Topic started by :) Punnahai (@ d150-35-51.home.cgocable.net) on Tue Nov 12 15:00:20 .
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

How do we go about getting rid of casteism from India? What is the way out of this mess? Let's have a solution driven discussion, no pointing fingers at anyone please. Thanks.

Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: Rohit (@ leic-cache-1.server.ntli.net) on: Mon Aug 16 17:35:53 EDT 2004
  
  Ad-Hominem Argument : This is an exact example of one of what are considered logical fallacies, based on delusions.
  
  See the shheer contradiction and the logical fallacy revealing itself.
  
  Implying, Africa too must have a hidden Varna system and dissonance reduction process of the backward shudra morons!
  
  http://forumhub.com/tnhistory/17886.10.36.23.html
  
  
• From: Rohit (@ leic-cache-1.server.ntli.net) on: Mon Aug 16 17:38:28 EDT 2004
  
  For the benefit of all readers:
  
  If apple-trees produce only 3% apples of a specified quality and if there are four apple-trees of varying sizes, one growing approximately 500 apples, the second one growing 1000 apples, the third one growing 2000 apples and the fourth one growing 13000 apples.
  
  Now, a choosy customer orders 500 apples that must conform to the specified quality standard.
  
  The farmer has to be foolish enough to supply all 500 apples from the first tree only. Simply because only 15 apples can conform to the specified quality standard. The farmer would be supplying 485 (97%) apples that are totally out of specification, even when the right quality apples are available from the other three trees.
  
  The customer will never order apples from the ignorant farmer who doesn’t understand the quality standard.
  
  
• From: Rohit (@ leic-cache-1.server.ntli.net) on: Mon Aug 16 17:45:33 EDT 2004
  
  (Binding factor) x (Spread of intellectual abilities) = Constant
  
  To many mental “Binding Factors” makes one to loose the concept of quality, like the ignorant farmer did.
  
  The evidences are plenty and everywhere on this forum and they prove the 100% validity of the above equation.
  
  
• From: Rohit (@ leic-cache-1.server.ntli.net) on: Mon Aug 16 18:28:20 EDT 2004
  
  Inability to understand logic is a strong sign of lower IQ and people having lower IQ can’t be proven other than mentally retards. They deserve their well-earned certificate of backward shudra and now, as can be easily seen, they are fully entitled to show their lack of intellectual development freely.
  
  
• From: R (@ ac82dacd.ipt.aol.com) on: Mon Aug 16 19:00:19 EDT 2004
  
  "The farmer has to be foolish enough to supply all 500 apples from the first tree only."
  
  500 apples cannot grow on one tree. Apples are grown in an orchard, under particular climatic conditions. Regardless, no farmer will supply apples from one only tree.
  
  
• From: R (@ ac82dacd.ipt.aol.com) on: Mon Aug 16 19:08:01 EDT 2004
  
  "the second one growing 1000 apples, the third one growing 2000 apples and the fourth one growing 13000 apples."
  
  This is even more ridiculous. An apple tree growing 13000 apples?
  
  
• From: Rohit (@ leic-cache-1.server.ntli.net) on: Tue Aug 17 02:50:06 EDT 2004
  
  Not as ridiculous as all logical fallacies. Dear this is illustration of natural process, if you don't like the numbers, reduce all numbers proportionally, that will give the picture that you can see.
  
  
• From: Rohit (@ leic-cache-1.server.ntli.net) on: Tue Aug 17 02:52:15 EDT 2004
  
  The farmer we are talking about has just done that, he supplies all 500 apples from the same tree.
  
  Thanks for opening your eyes!
  
  
• From: RC (@ pd9512edc.dip.t-dialin.net) on: Tue Aug 17 04:20:58 EDT 2004
  
  Rohit,
  because of lot of trees this person does not see the forest. You need to build a road before this creature can drive a vehicle. This could strain his genically forwarded brain that much that he'll for sure take away his brain and keep it showing to all his companions in a showcase.
  
  How good it is to have ones brain out of reach. A fantastic moron, easy job for you to show this creature its boundries.
  
  
• From: BAB (@ cache-mtc-ae09.proxy.aol.com) on: Tue Aug 17 08:45:00 EDT 2004
  
  Caste is not the bane of India, it is color, work and class discrimination filled with lack of respect for all forms of work.
  
  The Indian people do not value the importance of the links of the chain and do not understand that the chain is as strong as its weakest link.
  
  When Indians learn to appreciate this fact and be supportive of every sector of the nation to work with dignity, only then we will change as a nation.
  
  
• From: R (@ ac9910e6.ipt.aol.com) on: Tue Aug 17 08:50:47 EDT 2004
  
  "If apple-trees produce only 3% apples of a specified quality and if there are four apple-trees of varying sizes..."
  
  It is impossible to grow apples of many different varieties on a single tree. Each tree will contain one type of apple.Cross pollination requires two seperate trees. Furthermore, if size is the factor, this can be taken care of with a simple genetic engineering technique - injection of growth hormone. If color is the factor, then you are also talking a certain type of apple. As I have already mentioned, many different types of apples do not grow on a single tree. In light of which, the following statement is absurd: "If apple-trees produce only 3% apples of a specified quality..." unless you are referring simply to size, which is irrelevent in light of GE.
  
