Topic started by Mani M. Manivannan (@ hybrid-024-221-181-057.ca.sprintbbd.net) on Sun Jan 14 20:45:04 .
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

The MSNBC reports about the racial tension between descendants from India and those from Africa in Trinidad.

http://www.msnbc.com/news/513604.asp?0nm=-328

".”
Under British rule, Indian laborers were scattered around the globe, to colonies in the Caribbean, Africa and the Pacific. Their descendants remain today alongside other ethnic groups in independent nations such as Trinidad and Tobago, Guyana, Fiji and Kenya.

But the Indians’ strength in maintaining their culture also has kept them apart from other ethnic groups in many places, creating hard feelings and struggles for dominance that sometimes explode in violence."

"The divide in the Caribbean dates back more than 160 years to the abolition of slavery in the British colonies, when freed blacks abandoned the plantations.

Seeking a new source of labor, the British brought in shiploads of Indians to work in the cane fields. The indentured laborers went to Jamaica, Guadeloupe, Suriname and other colonies, but the largest numbers came to Trinidad and Guyana.

Indian laborers lived in barracks apart from the former slaves.

“The Indian communities were allowed to keep their religion and their language and their culture,” Ragoonath said. “And that, I think, allowed them greater separation from the Afro community, simply because the Afro community was more assimilated into British culture.”"

“The trouble is that the Indians here believe they are in India,” said Alphues Jarvis, a black construction worker at one National Movement rally. “We don’t believe we’re still in Africa. Enough is enough.”

In Guyana, a new Indian group that sprang up two years ago adopted as its sign a map of India imposed on the South American nation’s map, enraging blacks. Such resentment is common in many former British colonies.

The descendants of Indians moved long ago to British colonies in Asia like Sri Lanka and Malaysia have been unable to emerge from lives of poverty. They still toil on Sri Lanka’s tea plantations and Malaysia’s rubber and oil palm plantations.

People in Malaysia often say the British followed a practice of “divide and rule” — keeping the Chinese in urban businesses, Malays in agriculture in rural areas and Indians on rubber plantations. Modern Malaysian politics is still divided along racial lines."

Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: happyindian (@ bbcache-13.singnet.com.sg) on: Wed Oct 6 12:07:06 EDT 2004
  
  The truth hurts,
  
  Yes dear friend, Africa is (one of?)the cradle(s) of humankind's origin, so all races (if there is any such thing as race) respect Africa and its myriad fascinating culture. I suppose we cud all do away with our innate immature need for acceptance and recognition; refrain from arguing on who contributed or didn't contribute what; or try 2 prove a point on who's more hard-working / mentally-physically stronger, etc, etc, and simply concentrate on our present and grow as one humankind. The ppl that fight the most amongst themselves r the ones taken the gr8est advantage of. So, I suppose its just better 2 live our culture, feel happy with it whteve it is and pass it on thru the generations instead of fighting like this.
  
  
• From: Urme (@ 69.158.112.105) on: Wed Oct 6 14:48:24 EDT 2004
  
  My question was not really answered, but that OK. I only caught this thread by glancing through, I was not looking for it.
  
  
• From: R (@ 4.28.83.143) on: Wed Oct 6 16:04:13 EDT 2004
  
  What was built then (pre-Industrial revolution) could be built much faster and more efficiently now, with less human labour. And how does one say blacks built up the US? Other than picking cotton, and working on a few railroads, they did little other than sing songs and run away. Slavery was not allowed in the Nothern half of the US, and was banned altogether in Europe. In the US before 1863, there were essentially two different economies. Blacks only contributed to one of them (agricultural).
  
  
• From: R (@ 4.28.83.143) on: Wed Oct 6 16:07:04 EDT 2004
  
  And I do not know why blacks in the US complain of discrimination. More than 50,000 white men died in the US Civil War. But I never hear a black mention that. And almost every great ancient civilization has practiced slavery. One finds then, that no race has been immune from slavery.
  
  
• From: R (@ 4.28.83.143) on: Wed Oct 6 18:49:29 EDT 2004
  
  It is true that Africa is the cradle of civilization. But this is a reference to PRE-HISTORIC Africa, not present-day Africa. The evidence is based on the finding of the skeletal remains of one, Lucy. However, LUCY is not AFRICAN in any way. In fact, she is not even judged to be human - specifically, homo sapien, by scientific standards. So why blacks shout over and over again about Africa being the cradle of civilization is beyond me. The different races as we know it did not form until thousands of yrs of evolution had done its work in accordance with environmental & genetic factors.
  
