railway station when he is informed of Anandan's death. The scene where he butts in (before anyone else does) to tell Anandan that he had objected to his nomination. Even Ais was good - and that's no mean achievement- when she says 'adhE kaadhal varalai ?'

RahmAn was excellent. Imagine the opportunity to recreate Tamil films from ManthirikumAri to AnbE Vaa. Has he ever used ManO before/since 'aayirathil nAn oruvan ?'.

The movie did not raise important question about the Dravidian movement. Nor did it bring out the cultural impact it had, nor was the political situation analyzed (except for nAvalar RajEsh's comment on the the ubiquity of corruption). Perhaps then for all his trilogy (quadrology ?) MR isn't the kind to get you thinking about war/peace/morals etc. Iruvar was simply about the private and public lives of the duo. And that was handled pretty well.

Anyway, all of Mani's movies are a coming together of the best. What is his director's mark? Where does his uniqueness lie? I don't understand this at all. Isn't the director's job exactly about the getting the best out the team. He gets the best out of his MDs, lyricists, his actors and technicians.

And it's not as if he stuck with the same team all the time.He has worked with a variety of technicians: PC Sriram , Rajeev Menon, Santosh Sivan , Ravi K Chandran and they have all excelled in his films. ThOttA DharaNi to Sameer Chanda (imagine trusting him to recreate the Tamil milieu in Iruvar) . ARR and IR are too obvious to mention. Thalapathy and Nayagan even more. What sort of 'mark' ?

[kannannn]

PR, let me start with your last question:

Anyway, all of Mani's movies are a coming together of the best. What is his director's mark? Where does his uniqueness lie? I don't understand this at all. Isn't the director's job exactly about the getting the best out the team. He gets the best out of his MDs, lyricists, his actors and technicians.
A director's job is not only to get the best out of his team. There needs to be a special touch, a special perspective. I find that lacking in Mani's movies (atleast in the ones he made after Nayagan). I hate to do it, but I have to bring in my favourite - and incidentally Mani's too - director into the discussion: Bharatiraja. Did he have the best technicians in all his movies? He had in some, he didn't in others. But does that stop us from appreciating the way he tackles the issues? No. In fact, there is that stamp of Bharatiraja in all his movies. You still appreciate the way he makes a statement on casteism, women's liberation, unemployment or generation gap. It doesn't really matter if the songs are great. It doesn't really matter if the room is strategically lit to make it difficult for the viewers to identify the characters. Film making goes beyond these. It should make the viewers think. It should make hubbers open threads to discuss the director's perspective and hidden meanings. Even a movie like Sigappu Rojakkal has a thousand things to discuss about.

So that brings us back to the question: What is Mani's stamp? Courage? No. Subtlety and symbolism? - heck, no. We just see scenes unfold before us for 2.5 hours with good music, cinematography, editing and (sometimes) dialogues. That's about it. From my experience, the only way you can say a movie is Mani's is by the characters' half sentences and dim-lit rooms. That can hardly qualify as director's mark.


Agree that dialogues (suhAsini) were very very ordinary in Iruvar. Some parts played up the word-tactics well (like the nANayathukku iraNdu pakkam by thamizchelvan in the assembly and nAn mEdai pEchALaNA by Anandhan on stage). But MR seemed to cut every scene short of its greatness (like Nasser commentiing to Prakash Rak ; unga naNbarukky makkaLai eppidi thanvasappaduthaNumnu therinjirukku. Why do you need to say those lines ?
You hit the nail on the head. What troubled me throughout the movie was how each point was unncessarily, pain-stakingly being reinforced. For example, Prakash Raj's dialogues at the beginning ("Saanikku pottittu saami endru kumbidum..") makes it loud and clear about his views and personality. His later conversation with Mohan Lal atop the building about his political goals (which BTW was very artificial and poorly handled) again makes some of his views clear. Why the unnecessary 'Kavidhai nadai' with Revathi about how men and women are equal, on their first night?! I only felt like crying out, "Dude! We get the picture."

There is a particular scene in "Hazaron Khwaishen Aisi" that reminded me of Iruvar. Kay Kay asks Shiney Ahuja why he doesn't have any political views or ideologies, to which he replies: "Your father is a judge and you have time and money in your hands to have ideologies and fight for them. I am a simple middle class man who has to find a job to make ends meet. I can't afford to have ideologies". Contrast this with the scene where Mohan Lal informs Prakash Raj about the loss of their job. Prakash Raj waxes eloquent (again "arghhh...") about the new party and its goals, to which Mohan Lal responds in anger, explaining how his family has suffered and how all he can think about is his sustenance. The scene in HKA was simple and beautiful while the one in Iruvar was loud and artificial. I think you get the point.


To say MohanlAl was the only saving grace in Iruvar is unfair. PrakAsh Raj richly deserved his national award. The scene with the flower crown when the crowd rushes away when Anandan arrives, is beautiful. Even the reaction in the railway station when he is informed of Anandan's death. The scene where he butts in (before anyone else does) to tell Anandan that he had objected to his nomination.
The point is, such scenes are few and far between. OTOH, Mohan Lal turns in a cool, natural performance through out the movie (the scene atop the building I mentioned and the scene where he responds in anger to the director who ventures to teach him about holding the sword are but a few). BTW, according to Adoor, Mani has used Mohan Lal the best till date.


RahmAn was excellent. Imagine the opportunity to recreate Tamil films from ManthirikumAri to AnbE Vaa. Has he ever used ManO before/since 'aayirathil nAn oruvan ?'.
Absolutely agree. I rave about his music in Iruvar to my friends all the time. His genius comes through in the movie. None of the songs sound ripped off from the old ones, yet they recreate the effect of the era. I just have a small complain though. He has excessively used the BGM piece where the music rises in a crescendo, whenever there is a dramatic incident on screen.


In the foreword to Sujatha's screenwriting book , MR mentions that he is forced to write because of the paucity of writers. The line you quote from Kannathil MuthamittAl is of course dumb. BombAy climax was as dumb as it gets.
I too read about the lack of writers for Mani. But that shouldn't stop him from making movies with sensible dialogues.

That his dialogues are too short is blown out of proportion.
Strongly disagree. It irritates me when his characters mouth made-up half sentences, that fall between silent communication and full sensible phrases. I for one can't understand what does he wants to show with such dialogues?

[Rajkumar_mj]

I Saw the movie on last saturday in Albert theatre. I went to the movie with lot of expectations. But I was disappoined with the movie. :(

<IMO>
It is pretty average movie. It is not as great as his previous movies.

Madhavan,Vidhya Balan charecters were wasted .I dont understand What Mani is going to convey to people thru this movie.

I read it in some blogs Comparing Abisheks performance with Nayagan(IMO It is not the Greatest performance of KH) Kamal performance. But Abishek hasnot done 25% of what Kamal did in Nayagan.

And Vikram ,Surya ,Ajith,Madavan could have done better than Abishek.