  
• From: R (@ ac9910e6.ipt.aol.com) on: Tue Aug 17 08:58:18 EDT 2004
  
  "The farmer we are talking about has just done that, he supplies all 500 apples from the same tree."
  
  500 apples do not grow on a single tree. And such a large number of apples is generally grown in an apple orchard.
  
  "For these reasons new apple trees are usually grown from buds. These buds are cut from a healthy apple tree which bears plenty of good apples of the kind the farmer wants. The buds are made to grow on strong roots of other apple trees by the process called budding. Budding is a kind of grafting. The apples these trees bear will be like the apples of the tree from which the twigs were cut. Budding permits the fruitgrower to have as many trees as he wishes, all bearing exactly the same variety of apples."
  
  
  
  
• From: R (@ ac9910e6.ipt.aol.com) on: Tue Aug 17 09:02:52 EDT 2004
  
  "reduce all numbers proportionally, that will give the picture that you can see."
  
  As I have said, budding is the primary technique used to grow new apples. This technique allows the farmer to grow as many apples as he wants, but not on a single tree, obviously. Reducing the numbers is irrelevent, as no one harvesting apples to sell will grow just one tree. Especially when the cost of growing new trees is virtually nill.
  
  
• From: R (@ ac9910e6.ipt.aol.com) on: Tue Aug 17 09:07:36 EDT 2004
  
  But a farmer would not simply grow 1000 trees. Other factors come into consideration, such as the size of the land, the fertility of the soil, and the seasonal weather conditions for that year. So more likely that the farmer will grow a number of crops. If one fails, the profit loss can be made up with another. Net profit is never based on the selling of a single crop.
  
  
• From: RC (@ pd9512161.dip.t-dialin.net) on: Tue Aug 17 10:57:06 EDT 2004
  
  "But a farmer would not simply grow 1000 trees."
  
  Ok, then let 2000 farmers grow 1000 trees!
  
  The point is you don't understand Rohits point! Good luck and read it carefully or let it read and make it more clear to you.
  
  
• From: Rohit (@ leic-cache-1.server.ntli.net) on: Tue Aug 17 16:08:14 EDT 2004
  
  Finding stuck! Great! Then try to understand W, X ,Y, Z and see if that helps. Would it? I don't think so! It is all about grasping the concept of quality!
  
  
• From: Rohit (@ leic-cache-1.server.ntli.net) on: Tue Aug 17 16:13:06 EDT 2004
  
  >>no one harvesting apples to sell will grow just one tree.
  
  exactly, that is why more trees and then select the quality apples from all of them (whole country country and not just one category that can produce just 3% quality on its own) Got it? perhaps still struglling. How sad!
  
  
• From: RC (@ pd951271b.dip.t-dialin.net) on: Tue Aug 17 16:37:12 EDT 2004
  
  In Football they would call it a owngoal, Rohit. I am quite sure he/she/it 'R' will engage first his brain in future before dancing on the keyboard.
  
  Rohit, a big wicket yours!
  
  
• From: sagar (@ 141.156.25.137) on: Thu Aug 19 12:46:36 EDT 2004
  
  I have come to believe that originally everyone received their place on the caste system based on the effort they make to become virtuous. The ones with most effort became Brahmins (children of Brahma) and the souls that made lest effort became Shudras in the iron age.
  
  
• From: BAB (@ cache-gtc-ab16.proxy.aol.com) on: Thu Aug 19 14:14:21 EDT 2004
  
  Class/caste systems exist everywhere - the difference is that class is respected by all and not held against anyone. All are free to move up/through the social ladders according to his/her ability and effort to do so.
  
  
• From: davie (@ cim-dell14.cim.utep.edu) on: Thu Aug 19 20:05:04 EDT 2004
  
  abolish the books that give false information example the book by A.K Aravanan that is false, right from starting to ending. and those scrwed up websites by clyde A Winters That itself will help
  
  
  
• From: R (@ ac982463.ipt.aol.com) on: Thu Aug 19 22:55:53 EDT 2004
  
  "All are free to move up/through the social ladders according to his/her ability and effort to do so."
  
  But not all move up - a factor which caste accounts for, to a certain extent. Whereas with a class system, many people who are told they can up do not realize or choose to ignore that in fact they cannot move up no matter what they do - a factor called genetics, which karma accounts for very well. Otherwise, if all have access to public education in the class system, why are there 30,000 people who committ suicide in the USA every yr? Should not these 30,000 people, having faced no educational barrier, become doctors and engineers when the law requires children to go to school?
  
  
• From: R (@ ac982463.ipt.aol.com) on: Thu Aug 19 23:01:52 EDT 2004
  
  Why does the USA have the world's largest prison system? Why do some well-to-do children in the USA carry guns to school? And why are more than 50% of all American adults obese? What is very evident here is that if a country turns Capitalist overnight, or even over a period of 225 yrs (as is the case in the US), not all the children in that society will become doctors or engineers. One sees very well indeed the superficiality of such Western economic indicators as GNP & GDP.
  
  
• From: R (@ ac982463.ipt.aol.com) on: Thu Aug 19 23:04:30 EDT 2004
  
  Consider: if first-world & third-world were defined relative to obesity, America will be 3rd world, & India will be first-world!
  
  Amazing how far a little logic goes. Point is that one does not need eyeglasses to see how incomplete certain definitions (first-world/thirld-world) are. That is something to think about, for all those who associate casteism with India's so-called "third-world" status.
  
  

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