  
• From: Urme (@ 69.158.112.105) on: Thu Oct 7 17:07:18 EDT 2004
  
  Someone wrote somewhere on this forum - I think it was some Patel, that the time will come when some of us will swim and the rest will sink. There are many culprits (and they know themselves) on various parts of this forum and we know what they are trying to do. Who can they fool. The time will come when they will SINK (they once thought man came from single cell amoeba). The SANK before.
  
  Thanks Mr. Patel. I searched for you posting but could not find the thread because I took too long to respond/make my post (although you were writing to someone else). I was very busy.
  
  
• From: Urme (@ 69.158.112.105) on: Fri Oct 8 11:49:01 EDT 2004
  
  Should read:
  
  "They" SANK before.
  
  ....searched for "your" posting ...
  
  
• From: Ramdeo Nagapen (@ cache-dtc-ae09.proxy.aol.com) on: Fri Oct 8 20:02:42 EDT 2004
  
  A lot of Indians in the West Indies mainly come from Bhojpur and Madras regions of India.
  My ancestors are from Madras, we still do Madrasi Puja to Kali, Madraveeren, and Muneswaran.
  
  
• From: Urme (@ 192.30.226.60) on: Sat Oct 9 13:11:18 EDT 2004
  
  This motive was sold out in New York recently, coming to Albion, Canada on 14th October 2004. Those here must see it.
  
  http://www.hardbeatnews.com/details2134.htm
  
  
• From: Sense was made before books (@ 213-208-105-139.dyn.gotadsl.co.uk) on: Sun Oct 10 18:12:03 EDT 2004
  
  It is obvious some of you people are ignorant to the facts or just plain racist to admit them.First of all it was the MONEY MADE from pre industrial Western world, which was basically fronted by AFRICAN FREEE LABOUR, that gave birth to the industrial world.The money saved and invested from forced AFRICAN LABOUR financed the beginning of industrilisation.Go read the history books y'all will see many of these same slave investers financed the industrial revolution from their profits made.Go read first before talking crap.Next thing, go read about the international summit held in South Africa recently, y'all will see that it is estimated by the WEST that they will actually have to pay Africans over £33 Trillion to compensate for the labour of slavery and that this payment will actually banckrupt the world bank if it was to be paid.
  
  
• From: Sense was made before books (@ 213-208-105-139.dyn.gotadsl.co.uk) on: Sun Oct 10 18:13:39 EDT 2004
  
  And regardless of what y'all say of Africa , it is also proven without a doubt by all scientist that Africans have the most varied genetic coding in the human spiecies so even if all other races was wiped out, Africans hold the genetics to evolve into the other races.Go check the facts.As for Lucy, if there wasn't an Africa you wouldn't even be talkin about Lucy, so once again Africa and her children comes first again in the developing of civilisation.And yeah, not everbody submits to evolutionary concepts like man came from monkey, some of us regardless of race, are actually smart enough to see there's definitely a GOD.
  
  
• From: iseedeadpeople (@ 82-35-64-203.cable.ubr01.dals.blueyonder.co.uk) on: Sun Dec 26 19:46:36
  
  I have a small beef with indians... I am mixed race (half black *Mother*, half white *Father*). I want to know, when im out with my black freinds and were on the bus on the way to the theatre or whatever, I get nothing but coldness and dirty looks FROM INDIANS...? who probably see me as another ''confused mixed kid'' not knowing my dad is a successful businessman and my mothers a doctor and im a pretty well rounded 'content' guy. But this perpensity to judge and kiss 'the white mans backside' and attempt to drag up racist feelings from the past committed on blacks by whites by emphasising, ''black, night, lazy, poor, etc etc' whenever one of thier news-casters stands up to deliver the news.
  
  In retrospect as an individual with full control of my own mind. I come to the conclusion that it's a shame, but indians cannot be trusted as they are two faced and seem void of any obvious ''soul'', there obssesed with skin tone and being known as intellegent, when even in England 'people know' there the most disadvantaged group, economically, socially etc. The poorest 'borough' in england Tower Hamlets, is a giant ghetto occupied by just over 90% of south asians (indians) Yet they try and paint themselves as something else.
  
  For the sake of (yourselves) Indians, try to humble yourself, I personally dont know why you feel the need to ostracise yourselves but know this. The only thing that saved you from the inate savagery of the english white man this century was the ''BLACK'' movement i.e. Brixton riots, in which 'you' played no part. It 'seemed' according to my black freinds that you simply buried your head in the sand and hid. Well with the victor comes the spoills, and I really worry for your future. I think the Bradford riots are just the begining of the end unless you try and assimilate.
  
  I say this because (sadly) black people through the treatment they receieve not by white people (in this century) but by 'wannabe white, getting it wrong indians' wont be there to help you in your time of need and im affraid it seems inevitable the storm 'will come'. You should have stayed under the wing of 'minority' as apposed to 'pretending to be white'.
  
  

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