The Climax is one of the worst thing for the film. We have seen these kind of scenes in Many movies.

Plus points are A.R.Rahman Rajiv menon and Surya's Voice. :D

Again he proved he is the one of the most hyped director of India.

</IMO>

<Dig>

Lot of Audiences appluased and whistled like anything when they seen A.R.Rahman name in Title. That is the happiest thing for me. He should do more movies in TAMIL for the fans . :D
</Dig>

[MADDY]

I Saw the movie on last saturday in Albert theatre. I went to the movie with lot of expectations. But I was disappoined with the movie. :(

<IMO>
It is pretty average movie. It is not as great as his previous movies.

Madhavan,Vidhya Balan charecters were wasted .I dont understand What Mani is going to convey to people thru this movie.

I read it in some blogs Comparing Abisheks performance with Nayagan(IMO It is not the Greatest performance of KH) Kamal performance. But Abishek hasnot done 25% of what Kamal did in Nayagan.

And Vikram ,Surya ,Ajith,Madavan could have done better than Abishek.

The Climax is one of the worst thing for the film. We have seen these kind of scenes in Many movies.

Plus points are A.R.Rahman Rajiv menon and Surya's Voice. :D

Again he proved he is the one of the most hyped director of India.

</IMO>

<Dig>

Lot of Audiences appluased and whistled like anything when they seen A.R.Rahman name in Title. That is the happiest thing for me. He should do more movies in TAMIL for the fans . :D
</Dig>

then u shuld listen to the claps that he gets in north theatres......he should go to Hindi only.......tell me one award that a tamil magazine/tamilnadu govt./tamil organisation has given ARR in the past 6-7 years??? he has much more respect and adulation in north...... 8-)

Did u see Guru in Tamil?? Hindi version was simply superb.....vintage mani.....i think he also better stay in Hindi.......nothing wrong man, these 2 can live in Chennai and still work for hindi movies..... :D ......but unfortunately both are gonna work in tamil movies and get beaten up like vadivel...... :lol:

yeanpa, neenga adikkaradha continue pannungappa......hamma,hamma......ippadiye adichu adichu odambu-ellam rana galam aaidichae pa.... :cry:

[leosimha]

Maddy....why do you say that Maniratnam and ARR are not appreciated in our Tamil Land....I think ARR and Maniratnam combo is the best....I would put this ahead than ARR+Shankar combo...hmm...by the way we shouldn't see Guru in Tamil...I don't understand why Maniratnam dubbed this movie in Tamil..The tamil movie will flop as the movie is with Mumbai/Gujarati backdrop....

[thinkfloyd]

Saying Guru is vintage Mani is tantamount to insulting Mani. He has done much better films.

Rajkumar_mj,
You haven't missed much by seeing it in Thamizh, though it would have been better in Hindi, as it would be with any dubbed movie

[thimuru]

MADDY,

WHAT SHOULD U EXPECT TAMIL PEOPLE TO DO?

GIVE THE CM POST TO ARR AND MANI?

look...its tamil people who encouraged them!

[great]

Did u see Guru in Tamil?? Hindi version was simply superb.....vintage mani.....i think he also better stay in Hindi.......nothing wrong man, these 2 can live in Chennai and still work for hindi movies..... :D ......but unfortunately both are gonna work in tamil movies and get beaten up like vadivel...... :lol:



Raj,

Even I share the same opinion go back few pages . But i really enjoyed Madhavan acting probly they should have strectched his part till climax. He was missing is the final part.

Vintage Mani for this movie :shock: :shock: :shock:

[MADDY]

Vintage Mani for this movie :shock: :shock: :shock:

yaenpa kannungala - PR,Kannan,Thinkfloyd,great,Thimuru - ippadi round katti maniratnatha thaakkareengale........avaru hindi-la dhaane padam eduthaaru......mannichi vittudunga..... :cry:

vintage mani - y not???? :?

vidya balan - Abhishek, rite from her childhood says she will marry guru, just for fun......when abhishek meets her after her marriage , she ties raakhi to abhishek......wow, that was so subtle and romantic.... :D

Ash- when the panel tells her that she would also go to jail if she accepts she is 50% partner for Guru's business for which ash replies i'm his 50% partner in life too..... :shock: .....thats mani,.,,......now ask ur selvaraghavan or cheran to bring up such emotion...... :evil:

these are just samples...... :D ......

sinthiya- thread start pannittu engama pona??? maniratnam-a oru vazhi pannitaanga......ithu thevaya?? :cry:

[Saamy]

the truth remains that Maniratnam is the most over-hyped director in India..

[MADDY]

the truth remains that Maniratnam is the most over-hyped director in India..

is he in Tamilnadu??? i guess Bharathirajan is considered the best amongst yesteryears and all these "bachhuus" in the current gen.....Mani, infact has no place in Tamil films......only his HC fans want his movies.....

[Saamy]

the truth remains that Maniratnam is the most over-hyped director in India..

is he in Tamilnadu??? i guess Bharathirajan is considered the best amongst yesteryears and all these "bachhuus" in the current gen.....Mani, infact has no place in Tamil films......only his HC fans want his movies..... yes he lives in alwarpet, chennai, tamilnadu, india.

[MADDY]

yes he lives in alwarpet, chennai, tamilnadu, india.

i asked, is he hyped by tamil media, tamil ppl. also?? :D .....i know north media go over the roof in appreciating him....

[Saamy]

yes he lives in alwarpet, chennai, tamilnadu, india.

i asked, is he hyped by tamil media, tamil ppl. also?? :D .....i know north media go over the roof in appreciating him.... the northies go over the roof, because they were only used to mediocore people. ARR and mani are good. but they hype them as greatest .. :lol: :lol:

[MADDY]

yes he lives in alwarpet, chennai, tamilnadu, india.

i asked, is he hyped by tamil media, tamil ppl. also?? :D .....i know north media go over the roof in appreciating him.... the northies go over the roof, because they were only used to mediocore people. ARR and mani are good. but they hype them as greatest .. :lol: :lol:

yes yes Mani and ARR are only good not great.....i know.... :D .....btw, northies hyped kamalhassan also to a great extent in the 80's..... :lol: .......

[Saamy]

yes he lives in alwarpet, chennai, tamilnadu, india.

i asked, is he hyped by tamil media, tamil ppl. also?? :D .....i know north media go over the roof in appreciating him.... the northies go over the roof, because they were only used to mediocore people. ARR and mani are good. but they hype them as greatest .. :lol: :lol:

yes yes Mani and ARR are only good not great.....i know.... :D .....btw, northies hyped kamalhassan also to a great extent in the 80's..... :lol: ....... yes but really, kamal is not only good but great.. 8-)

[m_23_bayarea]

yes but really, kamal is not only good but great.. 8-)

Aaandavaraeeee !!! :notworthy: :P :wink:

[hub rap]

Guru is a great movie with respect to portrayal of the director's thoughts. Had the story been more focussed on the protagonist and had not digressed to less relevant things, the movie could have very well competed with other movies of Mani. More relevant scenes, IMO, would be scenes relating to how GuruKanth Desai toiled hard to make such a vast empire and to outsmart his scourges. These scened could have been accommodated in the place of a few songs and a few romantic scenes involving madhavan and vidhya. Probably, Mani must have assumed that people know every hardship underwent by Dhirubhai and hence kept his focus only on conjuring up a climax that would lead to justifying every deed of Dhirubhai under the pretext of developing the nation.

As Mani had said, Abhisekh carries the entire film in his shoulders. Anybody could have done Aishwarya's role and would have suited better. I dont mean to say that Aishwarya bungled her job. She was too much for that role similar to Kamal in VV. IMO, Mani casted aish to reinforce his clout in the tinsel town and to rub salts on the wounds of Shankar and Rajini. The dialogues were spot on and a perfect Gujarathi slang was as good as the Bengali slang perfectly captured in Yuva (especially Om Puri's).

Well, am surprised at nobody mentioning about the irritatingly shaky and hazy camera work at the initial part of the movie. Rajiv menon had said that it was to represent the ebullience of the youth. The camera gets steady as guru progresses with age. Is it really necessary to shake the cameras to reinforce that gurukanth is young and energetic? The sets of bombay looked great. Though there was a scene where abhisekh talks with mithun with a lot of high-rise buildings in the background. i suspect if such building existed in the late sixties. And no wonder, Mani will stick with Rahman.

[hub rap]

2. The initial tussle between Aish and Abhi was made up just for the tere bina song and abhi did not even try to explain his stance on that matter.

I feel there was nothing to explain there. Both knew there was true love between them. Though, as always, a few truths hurt and humans react well before they could think. Aish leaves, repents in solitude and forgives him when he comes back.



4. Dialogues, though powerful most of the times (especially the 5 minutes thing) was not so good in a few scenes.
if you could, quote a few pls.

[hub rap]

But the point is there are better movies than nAyakan which could not find a place in the Time's list :(

Good Point Nerd :thumbsup: . We dont need lesser related critics to tell us how great/or not our movies are. We always knew nayagan is great. There wouldnt have been any disappointment even if nayagan couldnt have found a place in the Times' list or Dil Se not entering the UK top ten. Though, we cant hide our happiness when our movies find a spot(global recognition) they deserve.

[Rajkumar_mj]

yes he lives in alwarpet, chennai, tamilnadu, india.

i asked, is he hyped by tamil media, tamil ppl. also?? :D .....i know north media go over the roof in appreciating him.... the northies go over the roof, because they were only used to mediocore people. ARR and mani are good. but they hype them as greatest .. :lol: :lol:

yes yes Mani and ARR are only good not great.....i know.... :D .....btw, northies hyped kamalhassan also to a great extent in the 80's..... :lol: .......

//dig
Maddy

Please don't pull Kamal here. We have a lot of threads. You can bash him there.

BTW-> Kamal was not hyped to great Extent as you said. But Nothies Made him to quit Bollywood because of Fear. He doesn't need any hype.

//dig

[P_R]

In fact, there is that stamp of Bharatiraja in all his movies. You still appreciate the way he makes a statement on casteism, women's liberation, unemployment or generation gap. Am not sure if this is a proper yardstick at all. But when barathiraja sets out to 'say' something he becomes less of what I like him for.

For instance in NizhalgaL. The role played by RajashEkar was really memorable but the dialgues spoken (for instance when his friends desert him) let down the whole thing. Atleast with MR you know that he is trying to be clever with the lines. With BR it is bad because he earnestly means those lines.

I won't even talk about NizalgaL Ravi's romantic (!) sequences. MR would have definitely written and exectuted the scenes much much better. Am too pained to dwell on the tubby angels accompanying Chandrashekar in madai thiranthu. To borrow your expression, IR was the saving grace of NizhalgaL.

Ironic as it is, BR the groundbreaker can't resist a cliche. PudumaippeN is my least favourite film (wait, that's gaptun's thamizhchelvan).VEdam Pudhidhu is appealing not just because he had something to say , but because he said it well. After that all movies had tumbling brass pots.

BR is at his finest when he is out to tell a story. Melodrama notwithstanding Kizakku CheemaiyilE is bang of target in terms of locale. And it's not just because it was his neck of the woods. Very few movies have brought out Madras kuppams like En uyir ThOzhan. But I hate it when the yellow letters with his voice-over ends the film (with his anbudan signature). What kind of understanding of film is that ? It worked once in 16 VayathinilE and En uyir thozan (vidai thanthAl vidiyumA, vidindhAl vidai varumA) but it has ruined many (nizalgaL, vedam puthithu etc)


MR has never made a downright terrible film. Yes he has gone about explaining stuff, not trusting the viewer to make sense of the subtleties, dumb dialogues. But the disappointment has always been that the movie could have been much better or that his climaxes are cop-outs (though more variety than the invariably deathly climaxes of BR).

But BR has messed up more movies (on a per good movie basis) than MR has. He has made too many unbearably ordinary films with no 'marks' whatseover.If you imply 'mark' as a continuous pattern running all through all the works I don't quite agree such a thing is necessary at all.

MR's mark, as I see it, has been to push the cart further from where BR brought, by a greater emphasis to visual storytelling. His lasting contribution would be raising the bar on the content we see on screen. I felt in the middle of the riot in Bombay (though by the climax I also wished I had a cudgel) , I felt soaking wet watching andhi mazhai mEgam, could feel the sparks fly when the camera circumambulates the meeting between SuryA-DEvA and the collector.


It irritates me when his characters mouth made-up half sentences, that fall between silent communication and full sensible phrases. I for one can't understand what does he wants to show with such dialogues? Well let me rephrase. With the kind of emphasis that's been given to MR's 'crisp' dialogues, it is made to look as if all the characters in all his films speak that way. That is not true. Again I'd bring up the example of alaipAyuthE. The scene where Pyramid Natarajan visits Shalini's house is extremely well written. Usually Tamil cinema formula where the rich baddie is all overt about his prejudices or is overflowing with the milk pf human kindness. MR portrayed him (as well his proudly insecure opposite number) extremely well as the friction develops when the conversation proceeds. Such things are forgotten and MR is always remembered for "Yen ?" "DevA !". That is unfortunate.
yaenpa kannungala - PR,Kannan,Thinkfloyd,great,Thimuru - ippadi round katti maniratnatha thaakkareengale........ thAkkinEnA ? :roll: I thought I had just painstakingly defended Iruvar, which was no mean achievement (I mean the movie not my defence :P)

[hub rap]

[quote]trust me, i wont kill my father for having a second wife.... :lol: ......i would embrace that family too......dont u guys think so?? (hope my son also doesent mind infidelity :wink: )
idharkku paer dhaan tholai nokku paarvaiyo?


mani is making one more Hindi movie after Lajjo and is set to retire after that/....... :lol: ........we(TF) guys have already lost him.....u have btter people, dont worry..... :D ......
No hint of retirement from mani. In fact he sounded like he has just entered the film industry and had said "i would never get bored of film making" courtesy - CNNibn interview.

"btw, dubbing Guru in Tamil is a mistake......."
i couldnt bear the lyrics of "rendu maanga doi". there was a desperate attempt to make a literal translation from hindi. sounded very awkward.

[hub rap]

That's the reason some of his films have the most inexplicably dumb and simplistic endings - Roja, Bombay and now, Guru.

I will just take this sentance.

Bombay climax was pathetic and you ve hit the bulls eye :)

I dont know how else to end rOjA and guru. Lets take guru for example. How will you suggest MR to have ended that film ?? Seeing gurubhai dying with a background song similar to thenpANdi ?? IMHO, the climax saved the otherwise dull second half.

Well, then you are supposed to give an alternate climax for bombay.

[hub rap]

Nerd, I don't know if Karunanidhi really asks his wife 'Oru kuvaLayil kuLambi neer kondu, vaa en komaLame'. But, fair enough!! Maybe, just one of the many things we disagree on Smile .

kulavi- tumbler
kulambi neer?

kulavi :?: :rotfl: no explanation needed... obviously a typo.

[hub rap]

RahmAn was excellent. Imagine the opportunity to recreate Tamil films from ManthirikumAri to AnbE Vaa. Has he ever used ManO before/since 'aayirathil nAn oruvan ?'.
Mano had sung three beautiful songs for thiruda thiruda - kannum kannum, veerapaandi and putham pudhu bhoomi.

[kannannn]

Am not sure if this is a proper yardstick at all. But when barathiraja sets out to 'say' something he becomes less of what I like him for.
I know it is not a proper yardstick, but I mentioned Bharatiraja only in the context of director's 'mark'. It could be any other director (even Balachandar, not my favourite, has his 'mark').


For instance in NizhalgaL. The role played by RajashEkar was really memorable but the dialgues spoken (for instance when his friends desert him) let down the whole thing. Atleast with MR you know that he is trying to be clever with the lines. With BR it is bad because he earnestly means those lines.
Nizhalgal is a good example, because it is not BR's best. But the movie is intersperced with fine gems. Let me quote a few: the scene where the heroine (buying vegetables) finds out that Ravi was after all not making gestures at her but was calling for tea from the road-side shop. As she smiles in embarrassment, the weighting scales even out, suggesting a change in her assessment of him. The college student running along the sea shore is a recurring theme in the movie, referring to his love for nature and his desire to be free. This aspect is further brought out when his college teacher lectures him on the importance of attending class, simultaneously plucking off the petals from the plant nearby. The student is no longer paying attention to him but is infuriated by the teacher's lack of respect for nature, and finally slaps him. This single scene describes what is in the mind of BR. No college education can teach you to admire and respect nature. And the student has learnt the greatest lesson in life inspite of being a truant. One can go on and on, but I'll stop here, lest the thread turns into a BR retrospective. So, most movies of BR have something hidden that requires to be pulled out, analyzed and fitted with the rest of the movie.

I won't even talk about NizalgaL Ravi's romantic (!) sequences. MR would have definitely written and exectuted the scenes much much better. Am too pained to dwell on the tubby angels accompanying Chandrashekar in madai thiranthu.
That particular romantic scene was meant to be raw. It didn't have a well dressed hero speaking smart pick-up lines, but if it did, it wouldn't have fitted into the movie. That's the way the characters are. Notwithstanding this fact, I do accept that Mani does a great job in romantic sequences, but even there, he can't stretch it into a full-length romantic movie (Idhayathai Thirudadhey being the case in point).

I must also accept that BR does a tacky job of his songs. But then, I am against songs in movies anyway, so it doesn't matter.

The point I am trying to convey is, even in a movie like Nizhalgal his realism stands out. I find that lacking in Mani's movies.


MR has never made a downright terrible film. Yes he has gone about explaining stuff, not trusting the viewer to make sense of the subtleties, dumb dialogues. But the disappointment has always been that the movie could have been much better or that his climaxes are cop-outs (though more variety than the invariably deathly climaxes of BR).
That's exactly what I don't want in a movie. Even Bhagyaraj has, in his peak given consistently enjoyable, rooted-to-the-soil, realistic movies. But that doesn't make him a better director that BR.


With the kind of emphasis that's been given to MR's 'crisp' dialogues, it is made to look as if all the characters in all his films speak that way. That is not true. Again I'd bring up the example of alaipAyuthE. The scene where Pyramid Natarajan visits Shalini's house is extremely well written. Usually Tamil cinema formula where the rich baddie is all overt about his prejudices or is overflowing with the milk pf human kindness. MR portrayed him (as well his proudly insecure opposite number) extremely well as the friction develops when the conversation proceeds. Such things are forgotten and MR is always remembered for "Yen ?" "DevA !". That is unfortunate.[
Hmm.. It is embarrasing to say this, but I will anyway. I found Alai Payuthe to be 'cute' and the dialogues good but only till a certain stage. He seemed to have reverted back to his old self after the lead pair moved into the half-built apartment (perhaps, Sujatha washing his hands off midway contributed to this?).

Anyway, let me sum up my view: Mani's movies have high production values, great acting and in some cases good dialogues. But they are never fulfilling and never offer realistic solutions. They also have some good moments in them, but I feel they are there just to cheat the viewers, intersperced among his usual aesthetically pleasing songs and extraordinary situations. Take these out and I don't think Mani will command the respect he does today.

[thinkfloyd]

yaenpa kannungala - PR,Kannan,Thinkfloyd,great,Thimuru - ippadi round katti maniratnatha thaakkareengale........avaru hindi-la dhaane padam eduthaaru......mannichi vittudunga..... :cry:


Now this is getting irritating. You seem to take every issue personally. ARR, Kamal, Gautham, Mani....
Pl read Prabhu's post again mine too. How does it matter whether Mani makes a film in Hindi or Tulu??? You are hell bent on slotting people under one category according to your whim and fancy. Where is the Tamil vs Hindi thing here you seem very eager to create?
I said i didn't find Guru impressive at all and that he has made better films than this. The forum is about discussing what we like or what we don't like in films and this thread is about Mani's new releases. Where's the Tamil Hindi connection here? If you disagree with my points or Kannan's please state so and respond to the issues instead of making it a regional, linguistic or personal issue.

BTW, what makes you think 'we' shouldn't comment on Mani's films because "avaru Hindi la dhaane padam edukkararu"?? Kuthagaikku eduthirukeengala?

[kannannn]

thinkfloyd, very well put!! I wish people would answer the concerns and put forth their point of view like Nerd or PR. Else, how can one understand what is on the mind of hubbers like MADDY?! If one thinks a director is great, it is only natural that they give reasons for the same. Simple as that.

[Nerd]

That his dialogues are too short is blown out of proportion.
Strongly disagree. It irritates me when his characters mouth made-up half sentences, that fall between silent communication and full sensible phrases. I for one can't understand what does he wants to show with such dialogues?

I will just take this point. I am a big fan of MR dialgues (or whoever that writes in a MR movie). Lets keep iruvar aside for sometime (havent seen it lately). Lets take thaLapathi. Deva would ask one of his men to surrender to Rajini out of the jail. Rajini would be perplexed and would not know whats going on.

He asks, yen

The other guy replies deva

Now thats brilliant, aint it :P

Dialogues in thaLapthi are one of his best, if not THE best. Even in dil se (one of his less acclaimed works), the dialogues were top-notch. I was not very impressed with the dialogues in his latest guru though.

You don't need pages of dialogues and BR (I like him more than MR, btw) would milk the situation with excessive dialogues and sometimes his protoganist keeps talking for no apparent reason. (e.g. kizhakku cheemayilE, vijayakumar the thaaimaaman thing. Give it a break, dude :) )

kannannn talked about the director's touch. Common, some of BR's so called touches (or you can hail them as subtleties) are irritating to say the least (angels flying, sea waves, birds flying et all)

And MR is very good in dealing with relations, though many would disagree with me on this:
- Anjali and her family . Anjali and Prabhu
- simran and her adopted child
- rOja and rishi
- Manisha and arvind (Bombay first half was kickass)
- velu nayakkar and his daughter/son
- I guess I dont have to talk about mouna raagam here.

Also MR does not make you think once you come out of the theatre (You can actually count the number of mainstream TAMIL MOVIES that makes you think).

To sum up, MR is great because
- He makes a movie that is gripping till the end
- His movies are technically spectacular
- The cast churn out amazing performances
- He often writes awesome dialogues
- He is very good at portraying a complex relation
- He is versataile

I might have missed some and might have exaggerated some :)

[NOV]

the truth remains that Maniratnam is the most over-hyped director in India..but the absolute truth is that Maniratnam has no competition and is the best director of current times, at least as far as India is concerned!

[Surya]

the truth remains that Maniratnam is the most over-hyped director in India..but the absolute truth is that Maniratnam has no competition and is the best director of current times, at least as far as India is concerned!


YEA-UH!!!!! :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:

[m_23_bayarea]

but the absolute truth is that Maniratnam has no competition and is the best director of current times, at least as far as India is concerned!

Yay Baby! :boo: :redjump:

[Saamy]

the truth remains that Maniratnam is the most over-hyped director in India..but the absolute truth is that Maniratnam has no competition and is the best director of current times, at least as far as India is concerned! Yes. U just proved my statement. :lol:

[MADDY]

//dig
Maddy

Please don't pull Kamal here. We have a lot of threads. You can bash him there.

BTW-> Kamal was not hyped to great Extent as you said. But Nothies Made him to quit Bollywood because of Fear. He doesn't need any hype.

//dig

where did i bash kamal here??? :shock: :shock: .....this is getting crazy........if u guys want me to stop typing the word "Kamal" then i wont......please tell me wat else u need from me.....i stopped coming into kamal threads long back.....and i refrain from referring to kamal in my posts........damn, still i get faulted by u guys.... :?

btw, ppl. who are bashing mani here seem to be ur guy's fans only.... :evil:

[kb]

his versality is :notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy:

from love in alaipayuthu,mouna raagam
patriotism in roja,uyirae
religion in bombay
childishness in anjali, kannathil muththamittal
hatred in agninatchathiram
untouchabiliy in indhira
friendship and mother-son senti in thalapathy
selfconfidence- GURU

sho abba ippave kanna kattuthey..

oru manushan ivlo va deep-a think panrathu..

he became so classy that people think its proud or dignity to say maniratnam is their fav director

[P_R]

Nizhalgal is a good example, because it is not BR's best. But the movie is intersperced with fine gems. Let me quote a few: the scene where the heroine (buying vegetables) finds out that Ravi was after all not making gestures at her but was calling for tea from the road-side shop. As she smiles in embarrassment, the weighting scales even out, suggesting a change in her assessment of him. The college student running along the sea shore is a recurring theme in the movie, referring to his love for nature and his desire to be free. This aspect is further brought out when his college teacher lectures him on the importance of attending class, simultaneously plucking off the petals from the plant nearby. The student is no longer paying attention to him but is infuriated by the teacher's lack of respect for nature, and finally slaps him. This single scene describes what is in the mind of BR. No college education can teach you to admire and respect nature. And the student has learnt the greatest lesson in life inspite of being a truant. Hmmm....true. Perhaps I haven't watched it that carefully (like the scales stuff). But the 'jobs jobs' chant during the titles is as subtle as pronouncing the b is subtle.

I still feel the RajshEkar bit only almost there (if at all). I remember one more nice scene in the park where he is matching the swaras to the plant and smiling to himself at his own discovery. But lines like "nAn pAdangaLai vida padangaLai thAn virumbirEn" has a nails-on-the-blackboard effect on me. "Why did you say that ? :evil:". So the charges against MR apply to BR too, sometimes in greater measure.


Dialogues in thaLapthi are one of his best, if not THE best. Even in dil se (one of his less acclaimed works), the dialogues were top-notch. I was not very impressed with the dialogues in his latest guru though. I like the dialogues in ThalApathi but not the artificially laconic "yEn / dEva" but the other ones.
Most importantly the ordinary lines are made to stand out by amazing delivery and intonation (thappu paNNAn adichEn......pOyittAn :clap:). That is the film dialogue for you. Not quotable quotes that mean weighty things outside contexts too. But lines that make you feel the character. That's the mark of good direction. You really feel it when MAdhavan says "unakku velai EdhudA kaNNu?" in Kannathil MuthamittAl.

I consider 16 vayathinilE a landmark and BR the biggest pathbreaker. His contribution to Tamil storytelling is historic. But Unlike either kannannn or Nerd I am not able to say for sure that I prefer BR to MR, simply because of the complete lack of consistency in BR's filmography. BR lost it long back. In fact, I'd consider the long speeches by VijayakumAr atypical of BR style. But considering he's made half a dozen dumb films after that I am no longer sure what is typical BR ? Do I just pick out his early good movies and forget he made Thamizhchelvan,Captain MagaL, eera nilam ?

If MR disappoints me, that's because, cliched as it sounds I expect much. Was disappointed with Aayitha Ezuthu but I'd still call it a pretty noble attempt. Naive, yes. Bad, definitely not. Haven't seen Guru yet. But I am sure I will. Very likely to watch Lajjo too. But am not interested in the new BR-Nana PatEkar film or BR's dream project Kutraparambarai. The guy is a perungAya dabbA.

[selvakumar]

selva

what a dialogue that is :clap: in ur sign!

and remember the scene when kalaingar says "thamizh muthanmaya irukanum etc"....lal replies with "yelllaarum nalla irukanum.....saapidillama yaarum kashtapadakoodadhu"

:clap:

Indeed Vikki. I love some of the dialogues in "IruvaR" very much. I still remember the dialogue that you have mentioned. When PrakaashRaj speaks about love towards language, policy etc LAL simply replies his inner desire. "Yellaaarum nalla irukanum.. saapidaaama yaarum kashtapadakoodaadhu". I simply love that sequence very much. :clap:
Credit goes to MANI and Suhashini (dialogues).

I wouldn't say that IRUVAR was a classic now. (after having watched teh movie more than 20 times). But it has lot of scenes that make you sit and watch it for 3 hours continously. The "Feel" that it provides is simply superb.

I love "Agni Natchathiram" as well. :clap: I have copies of both these movies. I have watched both of them many times. :)

[thimuru]

yes he lives in alwarpet, chennai, tamilnadu, india.

i asked, is he hyped by tamil media, tamil ppl. also?? :D .....i know north media go over the roof in appreciating him....


look....tamil media had been prasing for decades...he was full of praises....so when he makes a movie here with his old style how will it impress!

whats the difference between love he showed in mouna ragam,agni natchathiram upto surya-love sequance in aayudha ezhuthu?

20 varushama ore maadhiri making paathu inga makalukku bore adichu pochu....its cute...OK....but in all movies???


avaru style-a paathu paathu bore adichu pochu....but for northies its new

infact tamil people and media has praised him a lot!

those hindi wallahs gave him only 60-70% opening....in chennai it got 100% opening...chumma thulla koodadhu

[MADDY]

yaenpa kannungala - PR,Kannan,Thinkfloyd,great,Thimuru - ippadi round katti maniratnatha thaakkareengale........avaru hindi-la dhaane padam eduthaaru......mannichi vittudunga..... :cry:


Now this is getting irritating. You seem to take every issue personally. ARR, Kamal, Gautham, Mani....
Pl read Prabhu's post again mine too. How does it matter whether Mani makes a film in Hindi or Tulu??? You are hell bent on slotting people under one category according to your whim and fancy. Where is the Tamil vs Hindi thing here you seem very eager to create?
I said i didn't find Guru impressive at all and that he has made better films than this. The forum is about discussing what we like or what we don't like in films and this thread is about Mani's new releases. Where's the Tamil Hindi connection here? If you disagree with my points or Kannan's please state so and respond to the issues instead of making it a regional, linguistic or personal issue.

BTW, what makes you think 'we' shouldn't comment on Mani's films because "avaru Hindi la dhaane padam edukkararu"?? Kuthagaikku eduthirukeengala?

thinkfloyd, the "microscopic" analysis carried out here of Mani's faults is pretty irritating..........we all know that the sensilbilities should be a bit low when movies are made in hindi.......i agree with most of points on Iruvar which is a tamil film and which was a pretty lack lustre film.......thats wat i meant here......i dunno y u r jumping on me like this??? :? .....i never meant to cause any linguistic or regional fight here......

what i mean to say is, Mani has done many mistakes but it irritates me to the core when his mistakes are pointed in a never-seen-before-zeal and enthusiasm......

btw, i'm quitting, i cant do justice to my maniratnam support this way (working 14 hrs/day in the office :evil: ).....if any maniratnam fan cares to answer these "mountains of accusations" on him, they'll have my heartiest congratulations...... :x

[thinkfloyd]

Relax Maddy,
This is getting recursive :)
I'm not jumping on you. On the contrary, my point is that you should NOT think 'we' are jumping on you or Mani or ARR. You seem to think 'we' are against them and Hindi or whatever.
I never 'bashed' Mani, as you say. Just had some criticisms. That's it.
Peace

[Saamy]

yes he lives in alwarpet, chennai, tamilnadu, india.

i asked, is he hyped by tamil media, tamil ppl. also?? :D .....i know north media go over the roof in appreciating him....


look....tamil media had been prasing for decades...he was full of praises....so when he makes a movie here with his old style how will it impress!

whats the difference between love he showed in mouna ragam,agni natchathiram upto surya-love sequance in aayudha ezhuthu?

20 varushama ore maadhiri making paathu inga makalukku bore adichu pochu....its cute...OK....but in all movies???


avaru style-a paathu paathu bore adichu pochu....but for northies its new

infact tamil people and media has praised him a lot!

those hindi wallahs gave him only 60-70% opening....in chennai it got 100% opening...chumma thulla koodadhu well said thimuru..

in places like mumbai and delhi it got only 25 to 30% opening.. :lol:

[thinkfloyd]

That's a good point thimiru.
Maddy,
For all your cribbing about TN giving Mani a raw deal, the best business for Guru is in the South. Its the South which ahs come to the rescue :)

[selvakumar]

I wantted to comment on these things a bit. But staying away :yessir:

Bala,
It is unfair to say that "Mani is overhyped" when we can find faults in his narration. Even I had a similar opinion that - Mani is not great compared to the likes of SR, Bala, SJS etc sometime back ! May be - I decided these things after watching very few movies of Mani.

Presently, he is the best among the current directors and that is pretty acceptable. Mani had done great films in the past. Much like how our young directors are doing. "We need to wait and see how our present directors give movies after 5 to 10 films and then arrive at a conclusion". I think no one will deny the fact that Mani is currently the NO.1 when it comes to *directors*.

I have not yet seen GURU. But heard that it is much better when compared to AE, Iruvar etc :) Not sure though. Guess - Mani started crippling with AE. I was :evil: when I watched the film. A bit of "Manda Kaanchu PoNa" effect and the "feel good" factor that was present in "Iruvar" was missing and the characters looked :evil:

OTOH, There are much better movies like "Agni Natchathiram", "Mouna Raagam" etc from Mani :wink: He had used the same style of narration in those movies and thus carving a unique style for himself. I don't have any problem with the "short dialogues", "partial narration" etc though ! :)

[leosimha]

Tomorrow evening 6:40 PM @ PVR, Forum Mall, Bangalore, I am going to watch Guru in Hindi.....

[great]

thinkfloyd, the "microscopic" analysis carried out here of Mani's faults is pretty irritating..........we all know that the sensilbilities should be a bit low when movies are made in hindi.......i

what i mean to say is, Mani has done many mistakes but it irritates me to the core when his mistakes are pointed in a never-seen-before-zeal and enthusiasm......



Chill out Maddy, even we like Mani but doesnt mean we should not give opinion on his movies . Regarding Microscopic analysis we havent done that . sample peace "why is the south indian temple gopuram seen once in while . Northie temple doesnot have such huge Gopurams :P "

Between no one will go indepth analysis for small director or actors. Get that point first !!!

[Thirumaran]

Between no one will go indepth analysis for small director or actors. Get that point first !!!

:exactly:

We should be taking in the +ve way that Mani's movies are looked with more critical eyes. :)

[Nakeeran]

Between no one will go indepth analysis for small director or actors. Get that point first !!!

:exactly:

We should be taking in the +ve way that Mani's movies are looked with more critical eyes. :)

Indha comment enna oru fellow hubbera solreengalaa alladhu oru Moderatora solreegalaa THiru M ? :wink: :D

Forget it. Mani R is one of the very best of tamil cinema directors till date. Many subjects that he had touched were all well handled

say Mouna ragam ( excellent work on human behavioural science )
Roja ( kashmir issue )
Dil se ( North eastern border issue )
Mumbai ( Mumbai riots / Babri masjid )
Alai payuthe ( love before marriage and after )
Kannathil muthamitaal ( no need to mention )

Ennum vera ennayaa vendum to prove his class ? :)

[Thirumaran]

Indha comment enna oru fellow hubbera solreengalaa alladhu oru Moderatora solreegalaa THiru M ? :wink: :D


Ippoathaikku fellow hubbera thaan sonnaen. :roll:

Naan sonnatha yaarum appreciate pannalainaa Moderatoraa sollvaen :twisted:

JK.. :oops:

[Thirumaran]

Indha comment enna oru fellow hubbera solreengalaa alladhu oru Moderatora solreegalaa THiru M ? :wink: :D


Ippoathaikku fellow hubbera thaan sonnaen. :roll:

Naan sonnatha yaarum appreciate pannalainaa Moderatoraa sollvaen :twisted:

JK.. :oops:

[kannannn]

Ghatham, Ghatham.. PEACE OUT GUYS!! My points were just to prove that he is/was not the BEST director in India as is made out to be. And I thought I should spell out the reasons why I thought so. Continue with Mani's Guru.. I will join when I have watched it.


BR lost it long back. In fact, I'd consider the long speeches by VijayakumAr atypical of BR style. But considering he's made half a dozen dumb films after that I am no longer sure what is typical BR ? Do I just pick out his early good movies and forget he made Thamizhchelvan,Captain MagaL, eera nilam ?
Sadly, I have to agree. There is no question that BR has lost it long back. But it happens to even the best (Woody Allen is a shadow of his former self).

[VENKIRAJA]

I wantted to comment on these things a bit. But staying away :yessir:

Bala,
It is unfair to say that "Mani is overhyped" when we can find faults in his narration. Even I had a similar opinion that - Mani is not great compared to the likes of SR, Bala, SJS etc sometime back ! May be - I decided these things after watching very few movies of Mani.

Presently, he is the best among the current directors and that is pretty acceptable. Mani had done great films in the past. Much like how our young directors are doing. "We need to wait and see how our present directors give movies after 5 to 10 films and then arrive at a conclusion". I think no one will deny the fact that Mani is currently the NO.1 when it comes to *directors*.

I have not yet seen GURU. But heard that it is much better when compared to AE, Iruvar etc :) Not sure though. Guess - Mani started crippling with AE. I was :evil: when I watched the film. A bit of "Manda Kaanchu PoNa" effect and the "feel good" factor that was present in "Iruvar" was missing and the characters looked :evil:

OTOH, There are much better movies like "Agni Natchathiram", "Mouna Raagam" etc from Mani :wink: He had used the same style of narration in those movies and thus carving a unique style for himself. I don't have any problem with the "short dialogues", "partial narration" etc though ! :)

iruvar is a great movie from mani i thought.it didnt do weel in Bo though it had a very good script.except double aish,everything was good.uh oh!expalain plz why iruvar didnt interest u selva...

[Nerd]

i agree with most of points on Iruvar which is a tamil film and which was a pretty lack lustre film......

you say WHAT ??

Iruvar is a tamil film and it was a lackluster film, is it?? :shock:

All his hindi movies are worse than most of his tam movies and iruvar is better than all of this hindi/bilinguals :twisted:

[atqsar72]

I read in KUMUDAM interview Mani is going to join hands with IR very soon. Is that true..?

[buddysathi]

Only When Hell Freezes..

[MADDY]

http://www.indiafm.com/movies/boxoffice/12838/index.html

Guru is a hit..... 8-) .......considering only 15 crores was the expenditure.......

i stick to my arguement that still Mumbai is Mani's stronghold and not chennai..... 8-) ........this time with link...

Mumbai - 4.4 crores + 2.4 crores
Chennai - 32 lakhs+ no data available for 2nd week(which means nuthing substantial)

(P.S: this is a trend that mani is doing better in north and not any source of regional divide) :roll:

[thimuru]

http://www.indiafm.com/movies/boxoffice/12838/index.html

Guru is a hit..... 8-) .......considering only 15 crores was the expenditure.......

i stick to my arguement that still Mumbai is Mani's stronghold and not chennai..... 8-) ........this time with link...

Mumbai - 4.4 crores + 2.4 crores
Chennai - 32 lakhs+ no data available for 2nd week(which means nuthing substantial)

(P.S: this is a trend that mani is doing better in north and not any source of regional divide) :roll:

enna nakkala.hindhila padam eduthutu tamil naatu collectionoda compare pannnaa epdi?

compare regarding opening man

[MADDY]

compare regarding opening man

u mean to compare opening of :

tamil guru and Hindi guru in chennai?? or
Hindi guru in mumbai with tamil guru in chennai?? or
Hindi guru in mumbai with Hindi guru in chennai??

:? ...........kova padama badhil sollunga... :D

[leosimha]

But I feel Guru is an average movie....going to watch Guru today evening....

[MADDY]

But I feel Guru is an average movie....going to watch Guru today evening....

Prejudging will spoil ur opinion...... :D .......anyways just see and write ur view here......

i wanted a commercially successful movie for mani....he has got it atlast..... 8-)

[leosimha]

But I feel Guru is an average movie....going to watch Guru today evening....

Prejudging will spoil ur opinion...... :D .......anyways just see and write ur view here......

i wanted a commercially successful movie for mani....he has got it atlast..... 8-)

will see and surely post my views.....yes if it is a commercial movie...then mani shouldn't have gone for the dubbed version in tamil...he should have gone for remaking it in tamil with tamil style...anyways...all for good...

[thimuru]

MADDY,

endha mozhiya irundhalum abishek is a non tamil actor and the film got good response here due to respect for mani

[leosimha]

MADDY,

endha mozhiya irundhalum abishek is a non tamil actor and the film got good response here due to respect for mani

might be...but people would love to hear ARR songs also...and when ASH is there...thats also one more plus apart from ARR...

[MADDY]

MADDY,

endha mozhiya irundhalum abishek is a non tamil actor and the film got good response here due to respect for mani

appadi irundha romba sandhosham dhaan.... :D ......north or south Mani is the best-unnu peru vaanguna adhu enakku sandhosham dhaan..... 8-)

[Scale]

the truth remains that Maniratnam is the most over-hyped director in India..but the absolute truth is that Maniratnam has no competition and is the best director of current times, at least as far as India is concerned!

:omg: :shaking:

[NOV]

Did you know that....

Maniratnam's real name is G. Subramaniam ?

He was born on June 2, 1956 in Madurai, Tamil Nadu,

Family consists of father: "Venus" Gopalratnam, brothers: G. Venkateswaran, G. Srinivasan

Married to actress Suhashini daughter of Charuhasan and has a son, Nanda

Studied in Vidya Mandir School, Chennai and obtained a degree in commerce from Madras University and an MBA from the Jamnalal Bajaj Institute of Management Studies, Mumbai.

Has worked as a Management consultant?

[NOV]

How others see him...

Suhashini : Mani is the best thing to have happened to me

Madhavan: To act in Mani's film is a demanding job

Abhishek bachan: I do not have enough words to explain the experience of working with someone like Mani.

Simran: Mani Ratnam is so organized.

Aishwarya: Mani Sir is an institution.

Balu Mahendra: His enthusiasm is infectious.

Rajiv menon: Mani Ratnam is a perfectionist.

[NOV]

Some amazing facts....

* Nayagan, listed in of the 100 movies of TIME magazine

* Kannathil Muthmital bagged 5 national awards

* Dil Se, first Hindi movie released in London

* Has no previous experience in the film industry before becoming a director

* His wife Suhasini is the niece of actor Kamalahasan

* He has never shot a single frame in a foreign locale for his all film

* Has worked with best cinematographers like P.C.Sriram, SantoshSivan, RajivMenon, and Balu Mahendra.

* Most of his films have been seen in both North and South India.

[NOV]

Awards and Recognition

* Pallavi Anupallavi: Karnataka State Award- Best Screenplay

* Mouna Ragam: National Award for Best Regional Film.

* Gitanjali: Best Picture Providing Wholesome Entertainment - Andhra Pradesh State "Nandi" Award

* Anjali: National Award- Best Regional Film

* Roja: National Award - Best Film on National Integration

* Bombay: Best Film on National Integration
Best Director - Filmfare Awards,1996:
Best Director - Cinema Express - 16th Annual Awards - 1995

* Kannathil Muthamittal : Best Director - Cinema Express Award,
Best Director - Film Fare Awards and
Best Director - Swarna Kamal Award

* Received the Padma Shri award from the President of India in 2002

[joe]

* He has never shot a single frame in a foreign locale for his all film

:shock:

Kannathil Muthamittal didn't shoot in Srilanka?

[great]

* He has never shot a single frame in a foreign locale for his all film

:shock:

Kannathil Muthamittal didn't shoot in Srilanka?

Nope that was set !!!

Guru was shot in Turkey.

[joe]

* He has never shot a single frame in a foreign locale for his all film

:shock:

Kannathil Muthamittal didn't shoot in Srilanka?

Nope that was set !!!


You mean the Budtha statue and huge falls are sets? :shock:

[Sinthiya]

Nope that was set !!!
:o ..really? it can't be....there were very few shots that i could recognize.... :roll: ....

NOV...thanks for all this information! :clap:

[villan007]

Nope that was set !!!

Guru was shot in Turkey.

not even a single scene shot in SL ? :shock:

[great]

I remember, Sabhu cyril once mentioned that buddha statue they have created.

[villan007]

yea that falls and the statue were sets... :)

aana matha scenes :?

[NOV]

I think they meant it as foreign localities for song sequences....

[great]

yea that falls and the statue were sets... :)

aana matha scenes :?

:? they would have put sets near the sea shore . But for Mani, they say Guru is the first movie to shot in foreign location :?

[selvakumar]

http://charuonline.com/kp233.html

:clap: :notworthy:

Friends, I have watched GURU already :wink: ! It is one of the "Feel Good" movies from Mani ! :clap: Didn't find time to post the review. But I thought of posting the same after watching it couple of more times :wink:

Finally, Mani had convinced one of the harsh reviewers. ( Charu )

[thimuru]

selva...charu is one funny guy

agni natchathiramnu oru padam vandhadhe theriyadham?

nayagan padame paakalayam...

ennangada deii....

[selvakumar]

Vikki, I agree he is a "different" person with strange policies and personal values.
But this is the first time I see him appreciating him, I believe :wink:

[thimuru]

Vikki, I agree he is a "different" person with strange policies and personal values.
But this is the first time I see him appreciating him, I believe :wink:

yeah..infact Im surprised greatly...

[Ramakrishna]

Mani makes money!
By Moviebuzz | Friday, 02 March , 2007, 13:06

Mani Ratnam's Guru is celebrating 50 days run today. Though Bollywood trade is reluctant to admit that the film is a hit, it is the first hit of the year.

Mani has made his Bollywood critics eat crow. They have been saying that he does not understand the Hindi film sentiments and all his straight films in Hindi like Dil Se and Yuva were turkeys at the box-office.

Guru made at a cost of approximately Rs 10 Crore by Madras Talkies has grossed nearly Rs 41 Crore from domestic Indian market. And overseas Guru is this year's biggest hit, and is reported to have got a distributors share of Rs 14 Crore!

Now that he has proved that he can deliver hits at the Bollywood box-office, people in Mumbai are paying more attention to his next film Lajjo. The film has Aamir Khan and Kareena Kapoor in the lead, with music by A.R Rahman and camera is handled by P.C Sreeram.

Mani is now writing the script of the film which will start rolling sometime in September this year. Mani has no immediate plans to direct a Tamil film, as there is more money to be made in Bollywood!

[Flavia]

'LAJJO' enna aAchu? :?

[maithree]

Mani is Enjoying the Awesome Result of Guru. 8-)

I think Lajjo is to start Soon if it hasn't already. :)

After Fanaa I can't wait to see Ameer again. 8-)

[Wibha]

:cool:

[nemesis786]

:cool:

:lol2:

[MADDY]

Lajjo shooting will start by september 8-)

Aamir-Maniratnam-ARRahman :clap:

one more hindi movie from Mani will be awesome - maybe a soft romantic movie with Hrithik in the lead :wink:

[thimuru]

Lajjo shooting will start by september 8-)

Aamir-Maniratnam-ARRahman :clap:

one more hindi movie from Mani will be awesome - maybe a soft romantic movie with Hrithik in the lead :wink:

hrithik good in romance?

[RPB]

Lajjo shooting will start by september 8-)

Aamir-Maniratnam-ARRahman :clap:

one more hindi movie from Mani will be awesome - maybe a soft romantic movie with Hrithik in the lead :wink:

hrithik good in romance?

HRITHIK NOT BETTER THAN AMIR KHAN IN ROMANCE.

[MADDY]

Lajjo shooting will start by september 8-)

Aamir-Maniratnam-ARRahman :clap:

one more hindi movie from Mani will be awesome - maybe a soft romantic movie with Hrithik in the lead :wink:

hrithik good in romance?

Mani can make anyone act.......so its just the question of finding unusually interesting combos...... :D .......Hrithik has great mass 8-)